I stopped playing just a few days ago and don't think the game is for me, but I can vouch for the CS - I sent a ticket about a few things and it was taken care of almost instantly. 

Originally posted by Slheyas

Seriously, 2012 is bringing a ton of AAA MMO titles that will probably all take a good chunk of players from many mmos. From the top of my head there are :

 

-Guild Wars 2

-The Secret World

-Tera

-Archeage

 

Those 4 titles are promising and in all honesty they all look really good, pretty sure they will all be successful (some more than other) at the detriment of other games, Swtor being one of them. A lot of players are playing the game only because they're waiting for another title (that'd be me). A lot will just quit and go play the shiny new mmo and we're already seeing players growing bored of the game and leaving before the free month is up.

 

So what do you think? Do you believe SWTOR has what it takes to survive the onslaught of new and innovative (because those 4 are innovative in at least one aspect, infinitely more than TOR) mmos? I honestly think the future of this game is pretty grim, and it has only been one month.

 

The game is good as far as (pardon me for using that expression) WoW-Clones go but I seriously think that a lot of players are growing bored of the classic WoW formula, it worked for a long while but now they crave for more and TOR might have trouble offering what they ask for, voice acting is nice but it's an addition that doesn't make the game that much fun in the long run.

 

Just my 2 cents.

The game will take a huge hit - it's just too much of the mid 2000's mmo style.  Even a lot of people that currently are defending TOR, in my opinion, will get pulled away by one of those games just because it will feel fresh.  I think SWTOR would have thrived if released 4-5 years ago - but in 2012, it will really suffer.

Originally posted by stayontarget

Not related but interesting none the less.

http://i.imgur.com/RAXHh.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/NZQne.jpg

wowwwww...................................

Originally posted by insanejosh

Originally posted by sanosukex

Originally posted by Zorgo

Originally posted by fundayz

No high res textures? After you said it was a bug and being fixed? How can anyone pretend that Bioware knows what they are doing now?

1. No forum search function.

2. No UI customizability.

3. No viable way to consistently play varied builds (No dual spec and uncapped respec costs).

4. No queueing for specific Warzones.

5. No server forums.

6. Phasing still remains throughout the game, while it was said that it was only for the beginning zones and only for a short time after release.

7. No proper LFG feature. Not even a global LFG channel.

8. Many people still have performance issues even with the lowered graphics, especially in 8v8 PvP. 8v8.

9. Unfinished CE shop.

10. No world atmosphere.

11.  Tiny draw distance for ground effects.

12. No race variety.

13. No macro or addon support.

14. Ability delay.

15. Simultaneous US and EU maintenance. As if they can't afford two maintenance crews like pretty much every decent MMO on the market right now.

Seriously? Sure, individually these are not gamebreaking but combined they really make you wonder what the budget was spent on. 

 

 

There seem to be those that believe it is financially possible and physically possible to add every feature from every previous mmo before launch in a polished state in less development time than all previous mmos, although it took some of those games literally over a decade to create and implement these said features.

Gone seem to be the days when an mmo was to 'grow' after its initial release, now we demand a 'complete' ever growing game which already has everything we ever wanted, but magically can still add more of what we want. In short, we are demanding a 'feature', which is unobtainable.

The game is not a month old, could you folks let them spend some time with their families before crying foul and their slow pace of adding features.

If you compare this game's features at release with every other mmo's release features, it may not be at the top of the list, but it is a long way from the bottom. As mmo's go, this game is proving that there is a continuing trend that we as customers are receiving more at release than previously.  They made decisions that resulted in a fluid polished, playable game - if they put the lfd tool on the back burner to make that happen, I am happy.

I slogged through EQ with hand drawn maps created while I played - I can certainly be patient for an lfd tool.

true games will grow but rift has almost all those features at launch.. I'd rather them of had most of those at launch and not have to work on them now and concetrate on getting more content out.

Why does everyone always bring up Rift? Look at rift now, its so freaking dead they are giving the game away. Give it a couple of months and it will be F2P.

I also bet, more than half the people complaining on this site about TOR don't even play the game. Oh well, in a couple of months they will all be complaining about GW2.

It's because everything in RIFT is done with really high quality and attention to detail, which is what TOR lacks in so many things.  The problem with RIFT, however, is that it's just boring.  It's more of a clone than TOR by a long shot.  So then the argument could be made, which is a fair argument - is it better to have high quality attention to detail but boring gameplay, or low quality / attention to detail but fun gameplay?  

I argue there should be both - which neither TOR or RIFT is. 

Originally posted by spizz

Graphic is the least issue  for me, it just lacks in other more important things.

I agree, there are plenty of other reasons I'm not staying past my 30 days, but it's still just 1 more thing about the game that makes it feel low to mediocre quality.  There are so many things that add up.

