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All Posts by Uhwop

All Posts by Uhwop

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1544 posts found

Gotta give him some credit.  When all is said and done, he'll probably have ended up working for free.  He obviously had enough belief in what they were doing to have taken no up front compensation. Cudos to him.

Originally posted by ShakyMo
Perhaps it soloable to speak to fans of the Single Player tes rpgs.

 Or maybe because they're just doing the exact same thing as every other developed MMO? 

He explained why in the video.  It's designed to make everything accessible.  He talks about  being able to play for 15, 30, or 60 min blocks.  In otherwords, like most every other game, it's designed around casual gameplay.  Nothing wrong with that of course, and it goes in line with what they said in the GI interview that's coming out.  They're trying to appeal to the "typical" mmo player.

Nothing wrong with that.  However, one thing I've learned is that when an MMO is soloable and doesn't require any grouping, people don't really play together.  Rifts in Rift didn't get people actually playing together, it just put them in a group and they played solo. 

Like most MMO's, they're missing the part were you shouldn't just be grouping or killing the same thing, you should be interacting with each other.  Player interaction is the part that most MMO's don't get, and why people aren't really playing together, even when they're grouped with a bunch of other people doing the same thing. 

Again, an element they seem to be ignoring from the ES games.  Interacting with the world and the people is a big part of the ES games, that same thing should be emphasized in TESO through player interaction.  To me that's not done by using the trinity style combat system, raids, public events, or faction pvp.  It's done like in EVE, were every player plays a role and everything you do has some impact on other players and therefore the world at large.  It reamains to be seen if they're going to achieve this in TESO, as it stand it's looking more and more like a quest grinder with 3 faction pvp.

Originally posted by buegur

Uhwop, if I had my rathers I would have them design the game as I wanted, but if what I heard that this game been under development for at least a couple of years I can live with less.  If it is true they are going to release the game next year there is very little time for them to change the core features.


"It doesn't bother you that it'll be a class/ level based character progression, with quest driven leveling, an ephasis on a single player storyline that incorporates heavy use of phasing, and an engame pvp system that is doesn't really have a true purpose? "

My rathers would have a skill based, but i can live with Class/Level based.  Everything I read on the end game PvP says that it would be based on DAoC type of realm warfare where it will indeed make a small difference, so I like that.  As i liked SWTor's storylines that would tweek my interest, but of course I'm for a more open feeling that Elder Scrolls has.  I am still open and hoping that is indeed the case and the single story line is just an additional content.

"They said that the winning faction will have a ruler designated based on who contributed the most during the fighting, but that it's only a title and has no impact on the game. The ruler is only a ruler because the game says he is, but he can't do anything in the position and it's only a "bragging right".

I see this as a thrown in extra that doesn't hurt the game but adds a little favor.

"As well as all the lore they're writting for the game has been admitted to not being considered canon by the guys at Bethesda."

Unfortunately standard practice for MMO's.  We will have to wait and see how much this truely effects the game.  A few deviations won't matter to me if they get the main feel for the Elder Scroll worlds.

I think more importantly are they going to have the open feelingness of ES worlds and the multitudes of choices we have in them, such as advancing in the various guilds?  It seems to me most MMO's out there today fail in keeping our interest once we level because of a lack of depth at the top.  Add in all the extras such as working for the various guilds, meaningful RvR, communities/housing, trades that have purpose in the end games and I'm betting it will succeed even with its short comings in other areas.  The ES world has openess needed to put back the community experience back into MMO's thats been sorely lacking of late.

 Fair enough.

Won't be any housing though, and we haven't heard yet if crafting is actually going to be meaningful.  As well they haven't actually said what "meaningful pvp" is yet; only that one person will get a title that doesn't actually have any impact.

I have no problem with 3 faction pvp.  I'm not FFA pvp junky who thinks that the only good pvp is FFA/ full loot.  I just have my concerns that with the direction they're going, and the emphasis on solo quest lines with phazing, no real need to group, and quest grinding (yeah, they have varified that they still have quest hubs, just a diffirent variation of them.  Gotta watch the latest interview), and a really big emphasis on casual, accessable play were the biggest impact you have is on the phasing of the world, that the PvP is going to boil down to fight over a zone for the right to say you won, but little else.

