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The Secret World

The Secret World 

General Discussion  » Well Screw You Funcom

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56 posts found
  Po_gg

Elite Member

Joined: 5/12/10
Posts: 1992

1/31/14 3:23:09 PM#21
Originally posted by cheyane

What is in the boxes ? I have never bought keys in any game I played with boxes. Never felt the need.

I'm not logged in, so just out of memory: money, AP boost, signets, augments, black bullions, so pretty much only stuff that's good and worthy. No cosmetics, pets, or similar stuff which would maybe more acceptable...

And there's 2 boxes, the epic one is much more expensive, and it can give (with a slight chance I guess) epic signets and augments, or it gives the above instead, just more (so more money, more black bullions, etc.).

  cheyane

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/17/09
Posts: 2347

1/31/14 3:26:41 PM#22

My god ! /whistles softly; I seriously have no comment after learning what's in them.

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  DamonVile

Elite Member

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 4606

1/31/14 3:29:58 PM#23
Originally posted by Po_gg
Originally posted by DamonVile
So what happens if you just don't buy keys to open them ?

Hopefully that will be the case. I've never bought anything that would support the lockbox scam in any games I play. Ok, I admit honestly, on a few occasions I strongly had to fight back the urge when I saw a D'Kora on the Exchange, but I'm tough (or just stupid...) and I avoided to support the lockboxer :)  (D'Kora is a great ferengi vessel in STO, which is lockbox-only)

 

If many players avoiding to purchase the boxes, then the ball goes back to the devs. They can either push it further (Turbine tried that too, luckily without much result), or just leave it as it is. They will still get some extra income from it, since a few folks will buy them, a few always does.

I don't buy lock boxes or keys but I have no issue buying what comes out of them with in game money. 

Games don't run on promises, good intentions or cheese... if someone wants to spend a pile of money on lockboxes go for it. If I can earn that same item just by playing, then the company wins, the lockbox guys win and I win. We all get what we want.

It's nice to say a company should only sell hats but when you're not paying your bills because people don't buy enough hats, you have to start looking for other things people will buy. It's all wonderful for a gamer to say just shut the game down and keep your " integrity " but it's not just a game to them is it ? I'm not so sure I'd want my company to just shut my job down instead of selling something I don't like.

People are like cats. When they die, you get a new one.

  DamonVile

Elite Member

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 4606

1/31/14 3:31:49 PM#24
Originally posted by Po_gg
Originally posted by cheyane

What is in the boxes ? I have never bought keys in any game I played with boxes. Never felt the need.

I'm not logged in, so just out of memory: money, AP boost, signets, augments, black bullions, so pretty much only stuff that's good and worthy. No cosmetics, pets, or similar stuff which would maybe more acceptable...

And there's 2 boxes, the epic one is much more expensive, and it can give (with a slight chance I guess) epic signets and augments, or it gives the above instead, just more (so more money, more black bullions, etc.).

I don't know what any of those things are but...boxes should just be cosmetic things :/

People are like cats. When they die, you get a new one.

  dancingstar

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/19/11
Posts: 276

1/31/14 3:43:21 PM#25
Originally posted by cheyane

What is in the boxes ? I have never bought keys in any game I played with boxes. Never felt the need.

Two types. The cheaper one (160 points) contains one green rarity item and one green or blue rarity item. The "Deeper Mystery Box" (480 points) contain two green rarity items and one blue or purple rarity item. Drop research is currently ongoing; some preliminary reports were posted in a thread on the TSW forums which got locked after it degenerated into flaming and name-calling (well, to be fair, it pretty much started out as flaming and name-calling).

