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I was sad to hear about this a week or so ago. I have a lot of great memories in Galaxies and made some long term friends there that are still playing together. A lot of SWG players like myself saw the writing on the wall with the TOR announcement and have somewhat 'diversified' into other games. LOTRO going FTP made it easier for a lot of us to find a new temporary home... but Galaxies will always be the place we met.. the place we bonded our friendships.. the place we got to go fly X-Wings in space... play Jedi and Bounty Hunter... engage in the Galactic Civil War we saw in the movies.
I honestly don't give 2 cents about NGE or pre-CU or unlock vs clicky... those who remained for years made a great community... a passionate community.. and regardless of your start date (or end date)... SWG was unique, special.. and while not flawless.. there was plenty of fun to be had in exploring the game.
I was hopong SWG might opt for the LOTRO mixed platform.. but my guess is the 'retooling' investment costs was not considered worth it by SOE/LA.
Goodbye my old friend.
Like others have mentioned.. you are touching on more than just 1 subject.
I see references to stupid NPC AI that allows you to 'pull' targets in plain sight of others and cut them down 1by1. Smart AI is rare, because people complain when combat is too hard.
Second you are alluding the the pointless reason to 'kill X creatures' other than to advance your character via per-kill XP or per-mission (which groups per-kill together) XP.
Third.. you are suggesting that the act of 'killing' something is violent and should be done sparingly, not as the main form of entertainment.
The target audience.. in combat-based gams.. is violence and survival of the fittest. The puzzle stars off as HOW to defeat them (what skills/process/tactics to use) OR.. as you get more advanced.. how to defeat them FASTER.
There are some games with absolutely no combat.. and people who are attracted to that game will play that game and do puzzles and walk-around missions with no violence. Those games have their place.
But I will say that that I believe there is a strong core playerbase that wants struggle of some kind to overcome.. and war-games will still have that appeal in whatever flavor that suits the imaginary universe.
Should AI get smarter.. yes.. but progressively so that PvE content does not become massively boring. PvP is still the biggest challenge because there is always a bigger fish ready to challenge your dominance, regardless which game you play.. OR.. you get soo good you get bored and quit.
I believe MMO's can stand for a lot more CONSEQUENCE to killing-actions... as in.. how other players or NPC interact with you as a result of your mass-murdering ways. There needs to be a regional-affecting or community-affecting or world-affecting or galaxy-affecting reason to engage in combat other than 'to get more stuff to kill faster'.
Thats where MMO's are dropping the ball... as instance (que up to fight) combat is quick, fast.. but generally holds no in-game world effect other than bragging rights on game forums.
Combat, in MMOs anyway, can affect game change and experience.. if the developers are brave enough to take that road and not cop-out because it might be 'harder' than the standard 'que for instance = get new piece of uber gear' formula that prevails in the current MMO development formula.
Get brave.. add some consequence.. not just items to promote kill griding.
SWG Game Update 17.9 - Gone Fishing!
General Discussion « Star Wars Galaxies
10/05/10 3:10:09 PM
The devs copied the leaderboard code from GCW into the fishing system.. tacked on a few funny game messages.. probably took a dev weekend or two to patch together for the fun of it.
Not everything in a game needs to be about combat.. its about living in a virtual world and being part of it. Fishing is just another way to chill out and explore and enjoy the scenery.
Thanks for keeping MMORPG up to date Badger!
If my reply seems to be favoring one form of MMO style over another, than thats what you are reading into it. The comparisons to other games is fair-play. I don't want TOR to be SWG II.. I don't need TOR to be SWG II.. and I am not expecting TOR be anything else besides what BIOWARE wants it to be.
TOR will have MMO aspects.. its not like everyone is completely isolated from each other.
One of the challenges with speculating like we've all done here in MMORPG is that, even if you viewed the demo read every publication on the game.. its still hard to get a sense of the overall feel of the game.
Even players who have been on the demo have very limited access to the entire gaming experience. So perhaps its unfair to lay any sort of judgement on the game as we simply cannot get a feel for it just yet.
Once the game comes out, I expect a lot of us to be impressed with the game quality... impressed with the storyline.. and utterly drawn into to find out 'what comes next' for a good, long while.
The discussion here is IF TOR is a MMO. Yes.. but not like other MMOs.. a different focus... a different method... but probably with the same 'fun potential' (if not more) than any other MMO out there.