Don't take that as me being the sort that wants hardcore gameplay were your actions have huge impacts on what you can or can't do.  It's just that, for me, the impacts of my actions in the ES games made the game fun.  If I can't do a quest because I did something early on in the game that would prevent me from doing it, then so be it.  That's the fundimental point of having your actions impact the world, not haveing the world phase in new landscape that someone else can't see because I failed to save an NPC while my friend did save him.  Phasing in a persistant online world is just about the worst thing blizzard came up with.

I just don't see any divergent gameplay coming out of this, and that's really a staple of the ES games.

Some things I picked up in the interview.

They're going to "disguise" the mundaine quests like kill 10 rats, and they incorporate disguising quests a lot.

The world is heavily phased.  Nothing like playing in a persistant online world with my firnd that looks nothing like the world he's playing in.

They think players don't like to not be able to do every quest in the game because a choice they made might prevent them from being able to do a quest.  This is probably why I play an entirely nuetral character in every ES game, I don't like killing an NPC and then finging out that I wasn't able to do a quest later on because of it. 

They want to reward exploring, so the compass will direct you towards quest givers.  Granted, you can turn the compass off.

Variation on quest hubs is not the same thing as not having quest hubs.  Either you don't have quest hubs or you have a variation of the quest hub.  Sinse they constantly repeat that they are doing a variation on quest hubs, and that you'll go from one place to the next doing quests,  that means there are quest hubs.  Which is strange, because prior to this interview about doing quests, they kept saying there were no quest hubs, and now they're saying that they're using a variation of quest hubs. 

They encourage grouping.  One way is by making it fun, because playing with people isn't naturally fun.  The other way is to not require you to group while you're soloing to play with someone else.  Unlike other games that encourage grouping by having you group, they're going to encourage playing with others by allowing you to play solo, while that other guy is playing solo.  For example, if guy A is out killing bears for a quest, and guy b comes along, other games would penalize you for killing the same bear. They're going to instead give you full rewards for killing the same mob, without the need to group.  Were other games will try and encourage you to actually form a party with guy b, TESO will not encourage you to group by encouraging you to play together.

But then, they're pretty much saying you can solo the entire game.


I don't like this paul sage guy.  It seems like he's been following MMO trends, but not actually playing the games.  He's putting a lot of emphasis on being able to everything solo, making everything easilly accessable, creating single player driven storylines, and trying to disguise traditional MMO mechanics without removing traditional MMO mechanics (IE: quest grinding and the typical go kil this many of this or collect this many of this style quest, as well as simply moving the quest hubs fromt he towns to POI's and making quest into archs or chains instead of just a bunch of individual quests) 

No problem with quest chains.  That's fine, but not when you combine them with heavy use of phasing so that the world I play in isn't the same as the world my friend is playing in. 

Encouraging grouping by not penalizing working together is great.  That's fine as well, However, when you don't encourage grouping by literally encouraging people to not group, you're not really encouraging playing together, but instead encouraging people to play solo, with someone else who's playing solo.  WAR and Rift both tried to encourage grouping and playing together, but only when I"m in a public quest or event area.  And even when people did end up in a group, they never talked to each other, and would go their sperate ways when they were done the quest or event.  If the content doesn't require you to group to do it, and is all soloable, people tend to not group.  Yes, some people would be social, but for the most part they weren't.  It's even a common complaint on the Rift forums that people only group for the events and then go their own way, because there's no reason to group outside of that.  Even doing dungeons, people would rarely talk, but that was a problem of cross server grouping. 

CoH required me to do a lot of grouping as did early EQ2, and it was fine.  Grouping itself was never the problem.  Getting a group was always a pain in the ass, that was the problem.  LFG and LFD tools are requested and work because they make it easy to group.  People don't want to shout in chanell for an hour straight that they are looking for a group to do something.  Making content soloable isn't how you encourage people to play together, it's counter to the idea of grouping.  And "fun" has never been an incentive to get people playing together.



They need to start talking about crafting and economy.  Something tells me it's going to be your typical MMO crafting and AH economy.  If so, that means the impression I came away with, watching this interview, is that TESO is yet another quest grinder to level to endgame, to then raid and do PvP.  Same old same old.