Green rarity items can be any one of:

  • 1 green rarity signet
  • 1 green rarity Augment Resonator
  • 3 Black Bullion (token currency normally gained from running hardmode dungeons)
  • 10 Black Marks of Venice (token currency normally gained from PvP)
  • 10 Credits of Ca d'Oro (token currency normally gained from solo PvE content)
  • 5 Pure Anima - Max Health (consumable)
  • 300,000 Pax Romana (the main ingame currency)
Blue rarity items can be any one of:
  • 1 blue rarity signet
  • 1 blue rarity Augment Resonator
  • 9 Black Bullion
  • 30 Black Marks of Venice
  • 1,000,000 Pax Romana
  • 1 x 50AP injection
  • 1 x 3 day AP booster (this and the above are cash shop consumables)
Purple rarity items can be any one of:
  • 1 purple rarity signet
  • 1 purple rarity Augment Resonator
  • 1 x 110AP injection
  • 1 x 7 day AP booster
  • Set of Delivering Ritual fragments (used to access one of the game's raids).

The AP Booster / AP Injections are the only things in there that are not obtainable by gameplay.  [EDIT: but AP themselves of course are obtained by ordinary gameplay: 50 AP, without any boosters, can be had by running 2 or 3 missions in Transylvania.]

Purple rarity signets, and purple or higher rarity Augment resonators, are currently the most valuable things on the player market in TSW, though a significant number of the 60 or so signet types are viewed as of limited value in both current PvE and PvP metas & sell for comparatively low prices on the player market (and if you wind up with a Serenity, Subjugation or Hatred you'd probably be best off just vendoring it).

As I noted in an earlier post, it's the boxes themselves, not keys to open boxes which drop in the game world, that are sold on the cash shop.

Currently Funcom store points are a little over 7 UK pounds for 1000.

 

  Po_gg

Elite Member

Joined: 5/12/10
Posts: 1992

1/31/14 4:01:23 PM#26

Damn... where did you found that? I thought the "what's in the box" is a valid question but I haven't found the list, so I logged in and wrote it up. Logged out, came back to post it, and -dang- it's already here :)

edit: yep, as dancingstar summarised after the list, sadly it's a pretty good deal. I wouldn't like to cry out P2W, but it definitely could save a lot of grind and / or spending for the player who are willing to gamble... And the AP injections which are store-only and not obtainable in-game, are 480 / 1440 FC in the store.

  dancingstar

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/19/11
Posts: 276

1/31/14 4:09:05 PM#27
Originally posted by Po_gg

Damn... where did you found that? I thought the what's in the box is a valid question but I haven't found the list, so I logged in and wrote it up. Came back to post it, and -dang- it's already here :)

That was pretty much cribbed from the shop screen in game, you posted your previous "from memory" reply while I was typing it up.

  User Deleted
1/31/14 4:22:11 PM#28


Originally posted by DamonVile

Originally posted by Po_gg

Originally posted by DamonVile So what happens if you just don't buy keys to open them ?
Hopefully that will be the case. I've never bought anything that would support the lockbox scam in any games I play. Ok, I admit honestly, on a few occasions I strongly had to fight back the urge when I saw a D'Kora on the Exchange, but I'm tough (or just stupid...) and I avoided to support the lockboxer :)  (D'Kora is a great ferengi vessel in STO, which is lockbox-only)   If many players avoiding to purchase the boxes, then the ball goes back to the devs. They can either push it further (Turbine tried that too, luckily without much result), or just leave it as it is. They will still get some extra income from it, since a few folks will buy them, a few always does.
I don't buy lock boxes or keys but I have no issue buying what comes out of them with in game money. 

Games don't run on promises, good intentions or cheese... if someone wants to spend a pile of money on lockboxes go for it. If I can earn that same item just by playing, then the company wins, the lockbox guys win and I win. We all get what we want.

It's nice to say a company should only sell hats but when you're not paying your bills because people don't buy enough hats, you have to start looking for other things people will buy. It's all wonderful for a gamer to say just shut the game down and keep your " integrity " but it's not just a game to them is it ? I'm not so sure I'd want my company to just shut my job down instead of selling something I don't like.


I can see the big picture of what you're saying, but still. If you aren't selling enough hats to keep in business, is the best idea really to put your hats in a slot machine?

I'm not a fan of real money gambling mechanics being put into a video game. I can see how some people tolerate it or even justify it though.

  Vikestart

Novice Member

Joined: 11/21/13
Posts: 4

1/31/14 9:12:34 PM#29

First, it's not a lockbox. You're not using the correct term. Lockboxes are those boxes you get as loot while playing and it says you need to buy a key to unlock it. That's not the case here, they are completely confined to the item store only.

