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Mortal Online

Mortal Online 

General Discussion  » MO has one of the best combat{Video inside}

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66 posts found
  Toferio

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/26/09
Posts: 1461

2/11/14 12:36:28 PM#21
Originally posted by Anubisan

It's about your twitch skill and your ability to anticipate your enemy's moves. 

Objectively, exactly same can be said for most themepark games. You have exactly same twitch skill reaction to enemies moves and trying to counter their say "fear" with your spell protection, it is not different. As for anticipating moves? There too, it's the same. In themeparks you always try to anticipate what cooldowns the enemy will use when based on your actions.

I'm not saying MO has better/worse combat, only that similar principles apply to themeparks, even if in different form.

  Anubisan

Novice Member

Joined: 1/09/05
Posts: 1835

2/11/14 1:27:22 PM#22
Originally posted by Toferio
Originally posted by Anubisan

It's about your twitch skill and your ability to anticipate your enemy's moves. 

Objectively, exactly same can be said for most themepark games. You have exactly same twitch skill reaction to enemies moves and trying to counter their say "fear" with your spell protection, it is not different. As for anticipating moves? There too, it's the same. In themeparks you always try to anticipate what cooldowns the enemy will use when based on your actions.

I'm not saying MO has better/worse combat, only that similar principles apply to themeparks, even if in different form.

That is true, but you really don't have to aim at all in most of those games. You just have to be looking somewhat in the general direction of your enemy and pressing your skill buttons in the correct order. Sure, you still have to use the correct skills at the correct time, but it just seems less skill-based to me. It's obviously totally subjective, but I personally have never found that to be anywhere near as entertaining as actually having to swing a sword at exactly the right angle and speed to hit my target while they're trying to block or parry my attacks.

Beyond that, the fact that these themepark games have virtually no risks at all when you die just makes them feel meaningless to me. I literally don't care at all about dying, so there is no adrenaline flowing, no emotional investment in my character... nothing. No point in even playing...

  Toferio

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/26/09
Posts: 1461

2/11/14 3:48:42 PM#23
Originally posted by Anubisan
Originally posted by Toferio
Originally posted by Anubisan

It's about your twitch skill and your ability to anticipate your enemy's moves. 

Objectively, exactly same can be said for most themepark games. You have exactly same twitch skill reaction to enemies moves and trying to counter their say "fear" with your spell protection, it is not different. As for anticipating moves? There too, it's the same. In themeparks you always try to anticipate what cooldowns the enemy will use when based on your actions.

I'm not saying MO has better/worse combat, only that similar principles apply to themeparks, even if in different form.

Beyond that, the fact that these themepark games have virtually no risks at all when you die just makes them feel meaningless to me. I literally don't care at all about dying, so there is no adrenaline flowing, no emotional investment in my character... nothing. No point in even playing...

I'd agree that aiming is more fun, but as I wrote somewhere previously I find it somewhat more limiting at the moment as well as less engaging because how few abilities/choices you have.

As for the dying.. You are partly right, the loss is almost non existent in themeparks, although one could argue that all you really face in MO are few extra hours of farming - just a time sink. However for me the adrenaline rush came not from the material loss, but from the fact of losing in such games. I were pissed that some guy managed killing me, often resulting in us trying to screw each other over for hours, simply because of the principle, and me grinding my teeth when I got killed. Not because of the loss, but because of the humiliation of the losing.

I can honestly say that I've never been as pissed off in any other game (including DF and MO) as I've been in WoW, including the adrenaline rush when I am about to finally attack that guy who killed me few times prior to it. Then again, maybe it depends on the fact that I am more hot blooded than your average gamer.

  Hrotha

Novice Member

Joined: 4/25/08
Posts: 840

2/11/14 3:56:56 PM#24
Originally posted by SuperNick
Looks incredibly dated on all fronts.

^

  Anubisan

Novice Member

Joined: 1/09/05
Posts: 1835

2/11/14 5:15:51 PM#25
Originally posted by 4bsolute
Originally posted by SuperNick
Looks incredibly dated on all fronts.

