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Elder Scrolls Online

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General Discussion  » Big drop in price?

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82 posts found
  CrazKanuk

Elite Member

Joined: 10/06/09
Posts: 936

6/13/14 11:07:56 AM#41
Originally posted by Hariken
Originally posted by rojo6934
Originally posted by NeithWeaver
Originally posted by Deadlyne

Because Wildstar just came out.  Now there is some real competition.

Pretty much this.

This^

You will notice Wildstar massive price drop too when Warlords come out.

This is it right here

People need to be reminded just how powerful Wow is. The same thing happened with GW2. When mist came out the playerbase got alot smaller in days.  Alot of people are checking out Wildstar and waiting for the new Wow espansion just like in GW2. Wildstar and ESO will never knock wow off the top of the mount.

I know right? Actually Dino Horde just did the same thing on steam this past weekend. They were offering 95% off! Damn Wildstar is making everyone drop their prices /sarcasm

 

Let's be honest, ESO is a subscription game, the box price will make a dent in their dev costs, but after launch there really isn't going to be much reason to even have a box price, your focus is obtaining/retaining subscribers. If they were really concerned about people leaving their service for Wildstar they would have dropped their subscription fees, not their box price. 

Crazkanuk

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  gervaise1

Elite Member

Joined: 1/17/07
Posts: 1227

6/13/14 12:33:54 PM#42
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by Zhiroc

Someone with experience being in retail may very well correct me, but I was under the impression that when you sell physical copies of anything in a store, you are not doing so "on consignment" from the supplier. In other words, you BUY their product at at a discount (usually called the wholesale price), and then usually you are free to sell it for whatever you want, though I believe there might be price guarantees for a while... but this can run into trouble with the govt because anti-trust regulations frown on price-fixing.

There could be "buy-back" provisions if something doesn't sell--I believe magazines are often sold this way, but for other products, it might be less likely.

So, when you see things like "clearance sales", the retailer and not the supplier has decided to sell the product for a cut-rate price in order to clear inventory, because a store cannot afford to have product just sit and not move. If they are lucky, they might be able to get their cost back, but at that point, they might not care--they just want to be rid of it and get a little something out of it.

So, in my mind, if Walmart, Best Buy, or Amazon are cutting the price in half, it's probably because that was about the wholesale price they paid for it, and want to clear inventory--and not because Zenimax is "having a sale". If Zenimax were having a sale, then Amazon's price for the digital copy would have dropped too, and it's still at the full $60 price.

If so, then it means that ESO's sales figures are even worse than was expecting, as sales to retailers would also count as 'box sales' and if those boxes are still sitting on shelves even at a reduced price, then that is going to hurt, particularly so if a large online retailer like Amazon, is still unable to sell them at the 'reduced' price. Currently Amazon is selling ESO for £20 and if their not shifting at that price, then Zenimax might have a problem when some of these larger retailers decide they want their money back.

Just checked, Amazon is not selling the digital copy of the game in the UK.

Zhiroc you are correct. "Sale or return" deals rarely make sense these days. (If interested the key phrase is Supply Chain Logistics.)

Phry the phrase you are looking for is "through sales". Although we don't actually have any sales numbers for TESO (vgchartz numbers are a guess). Through sales is what is usually announced. 

Zenimax and Amazon will have done a deal. Amazon will have bought so many copies at some price. Possibly a tiered price  based on a) how many copies Amazon takes; b) how well the game is expected to sell; and, maybe, c) how well the game sells.

So -

Zenimax get money in the bank and the benefit of Amazon pushing the product. It is then up to Amazon to sell enough copies of the game at some price to recover what they paid, cover their costs and - if they do it right, make a profit. The price we pay of course will usually include tax.

Different retailers will do different deals and some may opt to sell the game for less on day 1 hoping that the extra sales make up for the lower price.

Retailers reduce their prices over time because it costs money to store stock: warehouse space; keeping them warm and dry; security etc.

