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Star Wars: The Old Republic

Star Wars: The Old Republic 

General Discussion  » Hidden Subscriber Benefits?

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58 posts found
  nachofoot

Novice Member

Joined: 4/24/07
Posts: 117

 
OP  5/12/14 8:33:48 PM#1

So I decided to try this game out prior to the upcoming expansion.  However, I noticed that RE'ing a crafted item now has a 10% chance of a schematic instead of 20%.

 

I was positive I was getting 20% before but now I'm not a subscriber.  Is this some sort of hidden subscriber benefit or was it changed?

  reeereee

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/22/13
Posts: 686

5/12/14 8:38:14 PM#2
Originally posted by nachofoot

So I decided to try this game out prior to the upcoming expansion.  However, I noticed that RE'ing a crafted item now has a 10% chance of a schematic instead of 20%.

 

I was positive I was getting 20% before but now I'm not a subscriber.  Is this some sort of hidden subscriber benefit or was it changed?

Correct, also if you're not a subscriber the crit rate on gathering missions is so low they're not even worth bothering with, as you can usually buy the non crit mats for less than the mission costs on the AH.

  nachofoot

Novice Member

Joined: 4/24/07
Posts: 117

 
OP  5/12/14 8:55:03 PM#3
Originally posted by reeereee

Correct, also if you're not a subscriber the crit rate on gathering missions is so low they're not even worth bothering with, as you can usually buy the non crit mats for less than the mission costs on the AH.

 

I didn't think they would be so dumb enough to hide pay2win features but I am now amazed.  Only a coward would nerf you behind your back.

 

Makes it much easier to uninstall and never look back.

  Deathsmind

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/07/11
Posts: 189

5/12/14 9:33:04 PM#4
Thats not pay to win. Thats buffs for helping the company. You can get the same stuff from not being a subscriber it just takes longer. 
  Tyggs

Elite Member

Joined: 5/07/14
Posts: 175

5/12/14 9:35:28 PM#5
Originally posted by nachofoot
Originally posted by reeereee

Correct, also if you're not a subscriber the crit rate on gathering missions is so low they're not even worth bothering with, as you can usually buy the non crit mats for less than the mission costs on the AH.

 

I didn't think they would be so dumb enough to hide pay2win features but I am now amazed.

 

Oh well...makes it much easier to uninstall and never look back.

What are you winning? You can craft the same things without paying a dime. Oh, wait, you don't know what pay to win means... carry on.

  Elevenb4

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/08/12
Posts: 207

5/12/14 9:44:14 PM#6
It's always cracks me up when people complain about the free stuff being offered by a company. Especially when you can get it all for $15. Complaining about limitations of the free side when to get it all costs $15...... I just dont' understand people. We used to call them cheapskates. The game is a great game. I'm not even playing it atm, but I'm subbing because I enjoy supporting the game. 

-Unconstitutional laws aren't laws.-

  reeereee

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/22/13
Posts: 686

5/12/14 9:50:31 PM#7
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by nachofoot
Originally posted by reeereee

Correct, also if you're not a subscriber the crit rate on gathering missions is so low they're not even worth bothering with, as you can usually buy the non crit mats for less than the mission costs on the AH.

 

I didn't think they would be so dumb enough to hide pay2win features but I am now amazed.

 

Oh well...makes it much easier to uninstall and never look back.

What are you winning? You can craft the same things without paying a dime. Oh, wait, you don't know what pay to win means... carry on.

I believe he's talking about what p2w would look like for crafters.  I mean seriously, imagine what it would be like if non-subscribers weren't allowed to crit in PvP?  Would that not be pay to win?  In fact more pay to win than you see in almost any mmo?  Why is it ok for crafting but not other aspects of the game? 

  Tyggs

Elite Member

Joined: 5/07/14
Posts: 175

5/12/14 9:52:29 PM#8
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by nachofoot
Originally posted by reeereee

Correct, also if you're not a subscriber the crit rate on gathering missions is so low they're not even worth bothering with, as you can usually buy the non crit mats for less than the mission costs on the AH.

 

I didn't think they would be so dumb enough to hide pay2win features but I am now amazed.

 

Oh well...makes it much easier to uninstall and never look back.

What are you winning? You can craft the same things without paying a dime. Oh, wait, you don't know what pay to win means... carry on.

I believe he's talking about what p2w would look like for crafters.  I mean seriously, imagine what it would be like if non-subscribers weren't allowed to crit in PvP?  Would that not be pay to win?  In fact more pay to win than you see in almost any mmo?  Why is it ok for crafting but not other aspects of the game? 

