Originally posted by MMO.Maverick

Originally posted by Kyleran

Would it surprise you to know that two of my more favorite MMO's are Lineage 1 and 2?  Both were better MMO's IMO than the games being passed around today.  (I don't include WOW in that list btw)

You might think I'm being subjective when I say the older MMO's were far richer and in depth than today's MMO's, and if I wasn't tired (and I had my own thread) I'd take the time to compare one title, DAOC against any modern MMORPG you'd care to name and detail about a dozen features that make the difference between greatness and just being average.

And while somone might say Xyson's a great game, they are being entirely subjective because feature wise the game is lacking, not subjective at all, just simple facts in that example. (as compared to a game like EVE or even DF)

Here you go again, taking an in itself subjective opinion as starting point and elevating it to a General Truth. Tsk, you should know better by now, don't you think?

What is considered great or not, is for the most part very subjective and different from one person to the next.

To you, those older MMO's were great and better than current MMO's, because they applied more to what you were looking for in an MMO. To others, they were not, and if the new post-WoW generation of MMO gamers would give a number of them a try now or as they were 1-2 years after their launch and compare them with the newer MMO's they've played, from an EQ to DAoC to AC to SWG, I doubt they would be that impressed and would switch right away to those older MMO's. In fact, I'm pretty certain that most of them would kindly or not so kindly thank for the offer and refrain.

Not that those old MMO's were bad, I certainly don't think so. But different MMO gamers are looking for different things in their MMORPG.

 When Facebook games gobble up the new school gamers dreams, you'll taste the burn of irony in the back of your throat.

Originally posted by MadnessRealm

Originally posted by chrisel

The whole game will soon be outdated, long before Aventurine is able to do some "relaunch". (BTW; where does this imaginary "relaunch" even come from??)  I

Relaunch is something Tasos has mentionned a few times. It's basically as if DarkFall had returned to BETA and  AV were to relaunch it (a bit like Square Enix is currently doing with FFXIV). The relaunch is scheduled to be around the same time as "DarkFall Arena", previously known as DarkFall 2010, and it is after the relaunch that Aventurine plans to advertise the game once again.

 The whole concept seems a bit imbecilic to me. Its not as if you can erase the bad first impression. We gamers are unforgiving.

Especially when new games are constantly coming out. Why would anyone go back to the old stock when it already burned its bridge?

Originally posted by MadnessRealm

Originally posted by Cecropia

Originally posted by Arcken

Well theres no arguing with someone who only sees what they want, so I guess you win.

either way, if grinding was the only problem darkfall had, it would probably have more than 7k in subs.

AV released their sub numbers? Link.

The new data is mostly based off Active Clan player numbers since inactive clans are being removed. It totals up to around 7k subs I think.

 indeed.

Well theres no arguing with someone who only sees what they want, so I guess you win.

either way, if grinding was the only problem darkfall had, it would probably have more than 7k in subs.

Originally posted by xanphia

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by xanphia

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by xanphia

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by xanphia

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by Consensus

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by Consensus

 

 

 

 Im not a fan of WoW myself, however its a completely correct statement when I say for more people enjoy WoW than enjoy Darkfall, theres no arguing that.

WoW does have more numbers but you make a spurious correlation.

 

Sub numbers do not = quality product or game.

 Now you are just arguing with yourself. I did not say sub numbers = quality, you did, I said "More people enjoy WoW than enjoy Darkfall.

You cannot argue my point because it is the truth.

You are losing the context of what you said. You compared sub numbers as 'speaking the truth' to the quality of a game. You were measuring a games quality by sub numbers. You inferred this in a prior post. Thus, I said you're making a spurious correlation by implying that sub numbers equate to quality product. Remember what you write dude.

 wrong again sir, the inference was on your part. I said simply, and will do so again. "according to the subscription numbers, more people enjoy WoW than Darkfall."

I cannot get more plain than that. If you cant understand that, I dont know what to tell you.

again let me reiterate, Im not saying subs are a measure of quality.