^

Well it's a 3 year old game made by a small indie development team. If you come here expecting an MMO with AAA graphics, you're kind of looking in the wrong place. Fortunately there are many shitty games out there that are quite pleasing graphically if that's your thing.

  YoungCaesar

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/08/13
Posts: 240

2/11/14 8:02:47 PM#26
Originally posted by Toferio
Originally posted by Anubisan
Originally posted by Toferio
Originally posted by Anubisan

It's about your twitch skill and your ability to anticipate your enemy's moves. 

Objectively, exactly same can be said for most themepark games. You have exactly same twitch skill reaction to enemies moves and trying to counter their say "fear" with your spell protection, it is not different. As for anticipating moves? There too, it's the same. In themeparks you always try to anticipate what cooldowns the enemy will use when based on your actions.

I'm not saying MO has better/worse combat, only that similar principles apply to themeparks, even if in different form.

Beyond that, the fact that these themepark games have virtually no risks at all when you die just makes them feel meaningless to me. I literally don't care at all about dying, so there is no adrenaline flowing, no emotional investment in my character... nothing. No point in even playing...

I'd agree that aiming is more fun, but as I wrote somewhere previously I find it somewhat more limiting at the moment as well as less engaging because how few abilities/choices you have.

As for the dying.. You are partly right, the loss is almost non existent in themeparks, although one could argue that all you really face in MO are few extra hours of farming - just a time sink. However for me the adrenaline rush came not from the material loss, but from the fact of losing in such games. I were pissed that some guy managed killing me, often resulting in us trying to screw each other over for hours, simply because of the principle, and me grinding my teeth when I got killed. Not because of the loss, but because of the humiliation of the losing.

I can honestly say that I've never been as pissed off in any other game (including DF and MO) as I've been in WoW, including the adrenaline rush when I am about to finally attack that guy who killed me few times prior to it. Then again, maybe it depends on the fact that I am more hot blooded than your average gamer.

Well imagine if that same enemy could keep all your stuff when you die, and next he sees you he can say, "oh thx for the gear"... and you see him using all your old stuff lol wouldnt that boil your blood more than in a themepark???

And you cant say that timing some cooldowns can be more skill based than freaking aiming your shots, perfect blocking on the perfect moment (rewarded with a counter attack that does double the dmg, which you have to aim as well), stamina management, using of the terrain, etc.... and lets not even start on group play, well proper war tactics like in Mount & Blade can help you beat double your numbers (the so called "zergs")

I cant speak for DF but MO magic system is pretty basic compared to WoW (no utlity mage spells, roots, stuns, etc.) because its just a placeholder theyre supposed to expand after the next patch (which is territory control), altho you still sorta have to aim because your spell fizzles if you dont, and you have a DoT spell, corrupt, that cancels any healing on your enemy (of course this has a counter, "purify").. and MOs melee is damn awesome, you cant compare that to any MMORPG out there atm, only to fps like age of chivalry....

 

 

  Realbigdeal

Novice Member

Joined: 9/28/08
Posts: 1652

 
OP  2/11/14 10:44:39 PM#27
Originally posted by Anubisan
Originally posted by Toferio
Originally posted by Anubisan

It's about your twitch skill and your ability to anticipate your enemy's moves. 

Objectively, exactly same can be said for most themepark games. You have exactly same twitch skill reaction to enemies moves and trying to counter their say "fear" with your spell protection, it is not different. As for anticipating moves? There too, it's the same. In themeparks you always try to anticipate what cooldowns the enemy will use when based on your actions.

I'm not saying MO has better/worse combat, only that similar principles apply to themeparks, even if in different form.

That is true, but you really don't have to aim at all in most of those games. You just have to be looking somewhat in the general direction of your enemy and pressing your skill buttons in the correct order. Sure, you still have to use the correct skills at the correct time, but it just seems less skill-based to me. It's obviously totally subjective, but I personally have never found that to be anywhere near as entertaining as actually having to swing a sword at exactly the right angle and speed to hit my target while they're trying to block or parry my attacks.

