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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » What is the worst common feature in modern MMOs?

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  danwest58

Elite Member

Joined: 5/14/09
Posts: 562

7/11/14 1:57:59 PM#121
Originally posted by Tolmos
Originally posted by ReallyNow10
Originally posted by cerulean2012

Most of the stuff that people have said they disliked can be ignored in games.

LFG/Group finder....don't use it

Fast Travel/teleportation nodes...don't use them

Mounts...don't use them

Quests....don't do them

See easy to fix.

Not really.  That's like a chess player telling a checker player just to ignore the white squares.  Doesn't work too well.

That's incomparable. The checker player would be at a distinct disadvantage. An MMO player ignoring these tools would not.

 

Ignore LFG/Group finder? They stand in town, just like the "good old days", and scream "LFG LFG LFG" or "LFM LFM LFM" until they get a group, like they want to. "Community building" and all that.

If they ignore fast travel/teleportation nodes, they just travel a little more slowly. This is the only place where they COULD suffer, getting to open world events more slowly.

Mounts- same as above.

Quests- You can PvP, Dungeon, open world events if they are available, etc. There are usually options to this. You may, in fact, level more quickly ignoring these in some games.

I never sat in town spamming LF1M FOR INSTANCE X.  Why?  I made friends in the game naturally through leveling, brought friends into WOW from other games, and joined a guild.  Yea I might have spammed the zone I was in for a person but thats about a dozen times over 4 years with Classic and BC WOW.  I always had over 100 friends on my friends list and kept adding so I could ask them if I needed people.  The people that spam LF1M for Instance in a city or LFG more than a handful of times in a month were people who LACKED social skills and/or were shitty players.  If a mage was known for breaking sheep in Classic and BC they had a hard time finding a group.  That was their fault not the lack of a TOOL.  If a person refused to try to make friends with people that they just ran will that is their lack of social skills.  

Today I read something interesting on the ArcheAge forums about how players want a PVE server so they can stay away from PVP just so they didnt have to socialize with other players or become better players themselves.  They want to go from point A through a PVP zone to Point B without getting attacked because they dont want to be apart of an MMO.  This is why the genera has turned to crap because these people DO NOT BELONG IN AN MMO and want all the benefits of being in an MMO without taking part in the core part of the genera.  Thats it, they want it handed to them without effort period.

So no Automated LFD tools are not needed to forum groups because you either lack skills to play the game or lack skills to socialize.  

  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15626

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

7/11/14 1:58:07 PM#122
Originally posted by danwest58
Originally posted by xAPOCx
Originally posted by vesuvias

Easy...

Elitist Veteran Know-it all Epeen gamers. The. Worst. ->.<- 

You know those folks that try to remove every convienence from the game that makes it even a little bit tolerable to play, so that everything you do can be a ridiculously hollow accomplishment of surviving soul-sucking brain-dead repetitive tedium. Yeah, those folks, you might have seen a few around however they are probably on some forum somewhere crying about LFG tools, "!" icons or soloing.

First off, If you need convenience just to tolerate playing a game YOU SHOULDN'T BE PLAYING THAT GAME!!!!! And second, Its a game. ALL accomplishments are in a sense hollow. If you don't enjoy it then GTFO of mmos and go back to Mario Cart.

 

And don't talk to me about crying. It was people like you crying about how hard is was to lvl and i cant find quest x or it takes to long to kill xyz mob and it takes to long to look for a group and why oh why is it so long to get from point A to point B etc etc. Because of your crying, we have the "MMOS" we have today. Cheap, shallow knock-offs of what this genre should/could of been.

 

But you keep up the good fight. Maybe one day MMOs will be so easy, the game will come with another person to play the game for you. That seems like that would be your dream MMO.

I could not agree with you more about MMOs and how people cry about how long it takes.  Its come to a point if people dont get 4 to 5 instances done in an hour they hate the game yet they wonder why the game is so shallow.  Its because the automated LFG tools.  Now I do support a buffed up LFG tool blizzard is making that will allow you to search players looking for X content with Y iLvL.  It does make it easier however it does not cut out the social interaction part of MMOs.  It just makes the search less painful.  

