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Star Wars: The Old Republic

Star Wars: The Old Republic 

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  Hatefull

Novice Member

Joined: 6/09/04
Posts: 764

Your tears make my gun work better.

10/31/13 5:59:35 AM#81


Originally posted by bobdole1979

Originally posted by MrJurgens

Originally posted by huskerman34 Quit bitching and play the game. The game is good and the dont rob you in the item shop like Allods does.
SWTOR is a TORtanic. How is it good if 75%+ of the player-base left throughout launch to before the F2P model?   :|
because its still the second largest western MMO

 

how good is SWG if 100% of the subscribers are gone now?

 



They shut down the servers, and OH btw a lot of people (I do not have accurate numbers) play the Emulator of Pre-NGE SWG. So you are wrong all over the place.

If you want a new idea, go read an old book.

  Hatefull

Novice Member

Joined: 6/09/04
Posts: 764

Your tears make my gun work better.

10/31/13 6:04:52 AM#82


Originally posted by LogicLester
The following is tongue-in-cheek The Birth of a Concept 

When the leaders of our studio first sat down to talk about what needed to be part of our first BIG push into the stars about two years ago, the list became very long—there were just so many Star Wars™ fantasies to fulfill in such a rich universe: bounty hunters and smugglers, Kessel Runs and capital ships, discovery of never-before-seen-planets, as well as long-lost species, and of course, Starfighter combat. And that’s the short list of the things we came up with.  <I loved those guys!  They were nuts, throwing money all over the place!  I MISS THEM!>

 

Before we could even really define what this expansion was going to look like, we had to put it on hold. <Holy crap, 50% of the subs cancelled in the first month!>  This pause went on for almost a year as we planned and worked on content for the ground game, added a Free-to-Play option for our players, and created content for a number of other features that players expected and wanted. <Those were the Dark Days!  Empty offices, fewer people in the cafeteria everyday, and they took our Dew machine!  We learned to hide behind our monitors whenever anyone walked by...>  It wasn’t until August of 2012 that work started again on defining how we wanted to revisit space.  <Oops, did I just out the fact that all the "SSSP" hype during all that time was crap?  Oh well I'm sure someone in marketing will edit that out, I need to get to lunch before all the ramen's gone!>

 

After a great deal of deliberation  <We had a long lunch, the good stuff, McDonalds!  No ramen that day!>, it was clear we had to prioritize which features would be best received by you, the fans, as well as give the greatest amount of replayability.  <We had no money left, we had to find a way to reuse as much as possible!>  And at the same time, we knew we had to create a strong foundation to build on for the future, you know, in case we wanted to add onto it later on… possibly.  <Who am I kidding?  If this flops they're shutting us down!>

 

At that time, we knew two things were vital to the experience: free-flight space combat and ship customization.  <It's what all those nuts on the forums kept writing about, and it worked for SWG, right?  Right??  I honestly don't know, I've never played any of these games!>   The Evolution of a Concept 

The very next question was how. <How do we keep our jobs as long as possible in hopes that the economy improves enough we can get a job somewhere else?>  How do you deliver on those two requirements and still appease such devout fans who, understandably, want the very best Star Wars experience possible?  <Oh yeah, and that too..>

 

It wasn’t easy, and every path had obstacles.  <We have like two programmers!>  Do you create a massive, open world to fly transports around, smuggling goods through enemy lines? Do you create capital ships, some so vast players feel they’re on another planet? Do you populate all of that with more quests and voice actors and opportunities for crafting and Star Destroyers and the Force™ and more? It was literally a whole new game, possibly larger than what we had already created.  <Yeah, it took like five minutes to shoot all those dreams down....did I mention one of the programmers is the nephew of the CEO?>

 