But... you aren't in competition with anyone when crafting, you just do it at a slower pace. It would be more like non-subs walk 5% slowing when doing PVE combat. You do it slower, but who cares, you are doing the same thing for free.

  syriinx

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/24/13
Posts: 821

5/12/14 9:55:11 PM#9
Originally posted by nachofoot
Originally posted by reeereee

Correct, also if you're not a subscriber the crit rate on gathering missions is so low they're not even worth bothering with, as you can usually buy the non crit mats for less than the mission costs on the AH.

 

I didn't think they would be so dumb enough to hide pay2win features but I am now amazed.

 

Oh well...makes it much easier to uninstall and never look back.

Its only pay2win if you have to pay above the sub.

f2p is, and should be, the poverty version of the game.  SWTOR's model is decent, lenient enough that you can effectively play the game but subbing is king and if you are subbed you can 100% ignore the cash shop.  

Its not like crafting is a big factor in SWTOR anyway

  reeereee

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/22/13
Posts: 686

5/12/14 10:09:43 PM#10
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by nachofoot
Originally posted by reeereee

Correct, also if you're not a subscriber the crit rate on gathering missions is so low they're not even worth bothering with, as you can usually buy the non crit mats for less than the mission costs on the AH.

 

I didn't think they would be so dumb enough to hide pay2win features but I am now amazed.

 

Oh well...makes it much easier to uninstall and never look back.

What are you winning? You can craft the same things without paying a dime. Oh, wait, you don't know what pay to win means... carry on.

I believe he's talking about what p2w would look like for crafters.  I mean seriously, imagine what it would be like if non-subscribers weren't allowed to crit in PvP?  Would that not be pay to win?  In fact more pay to win than you see in almost any mmo?  Why is it ok for crafting but not other aspects of the game? 

But... you aren't in competition with anyone when crafting, you just do it at a slower pace. It would be more like non-subs walk 5% slowing when doing PVE combat. You do it slower, but who cares, you are doing the same thing for free.

Not being able to crit is much more than a 5% loss on what you can do crafting wise, it would be more akin to a 30% speed debuff, which people would legitimately complain about.

 

Let's say PvP or Huttball is like virtual sports and you see that as competition, then what is crafting?  It's more or less a virtual business.  The idea that you somehow see virtual sporting as a form of competition but virtual business not a form of competition speaks to a lack of prospective.

  Tyggs

Elite Member

Joined: 5/07/14
Posts: 175

5/12/14 10:13:15 PM#11
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by nachofoot
Originally posted by reeereee

Correct, also if you're not a subscriber the crit rate on gathering missions is so low they're not even worth bothering with, as you can usually buy the non crit mats for less than the mission costs on the AH.

 

I didn't think they would be so dumb enough to hide pay2win features but I am now amazed.

 

Oh well...makes it much easier to uninstall and never look back.

What are you winning? You can craft the same things without paying a dime. Oh, wait, you don't know what pay to win means... carry on.

I believe he's talking about what p2w would look like for crafters.  I mean seriously, imagine what it would be like if non-subscribers weren't allowed to crit in PvP?  Would that not be pay to win?  In fact more pay to win than you see in almost any mmo?  Why is it ok for crafting but not other aspects of the game? 

But... you aren't in competition with anyone when crafting, you just do it at a slower pace. It would be more like non-subs walk 5% slowing when doing PVE combat. You do it slower, but who cares, you are doing the same thing for free.

Not being able to crit is much more than a 5% loss on what you can do crafting wise, it would be more akin to a 30% speed debuff, which people would legitimately complain about.

 

Let's say PvP or Huttball is like virtual sports and you see that as competition, then what is crafting?  It's more or less a virtual business.  The idea that you somehow see virtual sporting as a form of competition but virtual business not a form of competition speaks to a lack of prospective.

My perspective is fine. PVP is a legitimate activity for progression. Crafting in SWTOR is not. To say otherwise speaks to your knowledge of the game. Crafting is a side game that you manage your companions with. Crafting has very little bearing on the in game market. To say crafting in SWTOR is competitive is silly. To call it P2W is ridiculous. 

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 5575

5/12/14 10:17:35 PM#12

There are several paywall type of sub benefits to the game and it's not my favorite model, but subbing does unlock the game and I like that. I don't care if it's pay to win or not. That slogan is so overused it's getting sick.