I don't think anyone would complain about it "taking so long" if they were having fun. Putting in long grinds for the sake of grind isn't good game development. It worked in older games because that's what was there, and the novelty of the MMO was still fresh. In the end it's a measure to keep people playing as long as they can keep people around. This was one of the early ways to keep players subscribed, make the game about gaining levels, then take away their progress toward those levels. Not that replacing levels with gear is any better, which is what they do today in many games.

For many people games should first and foremost be about having fun, long grinds detract from that fun for many, it's not hard to understand that.

 

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  danwest58

Elite Member

Joined: 5/14/09
Posts: 562

7/11/14 2:02:51 PM#123
Originally posted by Tolmos
Originally posted by xAPOCx
Originally posted by vesuvias

Easy...

Elitist Veteran Know-it all Epeen gamers. The. Worst. ->.<- 

You know those folks that try to remove every convienence from the game that makes it even a little bit tolerable to play, so that everything you do can be a ridiculously hollow accomplishment of surviving soul-sucking brain-dead repetitive tedium. Yeah, those folks, you might have seen a few around however they are probably on some forum somewhere crying about LFG tools, "!" icons or soloing.

First off, If you need convenience just to tolerate playing a game YOU SHOULDN'T BE PLAYING THAT GAME!!!!! And second, Its a game. ALL accomplishments are in a sense hollow. If you don't enjoy it then GTFO of mmos and go back to Mario Cart.

Exactly! Convenience sucks! Take the Dungeon Finders games offer-  If you don't find standing around in a city screaming "LFG LFG LFG" or "LFM LFM LFM" for hours on end, until all your free time is used up and you didn't actually get to run the dungeon you intended to, completely fun and enthralling then obviously the flaw is with you! The convenience of actually running the dungeon you want to in a timely fashion is for ENTITLED WHINERS!!!!ONE!!

INSTANCES WERE NEVER DESIGNED TO BE RUN AT THE DROP OF A HAT.  But players like you wouldnt understand that.  You think you are so important because you cannot find friends to run your needed instance.  /CRY ENDLESSLY  Thats you.  Its not your fault you could not create a social network in game of friends who would run instances with you when you wanted or say hey tomorrow can we run SM at 8pm ET like TRUE MMO gamers did.  No you are some special snow flake who needs to run it when you feel like it and WHO THE FUCK CARES ABOUT THE MMO GENERA as long as you get your run when you want in some easy format.  You sir are the reason MMOs are in the shit hole they are now.  Because you cannot be bothered to make friends or play to a certain level.  PERIOD.  

  danwest58

Elite Member

Joined: 5/14/09
Posts: 562

7/11/14 2:08:33 PM#124
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by danwest58
Originally posted by xAPOCx
Originally posted by vesuvias

Easy...

Elitist Veteran Know-it all Epeen gamers. The. Worst. ->.<- 

You know those folks that try to remove every convienence from the game that makes it even a little bit tolerable to play, so that everything you do can be a ridiculously hollow accomplishment of surviving soul-sucking brain-dead repetitive tedium. Yeah, those folks, you might have seen a few around however they are probably on some forum somewhere crying about LFG tools, "!" icons or soloing.

First off, If you need convenience just to tolerate playing a game YOU SHOULDN'T BE PLAYING THAT GAME!!!!! And second, Its a game. ALL accomplishments are in a sense hollow. If you don't enjoy it then GTFO of mmos and go back to Mario Cart.

 

And don't talk to me about crying. It was people like you crying about how hard is was to lvl and i cant find quest x or it takes to long to kill xyz mob and it takes to long to look for a group and why oh why is it so long to get from point A to point B etc etc. Because of your crying, we have the "MMOS" we have today. Cheap, shallow knock-offs of what this genre should/could of been.

 

But you keep up the good fight. Maybe one day MMOs will be so easy, the game will come with another person to play the game for you. That seems like that would be your dream MMO.

I could not agree with you more about MMOs and how people cry about how long it takes.  Its come to a point if people dont get 4 to 5 instances done in an hour they hate the game yet they wonder why the game is so shallow.  Its because the automated LFG tools.  Now I do support a buffed up LFG tool blizzard is making that will allow you to search players looking for X content with Y iLvL.  It does make it easier however it does not cut out the social interaction part of MMOs.  It just makes the search less painful.  