Ultimately what matters is not what we describe as a MMO or not.. whats more important is: Is it fun to play?
The answer depends a lot on your expectations as well as what you experience when you actually log in the first few times.
I expect TOR to be entirely different than most MMOs in terms of delivery.. but I also expect to move around and interact like I do in any other MMO.. talking with other players.. grouping.. guilding.. trading.. doing high difficulty missions.
What I don't expect is very much sandbox tools for a virtual world... at least not to the extent of other MMORPG systems out there.
But so what.. so long as its fun.. and you personally enjoy it.. is all that matters when the game finally goes public.
Its not a SwG (or EvE) promo thread.. I am just drawing comparisons for the sake of reference to something familiar to me and quite a few others.
Will you need other players to truely interact.. probably not for the majority of the content..
Housing systems in SWG is about player interaction.. which ties into crafting. Weapon systems also ties into crafting in SWG.. as does Spaceships. There is a larger investment in 'player to player' systems in some games than what I suspect will be done for TOR.
All this adds to character development.. being a vital part of the game world.
I suspect TOR will have less of that in exchange for a more personal experience in storyline.
Nothing wrong with that.. but certainly a different approach that what might appeal to some players.
I am quite sure SWTOR will be 'MMO-like', as in.. be massively multiplayer.. as in having lots and lots of players.
However, I doubt its going to be the same level of PLAYER INFLUENCE we see in other games.
In other words.. having other players around will be a 'bonus'.. not a necessary part of the game and even maybe more of a distraction in some cases.
The game is story-driven.. class-specific... consequence-based interactions with NPCs. Basically, TOR is giving you a # of possible interactions with NPCs including your companions.. and then building alternative story lines based on your decisions and altering the NPCs/Environement based on your 'chosen path'.
Its a very neat idea.. will all the flash of fully voiced, cinematic cutscenes.. and pre-determined companions to help fill in the story line.
In other words.. BIOWARE is very much making your story for you.. you ride along and see how you affect it.
End game.. is clearly about trying it again with other decisions or trying another 'story' path with another character class. BIOWARE has often said 'Try it again in another profession' perhaps not in those exact words.. but I've heard it said enough times that it seems to be the main focus of the end game.. at least for now.
Things like player driven economy.. crafting.. piloting.. (not 'driving' a ship).. exploration.. recreation.. will all exist but will at best be secondary systems.. add-ons.. and not part of the CORE of the game.
EvE and SwG are better examples of the players making content from other players. NPC interactions (outside of grinding) is really a secondary focus.. its more about making your company (EvE) or city (SWG) and shaping the world around you than playing a character in a 'story'.
Character development.. as in inviduals that have their own story... will probably not exist in the traditional roleplay method. We will look a LOT alike.. we will have the same companions.. we will fly the same ships.. we will do the same missions.. so a lack of true character-attachment will be something I am betting will suffer in long-term playability.
Some people don't want 2 or 5 characters.. they want 1 or 2 truely unique characters that they bond with and can still have fun playing with after the 'story' line ends (ie: is waiting for the next NPC content publication to get released)
I am pretty sure SWTOR could be called a MMO with a highly solo/NPC based focus.
I imagine TOR will continue to evolve around the storyline concept.. and perhpas add some PvP end-game that might hold some subscribers.
But will you feel UNIQUE as a player character in SWTOR... I wouldn't bet on it. Not to the same extent you can in other MMO games.
I am not saying that is bad or good.. I am saying its a different direction than the original RolePlay vision for MMO games. If it sells accounts.. then it works.. regardless of how much inter-player interaction is involved.
I have to suggest that SWG might also fit the same 'hybrid' concept as LOTRO did .. offering either a full access subscription along with a F2P access.
Why? Because SWG is not going to grow by any significant amount.. SWTOR is definately going to put a big dent into SWG subscription base, even if it may not be permanent.
SWG has tons of 'paid for' legacy content to offer to attract F2P.. and there is certainly an economy for 'pay shop cosmetics' as the current Trading Card Game system has already proven.
Additional character slots.. larger datapads.. etc.. could be rolled into the 'shop' pay-to-access componentst that subscribers could get included.
SWG is an old lady in terms of MMO's.. lots of great things.. lots of content.. but not new or shiney or even marketed anymore. A F2P option might revive the revenue a little and give the developers some more cash to hire an extra developer or two.