Beyond that, the fact that these themepark games have virtually no risks at all when you die just makes them feel meaningless to me. I literally don't care at all about dying, so there is no adrenaline flowing, no emotional investment in my character... nothing. No point in even playing...

They don't know how were shaking, they dont know how fast our hearts are pumping and everything when we play games as hardcore as MO, Dayz, Rust... The fear of dying and the fear of being the reason for the loss of our team turns  those feelings into great effects. Even after a victory or a loss, i'm still shaking at the same rate than when i'm fighting someone in real life or nah, i wont say that. I dont want to say something that is not true adn than say JK and go to jail for 8 years like that LOL player.

But for real, after each loss, i have to think all day while at school and work how i failed and how i can manage to win nexttime in the next encounter or how i can atleast not die to not lose my stuff.

...

But anyway, the topic is about combat. In tab targeting games, all you have to do is tapping each keys in the right order against several different classes. It dont have to counter play, you dont have to predict, you dont have to try to dodge. All you have to do is download autohotkey and lets say you're fighting a warrior, then keep pressing (Y) and with one button, you can perform the whole cycle to kill the warrior auttomatically. Make a new order with a new key to kill a mage, warlock, shaman ect...

I'm not even kidding when i say that coz every wow twich pvp i see, i see players using a bunch of addons and autohotkey to win in pvp with no efforts at all with the aid of 1 key that is supposed to play the whole cycle.

 

C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif

  Toferio

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/26/09
Posts: 1461

2/12/14 3:31:11 AM#28
Originally posted by YoungCaesar
Originally posted by Toferio

I'd agree that aiming is more fun, but as I wrote somewhere previously I find it somewhat more limiting at the moment as well as less engaging because how few abilities/choices you have.

As for the dying.. You are partly right, the loss is almost non existent in themeparks, although one could argue that all you really face in MO are few extra hours of farming - just a time sink. However for me the adrenaline rush came not from the material loss, but from the fact of losing in such games. I were pissed that some guy managed killing me, often resulting in us trying to screw each other over for hours, simply because of the principle, and me grinding my teeth when I got killed. Not because of the loss, but because of the humiliation of the losing.

I can honestly say that I've never been as pissed off in any other game (including DF and MO) as I've been in WoW, including the adrenaline rush when I am about to finally attack that guy who killed me few times prior to it. Then again, maybe it depends on the fact that I am more hot blooded than your average gamer.

And you cant say that timing some cooldowns can be more skill based than freaking aiming your shots, perfect blocking on the perfect moment (rewarded with a counter attack that does double the dmg, which you have to aim as well), stamina management, using of the terrain, etc.... and lets not even start on group play, well proper war tactics like in Mount & Blade can help you beat double your numbers (the so called "zergs")

I cant speak for DF but MO magic system is pretty basic compared to WoW (no utlity mage spells, roots, stuns, etc.) because its just a placeholder theyre supposed to expand after the next patch (which is territory control), altho you still sorta have to aim because your spell fizzles if you dont, and you have a DoT spell, corrupt, that cancels any healing on your enemy (of course this has a counter, "purify").. and MOs melee is damn awesome, you cant compare that to any MMORPG out there atm, only to fps like age of chivalry....

I've played a fair amount of aim based RPGs and FPS, I don't consider aiming be that much of a skill except for archery I'd say, which is affected by gravity. As for the rest of the stuff you list such as stamina management, terrain, blocking.. It is cancelled out by themepark's cooldown management, countering your enemies abilities, planning, mana management, etc.

When and if MO's magic system gets on par to themepark with more utility spells and stops being a placeholder, then I'd be inclined to say it takes more skill, given they don't fuck it up as they did with rest of the systems. However at the moment, the skills combat in MO requires are imho outbalanced by themeparks vast array of abilities, cooldowns and choices. It's of course subjective, but to me when I have to take into account all possible cooldowns my opponent will blow, control them and counter them, requires equal, even if other kind of, skills as aiming.

The video we're discussing is a perfect example, the combat looks kinda.. bland. It takes skills, but it is still based around few very simple core systems, hitting and blocking.. Not much to play around with there, is it? I guess it's just not my thing, but all I'm saying is that themeparks combat also require skill, although different kind of.