If a game sells really well the studio may produce extra copies and decide to sell the game for less - as happened with Skyrim. The reduction was actually in the price retailers paid - who then passed the price reduction on to end customers.

  MarkAnd81

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/10/14
Posts: 19

6/13/14 8:57:00 PM#43

Why is this a bad thing? A sale is always a good thing and brings more people to the game!

Seriously guys, come on! I wouldn't have tried the game if I didn't buy it for $10, and I am glad that I did.

Stop it with all this f2p nonsense.

  DrunkWolf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/07/09
Posts: 1072

6/13/14 9:07:28 PM#44
Originally posted by thegoodgamer
Why did this game drop so fast in price? In went from $60 to $30?

next stop Free to play.

  Bruhza

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/09/12
Posts: 282

6/13/14 9:11:24 PM#45
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by NeithFateWeaver
Originally posted by Deadlyne

Because Wildstar just came out.  Now there is some real competition.

Pretty much this.  I remember not too long ago when people were saying WildStar wasn't worth it, and ESO was gonna stomp it.  Hm... times have changed.  For a "cartoony childs game", it's actually doing pretty well for itself.

I've been thinking of getting ESO, but I think I'll be playing WildStar before that.  Maybe in a few months, ESO will be F2P.  That way, I don't have to worry about paying for something that will inevitably go F2P.

ESO is not going f2p anytime soon, they still need to cash in on selling console boxes.

You're a smart man.

 

I predict that about 3 months after console release it will go f2p. Not even being a hater. I thought it was pretty fun up to max....then the veteran ranks hit.......thanks, but I don't want grinding as my endgame. (The leveling kind that is)

  BMBender

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/14/07
Posts: 555

6/13/14 9:11:39 PM#46

I think the price drop represents retailer overhead. Some retailers obviously expected more units to move by this point

Some here have said that some WM BB's selling for 10 while other locals still selling at full price. That tells me in some regions stock has not moved well. The Amazon price point probably represents an aggregate of same over a broader regional/international avg.

EDIT if someone feels truly energetic they could try to get an avg price from all available purchase points. That would tell if their is a universal price drop, a regional one, or conflict between brick & mortar /online outlets

  Tokken

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/06/04
Posts: 887

"I'm your Huckleberry!"

6/13/14 10:01:45 PM#47

the price got lowered b/c it is a subscription based product that no one wants to subscribe to. Seriously.

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  FrodoFragins

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/29/10
Posts: 2767

6/13/14 10:08:46 PM#48
I'll wait for F2P.
  junzo316

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/19/07
Posts: 1690

6/13/14 11:18:15 PM#49
At 9.99 within 2 months of release is a horrible price drop.  That is about an 85% drop.  Crazy!  I see the console version being canceled and the game going f2p pretty quick.
  Stizzled

Tipster

Joined: 9/13/07
Posts: 1025

Kill Your Heroes

6/14/14 12:10:41 AM#50
Originally posted by junzo316
At 9.99 within 2 months of release is a horrible price drop.  That is about an 85% drop.  Crazy!  I see the console version being canceled and the game going f2p pretty quick.

They'd be crazy to cancel the console versions. What may be a fairly standard or lackluster MMO to PC gamers could still be a great experience to console gamers, just look at Destiny.

 

What I expect to happen is that, sometime near the end of the year, they'll give another console release date and some beta news to go with it. At or around that same time they'll also announce that they're dropping the subscription fee. I just don't see them going full F2P, not with all the fuss they made about P2P being the right choice for ESO. They'll try to save face by keeping the initial box price.

  DMKano

Elite Member

Joined: 6/17/11
Posts: 5124

6/14/14 6:16:21 AM#51
Originally posted by Stizzled
Originally posted by junzo316
At 9.99 within 2 months of release is a horrible price drop.  That is about an 85% drop.  Crazy!  I see the console version being canceled and the game going f2p pretty quick.