I am betting a lot of big-wigs are eyeballing LOTRO right now, and the other games, to see if this F2P offering has traction and boosts revenue.
So lets hear it from the f2p players
General Discussion « Lord of the Rings Online
9/17/10 5:29:18 PM
I played the LOTRO trial version a few times.. but never made it to a subscription.
The reason I didn't sub had nothing to do with quality or community or content.. there was plenty of both.
MY reason.. is that I already have a solid community in my 'main' MMO game that takes most of my play-time (father, 2 kids, non-MMO wife, community interests, outside hobbies.. and full time job).
No, my reason why I didn't get a subscription was time.. I didn't have time to get into the game and felt I was wasting my money if I subscribed to it... NOT because it wasn't a good quality game of an IP I love.. no.. and I supposed I can afford a subscription.. it just felt wasteful if I was not going to commit myself to the investment.. the community/learning the system investment.
I am a veteran SWG player.. I know the game mechanics as good as any... I am a vested part of the community, a guild leader, and a forum profession Senator on my 2nd term. So I only have so much 'free time' to play anything else.
So when LOTRO became F2P.. it gave me an option to 'ease' into the game.. and not feel guilty about spending monthly dollars if I don't play it more than a few times a week.. or a month.. depending on what else is going on in my life.
Inevitably.. I will spend a few bucks on LOTRO on expansions OR a subscription.. when I get the point where I am able and ready to really use it.
But for now.. I know if things are slow on SWG.. I can hop onto LOTRO and explore that world for a little while.
So.. thats me.. and I am not sure if my situation is unique or not.. however I imagine there are others like me who simply want a 'casual' 2nd or 3rd MMO to play for fun without the monthly obligation.
That.. and my daughter might eventually want to play it. I've been reading her the LOTR trilogy at bedtime for the past year or so... we are on the 3rd book now... and one day she might want to actually play an elf-princess. I hope LOTRO is around.. and the non-Leet, (possibly due to no PvP players) friendly community is still there to greet her and treat her properly.
From everything I've read on the subject.. the F2P hybrid works fine for me.. and for most of the actual subscribers (not those who quit).. so I guess thats a win-win situation, as best as I can tell.
I played STO a bit after release with my friends from another MMO game for about a month or so. Then I took a break and tried it a little bit last month to see the new interior layouts.
Unfortunatly for STO.. I am still far to involved in other MMO's to really want to maintain a regular subscription in STO.. as it does not carry enough of the MMO featuers I enjoy to keep me paying a monthly subscription fee.
I really do like the space combat.. particularly in teams.. I find it fun and authentic to what I envision ST combat would look and feel like (in 3rd person). Ground is pretty neat.. I like the NPC team concept.. but the actual missions are teadious right now.
I like how they are maturing the game.. making the ships more alive.. adding more content.. tweaking out bugs.. all these things are good and healthy advancement that I thinki will help maintain the current playerbase a lot longer.
I'd really like to drop in an play STO more often.. but I am thinking a few times a month.. not 3 or 5 times a week. Its a fun game.. but without the larger complexity of a full-features (multi-factioned, less-instanced) MMO.. it simply does not support a community-approach that attracts me to invest my time into it beyond the odd 'drop in' session.
In all fairness.. its going to take a LOT from any MMO to pull me into more than just casual play.. I already invest enough time in my current MMO community (forums/guid management/PvP rank maintenance) that I have very little room for a 2nd and 3rd MMO subscription, even if I can probably afford it.
I will probably keep an eye on STO.. like I do a few other MMOs. I've revisited CoH and LOTRO recently after a year (or longer) of inactivity. I guess I will just keep juggling accounts to suit my interest.. while keeping my main account (SWG) constant as my home base.
If you are a big ST fan and want to invest some time into a game.. STO is not a bad place to do that. Its not perfect.. but its certainly improving and maturing quite well.
There are some SWG players that prefer small-population servers for whatever personal reason (tigher community, less lag, less crowding, more open spaces for cities).
That said.. I would rather see players who prefer larger-population get a free CTS ticket so they can move. I still think the # of SWG servers is too high.. there are still to many very-low population servers that new players (and certain returning veterans) might get 'stuck on' without knowing.
SWG could probably shave off 2 or 4 more servers and still have plenty of room. That still might happen.. someday.