Wisely, we took a step back and looked at the broader picture. <If we said we couldn't do it they'd fire us all on the spot, and I need money to feed my children!>  We looked at the landscape of possibilities and where there were opportunities, when we quickly realized the answer was simple: PvP. <Do you have any idea how hard it is to program NPC AIs in a 3D environment?  I didn't, but we weren't even able to get simple scripting working right when we had dozens of programmers!>  Players had been clamoring for it since launch—the experience of customizing their own Starfighter and pitting your skills against other pilots in epic Star Wars environments <The same ones we used in the current space missions..>; the sound of that familiar music kicking in as you destroy an enemy’s objective <We can't afford to license more music so we're reusing that too..>; your Companions interrupting your focus to let you know an enemy is on your tail or your shields are down. <Yep, same sound clips we already have..NO MONEY!>

 

Momentum quickly grew as we imagined the possibilities. <They gave us 1 year, we didn't make it, but we begged and Bob threatened to commit hara-kiri on the conference room table if we didn't get more time...in the end they gave use 3 more months.  RIP Bob!>  What started as a feature for Star Wars: The Old Republic all of a sudden was becoming a game all by itself. So we embraced it. We focused on it. And we never looked back.  <For the love of God, please subscribe!  I need to feed my children!>

 

From there, it was just a matter of creating a strong vision for the player’s experience – the combat, the environments, the feel of it all – both as a pilot, but also in customizing your ships and how it’s all integrated together with the ground game.  <It's just as buggy and non-optimized too, but that's ok, right?  RIGHT??>

 

And while that’s all very interesting, you probably want to know more of the details about what to expect once Galactic Starfighter goes live. Let me tell you… in our next developer diary!  <The details are all still up in the air, they change everyday and it's almost launch, dear God someone help me!  My children....my poor children!>


Pure gold. I lol'd for real. I recently went back to test drive SWTOR again, and instantly remembered why I left.

Space bar breaking cut scenes, boring. PvP that is a joke wrapped in a terrible package. CC fest anyone? yeah. But hey I get to see clones of me running around all over the place with the exact same companions! So that is co...wait no, that sucks too.

Going to see what they do with this next abortion, and then move on to something else, unless of course I am blown away by this expansion, which knowing this team of; "Should have stuck with single players games all stars" I doubt I will even find it adequate.

Anyway, good post, still chuckling about it.

If you want a new idea, go read an old book.

  JeroKane

Elite Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 5352

10/31/13 6:07:23 AM#83
Originally posted by doodphace
Originally posted by Karahandras
Originally posted by doodphace

Love it or hate it, SWTOR is still the 3rd (or 2nd, depending who u ask), most played MMO in the west after WoW and EVE.

Of course, i'm basing that solely on officially announced numbers, seeing as those 3 are the only MMOs whos parent companies actually give active player data by way of subscription numbers, as opposed to smoke and mirrors "accounts" or "boxes sold".

I think there's a good amount of smoke and mirrors/massaging the numbers with wow and especially swtor's numbers.

And that somehow negates their numbers, in favor of "accounts created" or "boxes sold"? No matter how you spin it, their subscription numbers alone are nothing to sneez at. Now, add in all the F2Pers currently playing, and you are telling me its NOT top 3 in the west?

Right on :/

Right now you have to add FFXIV tho. That one has now taken a solid second Place.

So SW:TOR on fourth Place is still not bad at all.

  Hatefull

Novice Member

Joined: 6/09/04
Posts: 764

Your tears make my gun work better.

10/31/13 6:08:57 AM#84

[quote]

Why not let people decide for themselves?  Is there a video game company out there that doesn't care about money?  [/b][/quote]


Yes, there is. If you mean the only reason the company makes games is to make money, then yes there are plenty of game companies that don't care about money. They need money to make a great game, but they won't compromise their vision for funding.

Go take a look at Star Citizen, The Repopulation, two triple A titles coming out that are crowd funded (for the most part) and being developed by independent developers.

So, there is hope! Not for SWTOR, but for other games!

If you want a new idea, go read an old book.