They'd be crazy to cancel the console versions. What may be a fairly standard or lackluster MMO to PC gamers could still be a great experience to console gamers, just look at Destiny.

 

What I expect to happen is that, sometime near the end of the year, they'll give another console release date and some beta news to go with it. At or around that same time they'll also announce that they're dropping the subscription fee. I just don't see them going full F2P, not with all the fuss they made about P2P being the right choice for ESO. They'll try to save face by keeping the initial box price.

If the dev costs are higher than projected sales, then it's not crazy.

(Note I am not talking about ESO specifically - just want to refute the "crazy" claim of why development gets cancelled for some games)

 

 

 

  Doogiehowser

Novice Member

Joined: 3/14/12
Posts: 1939

6/14/14 6:27:21 AM#52
You can pick it up at wallmart for 9 bucks..why pay 30 for it? ESO isn't even worth 30 bucks.

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  Technohic

Novice Member

Joined: 7/20/06
Posts: 148

6/14/14 12:14:47 PM#53

Might by their best bet to go buy to play now to see if they can even get sales like that.  I think the longer they wait, the more likely it will just be free to play or closed.  

 

I think it is obvious they are desperate for sales.  The entire letting go of a large staff.  Stores trying to clear out their inventory of the hard copy for cheap.  And maybe the biggest sign is them trying to get people to buy the PC with a promise to qualify for console transfer hoping to get the console players on now.

  junzo316

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/19/07
Posts: 1690

6/14/14 1:35:39 PM#54
Originally posted by Stizzled
Originally posted by junzo316
At 9.99 within 2 months of release is a horrible price drop.  That is about an 85% drop.  Crazy!  I see the console version being canceled and the game going f2p pretty quick.

They'd be crazy to cancel the console versions. What may be a fairly standard or lackluster MMO to PC gamers could still be a great experience to console gamers, just look at Destiny.

 

What I expect to happen is that, sometime near the end of the year, they'll give another console release date and some beta news to go with it. At or around that same time they'll also announce that they're dropping the subscription fee. I just don't see them going full F2P, not with all the fuss they made about P2P being the right choice for ESO. They'll try to save face by keeping the initial box price.

It's an expensive gamble for them as far as consoles go.  The cost of manufacturing and distributing the hard copy disks AND they would, again, have to have an aggressive advertising campaign.  If they see the costs as too high for a game no one is playing, it just may be cancelled. 

  Stizzled

Tipster

Joined: 9/13/07
Posts: 1025

Kill Your Heroes

6/14/14 3:02:08 PM#55

Originally posted by junzo316

It's an expensive gamble for them as far as consoles go.  The cost of manufacturing and distributing the hard copy disks AND they would, again, have to have an aggressive advertising campaign.  If they see the costs as too high for a game no one is playing, it just may be cancelled. 


Originally posted by DMKano

If the dev costs are higher than projected sales, then it's not crazy.

(Note I am not talking about ESO specifically - just want to refute the "crazy" claim of why development gets cancelled for some games)

Canceling makes sense for many games for many different reasons. Canceling the console release of what is very much a console game because the PC port may or may not be doing so well is crazy. Of course, both of you are certainly right, it's already cost them a hell of a lot of money and it's going to cost them even more. But, I don't see how they could expect the sales to be so low as to warrant cancellation, it has basically no competition on the consoles, there's really nothing like it. As I stated before, what my be a trash game in a sea of trash games on PC could still be a very unique experience to console gamers who may never have experienced anything like it.

 

At this point, if the game is doing as poorly as some suggest, then ZOS need to be putting all of their eggs into the console basket. Consoles have always been the bread and butter of the ES series, and this game should be no different. The first thing they need to do is get their cash shop ready and drop the subscription, and I think that's exactly what they're doing with the six month delay. Just doing that will probably double their potential console sales.