Long post is long.  I apologize.

Originally posted by Qallidexz
Tab targetting.
Combat looks like it'll play out exactly like GW1 with a little GW2 thrown in, wich was effectively exactly the same as WoW with  a limitted skill deck that you build.


Yea, that's also the same as EQ which came out in 1999, and DAoC, which came out in 2001. Those games are such WoW clones, srysly.

 Please stop.  Honestly the mockery just comes across as childish.

At no point did I say or even attempt to imply it's a wow clone.

However the truth is, I've playd both EQ and DAoC and neither of them feels anything like WoW combat.  Frankly I'm tired of the well wow uses the same combat as EQ, no, it uses a hotbar and that's it.

I'm sure you'll disagree with me, and i'm sure others will to, and the only thing I can say is, you're wrong.

WoW's combat is appealing to so many people because it brought a certian level of "actiony" feel to it.  It's quicker then most of the games that came before it.  It imcorporated a sense of actually needing a level of skill, even though it's still entirely gear based, that many games before it didn't have.

GW evolved it by limitting the skills and creating a kind of deck style sytem.  But ultimately is was very much a wow modelled combat system becuase it aimed to create a fast, skillbased mechanic that would translate well into the realm of Esports.

This is what a lot of other games sinse wow have been trying to accomplish.  That fast, frantic, skillbased combat system using a hotbar, and most of them don't do it that well.  Even EQ2 is still only like WoW's combat beause it uses a hotbar.  Character movement though feels nothing like WoW.  Fast, as in you move around a lot to either to get in or out of range, to avoid ranges of other classes, to break LoS.  The only game I've played yet that really, truelly copies wow is Rift, it's the exact same thing.  GW is the same in feel, but the skill mechanics are slightly different, that's all.



Originally posted by Resiakraw

About the part in red, that kind of depends on how they do the class/skill system. For example, quite a few of us have played PoE recently. There are 6 classes, but every class can use every skill and gain every passive/stat boost in the skill tree. Every class shares the exact same skill tree, but what the class determines is where in the tree you start, making it generally easier to stick to that area of the tree and build yourself in that area, but if you choose you can do things like say start as a Witch and steer away from the Intelligence section and work your way into Strength or Dex passives. Skills themselves are linked to gems which just require you to have X level and X stat... so as long as you eithe rhave gear on which gives those bonus stats, or picking those stat passives in the skill tree, you can use any skill with any character.

If Zenimax is smart, theyll work out a system which offers that same form of freedom and customization. A ton of games could benefit from a system similar to PoE, allowing you to build how YOU want not the way some dev said you should be and you have no choice about it.


To see what im talking about with PoEs skill tree check here:

Every class uses this tree, just starts in different spots.

 That' pretty much what Saga of Ryzom does as well, but through skill point allocation.

Unfortunetly it doesn't sound like that's how it's going to work here.  The latest thing they've said makes it sound like a hybrid class/ skill use system.  Pick a mage and you'll have specific skill that you can selec from that are only available to the mage class.  Use the skills to improve them.  Regardless of your class you can use any weapon.

Here's my prblem.  What if I don't want to use a weapon?  a 3rd of my skills are dedicated solely to my weapon, I don't really get much of a choice, unless I can just use the other 4 skills only in combat.

My other big problem.  It's shaping up that the game is entirely focused on fighting mobs and other players.  The thing that made the ES games great to me is that that was a choice.  I didn't have to kill monsters if I didn't want to.  I could just hunt, or pick flowers, or catch butterflies, or craft potions, and skyrim really expanded on the idea of do whatever you want by adding more things to do, and giving you the ability to effect economies.

TESO isn't turning out to be a sandbox MMO like people expected when the announcement was first made, and lets face reality here.  The first thing EVERYONE thought, before any information came out, was that TESO would be a sandbox MMO that would play much like any one of the single player games.  Anyone that says that isn't the first thing they though when they saw the announcement is blatantly lying.

The very first article written here was very much inclined to the point of view that TESO could change the MMO landscape by bringing us a quality, well funded, polished, sandbox mmo experience.  Everything I've read sinse has been counter that. 