I don't think anyone would complain about it "taking so long" if they were having fun. Putting in long grinds for the sake of grind isn't good game development. It worked in older games because that's what was there, and the novelty of the MMO was still fresh. In the end it's a measure to keep people playing as long as they can keep people around. This was one of the early ways to keep players subscribed, make the game about gaining levels, then take away their progress toward those levels. Not that replacing levels with gear is any better, which is what they do today in many games.

For many people games should first and foremost be about having fun, long grinds detract from that fun for many, it's not hard to understand that.

 

Your Playing an MMO that is meant to be played for Months to years not in hours and DAYS.  Its not a Grind.  MMOS were never designed so you can accomplish things in a few hours or day it was designed to take you weeks if not a month or more to do things.  If you want a game you can finish in 30 hours go play a single player game.  I did the Epic Warrior chest quest during Classic.  I took me 4 weeks to do because of schedules and what not so I could do the instances with friends.  O well I was in the game to play the game over the course of months or years.  Not to get geared in 1 week and be O LOOK I AM EPICED OUT NOW WHAT?  Like many of you players do today.  You get to a point of being geared and man there is nothing to do.  Why because you want FAST EASY WATERED DOWN content.  Not ok this will take me some time to do COOL.  No its CRY CRY CRY because you cannot do it solo in 30 minutes.  

  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15626

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

7/11/14 2:28:42 PM#125
Originally posted by danwest58
Originally posted by Distopia
 

I don't think anyone would complain about it "taking so long" if they were having fun. Putting in long grinds for the sake of grind isn't good game development. It worked in older games because that's what was there, and the novelty of the MMO was still fresh. In the end it's a measure to keep people playing as long as they can keep people around. This was one of the early ways to keep players subscribed, make the game about gaining levels, then take away their progress toward those levels. Not that replacing levels with gear is any better, which is what they do today in many games.

For many people games should first and foremost be about having fun, long grinds detract from that fun for many, it's not hard to understand that.

 

Your Playing an MMO that is meant to be played for Months to years not in hours and DAYS.  Its not a Grind.  MMOS were never designed so you can accomplish things in a few hours or day it was designed to take you weeks if not a month or more to do things.  If you want a game you can finish in 30 hours go play a single player game.  I did the Epic Warrior chest quest during Classic.  I took me 4 weeks to do because of schedules and what not so I could do the instances with friends.  O well I was in the game to play the game over the course of months or years.  Not to get geared in 1 week and be O LOOK I AM EPICED OUT NOW WHAT?  Like many of you players do today.  You get to a point of being geared and man there is nothing to do.  Why because you want FAST EASY WATERED DOWN content.  Not ok this will take me some time to do COOL.  No its CRY CRY CRY because you cannot do it solo in 30 minutes.  

You can scream at me all you want. I don't mind that, what I do mind is missing the point completely. It's not up to you what feels like grind to another person. Again as I said before, if they were having fun, they wouldn't care how long it takes. That's what grind means in this sense, it feels like a chore rather than something fun to do to these people. Secondly stop referring to me, and what I want, I said nothing of what I want or feel is a grind or not.

SWG was not designed to take months to finish up a build, it was rather easy to spend those 250 skill points in a week or less. The substance of the game came in the form of community play, not carrots like levels or prizes. That's good MMO development IMO.

EQ was something else entirely, it's entire business plan was built around that journey through character development, the level is the prize. Chasing the dragon so to speak, do you really think this had nothing to do with their monetary goals?

 

 

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  vesuvias

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/13/04
Posts: 126

7/11/14 2:39:55 PM#126
Originally posted by danwest58
Your Playing an MMO that is meant to be played for Months to years not in hours and DAYS.  Its not a Grind.  MMOS were never designed so you can accomplish things in a few hours or day it was designed to take you weeks if not a month or more to do things.  If you want a game you can finish in 30 hours go play a single player game.  I did the Epic Warrior chest quest during Classic.  I took me 4 weeks to do because of schedules and what not so I could do the instances with friends.  O well I was in the game to play the game over the course of months or years.  Not to get geared in 1 week and be O LOOK I AM EPICED OUT NOW WHAT?  Like many of you players do today.  You get to a point of being geared and man there is nothing to do.  Why because you want FAST EASY WATERED DOWN content.  Not ok this will take me some time to do COOL.  No its CRY CRY CRY because you cannot do it solo in 30 minutes.  