Secondly, it's not really a good deal. An epic augment isn't really anything in itself. The only item that might actually be very decent to get is the epic signet, however, the chance of getting one is extremely slim, and even so if you manage to get an epic signet, the chance of getting a GOOD epic signet is even smaller.

These things are only worth spening points on if you don't have anything else to buy atm. Buyed a lot of them myself, got a few black bullions, a couple of green augments, pure anima etc. Definitely not worth it ;)

  Po_gg

Elite Member

Joined: 5/12/10
Posts: 1992

2/01/14 4:29:48 AM#30
Originally posted by Vikestart

First, it's not a lockbox. You're not using the correct term.

Secondly, it's not really a good deal.

(on a sidenote, in the evening I dived into this issue so much, that I missed the hobbit-taking event on Withywindle... they were already near Isengard when I logged in. /shakefist Funcom. :) )

 

First, it's not a lockbox. You're not using the correct term.  - seriously? that's your excuse? :)

There are numerous different implementations in games, with lots of different names. Lockbox is the most common, hence all of those mechanics are called lockboxes. I mean at least by us, common folks. And your definition isn't precise enough. (for example if the keys are dropped in game and you have to buy the box, that isn't lockbox by your meaning either :) )

These gambling mechanics (a.k.a. lockboxes), when you can acquire a random item from a loot table, if you spend real money for it. Simple as that. But if you like you can call it rafflebox, or rng-box (that's from the tsw forum), or anything else, it doesn't change anything. With the mystery boxes you get a random loot for real money. That's exactly what Joel ment when posted "no lockboxes, I promise".

 

Secondly, it's not really a good deal.  - I wish I could agree with you... In a small part I do actually, and maybe that will be the reason if it won't be a widespread purchase: for maxed out, endgame characters there's not much useful stuff in them, except the epic augment / signet, and maybe the ritual fragments. But as slight the chance to get one, I'm sure a few folks will buy those, for example from the bonus points which are close to expiration. (I'd spend them on cosmetics, but that's just me)

However, those characters who are still working on unlocking the wheel, or just started the endgame grind, or doesn't play an aspect of the game (like nightmares or pvp) it is sadly a pretty good deal. AP injections, AP boosters, max hp pure Anima are great for faster advancement. Black Marks / Bullions can be a nice gift to those who doesn't grind them, but there are a few stuff at the vendor which they like. Even the blue signet / augment is great for someone who's still not at the purples yet.

 

True, TSW is not an altoholic game. One character in each organisation is more than enough, so it's a bit of a mystery (pun intended) what was FC's goal. I think the boxes will swallowing the bonus points of the maxed-out characters, that's a safe bet. Probably a few folks will buy some additional FC points in the hope of epic signets, generating some extra income.

But it seems the main target of the boxes are the "leveling up" players (in brackets, since there are no levels :) ), and in TSW there's not many of them. Probably they're planning a campaign to get a new player influx in the game? That would be nice. Still, inserting these boxes was a shady and unfriendly move, and I can't see how can it help the idea... "come to TSW, now we also have lockboxes like all those other games"  :)

  AmbrosiaAmor

Elite Member

Joined: 11/24/10
Posts: 798

2/01/14 5:30:46 AM#31
Originally posted by Rayshe

I have been a large defender of Funcom...

 

Mistake #1 was defending Funcom (or any gaming company for that matter).

  Rayshe

Novice Member

Joined: 11/30/11
Posts: 1295

 
OP  2/01/14 12:41:53 PM#32
Originally posted by AmbrosiaAmor
Originally posted by Rayshe

I have been a large defender of Funcom...

 

Mistake #1 was defending Funcom (or any gaming company for that matter).

The reason i defended funcom with TSW is because they followed what they said as closely as they could. The only time they went back on their word is when they couldn't possibly keep it. The dev team for TSW was great, and they did great work. Sadly this lockbox crap comes up which literally sits as a direct lie to the issues we brought up on the forum. This is a issue that the devs themselves came to the forums and told us directly it wouldn't happen. This is why the lockboxes sting so bad, Its not because they are implimenting it. Its because they promised that they wouldn't.