Originally posted by Realbigdeal
It dont have to counter play, you dont have to predict

That's just an ignorant statement, and my last reply to you since it's obvious you're not interested in an objective discussion.

  Realbigdeal

Novice Member

Joined: 9/28/08
Posts: 1652

 
OP  2/14/14 11:10:31 AM#29
Originally posted by Toferio
Originally posted by YoungCaesar
Originally posted by Toferio

I'd agree that aiming is more fun, but as I wrote somewhere previously I find it somewhat more limiting at the moment as well as less engaging because how few abilities/choices you have.

As for the dying.. You are partly right, the loss is almost non existent in themeparks, although one could argue that all you really face in MO are few extra hours of farming - just a time sink. However for me the adrenaline rush came not from the material loss, but from the fact of losing in such games. I were pissed that some guy managed killing me, often resulting in us trying to screw each other over for hours, simply because of the principle, and me grinding my teeth when I got killed. Not because of the loss, but because of the humiliation of the losing.

I can honestly say that I've never been as pissed off in any other game (including DF and MO) as I've been in WoW, including the adrenaline rush when I am about to finally attack that guy who killed me few times prior to it. Then again, maybe it depends on the fact that I am more hot blooded than your average gamer.

And you cant say that timing some cooldowns can be more skill based than freaking aiming your shots, perfect blocking on the perfect moment (rewarded with a counter attack that does double the dmg, which you have to aim as well), stamina management, using of the terrain, etc.... and lets not even start on group play, well proper war tactics like in Mount & Blade can help you beat double your numbers (the so called "zergs")

I cant speak for DF but MO magic system is pretty basic compared to WoW (no utlity mage spells, roots, stuns, etc.) because its just a placeholder theyre supposed to expand after the next patch (which is territory control), altho you still sorta have to aim because your spell fizzles if you dont, and you have a DoT spell, corrupt, that cancels any healing on your enemy (of course this has a counter, "purify").. and MOs melee is damn awesome, you cant compare that to any MMORPG out there atm, only to fps like age of chivalry....

I've played a fair amount of aim based RPGs and FPS, I don't consider aiming be that much of a skill except for archery I'd say, which is affected by gravity. As for the rest of the stuff you list such as stamina management, terrain, blocking.. It is cancelled out by themepark's cooldown management, countering your enemies abilities, planning, mana management, etc.

When and if MO's magic system gets on par to themepark with more utility spells and stops being a placeholder, then I'd be inclined to say it takes more skill, given they don't fuck it up as they did with rest of the systems. However at the moment, the skills combat in MO requires are imho outbalanced by themeparks vast array of abilities, cooldowns and choices. It's of course subjective, but to me when I have to take into account all possible cooldowns my opponent will blow, control them and counter them, requires equal, even if other kind of, skills as aiming.

The video we're discussing is a perfect example, the combat looks kinda.. bland. It takes skills, but it is still based around few very simple core systems, hitting and blocking.. Not much to play around with there, is it? I guess it's just not my thing, but all I'm saying is that themeparks combat also require skill, although different kind of.

Originally posted by Realbigdeal
It dont have to counter play, you dont have to predict

That's just an ignorant statement, and my last reply to you since it's obvious you're not interested in an objective discussion

First of all, they're gonna rework magic and SV is pretty fast right now to patch their game since they dont have to fix new bugs every single time they release a patch anymore.

MO is different in that department of aiming. Melee requires aiming too since you can mostly deal high damage when you perform a piercing attack. Also, you have several hitbox in MO and yeah, different part, can be weaker. When you see someone parry, you have to aim and strike the area that the shield can't cover. While MO tries to go for realism, the game is a little too fast to be that so not being careful with your aiming mean that you will also miss a lot in melee especially when you chase. If you miss, you also lose stamina so there's a penalty based on every failure maneuver you perform. In case i didnt say it yeah, you also have to aim when you block or it's just gonna get through especially if you don't have a shield.