  JeroKane

Elite Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 5352

10/31/13 6:13:08 AM#85
Originally posted by Hatefull

[quote]

Why not let people decide for themselves?  Is there a video game company out there that doesn't care about money?  [/b][/quote]


Yes, there is. If you mean the only reason they makes game sis to make money, then yes there are plenty of game companies that don't care about money. They need money to make a great game, but they won't compromise their vision for funding.

Go take a loko at Star Citizen, The Repopulation, two triple A titles coming out that are crowd funded (for the most part) and being developed by independent developers.

So, there is hope! Not for SWTOR, but for other games!

You already answered it yourself. Crowd funding.

And you really think Chris Roberts doesn't do it for the profit? You really THAT naive?

Come on now! The only difference here is, that With Crowd Funding he can do whatever he wants with no deadlines. Compared to the rest of the publically registered Game studios that have to deal With stakeholders and set deadlines.

In the end they all still have a bottomline! To make Money!  Don't go kid yourself.

 

PS. I am backer of Star Citizen myself. So you know.

  Talin

Novice Member

Joined: 5/20/04
Posts: 825

You only live once... make it count!

10/31/13 6:17:26 AM#86

Amusing post and commentary, well done.

I've been involved in countless software design sessions and some of that commentary does actually come out from time to time....

  Hatefull

Novice Member

Joined: 6/09/04
Posts: 764

Your tears make my gun work better.

10/31/13 6:24:52 AM#87

[quote]Originally posted by JeroKane
[b][quote] Originally posted by Hatefull [b][quote][/b] Why not let people decide for themselves?  Is there a video game company out there that doesn't care about money?  [/quote][/b] Yes, there is. If you mean the only reason they makes game sis to make money, then yes there are plenty of game companies that don't care about money. They need money to make a great game, but they won't compromise their vision for funding. Go take a loko at Star Citizen, The Repopulation, two triple A titles coming out that are crowd funded (for the most part) and being developed by independent developers. So, there is hope! Not for SWTOR, but for other games![/quote]You already answered it yourself. Crowd funding.

And you really think Chris Roberts doesn't do it for the profit? You really THAT naive?

Come on now! The only difference here is, that With Crowd Funding he can do whatever he wants with no deadlines. Compared to the rest of the publically registered Game studios that have to deal With stakeholders and set deadlines.

In the end they all still have a bottomline! To make Money!  Don't go kid yourself.

 

PS. I am backer of Star Citizen myself. So you know.[/b][/quote]

I disagree with you. Being a backer does not mean you have read what Chris has to say or followed his career. I am not kidding myself nor anyone else I am going by what he has written. Does he want to get paid? sure! is he making this game purely to make money? no, he is not. You can keep your little veiled insults to yourself btw, I don't have time for that crap.

If you want a new idea, go read an old book.

  JeroKane

Elite Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 5352

10/31/13 6:32:10 AM#88
Originally posted by Hatefull

[quote]Originally posted by JeroKane
[b][quote] Originally posted by Hatefull [b][quote][/b] Why not let people decide for themselves?  Is there a video game company out there that doesn't care about money?  [/quote][/b] Yes, there is. If you mean the only reason they makes game sis to make money, then yes there are plenty of game companies that don't care about money. They need money to make a great game, but they won't compromise their vision for funding. Go take a loko at Star Citizen, The Repopulation, two triple A titles coming out that are crowd funded (for the most part) and being developed by independent developers. So, there is hope! Not for SWTOR, but for other games![/quote]You already answered it yourself. Crowd funding.

And you really think Chris Roberts doesn't do it for the profit? You really THAT naive?

Come on now! The only difference here is, that With Crowd Funding he can do whatever he wants with no deadlines. Compared to the rest of the publically registered Game studios that have to deal With stakeholders and set deadlines.

In the end they all still have a bottomline! To make Money!  Don't go kid yourself.

 

PS. I am backer of Star Citizen myself. So you know.[/b][/quote]

I disagree with you. Being a backer does not mean you have read what Chris has to say or followed his career. I am not kidding myself nor anyone else I am going by what he has written. Does he want to get paid? sure! is he making this game purely to make money? no, he is not. You can keep your little veiled insults to yourself btw, I don't have time for that crap.