Originally posted by Rhoklaw

Originally posted by Lowcaian

Originally posted by Rhoklaw

Oh noes! We have to play SWTOR with graphics that are still better than the most popular NA game ever? I will actually applaud EA / BioWare for creating a game in mind for all PC users, not just high end FFXIV . As for being lied to and told the game would launch with high res textures, I'm afraid I have to disagree. I'm tired of gaming companies trying to create the ultimate looking MMO and failing miserably because of the performance hit we take during PvP or Raids.

This isn't Skyrim, so let's not harp on SWTOR for making a game that decides to go the route of performance over looks. If you're an expert on such issues, please let us know, so we can make all future MMO's an Elder Scrolls masterpiece.

Some think the graphics are ok, to some they're not, which is okay, to each his own. That is however not the issue. The issue is wether or not they deliberately have been misledaing their customers.

So what I suggest all the high end texture fans should do is write a petition to have them reimplement high res textures into the game with a clause you need to "OK" at game launch that states, if you can't play the game with high res textures, don't come crying to us, than I'm sure you'll get what you want.

You seriously named your character Empress........?

I've seriously lost count of how many things they are going to "look into" or that are in the "future plans". 

Loved this game but the population was just too low to stay.

However, lots of signs in place that it's going to be going F2P soon:

1.  New devs have been put on board.

2.  New content update making it more accessible to new players (although some vets not happy about it)

3.  Killing of Live Gamer Exchange

4.  Response on twitter from Smedley when asked about Vanguard F2P recently with - "Stay tunes ;)"

Originally posted by fundayz

No high res textures? After you said it was a bug and being fixed? How can anyone pretend that Bioware knows what they are doing now?

1. No forum search function.

2. No UI customizability.

3. No viable way to consistently play varied builds (No dual spec and uncapped respec costs).

4. No queueing for specific Warzones.

5. No server forums.

6. Phasing still remains throughout the game, while it was said that it was only for the beginning zones and only for a short time after release.

7. No proper LFG feature. Not even a global LFG channel.

8. Many people still have performance issues even with the lowered graphics, especially in 8v8 PvP. 8v8.

9. Unfinished CE shop.

10. No world atmosphere.

11.  Tiny draw distance for ground effects.

12. No race variety.

13. No macro or addon support.

14. Ability delay.

15. Simultaneous US and EU maintenance. As if they can't afford two maintenance crews like pretty much every decent MMO on the market right now.

Seriously? Sure, individually these are not gamebreaking but combined they really make you wonder what the budget was spent on. 

 

 

16.  Website is constantly crashing

17.  No longer can you search previous topics and posts of users on the forums.

18.  No longer a "suggstion" board on the forum.

19.  Non existent guild functionality.

20.  Auction house / GTN that is terrible.

21.  Absolutely HORRID customer support.

Originally posted by Vallista

I was really excited about this game for a long time.  I figure with 3 major companies working together, that this title would inspire my hopes for a good mmo.  However, after watching mmorpg video review and reading countless posts on this forum, I'm really scared about picking up this game.  I feel like I'm making a deal with the devil.  I'm sorry but that is how I feel about it.  

The main thing that put a bad taste in my mouth was mmorpg video review.  The dishonesty of the review really got me thinking maybe this game is being pushed.  Don't get me wrong I'm not saying this game sucks, but for a major title by now my friends, family or normal chatter in my local video game community would speak more likely of this game but that is not the case.  I never in all my years as a member of this site, seen such a disregard of being honest about a game.  I even question how much experience the guy has reviewing mmo or playing them.  I'm not surpriesed, since mmorpg has tried many times in the past to push F2P games and we all know how bogus that is.    

While I'm a fan of star wars films, I'm not a hardcore or fanboy of series.  For me things like graphics, gameplay, overall presentation and community a lot more importation in an mmo than  star wars theme base mmo.  I seen the graphics of this game and compare it to game like rift, I can' honesty say they equal or better, in fact I can't even say there equal to rift.  The gameplay from what I seen in countless videos....well....looks like other mmos. 

After reading countless posts from players that have real criticisms, I can't feel but sad that this game is not worth getting at this time.  Many have even said its not really an mmo it's a single player game with co-op optionial.  Please tell me that is not the case.  I can't afford to sign this deal with the devil crossing his fingers.  

I don't know, I think you're making a little bigger deal than necessary.  Just buy the game and if you dont like it don't play past the first month, pretty easy.  I was super excited for this game, spent 4 months reading lore to know everything about the setting, played through KOTOR 1 and 2 again, and was basically positive it would be my final mmo home.

Now I'm not even subbing past my 30 days.  Am I upset?  yeah, kind of, maybe more disappointed, but there are always more mmo's coming down the pipeline.