TOR is not a game I will play a lot unsubbed, but I'll throw $15 - $30 at them every once in a while to play Star Wars and enjoy myself.

I think a mind wipe so people could play an mmo like it was their first time again, would be easier to build than a new mmo people here would actually like. - DamonVile

  reeereee

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/22/13
Posts: 686

5/12/14 10:20:15 PM#13
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by nachofoot
Originally posted by reeereee

Correct, also if you're not a subscriber the crit rate on gathering missions is so low they're not even worth bothering with, as you can usually buy the non crit mats for less than the mission costs on the AH.

 

I didn't think they would be so dumb enough to hide pay2win features but I am now amazed.

 

Oh well...makes it much easier to uninstall and never look back.

What are you winning? You can craft the same things without paying a dime. Oh, wait, you don't know what pay to win means... carry on.

I believe he's talking about what p2w would look like for crafters.  I mean seriously, imagine what it would be like if non-subscribers weren't allowed to crit in PvP?  Would that not be pay to win?  In fact more pay to win than you see in almost any mmo?  Why is it ok for crafting but not other aspects of the game? 

But... you aren't in competition with anyone when crafting, you just do it at a slower pace. It would be more like non-subs walk 5% slowing when doing PVE combat. You do it slower, but who cares, you are doing the same thing for free.

Not being able to crit is much more than a 5% loss on what you can do crafting wise, it would be more akin to a 30% speed debuff, which people would legitimately complain about.

 

Let's say PvP or Huttball is like virtual sports and you see that as competition, then what is crafting?  It's more or less a virtual business.  The idea that you somehow see virtual sporting as a form of competition but virtual business not a form of competition speaks to a lack of prospective.

My perspective is fine. PVP is a legitimate activity for progression. Crafting in SWTOR is not. To say otherwise speaks to your knowledge of the game. Crafting is a side game that you manage your companions with. Crafting has very little bearing on the in game market. To say crafting in SWTOR is competitive is silly. To call it P2W is ridiculous. 

Then, of course, you would understand why someone who just wanted to do some casual crafting would decided to uninstall the game.

  Tyggs

Elite Member

Joined: 5/07/14
Posts: 175

5/12/14 10:21:54 PM#14
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by Tyggs
Originally posted by nachofoot
Originally posted by reeereee

Correct, also if you're not a subscriber the crit rate on gathering missions is so low they're not even worth bothering with, as you can usually buy the non crit mats for less than the mission costs on the AH.

 

I didn't think they would be so dumb enough to hide pay2win features but I am now amazed.

 

Oh well...makes it much easier to uninstall and never look back.

What are you winning? You can craft the same things without paying a dime. Oh, wait, you don't know what pay to win means... carry on.

I believe he's talking about what p2w would look like for crafters.  I mean seriously, imagine what it would be like if non-subscribers weren't allowed to crit in PvP?  Would that not be pay to win?  In fact more pay to win than you see in almost any mmo?  Why is it ok for crafting but not other aspects of the game? 

But... you aren't in competition with anyone when crafting, you just do it at a slower pace. It would be more like non-subs walk 5% slowing when doing PVE combat. You do it slower, but who cares, you are doing the same thing for free.

Not being able to crit is much more than a 5% loss on what you can do crafting wise, it would be more akin to a 30% speed debuff, which people would legitimately complain about.

 

Let's say PvP or Huttball is like virtual sports and you see that as competition, then what is crafting?  It's more or less a virtual business.  The idea that you somehow see virtual sporting as a form of competition but virtual business not a form of competition speaks to a lack of prospective.

My perspective is fine. PVP is a legitimate activity for progression. Crafting in SWTOR is not. To say otherwise speaks to your knowledge of the game. Crafting is a side game that you manage your companions with. Crafting has very little bearing on the in game market. To say crafting in SWTOR is competitive is silly. To call it P2W is ridiculous. 

Then, of course, you would understand why someone who just wanted to do some casual crafting would decided to uninstall the game.

Not at all. Infact, if all you wanted to do is craft, SWTOR has NO wall there for free players. You can craft any Item available. It may take a bit longer as a free player, but what is your rush? There is no competition in crafting in SWTOR.

  DamonVile

Elite Member

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 4389

5/12/14 10:35:42 PM#15
Originally posted by Torvaldr

There are several paywall type of sub benefits to the game and it's not my favorite model, but subbing does unlock the game and I like that. I don't care if it's pay to win or not. That slogan is so overused it's getting sick.

TOR is not a game I will play a lot unsubbed, but I'll throw $15 - $30 at them every once in a while to play Star Wars and enjoy myself.