Now I'm reading an article praising ZeniOnline for bring us that 3 faction pvp experience that everyone seemed to know and love from DAoC.  I'm sorry, but as an ES fan I'm not looking for the DAoC experience in an ES mmo, I've playd and can still play DAoC for that experience, I want the ES experience in my ES MMO, period.

Instead of articles praising them for doing what another game already does, why not write an article asking why it's to much to ask that they give ES fans the ES experience they expected in an ES mmo?  Let's not ignore everything they aren't doing in favor of praising the couple things they may do well, in an effort to attract an audience that has nothing to with ES, and sure isn't what ES fans ever asked for in an MMO.

No fan ever expected an ES mmo that was based on 3 faction pvp, with classes, and an ephasis on single player story lines that rely heavily on phasing.  That's the exact opposite of what you would expect of an ES MMO!  THAT should be the headlining article about the game.


Website, controversy, more traffick, more clicks, more views, more replies, I'm contributing.  I get it.

A mortal online that is full featured, polished and working is more then capable of reaching that many subs.

I've been saying it for some time now. A full featured sandbox MMO, that actualy runs properly, and has enough stuff to do that doesn't degenerate the game into a game all about fighting, and that has mechanics in place to curb excessive ganking, is more then capable of exceeding EVE's playerbase.

The only reason EVE doesn't have closer to a million subs is because you're a spacship.  A sci-fi game, especially one that puts you in the role of a ship, is going to have a smaller following then a fantasy based one.  If you took EVE and translated that game into a fantasy setting, with all of its polish and features, the server would blow up.


MO's problems aren't really realated to what the game is, but how the game is.  Once they get that corrected, it shouldn't have any trouble getting near 500k subs.  If they survive that long, and if they have the technical know how to pull it off.

And the biggest if.  IF a real studio, with proper funding, and experience doesn't come along and do it first.

Originally posted by Vorthanion

I keep seeing people bitch about the mechanics of a typical MMO.  Yet where is all of the hate towards FPS with their cloning of Castle Wolfenstien and Doom mechanics?  How about all of the RTS clones of Warcraft and Command and Conquer who have used virtually the same mechanics throughout their history?


Maybe people need to grow up and realize they need to try a different genre rather than trying to force change in one that exists because people wanted an alternative to the plethora of spaz monkey combat games.  You don't see us going into those genres and demanding they slow the frakking pace down and yet you guys take every single opportunity to spout your vitriol towards tab targeting and combat based on character stats.  Instead of whining till they destroy the kind of RPG's we like, how about demanding they make an Action Adventure or FPS more to your liking?


What really ticks me off is that you have games like Darkfall, DC Universe Online and Tera already as well as upcoming releases like MechWarrior Online and Guild Wars 2, Planetside 2, The Secret World and Neverwinter Nights that are all embracing your precious action combat play style, yet you act all pissy when every single game doesn't embrace it.

 Or maybe it's because some people actually understand that there are other ways to make an MMO?

You can't really change an FPS game, now can you?  Even RTS game mechanics can't really change much either.

An MMORPG though, the mechanics can be implimented in a veriety of ways.  Including having them play like an FPS or RTS.

What really gets me is that the OP stated he actually would like to play an MMO just like wow, but that had the same polish and quality, and you went off on a tangent about action combat. 

Not everyone wants an MMO that entirely revolves around combat.  Not everyone wants an mmo that revolves around single player storylines.  Not everyone wants an mmo that revolves around FFA PvP or full loot.  And not everyone wants a sandbox mmo that's made by an underfunded, inexperienced development studio;  which is pretty much the only people who are making sandbox mmo's in a fantasy setting because not everyone wants to be a spaceship.

How about a little open minded rationalization before you start throwing out accusations that people just need to leave the genre?

Anyone looking at the water and going WTF, fugly.

One of the devs said that they're redoing the water in the game, which is why it looks the way it does, which is it doesn't look like the live server water and is quite ugly.   They weren't happy with what they had so they removed it on the test server to rework it,and in the meantime testers get to swim around in the worlds ugly water graphic.


Anyways.  I'm going to check MO out again when this is completed and released.  I hope that Henrik keeps his word and only releases it when it's fully finished and polished up.


Originally posted by Loke666
Originally posted by Arawulf
Blizz policy has nothing to do with people using the same password for multiple websites or people having unsecure computers.