Originally posted by BigBadWolfe

Okay so I'm hearing a lot of reports from players saying that they like TOR but they don't want to stay subbed to it, or that they are going to cancel and resub back to the game when they've added more content/fixed issues.

DON'T DO THAT.

EA/Bioware spent a lot of money on SW:TOR, I'm hearing estimates around $300 million or so, that's the most money a company has ever tossed at the MMO industry.  You WANT them to toss money at us.  However in order to cover such a big investment, Bioware needs an evern bigger return, and that's where the MMO community comes in.  Unlike other gaming industries, MMOs need to establish a relationship with the playerbase to keep making money, and lately that relationship as soured. A lot of developers think the MMO community has turned into a bunch of loud-mouth, lazy, fickle bunch of spoiled brats.

We need to change our ways and have more realistic expectations of new MMOs if the industry is going to survive. 

1.) We need to understand that a game that just launched is simply not going to have as much end-game content as a game that's been out for over a 1-6years.

2.) We need to understand that if we want new content, we have to pay for it.  If you like the game but want more content, unsubbing isn't going to help, but only make things worse.

3.) We really need to stop comparing everything to WoW.  I think this is self-explanitory.

4.) We really need to stop wishing every MMO that's not your kind of MMO will fail.  Just because I might not like that style of MMO doesn't mean that it should fail, and nobody be allowed to play it.

I'm not a SW:TOR fanboy, I'm just concerned what will happen to the industry if a huge financial investment like TOR can't buy its way into the market.  I can imagine that it's failure will create another black hole, similiar to Warhammer, where the industry was stuck in the dark ages of bad mmos for another 2-3 years.  Or even worse, MMOs turn out to be an unprofitable fad and they pull the plug like they did with the Guitar Hero type games.

So in conclusion if you do like Star Wars: The Old Republc, give them your money.  TOR may not be the best game in the market, or any good at all, but it's definitely super expensive, and it's new, and EA gets really mad if they don't get paid.  We want to keep the relationship between MMO companies and communities good, or they might pull out and go make cheap browser games or something.

lol seriously?  No thanks, they can deal.

Originally posted by Sovrath

Originally posted by Margulis

Originally posted by Sovrath

I'll have to point out that I was in LOTRO last night and had to laugh. NPC's were standing around like mannequins with no interaction.

In any case it's only an issue if people allow it to be an issue. I don't recall many posts/threads by angry players because LOTRO's npc's never moved except to sometimes swivel towards you if you clicked on it.

might be funny if someone made a similiar movie with other mmo's showing the npc's just standing, sitting, very little movement.

it's not even a comparison between LOTRO npc's and SWTOR.

1.  LOTRO - You can interact with all of them for some conversation, they have scripted conversations of their own frequently, especially in taverns and so forth, do way more things, play instruments, etc etc.  This isn't the best video but it's something. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzXiyudVcOE

2.  SWTOR - You cannot interact with any npc's, you can only talk to merchants and quest givers.  Hardly any ambient conversations or sounds, and besides for their mime movements hardly any scripted pathing or actions.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3Rrk6lgi24

Except that's not exactly true now is it?

To see if you were correct I  loaded up LOTRO just now. Since my charcter was in Rivendell I clicked around on various npc's that weren't merchants

Pethelen and Barbethir in front of the house in rivendell say nothing, they just stand there.

Same with one named Mehelen or some such name. I went in the house and all the townspeople and dancers said nothing. Some did have a little chat bubble but there was no intereacting with them.

There is a champion trainer named Celebren or some such thing in Rivendell and all I get from it is that I can't intereact with it. no greeting and it doesn't move.

Another one name Tordirith or some such name produces the same thing.

 

Then I went to bree. None of the wood workers say anything and they do the exact same thing over and over again which is saw wood. I suppose that's a bit of life. There were some townspeople who had chat bubbles over there heads so that is partially in the realm of life but clicking on them produced nothing. And not everyone had this. The woman chastizing the prisoner says nothing to you, neither does the prisoner or the watchers in the area.

I then went into the Prancing pony and there are npc's just standing there. One such man who is a "Traveller" does turn to you and a chat bubble appears mentioning some ore they moved. But the patron he is speaking to is mute and lifeless.

Same with every other patron in there that I clicked on. Though they are posed and in "conversation". I then clicked on "henry the mapmaker" and he also says nothing nor did I see any chat bubble over his head.

Yes, the merchants or quest givers will give you a greeting as well as the trainers that you have access to. That's pretty much it.

So sure, some npc's do have a little blurb of conversation that appears above their heads but it's a far cry from making the game feel like it's full of life. SWToR might be a little worse than LOTRO as there is only a little movement from the npc's but it's just slight movement.