Changes in SWG have a lot more to do with timing 'windows of opportunity' than forum-basing the devs. If the devs are not in 'profession update mode'... then even if you are a Senator you are NOT going to get anything done during your term if something else has priority. You can rant, scream, threaten.. but if they are commiteed to something else.. which was probably demanded a few years earlier.. then they are going to probably stay the course and all that campaigning is gone to waste.
Bashing the devs.. flooding the forums with demands.. would be a gigantic step backwards. The devs have, in the past year or so, taken care of some long-withstanding community 'demands'.. and the future is looking bright for more of that kind of work being done. But here are limits.. the devs are only so many people.. they have limited time and their priorities are to keep the game alive and fun.. and that sometimes involved putting other things on the back-burner.
I ran a 2+ year campaign to Stance (Light) Jedi skills fixed. I knew that the GU3 design changes to Stance Jedi would ultimately lead to the issues that became commonplace well before the changes ever hit live. I begged.. I pleaded.. I did everything I could think of to have the devs listen and make adjustments. Unfortunately.. those devs didn't understand.. they couldn't figure it out because they refused to see it from a players perspective.
Well.. fast forward 2 years later.. with constant and persistant campagning.. not throwing insults.. not bashing devs.. not ranting on the forums.. but simply keeping the issue alive... Stance Jedi finally got fixed because a 'window of opportunity' opened up and the devs where receptive to making changes.
The CURRENT SWG dev team is a lot more receptive than I've ever seen in the past.. unfortunatly they are also a very small team. The good news is that the dev team seems to KNOW the game a lot better from a PLAYER perspective.. wheras before the old devs seemed to be disconnected from that perspective.
So.. there will be windows of opportunity in the future for the various 'requests' players put forward... however it may take months.. or yes YEARS to get there.
Thats the bit of advice I give players asking me about "wouldn't it be great if the devs did XXXX'. My response is often 'yes'... but are you willing to put in the work to keep the subject alive for the 2 years it might take for the team to finally get it done.
Demands are easy to make.. an easy to justify. The hard part is sticking by your idea.. keeping the lines of communication open.. and being around when the window of opportunity opens up.
SWG is smaller.. but tigher.. and in a lot of ways.. that a whole lot better because the ACTIVE current players are finally seeing improvements requested years earlier come to live. For those who stuck it out... its very satisfying.
Star Wars: The Old Republic: The Story Problem
News & Features Discussion « General Discussion
9/15/10 4:03:04 PM
You really hit the nail on the head for me in this article. I always expected BW to make something 'other' than SWG II or WoW II.. so while others where putting on the blinders and 'hoping' this game would be the ultimate MMO of all time with the very best feature from every game they like... I didn't quite build up that level of expectation.
I remembered something said.. and forgive me for not linking or quoting precisely.. but I recall reading that BIOWARE was making a 'MMO-Like' version of KOTOR. To me. thats not a full featured MMO commitment.. thats not SWG II.. but more of an extension on a single player game but in a 'massive' multiplayer environment. All that means to me is that I can group (or not) with other player to do the pre-defined missions.
I think the very definition of MMO has shifted... and the usage of 'MMO" is being applied to a number of variations on the concept of 'massive multiplayer'.. but minus the RPG or World-Driven economy stuff.. like crafting, enterainment, housing, cities, honest to goodness space flight sim... the stuff that makes you feel part of the 'world' and not just a character in a pre-written story.
BIOWARE is gambling here.. on a MMO Audience.. and audience formed by people who HAVE played Sandbox MMO games like SWG, EvE... as well as the 'new' traditional instance/raid MMO games like WoW, LOTRO, CoH, etc. By calling SWTOR a MMO product.. they are going to attract the attention (and critisms) of the MMO audience. And I think that particular audience is starting to get the big picture... TOR is not a traditional MMO... it will possibly have a lot less of the traditional MMO features.. as 'open ended choices' are traded off for fully voiced, cinematic, multiple-ending cutscenes.
SWTOR is going to look great.. sound great.. and probably be a total riot for KOTOR fans till they blow through the majority of the game content.
Then.. SWTOR is going to have to mature into something broader to keep that MMO audience.. who expect a fun end-game.. expect social aspects.. and don't always want to do re-roll another character just to 'read it again'.
Keeping ahead of the story curve is a slippery slope.. players DO powerlevel.. they DO play all night and all day just to get to the ending as fast as possible. Its much easier for a player to out-pace development.
So.. while I am not worried about SWTOR being a fun game.. a great story.. a visual experience.. I am concerned the the MMO Player Community is still setting itself up for disappointment if they don't see this product for what it is.