True, but that does not mean that OP isn't right. Changing the password complexity is a great idea actually, it doesn't cost Blizz money and would probably makes things harder for many hackers....

i think you should post it on Blizz official forum OP.

 Blizz doesn't do anything less, and actually does a little more with the authenticator, that any other MMO I play does.

Most places I make a password for doesn't require case sensetive passwords.  Most of them only require 8 characters, and a lot don't even require a number. 

There are very few places that I've encounterd that require case sensetive, a number, and a non-alphanumeric character.  Most of them that require that level of password creation have been for online banking.


I do not understand the hypocrisy of holding Blizzard to higher standards then any other company that does the same thing.  People are acting like Blizz is the only company to not require more of you, when they aren't.  Just becaue they're more popular doesn't make them more responsible.

And again, they aren't "guessing" your password.  They're running against a list of passwords, usually associated with your email, that they got from other sites.  They'll even guess on variations of the same passwords, using case sensetive and "leet speak" formats.  Just because you used Mypass for one thing and then m4P455 for another doesn't mean you're any safer.  Hackers already know you did that, and they're running stuff to guess those diffirent variation.

Also, it's been shown that case sensetive is no more secure then no case sensetive, and the only really safe passwords are ones that are completely random using leters, numbers, and symbols, made as long as possible, and then never the same password.

I wonder how many other people clicked the report button and found the thread had already been reported?


It would seem to me, that if you're a fan of WoW, if you enjoy how it plays, and what you want is a new clase and lore, that you would just buy the expansion.  If the xpac gives you a new class to play and some new lore, and you already enjoy the game, chances are you'll just keep playing it or go back to playing it after a little break.

Just like the people that want 3 faction pvp and then talk about how great DAoC is.  So why not play DAoC if you admit that it's the best pvp you've ever played and all you want is 3 faction pvp. 


All you get is people with vacation syndrome, and developers who think they're catering to a playerbase that is more then just a group of people suffering from vacation syndrome.  At some point we all need a change of scenery, but after a little while, no matter how fun the vacation is, we all get tired and want to go home. 

It doesn't matter how good that copy is.  Eventually most of your players are going to go back to that game you're trying to copy.  Deveopers haven't figured out that they keep making MMO's for several milllion people, and the reality is is that it's a few hundred thousand player MMO because they already have that game.  If they just made the games focused on those few hundred thousand, the games would be better, and we'd see more variety.

Originally posted by kalsigur
Originally posted by Uhwop
Originally posted by buegur

I agree with Dimasok that if it has DAoC type warfare and a good community set in the Elder Scroll universe I'll be happy enough.  The combat type doesn't bother me which way they go.

 May ask?

Combat mechanics aside, because I do agree with that idea.  It doesn't bother you that it'll be a class/ level based character progression, with quest driven leveling, an ephasis on a single player storyline that incorporates heavy use of phasing, and an engame pvp system that is doesn't really have a true purpose? (They said that the winning faction will have a ruler designated based on who contributed the most during the fighting, but that it's only a title and has no impact on the game.  The ruler is only a ruler because the game says he is, but he can't do anything in the position and it's only a "bragging right".  That's straight from the developers mouth)  As well as all the lore they're writting for the game has been admitted to not being considered canon by the guys at Bethesda.

None of that bothers you as long as it's 3 faction pvp, in the ES universe?


It's just bewildering to me that some people would only care about the 3 faction pvp, yet DAoC never shut down their servers.  If that's all people want, and if DAoC does it so well, why aren't people just playing DAoC then?


Um, Elder Scrolls is a level based progression system with the illusion of being skill based. Always has been.

 All dungeons and towns are instanced ALREADY, and have been forever. (EXCEPT IN MORROWIND -Towns were open and connected to the rest of the world -  where you could fly - BRING BACK LEVITATE).

Also, a ruler is only a ruler because the people let him be. And he doesnt have any ACTUAL power unless the people allow him to. Bascially, "bragging rights" are a core human desire.

Lore is not canon? Please, it takes place 1000 years before any Elder Scrolls game you've played. You try going back 1000 years and tell me how accurate your lore is. I promise you, what you know, is not necessarily what happened. 