 

  bobdole1979

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/05/09
Posts: 218

6/15/14 8:35:01 AM#56
Originally posted by CrazKanuk
Originally posted by Hariken
Originally posted by rojo6934
Originally posted by NeithWeaver
Originally posted by Deadlyne

Because Wildstar just came out.  Now there is some real competition.

Pretty much this.

This^

You will notice Wildstar massive price drop too when Warlords come out.

This is it right here

People need to be reminded just how powerful Wow is. The same thing happened with GW2. When mist came out the playerbase got alot smaller in days.  Alot of people are checking out Wildstar and waiting for the new Wow espansion just like in GW2. Wildstar and ESO will never knock wow off the top of the mount.

I know right? Actually Dino Horde just did the same thing on steam this past weekend. They were offering 95% off! Damn Wildstar is making everyone drop their prices /sarcasm

 

Let's be honest, ESO is a subscription game, the box price will make a dent in their dev costs, but after launch there really isn't going to be much reason to even have a box price, your focus is obtaining/retaining subscribers. If they were really concerned about people leaving their service for Wildstar they would have dropped their subscription fees, not their box price. 

If they sell a million or more copies it can actually almost completley cover the development cost the problem is ESO only sold 400k  copies

 

http://www.vgchartz.com/game/70799/the-elder-scrolls-online/

 

That is really not a good start for a MMO.   Warhammer Online managed to sell 750k copies its first month.

  DMKano

Elite Member

Joined: 6/17/11
Posts: 5124

6/15/14 8:40:17 AM#57
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by CrazKanuk
Originally posted by Hariken
Originally posted by rojo6934
Originally posted by NeithWeaver
Originally posted by Deadlyne

Because Wildstar just came out.  Now there is some real competition.

Pretty much this.

This^

You will notice Wildstar massive price drop too when Warlords come out.

This is it right here

People need to be reminded just how powerful Wow is. The same thing happened with GW2. When mist came out the playerbase got alot smaller in days.  Alot of people are checking out Wildstar and waiting for the new Wow espansion just like in GW2. Wildstar and ESO will never knock wow off the top of the mount.

I know right? Actually Dino Horde just did the same thing on steam this past weekend. They were offering 95% off! Damn Wildstar is making everyone drop their prices /sarcasm

 

Let's be honest, ESO is a subscription game, the box price will make a dent in their dev costs, but after launch there really isn't going to be much reason to even have a box price, your focus is obtaining/retaining subscribers. If they were really concerned about people leaving their service for Wildstar they would have dropped their subscription fees, not their box price. 

If they sell a million or more copies it can actually almost completley cover the development cost the problem is ESO only sold 400k  copies

 

http://www.vgchartz.com/game/70799/the-elder-scrolls-online/

 

That is really not a good start for a MMO.   Warhammer Online managed to sell 750k copies its first month.

No.

They needed to sell over 5 million copies to cover the 200+ million dollar cost - remember that on a $60 physical copy less  than $40 actually goes to Zenimax.

There is a LOT of overhead in retail box business - which is why if you can recoup your profits with 100% digital sales - that's the way to go.

Bottom line - you don't want to be on the store shelves - as if your product doesn't sell after X number of weeks - guess what, you have to buy it back from retailers at 100% retail cost.

Yeah it sucks.

P.S. If you are selling your game for less than $20 from retail outlets - it means the company is dumping inventory so they don't have to incur buy-back losses at 100% retail cost - so those $9 sales = zero money for ZOS.

  bobdole1979

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/05/09
Posts: 218

6/15/14 8:43:41 AM#58
Originally posted by DMKano
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by CrazKanuk
Originally posted by Hariken
Originally posted by rojo6934
Originally posted by NeithWeaver
Originally posted by Deadlyne

Because Wildstar just came out.  Now there is some real competition.

Pretty much this.

This^

You will notice Wildstar massive price drop too when Warlords come out.