However I will say if you spent less time trying to tell me what i was saying and actually read and comprehended what Im point blank trying to tell you in the simplest plainest words, we wouldnt be having this conversation.

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by Majinash

Originally posted by Arcken

If you can somehow get that from sitting in front of a computer screen and have moving pictures produce that effect for you, well I guess more power to you.

I don't mean to sound mean but... It is pretty common for people to get that effect from watching moving pictures.  Have you never seen people cry at a movie?  You were never truely scared by an old horror movie?  Even books can elicit emotion, and those are just words on a page.

 

Back when I was playing RE2 I got a rush... and had nightmares for a week, along with the other 2 people in the room at the time.

 

I feel like it is the minority who need to do something like sky dive just to get an andrenal response.  The majority of the population could do the same with a movie, game, book, or even a heated conversation.

Don't bother with that, some people don't  accepts books movies or games as source for emotions or intelectuall thoughts.

 Thats not true, I felt terrible at the end of Old Yeller, but I would say it was the opposite of a rush.

Originally posted by Majinash

Originally posted by Arcken

If you can somehow get that from sitting in front of a computer screen and have moving pictures produce that effect for you, well I guess more power to you.

I don't mean to sound mean but... It is pretty common for people to get that effect from watching moving pictures.  Have you never seen people cry at a movie?  You were never truely scared by an old horror movie?  Even books can elicit emotion, and those are just words on a page.

 

Back when I was playing RE2 I got a rush... and had nightmares for a week, along with the other 2 people in the room at the time.

 

I feel like it is the minority who need to do something like sky dive just to get an andrenal response.  The majority of the population could do the same with a movie, game, book, or even a heated conversation.

 You maybe right, for me though playing video games is like reading a book. And I dont recall that ive ever had an adrenaline rush from the written word either.

Originally posted by 9ineven

Originally posted by oscarkool2

 Darkfall is still the Best mmo

...

 

Luckily, this is just an opinion and that post demonstrates very well that an opinion is purely personal.

 Exactly, I have played a lot of MMOs since 1999, and I have yet to say that about any one of them. Quite frankly Ive found issues in every MMO Ive tried, however Im man enough to admit their faults and not take personal offense when someone disagrees with me.

Originally posted by 9ineven

Originally posted by oscarkool2

 Darkfall is still the Best mmo

...

 

Luckily, this is just an opinion and that post demonstrates very well that an opinion is purely personal.

 Absolutely, Ive been playing mmo's since 99, and I have yet to actually think to myself "This is the best mmo"

Practically speaking ive had issues with every mmo ive played in one way or another, and Im man enough to admit the faults and not take personal offense when someone disagrees with me.

Originally posted by Snoepie

Originally posted by Arcken

@Sid

 

I havent gotten a rush because its just a video game, its not skydiving, or bungie jumping, or winning the super bowl.

You have a very low threshold for stimulation.

skydiving and playing a video game and 2 different thinks.

some videogames gives people rushes.. everyone have that sometimes.. sometimes more with other games then others..

 

i think this link will say enough

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gz-mj2Aca8&feature=related

 You're going to have to define rush, because i think thats where were miscommunicating. When I think of a rush, I think of a cold sweat, heart thumping, hands shaking, ocean in your ears kinda thing.

If you can somehow get that from sitting in front of a computer screen and have moving pictures produce that effect for you, well I guess more power to you.

Im really staring to think Darkfall players, or at least the ones that post here are just using Darkfall as a medium to say theyre better than everyone else. Theyre more hardcore, theyre tougher, theyre not WoW wussies, etc etc.

We get it, you have your own little clubhouse where you sit around patting each other on the back, breaching up each others egos all the while calling out everyone else who doesnt like Darkfall.

In your opinion Darkfall might be the best game out there for you, however most people dont care for it, and its not those peoples fault they dont, its the game itself.

So no matter how much better you guys feel you are than the rest of us, and congratulate yourselves for it, Darkfall isn't impressing anyone but the other people in your club.