SWTOR is a book.. an illustrated book.. with different chapters for different characters and situatoins.. but its still lineal.. and like all books it has an ending... till the author writes a sequal.
I am looking forward to SWTOR.. I love a good Star Wars story... I love cutscenes (the first time).. I love listening to dialog (once or twice)... and I love the look of the Star Wars universe comming ot life.
But will I re-do every character to re-experience the game from a different profession viewpoint.. maybe.. its too early to tell just yet.
So what if people want to be Uncle Owen???!!!!???
General Discussion « Star Wars: The Old Republic
9/15/10 2:12:57 PM
Actually... its not so much that story-based MMO will have lower retention.. thats not what I am saying per-say. I am talking about a target audience.. the 'Sandbox Crowd' will likely not be as crazy about rolling a new character after reaching the 'current' ending of the story (till the next update).. should that ever happen.. and start a new 'story' based on XXX character instead of YYY character perspective.
TOR may not be as attractive in the long term for Sandbox-styled players.. maybe.. this is speculation on my part.
The ability to retain those kind of players seems to be a lot more limited in TOR with what appears.. so far.. to be a realatively low social aspect game. However I could be entirely wrong.. perhaps the group stories will create a whole new kind of 'social combat' experience.. which has happened in other.. more combat-orientated games.
And I am not qualified to say.. for sure.. if Sandbox players is a big enough audience to support a new IP or not. I can speculate and debate it.. but really I have no idea what would have happened.. eventually.. to SWG if it was left untouched. Would players have quit from boredom.. maybe... possibly. I think EvE is pretty sandbox-like in my limited experience playing it.. and it seems to still be going strong and still adding new players to replace those who leave.
Personally I am not a pure-sandbox player either.. although I do play SWG.. its not the only style I like. SWG attracts me because I CAN do sandbox stuff.. but I don't ONLY do sandbox stuff. There are theme parks.. instance raids.. battlefields.. those kind of fairly structured systems that are common to the 'new' pre-set content methods being used in most MMO's today... those exist in SWG as well.
I suppose a lot of player where hoping for more 'sandboxy' elements in upcomming games like TOR just so they can express themselves and immerse themselvees with a bit more freedom. Obviously not a full-featured open-system sandbox.. but the ability to turn around in space and not just participate in 'combat' in every aspect.. thats something that does carry a lot of appeal to players who do burn out on 'themepark' repetition.
Star Wars Galaxies.. for all its faults, shortcommings and bad history.., still has at its very foundation the ability to have a lot of fun just exploring.. crafting.. entertaining.. building houses & cities .. and never once picking up a blaster or light sabre. Oh..you still can blast away or slice with a glow-bat.. thats there as well. You can raid 24x7 and farm instances for loot... but you don't necessarily have to.
TOR is purpose-built to give players a particular story experience as a pre-set character where decions lead down one of several pre-determined paths to provide appropriate NPC feedback and story conclusions.
SWG is purpose-built to leave things open ended.. game stories are part of mini-quests and NPC reactions are limited. Its other player reactions that generate your personal 'story'. Are you a sucessful munitions crafter... that depends on how you treat other players and the quality of your goods.
Both are good, fun designs.. both cater to a slightly different audience but there is certainly a good portion of players that can enjoy both at different times.
I just hope the 'big wigs' don't automatically assume that TOR will be the only supportable Star Wars MMO... because long term I think that will not be the case.. that SWG players will still prefer SWG for the unique parts it offers... even if they 'test out' TOR for a few months to a year.
BIOWARE's hype-factory needs to be cautious here.. players are quite worked up and expectations of the 'best MMO ever' where being tossed around on a regular basis. I suspect.. a lot of the SWG Veterans might have made that prediction a bit to early.. and expected TOR to be SWG II... and now are starting to see that is not the case. The space 'flight' (more space-driving) release by TOR had some serious critism.. and I bet a LOT of that critism stems from the expectations of some of these players.. that they hoped for something like SWG or better.
I could go on..but I think I've done enough of that already.
TOR just might.. might.. remind players that SWG still has a lot of the things they want to experience & do. I just hope SOE and LA don't toss in the towel too soon.. there is still some fight left in the old girl.. and she has been counted down & out prematurely more times than I care to recall.
I will agree that Galaxies has become a lot more CL90 (max level) focused.. and that the community is largely made up of top-level characters.. by far.