And you keep believing every Word these people say is the truth and continue living in Fairytale land.

I don't have time for this crap either.

  bobdole1979

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/05/09
Posts: 218

10/31/13 1:30:44 PM#89
Originally posted by JeroKane
Originally posted by doodphace
Originally posted by Karahandras
Originally posted by doodphace

Love it or hate it, SWTOR is still the 3rd (or 2nd, depending who u ask), most played MMO in the west after WoW and EVE.

Of course, i'm basing that solely on officially announced numbers, seeing as those 3 are the only MMOs whos parent companies actually give active player data by way of subscription numbers, as opposed to smoke and mirrors "accounts" or "boxes sold".

I think there's a good amount of smoke and mirrors/massaging the numbers with wow and especially swtor's numbers.

And that somehow negates their numbers, in favor of "accounts created" or "boxes sold"? No matter how you spin it, their subscription numbers alone are nothing to sneez at. Now, add in all the F2Pers currently playing, and you are telling me its NOT top 3 in the west?

Right on :/

Right now you have to add FFXIV tho. That one has now taken a solid second Place.

So SW:TOR on fourth Place is still not bad at all.

 

nope SWTOR still has more subs then EVE online (which btw thats not even counting the number of people that are playing EVE for free with the FLEX stuff)  but FFXIV isn't a western MMO.    Course it will be interesting to see what happens 1 month from now.  FF said they peaked at 1.5 million accounts not 1.5 million subscribers.

  bobdole1979

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/05/09
Posts: 218

10/31/13 1:32:07 PM#90
Originally posted by Hatefull

 


Originally posted by bobdole1979

Originally posted by MrJurgens

Originally posted by huskerman34 Quit bitching and play the game. The game is good and the dont rob you in the item shop like Allods does.
SWTOR is a TORtanic. How is it good if 75%+ of the player-base left throughout launch to before the F2P model?   :|
because its still the second largest western MMO

 

 

how good is SWG if 100% of the subscribers are gone now?

 


 


They shut down the servers, and OH btw a lot of people (I do not have accurate numbers) play the Emulator of Pre-NGE SWG. So you are wrong all over the place.

I do have the numbers.  SWG EMU peaked at 2,000 players at one time.   Thats less then the people on fleet of SWTOR 

 

They shut down the servers of SWG because the game failed hard.

  bobdole1979

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/05/09
Posts: 218

10/31/13 1:34:56 PM#91
Originally posted by didjerama
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by MrJurgens
Originally posted by huskerman34
Quit bitching and play the game. The game is good and the dont rob you in the item shop like Allods does.

SWTOR is a TORtanic. How is it good if 75%+ of the player-base left throughout launch to before the F2P model?

 

:|

because its still the second largest western MMO

 

 

no it isnt

yes it is.  The only other western MMO that comes close is EVE but SWTOR still has more subs

  DocBrody

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/24/13
Posts: 1638

10/31/13 3:06:31 PM#92
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by didjerama
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by MrJurgens
Originally posted by huskerman34
Quit bitching and play the game. The game is good and the dont rob you in the item shop like Allods does.

SWTOR is a TORtanic. How is it good if 75%+ of the player-base left throughout launch to before the F2P model?

 

:|

because its still the second largest western MMO

 

 

no it isnt

yes it is.  The only other western MMO that comes close is EVE but SWTOR still has more subs

lol .. how are you making up this stuff?

  DamonVile

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 4909

10/31/13 3:09:33 PM#93
Originally posted by DocBrody
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by didjerama
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by MrJurgens
Originally posted by huskerman34
Quit bitching and play the game. The game is good and the dont rob you in the item shop like Allods does.

SWTOR is a TORtanic. How is it good if 75%+ of the player-base left throughout launch to before the F2P model?

 

:|

because its still the second largest western MMO

 

 

no it isnt

yes it is.  The only other western MMO that comes close is EVE but SWTOR still has more subs

lol .. how are you making up this stuff?