@Sid

I havent gotten a rush because its just a video game, its not skydiving, or bungie jumping, or winning the super bowl.

You have a very low threshold for stimulation.

Originally posted by Majinash

Originally posted by Sid_Vicious

Planetside will not stir your emotions like Darkfall will.

You obviously never played Planetside when it was new.

 Or ever admitted someone else might be right on some level.

Originally posted by firefly2003

If you're not a soap opera fan, you may not have heard that the long-running ABC soaps All My Children and One Life To Live are coming to an end this fall. Declining ratings are the main problem, of course, but some sources are suggesting that a far more insidious culprit may be culpable: Zynga and its numerous popular Facebook games.

According to an article on AdWeek, the decline in soap opera viewership amongst its core audience coincides shockingly well with the rise in the popularity of FarmVille and CityVille.

AdWeek reports that in 2007, both All My Children and One Life To Live averaged a 1.9 rating with women age 25 to 54. Now both are hovering around a 1.4. Meanwhile, Zynga's games have grown to 47 million monthly users for FarmVille and 88 million for CityVille.

What I don't get is why people couldn't play Facebook games while watching soap operas? All due respect to Zynga, its games aren't exactly the most mentally taxing around.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2011/04/25/farmville-cityville-blamed-for-soap-opera-cancellations.aspx

 Soon enough Facebook will gobble up future MMO'rs. Ironic if you think about it, new school players keep telling old school players that their time has come and gone, well here comes a taste of your own medicine.

Originally posted by chrisel

My first month in DFO was absolutely fantastic. Then the "grind wall" hit me. I felt like being in a swamp, up to the neck in "gank trouble". It was under no sircumstance a situation I wanted to be within for another 5 months to hit the "competetive level" so I left. I would go back instantly if I knew that with only a few more weeks of hardcore gaming would end me up being competetive. Unfortunately that is far away from the situation. Even with the new impleted meditation system, it takes forever.

And now we arent even talking about the insane grind it takes on tradeskills.... Jeez man, I get exhausted just by thinking of all that DFO demands from me as a player to be able to compete. And no, I do not belive the community is "steadily growing". I do belive that DFO subs are stable, but most of all I ever met, had 2 or even more accounts just to cope especially with the tradeskills. Me, ended quickly up after I started it with 3 full accounts, and had plan for a 4th, just to speed up some tradeskill processes. Insane. I agree. Worthless insanity.

Thank you, but no thank you. DFO is (unfortunately) definately a "Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Work".

 I think youve pointed out the biggest problem im darkfall. The guys at the top of the pyramid want to keep their advantage in fights so they can plaster "noobs" with impunity,

If they really wanted a challenge theyd be lookin for a more even playing field.

Originally posted by thale_sr

Shadowbane was my hardcore standard.

fairly quick advancement, an excessive amount of pvp, and consequences to building your tree of life, and then having it torn down.

Top notch game.

 

Vanguard is my 2nd choice.

 

the rest pale in comparison, to the game play of shadowbane, and the beauty of vanguard.

 

 I miss Shadowbane in its prime. Especially when all of the North American players had to band together to fight off the Chinese zerg. Epic.

Originally posted by Greymoor

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by Sid_Vicious

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by Sid_Vicious

Originally posted by Blindchance

If you want pvp and can handle Darkfall's FPS combat I suggest trying it and then...buying a good FPS game instead.

No FPS out there can give the adrenaline rush that Darkfall can.

 

No game can.

 

You cannot name one. Nobody can.

 

Its the best game in the market if you want to feel something.

 

In Darkfall, you are a hero by saving a person  . ... not an NPC.

you are a conquorer from taking from another person . ... not an NPC.

 

The potential rush cannot be put into words. I have had a lot of fun in a lot of games but none quite like this one.

 

The closest games would be like EVE, UO, etc. but in those games it feels more like watching your avatar win instead of winning yourself so the rush isn't as good.