 Elders scrolls insn't class based, and it's skill up on use, with free form character development.  You know that, I know that, everyone person familliar with ES knows that.  Saying it uses levels based progression is just ignoring the entirety of how it that level based progression works. 

TESO is class and level based, and you know exactly what that means, as does everyone else.  NO free form character development.  You're locked into a class and that means you're locked into what skills you can ultimately use.  No one expected that from an announced ES game.  No one.

I would expect a ruler to do things like be able to set tax rates.  I dont' expect meaningful pvp to be a "bragging right".  How is that meaningful.

No, the lore isn't canon, they said so themselves.  One of the devs came out and said specfically that bethesda doesn't consider any of the lore in TESO to be relevant to the single player games, and that nothing write is considerd canon by bethesda.  That means that Beth can make a game in the exact same time period and the lore can be completely different.  If they tell me that, I think I'll take their word for it.


You didn't actually answer the question.  It's ok to you that the game has no real connection to the ES universe, outside of the names of landmarks being the same, that it doesn't even use the same character development as any other ES games, It's ok if the game ephasizes single player questing with heavy use of phasing, as long as it's 3 faction pvp with the ES name attacked to it?

And if all you care about is 3 faction pvp, and if DAoC is so great because of it, why not just play DAoC?

Originally posted by antlordi

Don't under-estimate Sony, they are not stupid, the only place you are going to see this kind of advertising is in free products, either free via their SOE services or free via their Playstation Home services

 This is the fist thing that popped into my mind.

Doesn't Funcom already employ a tactic like this.  Billboard adds in AO that free players can remove by paying for the game.  At least I'm sure they did it at one point, don't know if they still do.

Paying to remove adverts has been used in other free model based games before as well.  It's nothing new.

Originally posted by ShakyMo
It looks better than gw2

Meaningfull pvp system
Better lore
Return of open dungeons to mmos
3 separate pve paths / areas rather than cheap solution of sharing pve (e.g. gw2, tsw)
Better crafting

 By meaningngful pvp you mean that the person that contributes the most gets the title of ruler for bragging rights?  That's all they've said so far about PvP.  The person on the winning faction side that contributes most will get a title that says ruler, but can't do anything as ruler, and that it's just for "bragging rights". 

Better lore?  They've said, "well, we hope that the guys at bethesda will consider it canon one day".  The lore isn't even official lore recognized by bethesda.  How do you know it's better? 

Open dungeons?  You mean like a public quest zone, set in an enviroment that resembles a dungeon?  That's all we know so far, that'll it'll be a place were people can kill things together, just like a public quest or event in GW2/ Rift, and that it'll take place inside a non-instanced area that is a "dungeon". 

3 seperat pve paths?  That's awesome, nothing I love more then a persistant world with structured and restricted questing; in a game baed on a series that has given me unparallelled freedom for well over a decade.

Better crafting?  They haven't said anything about crafting other then there is crafting.  How is it better?  Unless crafted items are the best items in the game, and their is a system of item decay or loss that supports crafting and ultimately an ecomomy, it won't matter what the crafting system is or how deep a mechanic they use, it'll be as meaningful as any other themepark mmo that requires you to PvE in order to get a monster to drop the best item in the game.  In otherwords It'll probably be just like every other MMO, and act like an ancillary ability that you use to fill gaps in gear while you level, untill you reach endgame and start raiding or pvping to earn tokens to buy the best crap in the game; pointless.


PS:  I love the way you keep using he pitchfork comment and deriding anyone that doesn't like what they hear as jumping on the wow clone bandwagon, yet everytime you post you effectively state that the game will be great just because it's ES.  Keep up the good work, you're exactly the consumer they're aiming for.

Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

Can somebody tellme if it's tab-target or aim based? I've read about combos and action oriented which is all nice, but i'd prefer to be able to aim down the line, similar, i guess, to TERA (not a fonboy of the game) since it's only those 6.

Also, can we atleast switch the 2 weapon skills. I get, and like, skills being linked to the weapon but i hate being froced to use only the pre-determined ones. With only 2, i'd expect normal attacks, uppercut, spin, leap, for sword for example. I want to select them to fit my strategy. Hope it works like that.

 Tab targetting.