+1

P2W pretty much means " what I have to spend money???!!! " 

People are like cats. When they die, you get a new one.

  reeereee

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/22/13
Posts: 686

5/12/14 10:45:18 PM#16
Originally posted by DamonVile
Originally posted by Torvaldr

There are several paywall type of sub benefits to the game and it's not my favorite model, but subbing does unlock the game and I like that. I don't care if it's pay to win or not. That slogan is so overused it's getting sick.

TOR is not a game I will play a lot unsubbed, but I'll throw $15 - $30 at them every once in a while to play Star Wars and enjoy myself.

+1

P2W pretty much means " what I have to spend money???!!! " 

Ok, ok, SWTOR's model is like 100 times better than PWE games where the person who dropped $10k in the cash shop would go around crushing everyone in PvP. 

 

The only real problem is that Tera came along where I experience virtually zero negative effects from not spending a dime so it's hard not to be judgemental sometimes.

  DamonVile

Elite Member

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 4389

5/12/14 10:57:18 PM#17
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by DamonVile
Originally posted by Torvaldr

There are several paywall type of sub benefits to the game and it's not my favorite model, but subbing does unlock the game and I like that. I don't care if it's pay to win or not. That slogan is so overused it's getting sick.

TOR is not a game I will play a lot unsubbed, but I'll throw $15 - $30 at them every once in a while to play Star Wars and enjoy myself.

+1

P2W pretty much means " what I have to spend money???!!! " 

Ok, ok, SWTOR's model is like 100 times better than PWE games where the person who dropped $10k in the cash shop would go around crushing everyone in PvP. 

 

The only real problem is that Tera came along where I experience virtually zero negative effects from not spending a dime so it's hard not to be judgemental sometimes.

I agree TERA has a great system and I've spent money on the game and enjoy it, but asking for games to not charge anything or expecting them all to be 100% playable with no money at all isn't really asking for better games. It's asking for cheaper ones.

Not being cheap enough to play isn't really the problem with MMOs right now...imo. 

P2W arguments never really center around wanting better game play. They come from people wanting cheaper game play and being on a level playing field with those who spend money. So again...even though I don't support true pay to win, it's not the side I want to be on.

People are like cats. When they die, you get a new one.

  reeereee

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/22/13
Posts: 686

5/12/14 11:33:37 PM#18
Originally posted by DamonVile
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by DamonVile
Originally posted by Torvaldr

There are several paywall type of sub benefits to the game and it's not my favorite model, but subbing does unlock the game and I like that. I don't care if it's pay to win or not. That slogan is so overused it's getting sick.

TOR is not a game I will play a lot unsubbed, but I'll throw $15 - $30 at them every once in a while to play Star Wars and enjoy myself.

+1

P2W pretty much means " what I have to spend money???!!! " 

Ok, ok, SWTOR's model is like 100 times better than PWE games where the person who dropped $10k in the cash shop would go around crushing everyone in PvP. 

 

The only real problem is that Tera came along where I experience virtually zero negative effects from not spending a dime so it's hard not to be judgemental sometimes.

I agree TERA has a great system and I've spent money on the game and enjoy it, but asking for games to not charge anything or expecting them all to be 100% playable with no money at all isn't really asking for better games. It's asking for cheaper ones.

Not being cheap enough to play isn't really the problem with MMOs right now...imo. 

P2W arguments never really center around wanting better game play. They come from people wanting cheaper game play and being on a level playing field with those who spend money. So again...even though I don't support true pay to win, it's not the side I want to be on.

The problem is going expensive doesn't get you anything either.  The king of subscription mmos is on a 12 month hiatus from adding new content, and when it does get around to adding new content you'll be expected to pay a box fee to access it.  If there was actually someone out there delivering better gameplay for a higher price I would be down, but I just don't see anyone doing it in the current market.
  Four0Six

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/18/11
Posts: 1069

5/12/14 11:38:59 PM#19

In the beginning Pay 2 Win meant getting weapons that actually had better stats.

 

LOL

 

How far we have fallen.

  tawess

Elite Member

Joined: 3/24/05
Posts: 1907

5/12/14 11:46:58 PM#20
Originally posted by Four0Six

In the beginning Pay 2 Win meant getting weapons that actually had better stats.

 

LOL

 

How far we have fallen.

I always try to maintain this as the standard.

 

Now that is not to say a game can be P2Have fun... And that is almost as bad.

Tomas Soapbox

This have been a good conversation

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