Being a the only non-CL90 character at certain times does put some extra pressure on new players to try to 'get up to speed' with everyone else and feel like they can truely participate. Thats a challenge for any mature game.. and not something SWG has every really dealth with.. probably that was never really 'planned for' either at the start of the game. Part of the challenges of being one of the first MMO games is that you don't always foresee what the game will look like after 7 years.
City of Heroes did plan ahead and add a system designed to allow 'lowbies' to temporarly level up or 'vets' to temporarily level down. Galaxies does not have that.. although the subject has been put forward on the forums a few times.
I don't think anyone in SWG.. the players or developers... have any expectations for any substantial low-level polulation growth. I don't think I will every see a bunch of new or mid-level players (and not veterans rolling new toons) doing game quests. The 'new' players tend to be some of you people.. the returning Vets... so thats what the devs are catering to... a few newbies.. a few more veterans... but mostly existing players with multiple accounts.
Whats ultimately important is if you enjoy the community aspects of the game. That includes PvP and crafting and even just comparing notes on the forums with other players.
Most veterans WILL eagerly help new players.. what they typically don't enjoy is not the questions..but the lack of effort some players make simply demanding credits or 'tell me everything' and not spacing it out with gameplay and learning.
But still.. in all fairness... its been a long time since I actively seeked out new player to help them out. I used to do a lot more of that.. now I pretty much only do that on the forums.. my 'in-game' time is more limited than years ago.. so I tend to do more playing and guild stuff and not much seeking out or recruiting as before.
There is good and bad in any game. The good parts of SWG is that there is a mature playerbase.. there are a lot of players still open to helping you out if you stick around for more than 2 logins and actually want to spend time with them.
Like any mature MMO.. the 'newness' excitement has waned off.. but there is still a lot of fun to be had re-discovering the game anew.. and there are players willing to help you out if you invest some time and energy finding them.
It would be no different than starting EvE from scratch.. help is there if you look for it. SWG could do a better job at that, no doubt.. and should have from the start... but its probably not going to change mucn now that the target for new subscribers is returning vets (in my opinion, of course).
So what if people want to be Uncle Owen???!!!!???
General Discussion « Star Wars: The Old Republic
9/15/10 11:28:42 AM
I really do 'get' what the OP is saying.
Lots of players.. particularly disgruntled anti-NGE SWG veterans wanted SWTOR to actually be SWG II but in TOR time period.
They hoped for a pre-CU version.. after all.. BIOWARE has tons of cash.. tons of skill.. so they could do it.. if they wanted.
But they obviously are not making a Sandbox SW MMO.. they are making a TOR MMO.. in their own menthod.. and betting on control+story = fun.
SWTOR will likely be about playing all professions to experience all the different facets of the same basic story.
SWG was about setting up props and short-stories.. but mainly about allowing players to create a Star Wars community.. where players interacted heavily with each other.
I don't think TOR is going to be anywhere close to as community-orientated as SWG. Companions will replace other players.. and there is not a lot of good reasons to just 'hang out'.. as there is no buffing/social (ie: entertainer) class to perform that service.
Uncle Owen was about playing the SWG-crafting mini-game.. but he still interacted with other players.. could still produce goods for other crafter which supported housing & cities... as well as raw goods for munitions & combat.
In other words... even Uncle Owen had a 'purpose'... a viable reason to exist as a non-combat class.
Now... not everyone was just purely Uncle Owen (non-combat).. but some where (and stil are).. however thats where multple characters added to the experience.. created alter-egos that you could do both crafting on one toon and combat on another. SWG enouraged community development.. and still does.
TOR will encourage you to explore stories.. but I really wonder what kind of community it will create. The social aspects of MMO is very important for player retention... and I am not talking about PvP braggarts showing their leet skilz and such non-sense.
I mean.. head on over to the bar and chat with someone for fun... or fly up in space and yes: dicking around for a while... exploring the various wrecks or holding a party near a nebula or planet for background.
TOR will have some of these 'social/community' aspects..but only a fraction.. a drop in the bucket compared to what existed (and still exists) in SWG.
The crying shame is if the powers-that-be think TOR is a SWG replacement.. because it is not. Its different game that will ultimately appeal to a different audience.. and will hopefully be a lot of fun and sucessful.
But TOR is not a SWG replacement.. it has no intentions to replace SWG in terms of game function or community appeal.