This is it right here

People need to be reminded just how powerful Wow is. The same thing happened with GW2. When mist came out the playerbase got alot smaller in days.  Alot of people are checking out Wildstar and waiting for the new Wow espansion just like in GW2. Wildstar and ESO will never knock wow off the top of the mount.

I know right? Actually Dino Horde just did the same thing on steam this past weekend. They were offering 95% off! Damn Wildstar is making everyone drop their prices /sarcasm

 

Let's be honest, ESO is a subscription game, the box price will make a dent in their dev costs, but after launch there really isn't going to be much reason to even have a box price, your focus is obtaining/retaining subscribers. If they were really concerned about people leaving their service for Wildstar they would have dropped their subscription fees, not their box price. 

If they sell a million or more copies it can actually almost completley cover the development cost the problem is ESO only sold 400k  copies

 

http://www.vgchartz.com/game/70799/the-elder-scrolls-online/

 

That is really not a good start for a MMO.   Warhammer Online managed to sell 750k copies its first month.

No.

They needed to sell over 5 million copies to cover the 200+ million dollar cost - remember that on a $60 physical copy less  than $40 actually goes to Zenimax.

There is a LOT of overhead in retail box business - which is why if you can recoup your profits with 100% digital sales - that's the way to go.

Bottom line - you don't want to be on the store shelves - as if your product doesn't sell after X number of weeks - guess what, you have to buy it back from retailers at 100% retail cost.

Yeah it sucks.

 

Depends on the retailer Walmart will only give them about $20 but other stores its much higher.   But lets not get into a whole economics debate 

 

The point I was making is that the game only sold 400k copies (maybe double that with digital sales but even then thats not a lot)   so that after the intial first month or two when ALL mmos see a 50% drop or more in subs things are not looking good. 

 

Edit btw did they ever release their budget?  I'm not saying you are wrong with the 200 million but  I don't  remember them releasing anything.  All I know is that some of my friends at Zenimax told me they were throwing money at ESO as if it was the cure for cancer.

  DMKano

Elite Member

Joined: 6/17/11
Posts: 5124

6/15/14 8:48:09 AM#59
Originally posted by bobdole1979

 

Edit btw did they ever release their budget?  I'm not saying you are wrong with the 200 million but  I don't  remember them releasing anything.  All I know is that some of my friends at Zenimax told me they were throwing money at ESO as if it was the cure for cancer.

There was an infamous twitter leak - where it was posted $200 million but quickly got removed - however as most things on twitter it got read and screenshot by lots of people.

http://camelotpost.com/2014/01/02/the-elder-scrolls-online-budget-200-million-do-more-damage-than-good/

Also with 6 month console delay - the new rumor is that the final dev cost will exceed 250 million.

 

  Laughing-man

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/23/09
Posts: 3376

I thought what I'd do is I'd pretend I was one of those Deaf-mutes.

6/15/14 9:02:28 AM#60
Originally posted by DMKano
Originally posted by bobdole1979

 

Edit btw did they ever release their budget?  I'm not saying you are wrong with the 200 million but  I don't  remember them releasing anything.  All I know is that some of my friends at Zenimax told me they were throwing money at ESO as if it was the cure for cancer.

There was an infamous twitter leak - where it was posted $200 million but quickly got removed - however as most things on twitter it got read and screenshot by lots of people.

http://camelotpost.com/2014/01/02/the-elder-scrolls-online-budget-200-million-do-more-damage-than-good/

Also with 6 month console delay - the new rumor is that the final dev cost will exceed 250 million.

 

So that article is literally 'there are rumors that it's 200m' and it's substantiated by 'more rumors'.

No offense, I don't like ESO, but I don't think they spent 200million on it, they even said it wasn't 'close to 200 million' before when teased.

Also, your article was posted Jan 2. 

Interestingly enough on Jan 1st this article was published.  http://www.p4rgaming.com/zenimax-debunks-elder-scrolls-online-200m-budget-rumor-we-couldnt-have-wasted-that-much-money/

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