Finally that's something no one notice, but there's a lot of counters in MO. You can prevent a player from healing with an ability, you can drain the stam of your opponent simply by hitting him physically. They recently added spear stance this is used to deal more damage against mounts. You see players in the safe zone and you don't like the fact that the guards are protecting them? Well, become a thief and break their comfort.  Finally, there's also the perfect block mechanism and if performed correctly, you lose 0 stam and it leaves your opponent open for a counter attack.  I wont list them all, but theres a lot more examples.

 

--------

Please, tell me why it's ignorant. I know several players in rift too who say that they only need 2 keys to win and this is if they use AutoHotKey.

Do you know what AHK is? A Program that helps you customize your control so you can have 10 different butttons in one key and when you press that key, in a respective order, it goes to the next key. In most theme park games, you need to press your keys in the right order and fast in order to be succesful in PVP. Of course, there's some occasion where you will need some utilities and in this case, you just need to take a couple more slots to counter play which is not much left.

So if you get facestomped and you thought you were a lot better than that, than you should know that guy is using AHK and you should too if you want to get at that level. The developers of those theme park games like wow, they dont care. They will allow you to download every broken addons there is and they dont mind third party programs like AHK as long as you dont macro while you're AFK.

TLDR

{The community of the theme park games made up this new era of meta where you need addons and AHK to compete so at this level, theme park games dont take skills anymore while in MO or a game like darkfall, AHK won't help you at all.}

So whats the point of making a game with 100 abilities when again, AHK is gonna break it down in 2-3 sets with 1-3other utilities that you can use on specific situations? I'm not being biased, i used to watch a lot of streamed pvp video posted on youtube and everyone of them got a video where they explain what AHK is and what their setup is and how easy it is to play that way.

 

C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif

  Slapshot1188

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/06/07
Posts: 4196

2/14/14 3:57:36 PM#30

Somewhere along the line this thread got off track into a discussion about which input method into a video game requires more skill...

 

 

"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  Betel

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/08/10
Posts: 396

2/19/14 2:54:23 AM#31
Originally posted by RealbigdealThe community of the theme park games made up this new era of meta where you need addons and AHK to compete so at this level, theme park games dont take skills anymore while in MO or a game like darkfall, AHK won't help you at all.}

So whats the point of making a game with 100 abilities when again, AHK is gonna break it down in 2-3 sets with 1-3other utilities that you can use on specific situations? I'm not being biased, i used to watch a lot of streamed pvp video posted on youtube and everyone of them got a video where they explain what AHK is and what their setup is and how easy it is to play that way.

 

 

As a day 1 UO player in 1997, I can say you are completely wrong in stating that "theme park" games invented macroing in combat. UO PvP was all about macros, even moreso after the changes to poison and addition of bandages. One of the first OP char builds was built for macros, the hally mage. In fact, that was a true 2 button kill if your opponent wasn't used to PvPing - macro a 3 spell sequence to one key (magic arrow, explosion, energy bolt) then use your equip hally macro. Repeat as needed. Or there were the trapped boxes macros, which were a required part of PvP. I could go on. What was also clear, even back then, is that someone who thought they could press two buttons and win was always going to lose against anyone experienced in PvP.

The same applies in modern games like WoW. If you macro a long chain of commands, you can easily be countered and lose CD's and burst. Whether that is a paladin bubble on your target, losing range or LOS due to your target evading or whatever.

 

If you also want to see a skill vs numbers video, you need to see the old ShadowBane videos from the time of the Chinese Invasion. 60 people vs a 1000. That game had it's flaws, but it was still a far better game than MO will ever be, and the combat was also far better than the frankly awful state of MO combat. It's depressing that what was regarded as a failed game at the time (tho SB.exe has a lot of blame for that) is still miles ahead of a game like MO.

 

 

 

 

  Loktofeit

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 12406

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, ArcheAge, and Combat Arms

2/19/14 9:37:41 AM#32
Originally posted by Toferio
Originally posted by Anubisan

It's about your twitch skill and your ability to anticipate your enemy's moves. 

