Trending Games | ArcheAge | Guild Wars 2 | Firefall | WildStar

  Network:  FPSguru RTSguru
Login:  Password:   Remember?  
Show Quick Gamelist Jump to Random Game
Members:2,851,944 Users Online:0
Games:733  Posts:6,226,311
Recent forum postsRSS
Active threads
Cloud view
List all forums
General Forums
Developers Corner General Discussion
Popular Game Forums
Click a status to find game forum
Game Forums
Click a letter to find game forum
A-C
2029 Online 2112: Revolution 2Moons 4Story 8BitMMO 9 Dragons A Mystical Land A Tale in the Desert III A3 ACE Online ARGO Online Aberoth Absolute Force Online Absolute Terror Achaea Adellion Aerrevan Aetolia, the Midnight Age Age of Armor Age of Conan Age of Empires Online Age of Mourning Age of Wulin Age of Wushu Aida Arenas Aika Aion Albion Online Alganon All Points Bulletin (APB) Allods Online Altis Gates Amazing World Anarchy Online Ancients of Fasaria Andromeda 5 Angels Online Anime Trumps Anmynor Anno Online Applo Arcane Hearts Arcane Legends ArchLord ArcheAge Archeblade Archlord X Asda 2 Asda Story Ashen Empires Asheron's Call Asheron's Call 2 Astera Online Astonia III Astro Empires Astro Lords: Oort CLoud Asura Force Atlantica Online Atriarch Aura Kingdom Aurora Blade Auto Assault Avatar Star Battle Dawn Battle Dawn Galaxies Battle for Graxia Battle of 3 Kingdoms Battle of the Immortals Battlecruiser Online Battlestar Galactica Online Battlestar Reloaded Beyond Protocol Black Aftermath Black Desert Black Gold Black Prophecy Black Prophecy Tactics: Nexus Conflict Blacklight Retribution Blade & Soul Blade Hunter Blade Wars Blazing Throne Bless Blitz 1941 Blood and Jade Bloodlines Champions Bounty Bay Online Brain Storm Brawl Busters. Brick-Force Bright Shadow Bullet Run Business Tycoon Online CTRacer Cabal Online Caesary Call of Camelot Call of Gods Call of Thrones Camelot Unchained Canaan Online Cardmon Hero Cartoon Universe CasinoRPG Castle Empire Castlot Celtic Heroes Champions Online Champions of Regnum Chaos Online Chrono Tales Citadel of Sorcery CitiesXL Citizen Zero City of Decay City of Heroes City of Steam City of Transformers City of Villains Civilization Online Clan Lord Clash of Clans Cloud Nine Club Penguin Colony of War Command & Conquer: Tiberium Alliances Company of Heroes Online Conquer Online Conquer Online 3 Continent of the Ninth (C9) Core Blaze Core Exiles Corum Online Craft of Gods Crimecraft Crimelife 2 Cronous Crota II Crusaders of Solaris Cultures Online Cyber Monster 2 Céiron Wars
D-F
D&D Online DC Universe DK Online DOTA DOTA 2 DUST 514 DV8: Exile Dalethaan Dance Groove Online Dark Age of Camelot Dark Ages Dark Legends Dark Orbit Dark Relic: Prelude Dark Solstice Dark and Light DarkEden Online DarkSpace Darkblood Online Darkest Dungeon Darkfall Darkfall: Unholy Wars Darkwind: War on Wheels Das Tal Dawn of Fantasy Dawntide DayZ Dead Earth Dead Frontier Deco Online Deepworld Defiance Deicide Online Dekaron Demons at the Horizon Desert Operations Destiny Diablo 3 Diamonin Digimon Battle Dino Storm Disciple Divergence Divina Divine Souls Dofus Dominus Online Dragon Ball Online Dragon Born Online Dragon Crusade Dragon Empires Dragon Eternity Dragon Nest Dragon Oath Dragon Pals Dragon Raja Dragon's Call Dragon's Call II Dragon's Prophet DragonSky DragonSoul Dragona Dragonica Dragons and Titans Dream of Mirror Online Dreamland Online Dreamlords: The Reawakening Drift City Duels Dungeon Blitz Dungeon Fighter Online Dungeon Overlord Dungeon Party Dungeon Rampage Dungeon Runners Dynastica Dynasty Warriors Online Dynasty of the Magi EIN (Epicus Incognitus) EVE Online Earth Eternal Earth and Beyond Earthrise Eclipse War Ecol Tactics Online Eden Eternal Edge of Space Einherjar - The Viking's Blood Elder Scrolls Online Eldevin Elf Online Elite: Dangerous Embers of Caerus Emil Chronicle Online Empire Empire & State Empire Craft Empire Universe 3 EmpireQuest Empires of Galldon End of Nations Endless Ages Endless Blue Moon Online Endless Online Entropia Universe EpicDuel Erebus: Travia Reborn Eredan Eternal Blade Eternal Lands Eternal Saga Ether Fields Ether Saga Online Eudemons Online EuroGangster EverEmber Online EverQuest Next EverQuest Online Adventures Evernight Everquest Everquest II Evony Exarch Exorace F.E.A.R. Online Face of Mankind Fairyland Online Fall of Rome Fallen Earth Fallen Sword Fallout Online Family Guy Online Fantage Fantasy Earth Zero Fantasy Realm Online Fantasy Tales Online Fantasy Worlds: Rhynn Faunasphere Faxion Online Ferentus Ferion Fiesta Online Final Fantasy XI Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn Firefall Fists of Fu Florensia Flyff Football Manager Live Football Superstars Force of Arms Forge Forsaken World Fortnite Fortuna Forum for Discussion of Everlight Freaky Creatures Free Realms Freesky Online Freeworld Fung Wan Online Furcadia Fury Fusion Fall
