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Elder Scrolls Online

Elder Scrolls Online 

General Discussion  » Massively votes TESO most likely to flop

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262 posts found
  CthulhuPuffs

Novice Member

Joined: 3/03/13
Posts: 379

Will consume your soul, yet stay crunchy in milk

12/22/13 9:41:14 AM#121
Originally posted by Dren_Utogi

I've come to the conclusion :

 

Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

 

 

Except people with a Colostomy

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  Fearum

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/15/11
Posts: 1089

12/22/13 9:56:02 AM#122
That list on Massively looks like its a bunch of bullshit and I don't agree with any of it. Not just the ESO part but pretty much everything else they talk about.
  Reklaw

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Joined: 1/07/06
Posts: 6083

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12/22/13 10:22:39 AM#123

My vote would go to: TESO going to suprise allot of gamers in a positive way. Saying that we will still get the "this game fails, not enough content, this aint ES, combat s###s" type of topics. Happens with just about any single MMO/rpg ever released.

I do feel they should have made their topic on Massively stricktly about 2013 and what has happend in the mmo landscape. Perhaps even have a seperate topic about future or 2014 predictions.

But my prediction on TESO is more hoping for it to actually be a good MMORPG. Not sure yet if it will be just good short term, to me that's 3/6 months (all depends how slow/fast the leveling curve is), while long term might consist mostly due to it's PVP patform. Considering how big the mod community is from ES games I would have thought something similar like the Foundry in Neverwinter Online would be a great addition to a game like ESO. Not so much for me as I never used mods in my original games though did make a few mods or atleast attempted to do so but never really completed due to lack of time.

While I am not a big fan of most PVP in MMO/rpg I actually look forward to it in TESO. Maybe because Something I could never do in ES games and now I can. But still mostly looking forward to it's PVE parts first.

 

  Jyiiga

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/03/10
Posts: 1008

12/22/13 11:06:33 AM#124

I do enjoy these lists and the replies we get to them here. First off if any gaming website posts a list like this, we will have a dozen people that say that site has no credibility. Doesn't matter what site it is or who said it.

Having said that, their opinions (in general) carry about as much weight as mine here. Many of us have been playing these titles since UO, EQ and AC. We are just as much experts as they are. That said, you also have to put together sentences and paragraphs to have a decent opinion that anyone is going to pay attention to.

Bree, is the one that has the type of concerns I have. Those concerns come from players that have played the genre for a long time. Players that have seen it and done it, players that desire freedom and innovation. Not just more of the same with a new wrapper.

"Bree: I think ESO will launch just fine and collect a lot of box and sub fees initially, but long-term, it's in trouble. MMORPG fans are sick of story-driven single-player themepark MMOs, console fans will be mystified by subs and a three-way PvP endgame, and Elder Scrolls fans will wander back to the lore and mods of their solo sandboxes. I'm truly not sure for whom the game is intended, and I say that as a TES fanatic."

  gobla

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/30/07
Posts: 1407

C'est la vie.

12/22/13 11:21:55 AM#125

I have to wonder at those awards...

How does the most underrated game also become the runner-up for the biggest disappointment as well as the runner-up for MMO of the year?

Same for Defiance. Runner-up to best MMO. Runner-up to biggest disappointment. Runner-up to best pseudo-MMO.

How does that even work? It's a simple logical contradiction.

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  Comaf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/13/10
Posts: 1129

I want an mmorpg where pvp matters, my enemies are not my race or class, and community matters.

12/22/13 12:11:23 PM#126
Originally posted by DMKano

http://i.massively.joystiq.com/2013/12/19/massivelys-best-of-2013-awards/

Thoughts?

I hope it does OK, I know some great folks working at Zenimax.

 

A friend and I - both avid Dark Age of Camelot fans of olde...were really hoping this title would succeed.  It's so rare if non-existent to see a 3 realm fantasy mmorpg that is truly 3 realms from scratch...

 

And then he pointed out that the flaw of every company is to do something so absolutely foolish as to guarantee failure, despite the positives.  In this case, NDA or not, everyone is pretty aware of the awkward combat/UI mechanics.  I can't go into it because of the NDA...but good lord, so many people will be disgusted with this aspect of the game.

 

I get they are trying to be somewhat different...but being so disconnected as to not see this means they are clearly NOT listening to their player base.  Nothing ruins a title faster than closed ears and HUBRIS.  Warhammer is a wonderful example of this.

 

What a crying shame.  I keep hoping they will announce a UI/combat mechanic revamp.  If you were in beta you clearly know why.

  Margulis

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/14/08
Posts: 1643

12/22/13 2:45:20 PM#127
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by PerfArt
An easy, popular choice given the amount of hype and conflicting opinions on what kind of game it "should" be. Not a lot of other choices, given that most other games coming out are either too small to be truly "flop-worthy" or are Wildstar, which is sort of an evolution on the safest formula for success (WoW.)

Considering that every attempt to copy/recreate that "safest formula" has crashed hard, I would say Wildstar is the safest bet to flop.

Having some "experience" with both of these games, I find the highlighted comment most likely to be true. 