No actually its you who is trying to play an MMO that you want to consume months if not years of your life, but really they only have and only ever have had content enough to support maybe a month or two. The early MMOs were an aberation for the Genre, not the Gold standard. The Genre rightfully evolved away from those types of time commitments. It's more likely you than the casual that needs to find a new Genre. 

Personally I love playing in a new world every 3 months. LOVE IT. I don't feel this overarching need to devote my life to ONE particular game that consumes 16 hours a day of my life. Let it go. What was heralded as a industtry changing occurance, this idea that we play a single game or two for years on end, was a gross miscalculation for the early MMOs and the industry. Accept that you are traveler of worlds not a fully fledged resident of any single one and have fun. Achievements in these games are and always will be hollow to the core. It's a game, just have fun.

  AIMonster

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/31/08
Posts: 2017

7/11/14 2:40:00 PM#127

I agree with lots of people here and have to say quest hubs, especially when it's one of the only viable means of progressing quickly.  They lead you around, typically are filled with mudane tasks that aren't challenging in the slightest, and I just find it flat out boring.

Fortunately it's becoming less a modern feature and more an outdated feature although even games that try to break the mold aren't willing to go all the way with it.  Every game that has dynamic/public questing has traditional questing including GW2 (renown hearts).  Hoping games like EQ Next finally break away from it entirely.

Raptr link because it's the cool new trend:

  Maelkor

Novice Member

Joined: 8/20/05
Posts: 462

7/11/14 4:17:08 PM#128
Quest Hubs and beyond that quests for XP gain for advancement. Originally quests were created as standalone just to give out bits of extra xps and items and such. To make things more efficient quest hubs were created and it just went downhill from there. This has ruined all modern day(2013+) MMO's for me and I no longer play any of them for this primary reason. Its a shame because I would likely be willing to spend between $20 and $40 a month on gaming otherwise.
  Avanah

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/18/04
Posts: 869

7/11/14 4:28:25 PM#129

1. Self Entitled People.

2. Immature Brats.

3. Keyboard Thugs.

4. Mean People.

There are more "worst common features" I'm sure.

TGIF...Thank God I'm Female

"Those with the most Opinions tend to have the fewest Facts"

  TheQuietGamer

Novice Member

Joined: 6/02/14
Posts: 330

7/11/14 4:35:40 PM#130
Originally posted by Ivylena

1. Self Entitled People.

2. Immature Brats.

3. Keyboard Thugs.

4. Mean People.

There are more "worst common features" I'm sure.

and 5. Elitists.  

  shadowman465

Novice Member

Joined: 10/04/07
Posts: 30

7/11/14 4:39:39 PM#131

Instant completion of tasks.

-Instant Travel

-Group Finder

-Quest Pointer

 

Anything that really takes away the experience of a realistic world experience.

These features do come in handy when just logging in and playing but kind of

removes the experience of working towards something making the reward not

rewarding.

 

Kind of like the Matrix they tried creating a perfect world but failed because there

wasn't any point in living in a perfect world.

  Peajay123

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/01/14
Posts: 12

7/11/14 4:42:41 PM#132

What makes modern MMO's fail for me is how they are aiming their content to more casual players, making the game easy mode and very fast paced.

Reaching the max level and 'end-game' in a matter of days or weeks isn't an MMO, its a single player game trying to be an MMO and failing.

  Golelorn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/23/03
Posts: 1072

7/11/14 4:49:21 PM#133
Quest hubs... Seriously, go get your own rat meat. I couldn't care less.
  UO4ever

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/25/12
Posts: 31

7/11/14 4:59:04 PM#134
The worst common feature?  Steam.
  sketocafe

Elite Member

Joined: 7/19/11
Posts: 590

7/11/14 5:14:35 PM#135
LFG/LFR tools. If you don't have community, all you're left with to keep people is the strength of your content. These tools kill server communities for the sake of convenience. They also shrink the world, turning capitol cities into lobbies and eliminating spontaneous pvp action at dungeon entrances on pvp servers.
  shass

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/31/11
Posts: 100

The light at the end of the tunnel... is the headlamp of an oncoming train.