I just hope that Lucas Arts recognizes this.. and helps SOE weather the storm as some SWG players try out TOR but will likely keep some SWG accounts open as well.
It would be a crying shame to lose the SWG community... because TOR is not going to support it in the same way.
If you miss the SW community.. its still very much alive in Galaxies.. if you are on an active server like Starsider. I am still there.. I am still playing.. my guild is alive and healthy.. and the devs are still doing things to keep the game fun to play.
You should be able solo most of Mustafar now.. again with a bit better gear and a few more buffs.. like Medic Buffs and Entertainer Buffs.
Most of the game is still able to be done solo... and even some of the heroics can be done with just 1 or 2 other players (if they are geared & buffed up well enough).
If you never intend on doing group PvP.. you really don't need high-end gear at all to play all the solo content.
But.. between you and me.. the best fun I've had in SWG is when I am teamed up with someone else. And its not just because of the content.. but the inter-player interaction that builds relationships that has often turned into friendships.
I am a current & active SWG player.
I am the current SWG Jedi Profession Senator. (on my 2nd term now)
I have 3 active accounts and 6x CL90 toons. (Jedi, BH, Commando, Smuggler, Entertainer, Officer)
I've played every profession at least once.
I am part of a mid-sized and healthy guild (DotA) with mature and well behaved players. Most are my good friends.
My guild and most of my previous server (Scylla) move to Starsider during the free character transfer offering.. best move we ever made.
Starsider has a healthy population of players of all kinds.. crafter, entertainers, PvP, PvE, pilots.. but not always busy but rarely dead (unless you are talking 3am EST.
The game is alive.. the community is alive.. and there are still small but important game updates happening from time to time that patch up long-outstanding issues or add a bit of new 'stuff' to do.
There is lots of stuff I have not done yet.. SWG has a lot of legacy content and repeatable content (like raids) for high-end items & collections.
The development team has been the best I've seen in 4 years.. at listening and performing small changes .. but changes that really matter in terms of game-fun.
The lag that happens in invasions and PvP can be challenging.. just be aware its not always smooth sailing.
What you will find:
As far as game 'health'... I cannot comment because I am not privy to SOE profits.. which I doubt anyone here is.
As far as 'worthwhile'.. I think so. SWTOR is not a SWG replacement... its a different game that will not be a Sandbox style like SWG and likely a lot less social/community orientated (no crafters, no entertainers, no housing, no player cities).
So if you are wondering if there is anyone to play Star Wars with on Galaxies and have fun.. the answer is YES... provided you pick the right server and not one of the dead ones.
Starsider, Flurry, Chilastra, Bria are safe bets for community size.
Like Badger said.. be sure to drop by the SWG Jedi Profession forums or you can send me a Private Message if you are more comfortable with that.
I am the current SWG Jedi profession Senator.. and I would be glad to help you (or anyone else) with advice on Jedi equipment and skills.
For solo.. the best Jewelry Set is probably Guardian Jewelry.. however you have to perform Heroic group missions to get a full set.
Cybernetics are optional but not required.
Also, Jedi can wear any armor now.. which is probably a better option (in terms of stats) till you eventually get to the higher end collection items (Master Cloak Collection, Belt of Bodo Bass Collection, Meditate Collection). Those collections are all done doing the 'hologrind' now.
Jedi Treasure Map Jewelry is pretty affordable.. do a vendor search on the Bazaar for items with the keyword "Jedi Wristguard" (CL61) or "Jedi Knight Wristguard" (CL85).
You can also search for "Jedi Knight Robes" now.. they are tradeable.. and cheap.. and offer better stats than Apprentice Robes for a CL85 character.
This is the perfect time for SOE to start giving Galaxies that one last chance.
General Discussion « Star Wars Galaxies
9/03/10 2:48:34 PM
In reference to the original post topic...
A whole lot depends on what you are looking to do and if you are willing to invest a bit of time into the game.
A lot.. and I mean a LOT of old players simply cannot get past the past and find the fun in SWG no matter what I say or what the devs do... and even fully 'roleback' (not going to happen) wouldn't change that feeling of betrayal and anger. For those who harbor those feelings.. justified or otherwise... the rest of my response is not going to matter much, might as well save yourself some time and find something else to read/do/discuss.
However, if you still want to be part of the SW community.. be around other players who enjoy playing in a SW environment.. and miss the feeling of owning your own house.. or city.. starships... and of course characters.. then SWG has improved a lot in the past four years.