  Lord.Bachus

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12/22/13 4:07:00 PM#128

Thats the same website that predicted GW2 would get more players then WoW

They also predicted SWTOR would be a mega hit right from the start..

And they still asume the future is for sandbox MMO´s

 

There is absolutely no value for me in their opinions...

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  SavageHorizon

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/14/13
Posts: 1550

12/22/13 4:23:17 PM#129
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

Thats the same website that predicted GW2 would get more players then WoW

They also predicted SWTOR would be a mega hit right from the start..

And they still asume the future is for sandbox MMO´s

 

There is absolutely no value for me in their opinions...

Pretty sure you were one of the GW2 followers who over hyped the game and what's with your obsession against sandboxes mmos.  Every single thread or post you make seems to end with some sort of rant about sandbox mmo's lol.

I think people already know that ESO is not a sandbox mmo, liking sandbox mmo's doesn't mean you can't play or like themepark or hybrid mmo's.

And just about every mmo gaming site gave swtor top scores including mmorpg.com.

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  Karteli

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Joined: 7/09/12
Posts: 2704

12/22/13 7:18:44 PM#130
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

Thats the same website that predicted GW2 would get more players then WoW

They also predicted SWTOR would be a mega hit right from the start..

And they still asume the future is for sandbox MMO´s

 

There is absolutely no value for me in their opinions...

It's easy to mix up op-ed's vs. news reports, when even ArenaNet stated that they were planning to be the long awaited WoW-Killer.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/johngaudiosi/2012/04/23/arenanet-founder-mike-obrien-will-be-satisfied-when-guild-wars-2-is-the-most-successful-mmo-period/

 

Mike O’Brien, studio head at ArenaNet:

“We’re in it to win it this time,” said O’Brien. “We were number two to World of Warcraft with Guild Wars, now we want to beat them. We’ll be satisfied when the Guild Wars 2 is the most successful MMO. I think we have something unique here and players are going to see it and understand why dynamic events are a way better content model than people have experienced before in online worlds. Word-of-mouth will get people to understand that we really are doing something new and different. The sky’s the limit once this game is out. Online worlds have a networking effect. People will bring friends to Guild Wars 2. We hope all the people who play the beta weekend will tell their friends about it.”

 

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  karmath

Novice Member

Joined: 8/24/05
Posts: 841

12/22/13 7:44:10 PM#131

I cannot understand you people. Every single last themepark clone with a twist has failed. Every. Single. Last. One.

Why is this going to be any different? Zenimax has already pissed off the majority of the IP's existing fanbase and the game hasn't even released yet. It's pretty unfathomable that ES:O will succeed to any major degree at this point.

  jpaprocki

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/23/09
Posts: 228

12/22/13 7:50:35 PM#132
Originally posted by Myria
Originally posted by Razeekster

The red signal that I first saw that made me think that TESO may not do so great is the overall lack of community interest in the game. Just scroll through past TESO articles here on MMORPG.com and compare them to other major AA+ MMORPGs that are getting covered... The lack of interest from the MMORPG community honestly worries me, and I get a sense that people have just grown tired of the same exact MMORPG coming out with a different skin on it.

 

I honestly don't think the Elder Scrolls games were ever meant to translate into an MMORPG. I think Bethesda expected fans of the Elder Scrolls games to all flock to TESO just because it had the Elder Scrolls IP attached to it, and that just hasn't seemed to happen (at least not from what I've seen).

Honestly this site is about as non-representative of the overall market as it is possible to get. To the point where if I was making an MMO I'd float ideas here and implement the ones that got the worst response. If you took this site as any kind of indicator WoW is long dead, ToR closed its doors nearly two years ago, and nothing but F2P sandboxes rule the genre.

 

Given the disconnect between what the "vets" on sites like this and Massively go on about, and the state of the market, it's hard to take anything here seriously. The people here -- myself included -- are not the market, nor anything remotely like a representative sample of same.

 

That aside, I do think trying to make an Elder Scrolls MMO was a mistake. Honestly I think trying to turn any well known IP into an MMO is a dicey proposition at best. A fairly small but extremely vocal percentage of the population tend to take IPs very personally and tend to see their "vision" of them as being the only possible correct way to do them. Don't do it their way -- and give that there are thousands of mutually exclusive "their ways", there's no way you could -- and they will never forgive and never stop bleating about it.

 

There isn't ever going to be an MMO based on LoTR, Star Wars, Warhammer, Star Trek, or any other popular IP -- including Elder Scrolls -- that won't be slammed savagely and loudly for not being the way it's "supposed" to be. Albeit, like the whole sandbox/themepark thing, no two people will agree on how it was "supposed" to be, but it won't matter because by then all it's about -- really, all it was ever about -- is trying to tear whatever it actually is down.

 

Fortunately in general the market doesn't really give a rat's arse -- if it did the genre's landscape would be very different indeed. As long as the dev's recognize this and ignore the screamers, who frankly wouldn't be pleased by anything they did anyway, it'll be fine. The "vets' will declare the game a failure from now until doomsday and the game will go on being enjoyed by people less worried about MMO-religious wars and more about having fun.