Who's really "making stuff up" Ea says they have 500k subs and about 1.5 mil active accounts. Do you have anything other than your opinion that shows it doesn't ?

  DocBrody

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/24/13
Posts: 1638

10/31/13 3:12:46 PM#94
Originally posted by DamonVile
Originally posted by DocBrody
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by didjerama
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by MrJurgens
Originally posted by huskerman34
Quit bitching and play the game. The game is good and the dont rob you in the item shop like Allods does.

SWTOR is a TORtanic. How is it good if 75%+ of the player-base left throughout launch to before the F2P model?

 

:|

because its still the second largest western MMO

 

 

no it isnt

yes it is.  The only other western MMO that comes close is EVE but SWTOR still has more subs

lol .. how are you making up this stuff?

Who's really "making stuff up" Ea says they have 500k subs and about 1.5 mil active accounts. Do you have anything other than your opinion that shows it doesn't ?

 

yeah, no, well except my empty server with 20 people on Makeb

  DamonVile

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 4909

10/31/13 3:14:58 PM#95
Originally posted by DocBrody
Originally posted by DamonVile
Originally posted by DocBrody

lol .. how are you making up this stuff?

Who's really "making stuff up" Ea says they have 500k subs and about 1.5 mil active accounts. Do you have anything other than your opinion that shows it doesn't ?

 

yeah, no, well except my empty server with 20 people on Makeb

I looked outside my window just now and didn't see anyone. Is planet earth now empty ?!!!!???

  User Deleted
10/31/13 3:30:54 PM#96
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by didjerama
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by MrJurgens
Originally posted by huskerman34
Quit bitching and play the game. The game is good and the dont rob you in the item shop like Allods does.

SWTOR is a TORtanic. How is it good if 75%+ of the player-base left throughout launch to before the F2P model?

 

:|

because its still the second largest western MMO

 

 

no it isnt

yes it is.  The only other western MMO that comes close is EVE but SWTOR still has more subs

WRONG. EVE is ahead of SWTOR. Last time SWTOR's sub numbers were reported were back around May, and it was stated that it was riding somewhere below 500k. Next time back up your claims. Also, because this was reported back a bit after the release of RotHC I have no doubt in my mind this game has around 300k–400k subs. It's pure conjecture, but it's the way MMOs work; they lose subs after an expac is released.

  bobdole1979

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/05/09
Posts: 218

10/31/13 5:54:44 PM#97
Originally posted by MrJurgens
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by didjerama
Originally posted by bobdole1979
Originally posted by MrJurgens
Originally posted by huskerman34
Quit bitching and play the game. The game is good and the dont rob you in the item shop like Allods does.

SWTOR is a TORtanic. How is it good if 75%+ of the player-base left throughout launch to before the F2P model?

 

:|

because its still the second largest western MMO

 

 

no it isnt

yes it is.  The only other western MMO that comes close is EVE but SWTOR still has more subs

WRONG. EVE is ahead of SWTOR. Last time SWTOR's sub numbers were reported were back around May, and it was stated that it was riding somewhere below 500k. Next time back up your claims. Also, because this was reported back a bit after the release of RotHC I have no doubt in my mind this game has around 300k–400k subs. It's pure conjecture, but it's the way MMOs work; they lose subs after an expac is released.

yes back around may.  EVE reached 500k at January and hasn't increased since then.  In fact it seems to have gone down.

 

saying its around 300-400k is 100% unfounded bs that you are trying to sling.   If we include income from the cash shop

 

then SWTOR pulls way ahead of EVE. 

 

If we count the giving of the XPAC for free now and the upcoming space patch i bet subs are closer to 600k if anything.  

 

See anyone can play the conjecture game.