G-L
GalaXseeds Galactic Command Online Game of Thrones: Seven Kingdoms Gameglobe Gate To Heavens Gates of Andaron Gatheryn Gauntlet Gekkeiju Online Ghost Online Ghost Recon Online Gladiatus Glitch Global Agenda Global Soccer Gloria Victis Glory of Gods GoGoRacer Goal Line Blitz Gods and Heroes GodsWar Online Golemizer Golf Star GoonZu Online Graal Kingdoms Granado Espada Online Grand Chase Grand Fantasia Grepolis Grimlands Guild Wars Guild Wars 2 Guild Wars Factions Guild Wars Nightfall H1Z1 Habbo Hotel Hailan Rising HaloSphere2 Haven & Hearth Hawken Hearthstone: Heroes of Warcraft Helbreath Hellgate Hellgate: London Hello Kitty Online Hero Online Hero Zero Hero's Journey Hero: 108 Online HeroSmash Heroes & Generals Heroes in the Sky Heroes of Bestia Heroes of Gaia Heroes of Might and Magic Online Heroes of Thessalonica Heroes of Three Kingdoms Heroes of the Storm Hex Holic Online Hostile Space Hunter Blade Huxley Illutia Illyriad Immortals USA Imperator Imperian Inferno Legend Infestation: Survivor Stories Infinite Crisis Infinity Infinity Iris Online Iron Grip: Marauders Irth Worlds Island Forge Islands of War Istaria: Chronicles of the Gifted Jade Dynasty Jagged Alliance Online Juggernaut Jumpgate Jumpgate Evolution KAL Online Kakele Online Kaos War Karos Online Kartuga Kicks Online King of Kings 3 Kingdom Heroes Kingdom Under Fire II Kingdom of Drakkar Kingory Kings and Legends Kings of the Realm KingsRoad Kitsu Saga Kiwarriors Knight Age Knight Online Knights of Dream City Kothuria Kung Foo! Kunlun Online L.A.W. LEGO Universe La Tale Land of Chaos Online Landmark Lands of Hope: Phoenix Edition LastChaos League of Angels League of Legends - Clash of Fates Legend of Edda: Vengeance Legend of Golden Plume Legend of Katha Legend of Mir 2 Legend of Mir 3 Legendary Champions Lego Minifigures Online Life is Feudal Light of Nova Lime Odyssey Line of Defense Lineage Lineage Eternal: Twilight Resistance Lineage II Linkrealms Loong Online Lord of the Rings Online Lords Online Lost Saga Lucent Heart Lunia Lusternia: Age of Ascension Luvinia World
M-Q
MU Online Mabinogi Maestia: Rise of Keledus MagiKnights Magic Barrage Magic World Online Manga Fighter MapleStory Martial Heroes Marvel Heroes Marvel Super Hero Squad Online Marvel: Avengers Alliance MechWarrior Online Megaten Meridian 59 : Evolution Merlin MetalMercs Metaplace Metin 2 MicroVolts Midkemia Online Might & Magic Heroes: Kingdoms MilMo Minecraft Mini Fighter Minions of Mirth Ministry of War Monato Esprit Monkey King Online Monkey Quest Monster & Me Monster Madness Online MonsterMMORPG Moonlight Online: Tales of Eternal Blood Mordavia Mortal Online Mourning My Lands Myst Online: URU Live Myth Angels Online Myth War Myth War 2 Mytheon Mythic Saga Mythos N.E.O Online NIDA Online Nadirim Naviage: The Power of Capital Navy Field Need for Speed World Nemexia Neo's Land NeoSteam Neocron Nether Neverwinter Nexus: The Kingdom Of The Winds NinjaTrick NosTale Novus Aeterno Oberin Odin Quest Odyssey RPG Ogre Island Omerta 3 Online Boxing Manager Onverse Order & Chaos Online Order of Magic Original Blood Origins Return Origins of Malu Orion's Belt Otherland Forums OverSoul Overkings Oz Online Oz World Pandora Saga Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen Panzar Parabellum Parallel Kingdom Parfait Station Path of Exile Pathfinder Online Perfect World Perpetuum Online Phantasy Star Online 2 Phantasy Star Universe Phoenix Dynasty Online Phylon Pi Story Picaroon Pirate Galaxy Pirate Storm Pirate101 PirateKing Online Pirates of the Burning Sea Pirates of the Caribbean Online Pixie Hollow Planeshift Planet Arkadia Planet Calypso PlanetSide 2 Planetside Planets³ Playboy Manager Pocket Legends Pockie Ninja Pockie Pirates Pockie Saints PoxNora Prime World Prime: Battle for Dominus Priston Tale Priston Tale II Prius Online Project Blackout Project Powder Project Titan Forums Project Wiki Puzzle Pirates Quickhit Football