 I guarantee you sir, that Planetside in its prime was far more exciting than DF can ever  be. Hundreds of people in tanks, airplanes, firing chainguns and setting up Landmines and turrets, fighting over bases? Far more awesome than the dwindling population of Darkfall can produce. 

Darkfall will never ever, EVER, come close to Planetside in that aspect.

Planetside eh?

LOL

 

Whatever dude.

 

Have fun playing your risk free games.

 

The most exciting FPS game can break me into a sweat if its hard enough and I love them but obviously there is something about risk vs reward that is beyond your understanding and comprehension because no game other than Darkfall can provide a bigger adrenaline omfg I am at the edge of my seat and hope that I do not die rush.

 

Closest thing would be EVE but . .. do you think that you can get the same rush from watching your spaceship pew pew pew for you as you give it commands? hahaha

 I dont think Ive ever gotten a "rush" from a video game. Sitting on my arse with no actual stimuli beyond moving pictures on a screen just isnt gonna produce a "rush" like a roller coaster, repelling, bungie jumping etc.

Must be some wierd brain chemistry that calls up a "rush" while playing a video game.

Yes it is... adrenaline.

 I guess my advice is that if a video game triggers an adrenaline rush in certain people, those people need to get out more.

Let me clarify so no one tattles on me again.

Im not familiar with a rush from video games in the way that I am from say flying down a hill on skis at 40 mph.

Originally posted by stux

I haven't read all of the 3 pages but after reading the first the debate seems to be script vs no scripts and the variety of play styles people actually play.

 

In my year and a half this is my experience:

 

90% of the vets play the exact same hybrid type character.  Who wins is determined by a wide variety of things:

 

Ping and FPS are VERY important for sticky backing and weapon switching

Macroes do matter a TON for 98% of the player base.

Character matter for 99% of the player base (great gear which is a heavy grind combine with great fps, ping and player skill can make up some for the character)

Gear matters

Having a ton of buffs, bebuffs, and utility spells goes a long way.

Cross healing and buffing is huge

Numbers and terrain 

Distance, blinds, bunny hopping and weapon changes and know how and WHEN to use them make a huge difference.

Cheating does still happen most prelevantly lag switchers.

 

Outside of pvp:

The game is a huge grind for character skills, players skills, and keeping enough gear/gold/regs to pvp.

There isn't much to do outside of pvp other then grind for gold/mats which often turns into pvp.

The crafting system isn't bad but requires a lot of grind.

Most people have multiple alt to hit nodes and macro on.

The siege system is pretty broken.

The alignment system is pretty broken.

The game is extremely hard on newer players.

The most  of epic mobs usually aren't worth the trouble for the gear you risk, the likelyhood of pvp, the number of people  you have to divide it with, and the time.

The dev team works etremely slowly.

 

 

Overall, it is a fun game that I enjoy but I can see a lot of people not making it past the faults.

 A very concise breakdown. kudos.

Originally posted by xanphia

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by xanphia

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by xanphia

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by Consensus

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by Consensus

 

 

 

 Im not a fan of WoW myself, however its a completely correct statement when I say for more people enjoy WoW than enjoy Darkfall, theres no arguing that.

WoW does have more numbers but you make a spurious correlation.

 

Sub numbers do not = quality product or game.

 Now you are just arguing with yourself. I did not say sub numbers = quality, you did, I said "More people enjoy WoW than enjoy Darkfall.

You cannot argue my point because it is the truth.

Originally posted by Palebane

 

---

Originally posted by nariusseldon
And having to talk to a lot of NPCs to just find the right one is BAD design .. reading 1000 times "hi i am xxx, i have NOTHING important to say" is just boring and lazy design to fill up play-time.

---

 

Yeah, having to swing your sword and attack enemies is boring and lazy design to fill up play-time too. I want them to fall over as soon as I target them. That is more convenient.

 I disagree, i think it would just be easier if I didnt have to target them and they just died as I entered the zone.