Professions are much better balanced.. not perfect.. not flawless.. but there is a better dynamic between the profession and expertise choices that allows you to participate as you preferred profession in the vast majority of game content.. PvP or PvE.
Game missions/quests.. are in both single-part (legacy) and repeatable format.. or mixtures. The biggest change is its not as hard as it used to be... and most rewards are now tradable so you can participate more casually yet still achieve (or trade) a pretty solid standard. PvE is a touch easy.. if you have ALL the top-end gear anyway.. but still enjoyable and is continually getting a few small adjustments to re-invent content on existing assets.
GCW.. Galatic Civil War.. the PvP and PvE 'content' system has seen some steady improvements.. from ranking to leaderboards.. as well as Battlefields & City Invasions.. there are LOTS of ways to get involved in the GCW system and participate.. even as non-combatant like Entertainer and Crafter.
GCW seems to be the primary 'backbone' focus of content development.. or more accurately system development.. to help give SWG something 'unique' to our timeline and game systems that will not be reproduced by SWTOR.. at least as best as I can guess anyway. The GCW is now more visible.. carries more 'effect' on gameplay.. but its still entirely optional.
The 'bad' news about SWG is not that is dying or empty servers..
Lag.. has been challenging.. something that can affect gameplay quite badly in certain situations. The devs are trying to resolve it.. I hope they get there.
Scope.. the dev team is a shadow if its former size.. HOWEVER.. they are way WAY more in touch with players and more hands-on in terms of making the game more fun to play by removing silly restrictions and maintaining a level of balance as best they can.
Lately.. the SWG Dev team has been on the right track... the best I've seen in years. That will NOT be enough to win-over players still upset with previous game revisions.. but honestly SWG is not trying to win everyone back.. but just those who are able and willing to see the game for what it is.
A FUN Star Wars experience.
Not perfect.. not always.. not 24x7... but often enough to be worthwhile with a steady investment of time and with a good group of guild-mates to play Star Wars with.
SWG will never be in its 'glory' again.. that kind of fan-fare will be released on TOR soon enough. Nope.. it won't roll-back.. won't go back to 32 sub-profession choices.. no Alpha-Class Jedi.. none of that will happen.
However, it will keep plucking along adding little bits on little bits.. tweaking what it has.. adding something here.. removing something there.. and the community will hopefully sustain this gem of a game for a good long time.
So far.. I have yet to see its replacement. TOR is looking promising.. and I have a lot of faith in BIOWARE to make a good game.. but it will be different than Galaxies.... not a direct replacement.. or so I am guessing.
Come on out.. Try a City Invasion.. hang out with us.. we are still there.
DOUBLE XP weekend... so now is as good a time as any!
DC Universe Online: Weekly #2: Iconic Play and the Lure of the IP
News & Features Discussion « General Discussion
8/16/10 5:02:06 PM
DCO will face the same obstacles that CoH presented to me as a player. In CoH, I was able to make all my myu childhood 'supers' come to live.. both visually and more or less some of the basic powers I imagined.
So I got to create them.. fly around (jump around).. save some NPC civillians.. group for a few NPC missions.. and even join a super-hero 'guid' and roleplay a little.
Then I got bored.. and fast. I don't typically try dozens of games.. and I don't get bored easily.. but for CoH the 'fun' part seemst to be messing with the character generator.. and not actually playing that much.
These are characters beloved to me.. and yet because I never got a real 'home' and couldn't explore the any 'alter-ego' side (this was a over year ago).. CoH never managed to keep me in the game beyond Level 20'ish.
DCO is going to have an uphill battle making it better for me than CoH. Yes. sure.. I can fight alongside Batman perhaps.. but I have a feeling its just going to be another 'instance' thing.. you do it till you get bored of doing it.. then you have nothing else to do 'on the side'.
SOE gave me LOTS to do 'on the side' with SWG. Sure.. sure.. boo and hiss (get out of your system).... but I still have a house (or spacecraft) to decorate... items to craft.. space to explore.. as well as they typical PvP and PvE questgrinding.
I hope DCO remembers that its a MMO.. not an instanced-engine. Character development has to go beyond repeating quest series to get lootz.... that will attract some players... but for players like me it takes more than 'hanging' with Batman... its the little details in between that fill in the time and create a sense of 'owership' in your toons.