R-S
R2 Online RAN Online RF Online ROSE Online Rage of 3 Kingdoms Ragnarok Online Ragnarok Online II RaiderZ Rakion Rappelz RappelzSEA Ravenmarch Realm Fighter Realm of the Mad God Realm of the Titans Realms Online Reclamation Red Stone Red War: Edem's Curse Regnum Online Remnant Knights Renaissance Repulse Requiem: Memento Mori Rift RiotZone Rise Rise of Dragonian Era Rise of Empire Rise of the Tycoon Rising of King Risk Your Life Rivality Rockfree Rohan: Blood Feud Role Play Worlds Roll n Rock Roma Victor Romadoria Rosh Online Roto X Rubies of Eventide Ruin Online Rumble Fighter Runes of Magic Runescape Rust Rusty Hearts Ryzom S4 League SAGA SD Gundam Capsule Fighter Online SMITE SUN Sagramore Salem SaySayGirls Scarlet Blade Scions of Fate Seal Online: Evolution Second Life Secret of the Solstice Seed Serenia Fantasy Seven Seas Saga Seven Souls Online Sevencore Shadow of Legend Shadowbane Shadowrun Online Shaiya Shards Online Shattered Galaxy Sho Online Shot Online Shroud of the Avatar SideQuest Siege on Stars Sigonyth: Desert Eternity Silkroad Online Skyblade Skyforge SmashMuck Champions Smoo Online Soldier Front Soul Master Soul Order Online Soul of Guardian Space Heroes Universe Sparta: War of Empires Spellcasters Sphere Spiral Knights Spirit Tales Splash Fighters Squad Wars Star Citizen Star Sonata 2 Star Stable Star Supremacy Star Trek Online Star Trek: Infinite Space Star Wars Galaxies Star Wars: Clone Wars Adventures Star Wars: The Old Republic StarQuest Online Stargate Worlds Starlight Story Starpires State of Decay SteelWar Online Stone Age 2 Stormfall: Age of War Storybricks Stronghold Kingdoms Sudden Attack Supremacy 1914 Supreme Destiny Sword Girls Sword of Destiny: Rise of Aions SwordX Swords of Heavens Swordsman
T-Z
TERA TS Online Tabula Rasa Tactica Online Tales Runner Tales of Fantasy Tales of Pirates Tales of Pirates II Tales of Solaris Talisman Online Tamer Saga Tank Ace Tantra Online Tatsumaki: Land at War Terra Militaris TerraWorld Online Thang Online The 4th Coming The Agency The Aurora World The Black Watchmen The Chronicle The Chronicles of Spellborn The Crew The Division The Hammers End The Legend of Ares The Lost Titans The Matrix Online The Mighty Quest for Epic Loot The Missing Ink The Mummy Online The Myth of Soma The Pride of Taern The Realm Online The Repopulation The Secret World The Sims Online The Strategems The West Theralon There Therian Saga Thrones of Chaos Tibia Tibia Micro Edition Tiger Knight Titan Siege Titans of Time Toontown Online Top Speed Topia Online Torchlight Total Domination Transformers Universe Traveller AR Travia Online Travian Trials of Ascension Tribal Hero Tribal Wars Tribes Universe Trickster Online Trove Troy Online True Fantasy Live Online Turf Battles Twelve Sky Twelve Sky 2 Twilight War Tynon U.B. Funkeys UFO Online URDEAD Online Ultima Forever: Quest for the Avatar Ultima Online Ultima X: Odyssey Ultimate Naruto Ultimate Soccer Boss Uncharted Waters Online Undercover 2: Merc Wars Underlight Unification Wars Universe Online Utopia Valkyrie Sky Vampire Lord Online Vanguard: Saga of Heroes Vanquish Space Vector City Racers Vendetta Online Victory - Age of Racing Vindictus Virtonomics Vis Gladius Visions of Zosimos VoidExpanse Voyage Century Online W.E.L.L. Online WAR (Warhammer Online) WAR2 Glory WYD Global Wakfu War Thunder War of 2012 War of Angels War of Legends War of Mercenaries War of Thrones War of the Immortals WarFlow Waren Story Wargame1942 Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade Warhammer 40K: Dark Millennium Online Warhammer Online: Wrath of Heroes Warkeepers Warrior Epic Wartune WebLords Wild West Online WildStar Wind of Luck WindSlayer 2 Wings of Destiny Wish Wizard101 Wizardry Online Wizards and Champions Wonder King Wonderland Online World Golf Tour World of Battles World of Darkness World of Heroes World of Kung Fu World of Pirates World of Speed World of Tanks World of Tanks Generals World of Warcraft World of Warplanes World of Warships World of the Living Dead WorldAlpha Wurm Online Xenocell Xiah Xsyon Xulu YS Online Yitien ZU Online Zentia Zero Online Zero Online: The Andromeda Crisis Zodiac Online Zombies Ate My Pizza eRepublik