Combat looks like it'll play out exactly like GW1 with a little GW2 thrown in, wich was effectively exactly the same as WoW with  a limitted skill deck that you build. 

It honestly doesn't sound bad to me, but I don't understand the "our interpretation" stuff.  why interpret anything, just transition the ES format over to the MMO.  You don't have to change it.  Everyone playing MMO's has more then likely played and ES game and already knows exactly how it works.

Or have they not noticed that the people who don't play MMO's are also saying that it's turnign them off becuase it's not what they like about the single player games.  Nevermind the amount of people who do play MMO's who are also saying the same thing.


Again, it doesn't sound bad to me, but WoW also did the exact same thing.  Hotbar skills and then weapon skills that you had to improve.  They removed the whole weapon skills having an impact becaue people would just exploit mobs to increase a new weapon skill quickly, and it was also redundant.

If I'm a mage, and I want to play a mage, why do I need to have a weapon skill?  Why should I have to worry about raising a weapon skill?  It's not something I ever did in an ES game unless I was intentionally building a battle mage type character.  What they're describing is a system that makes all mages a battlemage type character because every mage is going to have to level a weapon skill, and sinse two or your hotbuttons are dedicated to weapon attacks you'll HAVE to level a weapon.  When a 3rd of your attacks are dedicated weapon attacks you don't get an option to make a character that doesn't rely on using a weapon.

It read to much to me like they were half assing a system by trying to interpret something that doesn't need interpreting.  The only really good thing I got out of it was that they already have the system in place for on use skilling, so they it's not to late for them to do it correctly and impliment the same system used in all the other ES games.

Hopefully enough people show ZeniOnline that they're not happy with this move away from what made character development in the ES so great, and ZeniOnline actually listens to the fans and changes it.  I'm not holding my breathe though.



PS: Did the developer really say the same thing like 3 times, or did the author of the article just make it seem like the Dev was just repeating himself.  Reaffirming through repatition anyone?  What am I a frigging dog?  Sit, sit, sit, sit, oh good boy!  Will I get a treat if I suddenly develop blind fanaticism?



Originally posted by buegur

I agree with Dimasok that if it has DAoC type warfare and a good community set in the Elder Scroll universe I'll be happy enough.  The combat type doesn't bother me which way they go.

 May ask?

Combat mechanics aside, because I do agree with that idea.  It doesn't bother you that it'll be a class/ level based character progression, with quest driven leveling, an ephasis on a single player storyline that incorporates heavy use of phasing, and an engame pvp system that is doesn't really have a true purpose? (They said that the winning faction will have a ruler designated based on who contributed the most during the fighting, but that it's only a title and has no impact on the game.  The ruler is only a ruler because the game says he is, but he can't do anything in the position and it's only a "bragging right".  That's straight from the developers mouth)  As well as all the lore they're writting for the game has been admitted to not being considered canon by the guys at Bethesda.

None of that bothers you as long as it's 3 faction pvp, in the ES universe?


It's just bewildering to me that some people would only care about the 3 faction pvp, yet DAoC never shut down their servers.  If that's all people want, and if DAoC does it so well, why aren't people just playing DAoC then?

I don't see how anyone who says they're an ES fan could read about his game and be excited for it.

I also don't see how anyone who doesn't play MMO's, but is a fan of the ES games would read about this game and want to play it.

If it's lacking all of the things that make the ES games great, why would ES fans be excited for it.  To say that because it's an MMO it has to play a certain way is a bunch of BS.  There is no unwritten rule tha says an MMO is supposed to be a linear, single player story driven, race/ faction locked, class based mmo with no real sandbox elements in it, and that's what they're making with this game.


I'd really like to hear the impression of the author of the first article about TESO that was written here, when the game was announced.  I got the very distinct impression that that individual very much expect an ES mmo that played much like the single player games. 


Now let me ask this.  How would people feel if Beth announced that they were making ES vi, but they wanted to move it into a more mainstream market so they're going to make the game play more like Dragon Age.  Instead of forging your own adventure you'll select a class with preset skills.  Instead of focusing on world development they're going to focus on Story narative.  They'll still let you explore the world, but due the class designs you may not be able to do certain content unless you level up first.  To make the game appeal to a wider audience, they're going to remove much of the fluff stuff that they think maybe people wouldn't care so much about, and instead put most of the emphasis on fighting monsters and playing through the story.  No more having a house, no more crafting, no more killing NPC's, and reducing the visuals so that they run on more machines, as well as removing most of the world interaction. 