  MMOManiacs

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/14/07
Posts: 194

10/31/13 6:10:09 PM#98
Originally posted by Masonic1
Originally posted by Burntvet
Originally posted by Masonic1
Originally posted by deniromonk
Originally posted by Burntvet

Multiple rumors a few months back, were saying that EA/BW is or was trying to dump TOR so they could get out of the licensing fees (which are still reportedly very high, the same as at launch), after Disney took over.

Not sure if anything came of it, but it certainly doesn't say anything good about how TOR is doing.

 

EA just entered into an exclusive deal with Disney to handle all things Star Wars releated in the videogame sphear....how gullable do you have to be to believe those "rumars" of EA trying to dump the SW license for SWTOR lol?

do you know how much money ea has to pay for it? a lot. and look at my last post ea is going in the red, they are shutting down projects left and right.

swtor was a blunder and so far there's no fixing it.

And not only that, but the licensing is likely very different for an MMO vs a SPG title: for an SPG, it is usually a flat franchise fee, once, plus a percentage of each box. But it is different for MMOs: they have to pay that license fee EVERY YEAR the game is running, and you can bet that number was STEEP for what they were expecting out of TOR.

Wanting to get out of that fee, for a "non-successful" product has nothing whatsoever to do with any other games EA makes or might make in the future. It is just good business.

 

(Also, I seem to recall that LA massively reduced the franchise fee for SWG a year or so after the NGE happened, or else that game would have closed much sooner. There were several threads / stories about that at the time.)

lets also look at this does disney really want tor?

it's well known as one of the worst mmo's of all time, it cost $300+ million to make, it maybe barely breaking over the 100k sub mark and i am being very fair about that. the community? just go look at the forums i never hear anything good about the game rather i see most of the community is on the verge of quitting more so now then before after the blunder with swtor:gs. i hear more people talk about how great swg was then i hear about tor.

disney won't want that when they are busy relaunching star wars. they want something huge that can draw tons of players in. and swtor isn't that game.

lol

  MMOManiacs

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/14/07
Posts: 194

10/31/13 6:12:28 PM#99
Originally posted by JeroKane
Originally posted by doodphace
Originally posted by Karahandras
Originally posted by doodphace

Love it or hate it, SWTOR is still the 3rd (or 2nd, depending who u ask), most played MMO in the west after WoW and EVE.

Of course, i'm basing that solely on officially announced numbers, seeing as those 3 are the only MMOs whos parent companies actually give active player data by way of subscription numbers, as opposed to smoke and mirrors "accounts" or "boxes sold".

I think there's a good amount of smoke and mirrors/massaging the numbers with wow and especially swtor's numbers.

And that somehow negates their numbers, in favor of "accounts created" or "boxes sold"? No matter how you spin it, their subscription numbers alone are nothing to sneez at. Now, add in all the F2Pers currently playing, and you are telling me its NOT top 3 in the west?

Right on :/

Right now you have to add FFXIV tho. That one has now taken a solid second Place.

So SW:TOR on fourth Place is still not bad at all.

SE has released every imaginable detail about the game except active player numbers/subscriptions.

Try again.

  MMOManiacs

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/14/07
Posts: 194

10/31/13 6:15:35 PM#100
Originally posted by Hatefull

 


Originally posted by doodphace
Love it or hate it, SWTOR is still the 3rd (or 2nd, depending who u ask), most played MMO in the west after WoW and EVE.

 

Of course, i'm basing that solely on officially announced numbers, seeing as those 3 are the only MMOs whos parent companies actually give active player data by way of subscription numbers, as opposed to smoke and mirrors "accounts" or "boxes sold".


 


More like 5th or 6th this year according to MMOdata.net. Which surprised me. They have not yet tabulated data for FFXIV, so that will push SWTOR further down the bench.

Lets all forget the fact that only CCP, Bioware, and Blizzard actually announced subscription numbers, you quote a site showing Warhammer online peaking at a higher subscription number than AoC, and you expect people to take it seriously?

That site also lists SWTOR as having 1.2 million players, which according to that site, is only behind WoW and...runescape?

You sure that you feel comfortable quoteing that site as fact?

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