MMORPG.com Discussion Forums

General Discussion

General Discussion 

The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Raph Koster on why fanboism is bad for the industry

12 Pages « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 » Last Search
221 posts found
  Neo_Viper

Novice Member

Joined: 5/10/13
Posts: 624

If I agreed with you we'd both be wrong.

10/15/13 4:05:54 AM#21

The eternal naysayers, who whine about everything and who are never happy, are just as bad if not worse. Just look at this website and these forums, and some of the trolls who keep on bashing games they don't even play anymore, most of the times with misinformation, sometimes years after they stopped. Those are just as bad as the fanatics of the other side.

Extremes and fanaticism are never good, be it for games, politics, religion or anything else.

Those extremes are often the most vocal, but they definitely aren't any kind of majority. The majority is between those two extremes.

 

Originally posted by Foomerang

Ah the sweet melancholy that is Raph Koster: the Robert Smith of game developers.

So right...

Raph said many good things, but also a good amount of nonsense. At moments, it seems that himself is living in one of those virtual worlds and not in reality.

My computer is better than yours.

  Scot

Elite Member

Joined: 10/10/03
Posts: 5233

10/15/13 6:57:30 AM#22

What he was getting at is that you learn nothing from those who think your game is great and plenty from those who do not think it is that good.

So for a dev the naysayers are more useful. But a game gaming company does not just have devs in it, I am sure marketing is very happy with the fanbois.

  Neo_Viper

Novice Member

Joined: 5/10/13
Posts: 624

If I agreed with you we'd both be wrong.