Because i can.
I'm Hopeful For Every Game, Until the Fan Boys Attack My Games. Then the Knives Come Out.
Logic every gamers worst enemy.

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 5643

2/01/14 1:21:53 PM#33
Originally posted by DamonVile
Originally posted by Po_gg
Originally posted by DamonVile
So what happens if you just don't buy keys to open them ?

Hopefully that will be the case. I've never bought anything that would support the lockbox scam in any games I play. Ok, I admit honestly, on a few occasions I strongly had to fight back the urge when I saw a D'Kora on the Exchange, but I'm tough (or just stupid...) and I avoided to support the lockboxer :)  (D'Kora is a great ferengi vessel in STO, which is lockbox-only)

 

If many players avoiding to purchase the boxes, then the ball goes back to the devs. They can either push it further (Turbine tried that too, luckily without much result), or just leave it as it is. They will still get some extra income from it, since a few folks will buy them, a few always does.

I don't buy lock boxes or keys but I have no issue buying what comes out of them with in game money. 

Games don't run on promises, good intentions or cheese... if someone wants to spend a pile of money on lockboxes go for it. If I can earn that same item just by playing, then the company wins, the lockbox guys win and I win. We all get what we want.

It's nice to say a company should only sell hats but when you're not paying your bills because people don't buy enough hats, you have to start looking for other things people will buy. It's all wonderful for a gamer to say just shut the game down and keep your " integrity " but it's not just a game to them is it ? I'm not so sure I'd want my company to just shut my job down instead of selling something I don't like.

I don't have a problem buying what comes out of them either. Like I said, not my preferred method, but it does work for both the player and publisher.

I think you answered your question, or statement rather, why they aren't just cosmetics in the boxes either. If it were just cosmetics then they would have sold well enough in the store outright, but people actually want to feel like they purchased something of value. The gamble is trying to get something valuable you can use or sell to purchase something you can use.

Every once in a while I'll buy a lot of 10 keys (or unlockers) for the boxes. They are fun to open like scratch-off tickets. The key is not to blow your whole paycheck on scratch-offs expecting to win one million dollars [pinky]. Same with lockboxes; don't spend all your money on them. They're meant as supplementary revenue generators.

My favorite implementation, by the way, is how Cryptic has couple this with a regular cash shop purchase. They had a Duty Officer sale in STO that included the equivalent of a free lockbox opener. It was cool. I purchased stuff I wanted (on sale) and got a few virtual scratch-off tickets. I actually made out really good on that one getting a rare Jem'Hadar attack ship.

I think a mind wipe so people could play an mmo like it was their first time again, would be easier to build than a new mmo people here would actually like. - DamonVile

  coventryhagdog

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/12/14
Posts: 88

2/02/14 2:25:03 AM#34
Originally posted by Rayshe
 

The reason i defended funcom with TSW is because they followed what they said as closely as they could. The only time they went back on their word is when they couldn't possibly keep it. The dev team for TSW was great, and they did great work. Sadly this lockbox crap comes up which literally sits as a direct lie to the issues we brought up on the forum. This is a issue that the devs themselves came to the forums and told us directly it wouldn't happen. This is why the lockboxes sting so bad, Its not because they are implimenting it. Its because they promised that they wouldn't.

 

I don't think TSW Is anything special, or any game made by funcom for that matter, but you can't hold it against them.

They are in a desperate financial situation. Selling gambling is a last resort for any gaming company.

 

At the end of the day, they have mouths to feed. Wages in Norway are VERY, VERY high.

They can't afford to take the liberties that some gaming companies take because of it, not to mention that they are already in hot water with possibly fraud.

 

It's a business.

 

 

 

  XV999

Novice Member

Joined: 3/07/12
Posts: 36

2/02/14 7:08:09 AM#35
A poster on anarchy online forums in the new engine beta said they have lots pay for items to come that will disrupt gameplay. Funcom is doing this with all their games. They need the money to play the game they are best at the stock market.