Objectively, exactly same can be said for most themepark games. You have exactly same twitch skill reaction to enemies moves and trying to counter their say "fear" with your spell protection, it is not different. As for anticipating moves? There too, it's the same. In themeparks you always try to anticipate what cooldowns the enemy will use when based on your actions.

I'm not saying MO has better/worse combat, only that similar principles apply to themeparks, even if in different form.

Do you really consider that twitch or action combat, though?

A certain amount of prediction? Yes. Engaging gameplay? For those that like it, certainly. I don't suggest that cooldown-based tab-targetting isn't fun or challenging, just that it is far from the twitch combat and prediction required in a game where you are actively targeting, timing blocks/parries, managing position relative to enemies, and avoiding friendly fire.

Keep in mind, this is all in first-person view, and not from a panned back third-person overview of the engagement, so to see what's around you, you have to actually look around you through all this. 

To say that exactly the same could be said about themepark games seems a heck of a stretch, if not completely false. 

 

 

"And wikipedia is as accurate as Britannica. Wikipedia is very reliable. You would be hard pressed to find a more reliable source for these kinds of things." -fivoroth

  Slapshot1188

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/06/07
Posts: 4196

2/19/14 10:11:07 AM#33
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Toferio
Originally posted by Anubisan

It's about your twitch skill and your ability to anticipate your enemy's moves. 

Objectively, exactly same can be said for most themepark games. You have exactly same twitch skill reaction to enemies moves and trying to counter their say "fear" with your spell protection, it is not different. As for anticipating moves? There too, it's the same. In themeparks you always try to anticipate what cooldowns the enemy will use when based on your actions.

I'm not saying MO has better/worse combat, only that similar principles apply to themeparks, even if in different form.

Do you really consider that twitch or action combat, though?

A certain amount of prediction? Yes. Engaging gameplay? For those that like it, certainly. I don't suggest that cooldown-based tab-targetting isn't fun or challenging, just that it is far from the twitch combat and prediction required in a game where you are actively targeting, timing blocks/parries, managing position relative to enemies, and avoiding friendly fire.

Keep in mind, this is all in first-person view, and not from a panned back third-person overview of the engagement, so to see what's around you, you have to actually look around you through all this. 

To say that exactly the same could be said about themepark games seems a heck of a stretch, if not completely false. 

 

 

Chess or Ping-Pong?  Which takes more "skill"?

 

It's a silly argument to have honestly as we are talking about input mechanics for a video game...

 

The real question for a game isn't which requires more "skill" but is it a FUN game.  The vast majority of people who have tried MO quit.  I'm sure there are a thousand different reasons and that some of those were due to input mechanics.  Similarly there are some who still play the game and some who prefer that input mechanic.  Neither side is right or wrong.

 

 

"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  Toferio

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/26/09
Posts: 1461

2/19/14 4:08:44 PM#34
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Toferio
Originally posted by Anubisan

It's about your twitch skill and your ability to anticipate your enemy's moves. 

Objectively, exactly same can be said for most themepark games. You have exactly same twitch skill reaction to enemies moves and trying to counter their say "fear" with your spell protection, it is not different. As for anticipating moves? There too, it's the same. In themeparks you always try to anticipate what cooldowns the enemy will use when based on your actions.

I'm not saying MO has better/worse combat, only that similar principles apply to themeparks, even if in different form.

Do you really consider that twitch or action combat, though?

A certain amount of prediction? Yes. Engaging gameplay? For those that like it, certainly. I don't suggest that cooldown-based tab-targetting isn't fun or challenging, just that it is far from the twitch combat and prediction required in a game where you are actively targeting, timing blocks/parries, managing position relative to enemies, and avoiding friendly fire.

Keep in mind, this is all in first-person view, and not from a panned back third-person overview of the engagement, so to see what's around you, you have to actually look around you through all this. 

To say that exactly the same could be said about themepark games seems a heck of a stretch, if not completely false. 

I commented on two things - twitch skill and anticipation of enemy's moves. I think we can both agree that the latter is given in both themeparks and sandboxes. It is differently implemented, but I would not say that combat in melee requires more prediction skills than say WoW, where you have to think in advance and cover all your enemy's cooldowns and skills (since WoW is much more ability/CD based).