10/15/13 7:10:54 AM#23
Originally posted by Scot

What he was getting at is that you learn nothing from those who think your game is great and plenty from those who do not think it is that good.

So for a dev the naysayers are more useful. But a game gaming company does not just have devs in it, I am sure marketing is very happy with the fanbois.

It's a bit silly even from a developer perspective. You also want to know what you did right. When the vast majority praises a feature, it's not "fanboism", it's that the feature is simply good. The few grumpy sad people who think otherwise won't change that fact.

My computer is better than yours.

  Scalpless

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/22/07
Posts: 1290

10/15/13 7:20:33 AM#24
Originally posted by Neo_Viper
Originally posted by Scot

What he was getting at is that you learn nothing from those who think your game is great and plenty from those who do not think it is that good.

So for a dev the naysayers are more useful. But a game gaming company does not just have devs in it, I am sure marketing is very happy with the fanbois.

It's a bit silly even from a developer perspective. You also want to know what you did right. When the vast majority praises a feature, it's not "fanboism", it's that the feature is simply good. The few grumpy sad people who think otherwise won't change that fact.

It's a weird perspective to have. If your game's crafting is widely regarded as awesome and people praise it everywhere, listening to the few guys who say it sucks (and they'll exist no matter what) is far from smart.

  Nadia

Elite Member

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 11430

10/15/13 7:25:35 AM#25
Originally posted by free2play

The biggest issue I have with both defenders and complainers is, they take everything out of context.

 

I can write up 2000 letter reviews and someone is sure to come in, throw 1950 characters out and turn it in to a mud slinging contest with a misquoted sentence.

 

I do my best to point out good and bad. I just find other people take what they want and ignore the rest.

i agree

  DMKano

Elite Member

Joined: 6/17/11
Posts: 5168

10/15/13 7:33:15 AM#26

I think this part is even more important:

"Good work may not have an audience.

This is a sad truth. There is no correlation between quality and popularity. You may make something that is sophisticated, subtle, expressive, brilliant, and lose out to what is shallow and facile and brash. Oh well. And that really is the right attitude to have about it, too: oh well. Getting bitter about it is pointless.

That said, don’t underestimate the skill required in being simple, polished, and accessible. Dense and rich is easy. Simple is hard. You denigrate “pop” at your peril."

 

  Kaneth

Elite Member

Joined: 8/19/07
Posts: 1568

10/15/13 7:38:15 AM#27
Originally posted by Scalpless
Originally posted by Neo_Viper
Originally posted by Scot

What he was getting at is that you learn nothing from those who think your game is great and plenty from those who do not think it is that good.

So for a dev the naysayers are more useful. But a game gaming company does not just have devs in it, I am sure marketing is very happy with the fanbois.

It's a bit silly even from a developer perspective. You also want to know what you did right. When the vast majority praises a feature, it's not "fanboism", it's that the feature is simply good. The few grumpy sad people who think otherwise won't change that fact.

It's a weird perspective to have. If your game's crafting is widely regarded as awesome and people praise it everywhere, listening to the few guys who say it sucks (and they'll exist no matter what) is far from smart.

I wouldn't say it's far from smart, but their motives should be questioned. As with all things, any and all creative and well though out praise and/or criticisms are extremely helpful.

WoW forums are a good example of extremes in many regards. There was massive hate and fanboism, but the "blue" posts were usually in threads that were well thought out and made valid points either way. Unfortunately, those good conversations quickly became overwhelmed with idiots on both sides of fence.

Raph has always been a better idea man in my eyes. He made some really good points, but like many others have stated, there's only so much developers can do. Marketing folks will undermine devs intentions on getting good feedback by generating massive hype. Ultimately, it's up to us as gamers to sift through the bullshit though.

  Lobotomist

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/20/07
Posts: 4810

I got so much trouble on my mind Refuse to lose.

10/15/13 7:41:48 AM#28
Dont want to say "I said it" but i said it ...

  Pratt2112

Elite Member

Joined: 2/12/12
Posts: 1159

10/15/13 8:24:40 AM#29
Originally posted by Wighty

This is a great read for anyone interested!

 

This is a snippet but the entire article is a very good read on gaming development by one of the forefathers of MMO gaming design.