  Seelinnikoi

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/11/11
Posts: 528

2/02/14 7:18:52 AM#36
People seem to forget this important fact that it's the "lockboxes players" that are supporting the game YOU also play for FREE!
  Madimorga

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 1997

2/06/14 8:05:34 AM#37
Originally posted by Seelinnikoi
People seem to forget this important fact that it's the "lockboxes players" that are supporting the game YOU also play for FREE!

 

Sub-free and free are two different things.  Still, the box is pretty cheap now.  But it's a pity they couldn't have stuck with selling DLC that gives new weapons and story and more fashion, maybe even some sort of housing, instead of going lockbox.  I'm sure the people who work on the game would rather offer more creative content than cash shop gambling for loot, too.  I doubt there is much job security for most of them in this 'content'.  

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  Rusque

Elite Member

Joined: 6/08/10
Posts: 1681

2/06/14 8:16:23 AM#38
Originally posted by Rayshe
Originally posted by AmbrosiaAmor
Originally posted by Rayshe

I have been a large defender of Funcom...

 

Mistake #1 was defending Funcom (or any gaming company for that matter).

The reason i defended funcom with TSW is because they followed what they said as closely as they could. The only time they went back on their word is when they couldn't possibly keep it. The dev team for TSW was great, and they did great work. Sadly this lockbox crap comes up which literally sits as a direct lie to the issues we brought up on the forum. This is a issue that the devs themselves came to the forums and told us directly it wouldn't happen. This is why the lockboxes sting so bad, Its not because they are implimenting it. Its because they promised that they wouldn't.

I dunno, this seems to happen all the time. People somehow delude themselves into thinking a company that makes a product they like is above certain behavior. Companies do not care about you. Not now, not ever. When they're making enough money, there's no problem and they're more than happy to maintain the status quo to keep making that money. When the money is less than they want/need, things change.

You can't run a business on ideals.

 

You can see people falling in love with SOE in various threads. "Ooo they dropped their NDA, that means they really care about the players this time!" *swoon* No, they don't. They care about your bank account and how soon it can get hooked up to their game. If that means playing nice and making you feel safe and loved, so be it. Always Be Closing.

  User Deleted
2/06/14 8:31:22 AM#39
Originally posted by Rayshe
Originally posted by Crazy_Stick
Well, they went back on a direct promise of no lock boxes ever and here they are. I admit that I consider them a bane of the free to play game lines. Frankly, they totally ruined Star Trek Online and would clutter the space map so bad when they were testing drop rates that you couldn't see your enemies in an STF run. It is not a good move on their part even if I have to acknowledge that they need some sort of additional income to keep the game running and maybe even growing. STO would not have survived without them as much as I hate what the boxes did to the game and integrity of play value. There simply has to be a better way and amidst all the other junk going on I hope they find it. TSW is a niche game but a good niche game and it deserves better than being taken over by some one like PWI.

NO, no, no, no, no. Anyone other than PWI they are the worst company out there when it comes to the cash shop nowadays. they throw everything they can in there. if TSW ever got taken over by PWI the playerbase it has left would leave. Not to mention PWI couldnt tell a story if their lives depended on it. STO is not a story driven game, Sadly to say TSW needs to stay with Funcom or crash. Cause no one could keep up with the story that funcom put out. No One.

The horrors that I have seen, I had several max level characters across 5 PWI games.... the thing that always made me abandon end game with PWI was the rune/gem pyramid scheme in every frickin one of their games.  Man, I don't wanna see funcom go PWI style.  Also I'm sure the stories in PWI games are much better.... before they use Google Translate.

  User Deleted
2/06/14 10:19:40 AM#40
Originally posted by Pyatra

The horrors that I have seen, I had several max level characters across 5 PWI games.... the thing that always made me abandon end game with PWI was the rune/gem pyramid scheme in every frickin one of their games.  Man, I don't wanna see funcom go PWI style.  Also I'm sure the stories in PWI games are much better.... before they use Google Translate.

I always thought they used babblefish...

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