7/11/14 5:30:41 PM#136
The worst common feature is the dumbing down of virtually every MMO that is released. Instead of patching in more interesting stuff, new mobs or quests with a challenge, the devs always think making it easier will pull the punters in. For a short time it may work, in the longer term people get bored. Risk and reward, if there is no risk - the reward is not worth it. AKA WoW, Rift and others. Currently the ploy is being deployed by Zenimax.
  Tolmos

Novice Member

Joined: 8/26/10
Posts: 131

7/11/14 6:34:47 PM#137
Originally posted by danwest58
Originally posted by Tolmos
Originally posted by xAPOCx

First off, If you need convenience just to tolerate playing a game YOU SHOULDN'T BE PLAYING THAT GAME!!!!! And second, Its a game. ALL accomplishments are in a sense hollow. If you don't enjoy it then GTFO of mmos and go back to Mario Cart.

Exactly! Convenience sucks! Take the Dungeon Finders games offer-  If you don't find standing around in a city screaming "LFG LFG LFG" or "LFM LFM LFM" for hours on end, until all your free time is used up and you didn't actually get to run the dungeon you intended to, completely fun and enthralling then obviously the flaw is with you! The convenience of actually running the dungeon you want to in a timely fashion is for ENTITLED WHINERS!!!!ONE!!

INSTANCES WERE NEVER DESIGNED TO BE RUN AT THE DROP OF A HAT.  But players like you wouldnt understand that.  You think you are so important because you cannot find friends to run your needed instance.  /CRY ENDLESSLY  Thats you.  Its not your fault you could not create a social network in game of friends who would run instances with you when you wanted or say hey tomorrow can we run SM at 8pm ET like TRUE MMO gamers did.  No you are some special snow flake who needs to run it when you feel like it and WHO THE FUCK CARES ABOUT THE MMO GENERA as long as you get your run when you want in some easy format.  You sir are the reason MMOs are in the shit hole they are now.  Because you cannot be bothered to make friends or play to a certain level.  PERIOD.  

How dare those people who have lives outside of MMOs want to have a feature that makes their ability to play the game a little more feasible?! How dare those monsters who hold full time jobs, have spouses and RL friends all want to be able to log in at variable times, run a few dungeons and generally enjoy the game they want to. Those SCOUNDRELS! THOSE MONSTERS! They are ruining the MMO generation!

-Signed,

Guy who has played MMOs for 15 years and, unlike you apparently, goes outside from time to time :)

http://imgur.com/a/kU0qS
Players of Balmung- a compilation of different characters I've come across during my adventures in FFXIV ARR.

  grndzro

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 1109

7/11/14 7:06:21 PM#138
Class based pvp balancing rather than group based pvp balancing.
  AlBQuirky

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 1/24/05
Posts: 3206

Tomorrow's just a future yesterday...

7/11/14 8:24:24 PM#139

My signature states my largest grievance with MMORPGs today. It is all too common in these games today. In a nutshell:
MMORPGs are now made for players who do not like MMORPGs."

- Al

Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
- FARGIN_WAR

  Tolmos

Novice Member

Joined: 8/26/10
Posts: 131

7/11/14 8:50:48 PM#140

I never did reply serious to this, so here it goes:

Factions.

In PvE: Nothing grinds my gears more than having a predetermined faction that limits my interactions with anywhere from 1/2 to 3/4 of the population of the server. My pool of available people to play with, talk to and have general interaction with is greatly reduced because... why? Some story plot says I'm not supposed to like them? 

In PvP: I find that more often than not the people I REALLY want to PK are on my faction. I'm limited to killing only those on the opposite side of the fence, and when one of "my own" go nuts and start being a dick, there is jack all I can do about it. Highly aggravating.

I much prefer systems that allow me to choose my allegiance, or have no allegiance at all and we all just do our thing. But the idea that I am trapped in this single faction, especially if that faction has an aesthetic I like but nothing else? Man... can't stand that crap.

http://imgur.com/a/kU0qS
Players of Balmung- a compilation of different characters I've come across during my adventures in FFXIV ARR.

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