It would be very tempting to go to each game that is out now and start clicking on npc's to see the reaction. But from my memory not many of them other than trainers or quest givers really give back much at all.

If there is another area you would like me to look in I'd be happy to do it. I've been playing the game since closed beta and it's full of posed statues. AS I said there is some life in a few npc's such as chat bubbles and the patrolling guard here and there.

Sounds just like a difference of opinion - you think that the little blurbs of conversation don't add anything, where as I do.  When I said "interact with npc's", that's what I mean, there being a conversation bub that pops up.  I will agree that both games, and most mmo's have their fair share of "statues", but the conversation bubs at least add SOMETHING.  The funny thing with TOR is also the very odd looking npc's that appear to be stuck in time, as that video shows.

I will agree that amount of players in an area adds to the life of a world, and the instancing in TOR really hurts that.  The lack of many game critters in the world as doesn't help, along with other things too like minimal ambient sound in a lot of areas, etc.  It's more a bunch of things combining that makes TOR seem much more dead than most mmo worlds.

Similar to you, I fired up another mmo I hadn't really spent much tim with - RIFT.  It's pretty generic theme park game play but the world has so much attention to small immersion details.  Running around the starter Defiant zone Freemarch there are animals all over the place, flies, butterflies, dogs, cats, etc etc.  Almost all npc's can be clicked on for conversation and there are a lot of scripted npc interaction events.  I definitely don't think that npc's alone completely make or break immersion, like I said a lot of things play into it, but TOR is the first game I've played where I couldn't help but notice the "ooddness" of the npc's and how cardboard cutout they felt.  Hey, that's just me. 

Epic thread for fanbois.

Thanks for actually including SWTOR in 2012, where it should be.

Originally posted by Sovrath

I'll have to point out that I was in LOTRO last night and had to laugh. NPC's were standing around like mannequins with no interaction.

In any case it's only an issue if people allow it to be an issue. I don't recall many posts/threads by angry players because LOTRO's npc's never moved except to sometimes swivel towards you if you clicked on it.

might be funny if someone made a similiar movie with other mmo's showing the npc's just standing, sitting, very little movement.

it's not even a comparison between LOTRO npc's and SWTOR.

1.  LOTRO - You can interact with all of them for some conversation, they have scripted conversations of their own frequently, especially in taverns and so forth, do way more things, play instruments, etc etc.  This isn't the best video but it's something. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzXiyudVcOE

2.  SWTOR - You cannot interact with any npc's, you can only talk to merchants and quest givers.  Hardly any ambient conversations or sounds, and besides for their mime movements hardly any scripted pathing or actions.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3Rrk6lgi24

Lot's of talk about SWTOR being a clone of a specific game but it's just a general theme park clone really, doesn't have to be compared to one game constantly.  But speaking of clones.....................

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJIsdl4BL2Q

Originally posted by Hardanger

When I imagine any Star Wars game that allows players to be Jedi, I visualize a population of 95 parts jedi/sith characters and 5 parts pew pew characters.  Is it actually like that?  If so, how much (if at all) does it ruin the atmosphere of the game seeing dozens of jedi/sith everywhere when realistically there should be much fewer?  Or is my assumption baseless, and there is actually a balance of non-jedi characters? 

 

I'm concerned because in a game so reliant on story that has a fairly high level of immersion, I'd hate to see a Darth N00bcake around every corner.

Don't expect much world immersion - this is what every quest hub and city  is like:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3Rrk6lgi24

Originally posted by CujoSWAoA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkyqSmFgNe0

Age of Conan took water seriously and it has some fun under water content too.

I expect Guild Wars 2 to take that kind of content to the next level.

I expect SW:TOR to never touch water or under water content in its entire lifespan. 

Shame that TOR is a 2012 mmo and games like AoC, LOTRO and RIFT just absolutely crush it in terms of graphical detail with this sort of thing.

[mod edit]

Originally posted by oobla

I rarely use this website unless I want to guage what a new games like before buying it . To look at some of the comments here you would think StarWars the Old Republic is a terrible game . So I went searching the web to see if I could find a review thats negative about it . So far every one I've come across sings its praises.

So I would like to challege someone to find a negative review (as long as its from a reasonably legitimate source ie a relativly well known gaming website ,newpaper or magazine website . Not someones blog review or a gaming site that invites people to submit thier own reviews .

I'm sure there must be a few out there  but all in all the reviews I've seen are overwealmingly possative .

Legitimate source?  Actually a consensus of user reviews is more legitimate than any "legitimate" source that you refer to.  DA2 was the ultimate example of the gaping chasm between a general user opinion and the "professional reviewers" - which showed the flaw of trusting professional critics.  This game is very similar - and it has way more to do with behind the scenes stuff than the quality of the game - which many people in the game magazine / website industry will attest to.

But who cares, just play it yourself and find out.