Well said

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  baphamet

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/05/06
Posts: 2610

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12/22/13 8:04:07 PM#133


Originally posted by karmath
I cannot understand you people. Every single last themepark clone with a twist has failed. Every. Single. Last. One.

Why is this going to be any different? Zenimax has already pissed off the majority of the IP's existing fanbase and the game hasn't even released yet. It's pretty unfathomable that ES:O will succeed to any major degree at this point.


define "fail"? you mean fail to meet lofty expectations that the fans here always put on these games and then rage when it inevitably does not meet those expectations?

if you look at it objectively, themeparks are the most successful mmo's out there, at least in the west.

by the way, the "majority" of the IP's fan base don't visit the forums. the vocal minority is what you meant to say i think.

  reeereee

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/22/13
Posts: 686

12/22/13 8:11:07 PM#134
Originally posted by karmath

I cannot understand you people. Every single last themepark clone with a twist has failed. Every. Single. Last. One.

Why is this going to be any different? Zenimax has already pissed off the majority of the IP's existing fanbase and the game hasn't even released yet. It's pretty unfathomable that ES:O will succeed to any major degree at this point.

I dunno, I think  they're deviating from the WoW script more than SWTOR, FFXIV, or Wildstar.  Unless you're advocating that all themeparks not named WoW will fail, which seems a bit of a stretch, though perhaps there is some evidence to support it.

 

They only need retain roughly 3% of their Skyrim boxe sales as long term subscribers to be the second most successful mmo in the western market.  It's a little early to pronounce them dead.

  SoulTrapOnSelf

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/17/13
Posts: 195

12/22/13 8:22:22 PM#135
the issue i have with teso is the first 10 levels.. even though i like to go questing and pick up some herbs, the main reason i wanna play teso if for the 3-faction pvp in cyrodiil;  i don't see a reason why zenimax wants players to level up to 10 to access cyrodiil
  User Deleted
12/22/13 8:36:31 PM#136
Originally posted by gobla

I have to wonder at those awards...

How does the most underrated game also become the runner-up for the biggest disappointment as well as the runner-up for MMO of the year?

Same for Defiance. Runner-up to best MMO. Runner-up to biggest disappointment. Runner-up to best pseudo-MMO.

How does that even work? It's a simple logical contradiction.

 

It wasn't a unanimous decision between the staff, they all put in their nominations and the ones with the most votes got it. How many pseudo-MMOs were released last year? Of course it had to be a runner up, and there is no denying that it was a disappointment to some so some of the team would have voted for it as a disappointment. In fact they said that Defiance mostly got nominated for the show tie in.

If you read in the comments, the Massively staff say that it was a year of slim pickings (like the previous year where they voted for SWTOR since there was nothing else). So its not surprising that some games released this year were both runners up to best MMO of 2013 and also major disappointments.

  User Deleted
12/22/13 8:37:40 PM#137
Originally posted by SoulTrapOnSelf
the issue i have with teso is the first 10 levels.. even though i like to go questing and pick up some herbs, the main reason i wanna play teso if for the 3-faction pvp in cyrodiil;  i don't see a reason why zenimax wants players to level up to 10 to access cyrodiil

That will just be the tutorial, and over in less than half an hour.

  Rhoklaw

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Posts: 2977

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12/22/13 8:48:08 PM#138

I think TESO will do fine, even as a subscription based game. Sure, it's not exactly like Morrowind or Skyrim, but no IP based MMO ever makes it's fans happy. Star Wars MMO's always let us down, Star Trek MMO let us down as did Matrix Online and apparently Lord of the Rings Online.

Soon as someone points out a truly successful IP based MMO, let me know. Until then, I'm going to assume TESO won't succeed where the others have failed, but it surely won't flop since it has non tab targeting combat with 3 realm PvP with a purpose.

  azzamasin

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Joined: 6/06/12
Posts: 2646

We live in a fantasy world, a world of illusion. The great task in life is to find reality.

12/22/13 8:52:53 PM#139
Originally posted by DMKano

http://i.massively.joystiq.com/2013/12/19/massivelys-best-of-2013-awards/

Thoughts?

I hope it does OK, I know some great folks working at Zenimax.

 

Great folks or not, the game design started back in the heyday of Themepark driven linear Storylines.  And this game has it in droves.  There is nothing reminiscent of Skyrim, Morrowind, Oblivion in ESO from a Gameplay combat and exploration viewpoint.  It looks like Skyrim but plays like SWTOR, WoW or Rift but with 100% worse combat.  They should of gone full blown action or at least quasi action like GW2, but instead they added in a tab function ontop of a combat with no weight and no soul.

If your idea of a Sandbox is open FFA Full Loot PvP, full crafted world with minimal support for anything combat then your sandbox ideas are bad! Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

  lizardbones

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Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10395

I've become dependent upon spell check. My apologies for stupid grammatical errors.

12/22/13 9:05:00 PM#140

If I was going to pick an upcoming MMORPG that would be seen as a flop, it would be TESO. None of the discussions will reflect any sort of objective reality surrounding the game, but I think TESO is going to pick up most of the proboscises of doom.

For every large, complex problem, there is a simple, clear solution that also happens to be absolutely wrong.

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