I don't consider WoW for action combat that much, but I wouldn't say it has no twitch elements. Twitch gameplay is a type of video gameplay scenario that tests a player's reaction time, of which there's plenty in WoW, again due to cooldowns and ability counters. Often if you counter a second too late you are at a disadvantage. 

Is twitch gameplay and prediction exactly same between MO and WoW? No, but I meant that both games have exactly same elements, even if differently implemented. 

  NexusCZ

Novice Member

Joined: 9/12/07
Posts: 66

2/19/14 7:46:06 PM#35

Hello OP i don't want to sound like idiot because discussion here seems very nice and civil but calling this one of the best combat ... i was watching and it was like :-O like wtf is someone really released this(combat system) but was fun watching these noobs standing still doing nothing to get owned you get credit for that nevertheless.

You actually played m&b, wotr so how can you objectively call this one of the best combats :)

  Loktofeit

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 12406

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, ArcheAge, and Combat Arms

2/19/14 7:52:53 PM#36
Originally posted by Slapshot1188
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Toferio
Originally posted by Anubisan

It's about your twitch skill and your ability to anticipate your enemy's moves. 

Objectively, exactly same can be said for most themepark games. You have exactly same twitch skill reaction to enemies moves and trying to counter their say "fear" with your spell protection, it is not different. As for anticipating moves? There too, it's the same. In themeparks you always try to anticipate what cooldowns the enemy will use when based on your actions.

I'm not saying MO has better/worse combat, only that similar principles apply to themeparks, even if in different form.

Do you really consider that twitch or action combat, though?

A certain amount of prediction? Yes. Engaging gameplay? For those that like it, certainly. I don't suggest that cooldown-based tab-targetting isn't fun or challenging, just that it is far from the twitch combat and prediction required in a game where you are actively targeting, timing blocks/parries, managing position relative to enemies, and avoiding friendly fire.

Keep in mind, this is all in first-person view, and not from a panned back third-person overview of the engagement, so to see what's around you, you have to actually look around you through all this. 

To say that exactly the same could be said about themepark games seems a heck of a stretch, if not completely false. 

 

Chess or Ping-Pong?  Which takes more "skill"?

It's a silly argument to have honestly...

...which makes it a good thing that no one is arguing that.  

Twitch skill, specifically was the point being discussed. It seems Toferio and I agree on the prediction part. 

"And wikipedia is as accurate as Britannica. Wikipedia is very reliable. You would be hard pressed to find a more reliable source for these kinds of things." -fivoroth

  goboygo

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/02/13
Posts: 462

2/19/14 8:24:37 PM#37
Originally posted by azzamasin
Sorry but that looks like complete garbage.  I'd rather have Neverwinter's combat which IMO is the best combat in all of MMO's.  Combat isn't only look and feel but animations, fluidity and pacing with a high degree of production quality (polish).

Neverwinter's spaz mode combat is the best combat of all MMO'S?   Are you being serious with that statement?

  FlyByKnight

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/31/12
Posts: 538

2/19/14 8:36:39 PM#38
Sorry OP, that looked pretty terrible. Looks like a bunch of clumsy people LARP'ing.
  YoungCaesar

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/08/13
Posts: 240

2/21/14 2:28:42 AM#39
Originally posted by FlyByKnight
Sorry OP, that looked pretty terrible. Looks like a bunch of clumsy people LARP'ing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MxamOQyWHlU

This is a siege with more than 150 ppl.... and good FPS as you can see...

  Toferio

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/26/09
Posts: 1461

2/21/14 5:58:45 AM#40
Originally posted by YoungCaesar
Originally posted by FlyByKnight
Sorry OP, that looked pretty terrible. Looks like a bunch of clumsy people LARP'ing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MxamOQyWHlU

This is a siege with more than 150 ppl.... and good FPS as you can see...

That's funny, because not only does the video description say "a lot of lag", but in chat you can see someone yell "5 fps".. 

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