How many ES fans would except that from Bethesda? 


Just because it's being made by ZeniOnlne, and just because it's an MMO, doesn't mean it's not an ES game.  When you remove all the elements that make ES, ES; including the lore that one of the devs admitted isn't even considered to be canon by the guys at Bethesda, the only thin you're left with is a game with the ES in the title and names on a map that you might be familliar with.

In the end, DAoC had far fewer followers then even SWG, people playing WoW are going to continue playing WoW, and ES fans who don't play MMO's aren't going to play a game that has next to nothing in common with the singleplayer games, they're going to wait until the ESvi releases and play it; not this.

Not even the media should be cutting them slack.  Once an ES mmo releases that is nothing but a DAoC/ ToR/ WoW ripoff, those people that have always wanted to play a real ES MMO will not get that option.  They won't make the game a second time, and we'll still be stuck with underfunded, indie developed MMO that never reach their real potential, but have more in common with ES then this game will.  That's not fair to the FANS of the game.  


I'm very dissapointed with the tone of this article.  3 faction pvp does not an ES mmo make.  ES is synonymous with a specific type of gameplay, and MMO's are still RPG.  There is absolutely no reason that an ES mmo could not be the sandbox mmo that EVERYONE EXPECTED when they announced they were making the game. 

Originally posted by Kaneth
Originally posted by Sorrow
Originally posted by i_own_u
Originally posted by sonoggi
Originally posted by Uhwop

Of course "Man dies of heartattack" is hardly news wrothy, and definately not going to get more hits on your website.  Journalistic integrity is actually an oxymoron.

well i think video game addiction deserves more public awareness and exposure, like drinking, smoking, enjoying cocaine, etc. it's a social problem like any other.

I do not believe there is any such thing as "video game addiction." An addiction as defined by is "the state of being enslaved to a habit or practice or to something that is psychologically or physically habit-forming, as narcotics, to such an extent that its cessation causes severe trauma."

I do not believe that any individual will suffer severe trauma if brought away from a video game. Narcotics create a physical need in your bodily system that you physically cannot live without.

There is a problem with people becoming obsessed with video games. but I believe that you cannot say video games have the same pull physically as lets say, cigarettes.

Actually you are 100% wrong even as far back as the 80's game designers admitted studies were conducted to find the right combo of lights and sounds to produce an endorphin release in players. Since then tons of scientific studies have been conducted and have determined video games CAN be just as addictive as opiates to many gamers. Video game addiction and withdrawl can be a very seious condition to many people, and is recently recognized by support groups like AA. Video game addiction has even successfully been argued as a disability to Social Security.

Regardless of whether video gaming truly addictive or not (the validity is still argued within the psychiatric community), people still make choices. People can choose to begin using drugs or alcohol, and they can also choose to seek help for their addiction. People need to quit playing victim and take responsibility for their choices.

 Some doctor figures out that, like everything else you'll do in your life that brings you a sense of enjoyment, the brain releases small level of dopamine (that's why enjoyable things are enjoyable after all), and determined that that is why they're adictive.

Afterall, dopamine causes the exact same effect as taking speed, and we know that many versions of speed are addictive.  So we can obviously draw a correlation between the effects of speed and dopamine and say that video games are addictive because of the release of dopamine.

So knowing that we can then say that:

Running is addictive for some people

cooking is adictive for some people

Drawing is addictive for some people

gardening is addictive for some people

swimming is addictive for some people

rock climbing is addictive for some people

bunjee jumping is addictive for some people

skydiving is addictive for some people

sex is addictive for some people

knitting is addictive for some people

movies are addictive for some people

masticism is addictive for some people

sports are addictive for some people

*laugh* gambling *laugh* is addictive for some people rflmfao

eating is an addiction

life is addictive!!

Or we can use common sense and realize that real addiction happens when outside chemicals cause a physcial depence, and not a naturally occuring biological function of the brain that's required in order to keep us from sitting in one spot and dying before we ever learn to walk, becaues without it we wouldn't have any motivation to do anything.

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