 

http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/

 

The meat of it:

 

People who tell you you’re awesome are useless. No, dangerous.

They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is. Especially watch out for the ones who tell you that nobody understands your genius.

Honestly, this is going to sound horrible, but self-doubt is one of your most powerful tools for craftsmanship. None of the designers you admire feel self-confident about their work in that way. None of them think that they are awesome. They all suffer from impostor complexes the size of the Titanic.

I am not saying that you need to lack confidence in yourself. (Heck, you’ll never put anything out if that’s the case! You need to have the arrogance to assume anyone will care in the first place). I am saying that nobody is ever done learning, and people who tell you you have arrived will give you a sense of complacency. You should never be complacent about your art.

Nail. On. Head.

This sentiment has been explained to people "fanboy-ing it up" for their chosen game time and again, but it's always dismissed, never sinks in, and continues to happen.

Will a veteran of the industry, who's seen it all from both sides of the fence, the good, the bad and the ugly of it command any more attention or respect from people who want to defend "their game" from any and all criticism? Probably not. They'll just find some arbitrary detail to dismiss everything he says outright and continue to wallow in their willful ignorance, believing "their game" is beyond criticism.

For those with the open mind and intellectual honesty to realize the truth in what he says, and those who are willing to learn, to replace poor beliefs with good knowledge, it's a very eye-opening article.

Thanks for sharing!

"Devs need to stop trying to make MMOs for people who don't like MMOs" - thevampirelematt/Reddit

  User Deleted
10/15/13 8:39:32 AM#30

Ralph may want to sit down and have a heart-to-heart with Mark Jacobs and John Smedley. They both have nothing but fanbois to fuel interest their games. If they didn't, they might be less content putting out information that amounts to little more than term papers.

 

  Pratt2112

Elite Member

Joined: 2/12/12
Posts: 1159

10/15/13 8:44:00 AM#31
Originally posted by Neo_Viper
Originally posted by Scot

What he was getting at is that you learn nothing from those who think your game is great and plenty from those who do not think it is that good.

So for a dev the naysayers are more useful. But a game gaming company does not just have devs in it, I am sure marketing is very happy with the fanbois.

It's a bit silly even from a developer perspective. You also want to know what you did right. When the vast majority praises a feature, it's not "fanboism", it's that the feature is simply good. The few grumpy sad people who think otherwise won't change that fact.

It seems you, and others in this thread, missed the central point of what Raph is explaining, or you're just outright dismissing what he said and deferring to the flawed conclusion that those voicing criticism of an otherwise liked feature/system are just  "grumpy sad people". You're doing precisely what he warns against... dismissing negative feedback and those giving it.

As he says - 100% correctly - you can not tell someone their experience was wrong, no matter how strongly you may disagree with it. Even if 900 people love a given feature, if there are 50 others who find problems with it, then those problems are very real and very legitimate to those players. You can not just dismiss that negative feedback, or the people providing it, simply because "more people like it".

The problem is, for those who like it.. they may have noticed the issue but decide it's not a big enough deal to worry about. They might be the more "fanboy" type and decide it must be part of the design, and therefor "right", because they can't conceive of the game having any flaws. They may not even recognize the issues. All those people are going to praise the given feature, without ever noting the parts that seem off. The developer learns nothing from that.

Meanwhile, those who do notice those issues and choose to voice them - the ones who are typically referred to as "trolls" or "haters", and told to "go away" - may be providing valuable insight to something the developer hadn't even noticed or considered.

By dismissing those people as "grumpy sad people", you are essentially shutting yourself off to something that could potentially be a bigger problem than it seems.

What Raph is making the case against in his article, is precisely what you're resorting right back to doing in your response; finding a way to dismiss negative feedback... and that is and can be very harmful to a game in the long run.

"Devs need to stop trying to make MMOs for people who don't like MMOs" - thevampirelematt/Reddit

  Doogiehowser

Novice Member

Joined: 3/14/12
Posts: 1939

10/15/13 8:44:15 AM#32

Whole heartedly agree with the topic. This website is the perfect example where posters would 'white knight' for companies and give an impression that game devs can do no wrong.

FFXIV ARR is the latest example.

"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.'
-Jesse Schell

"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid."
-Luke McKinney

  Pratt2112

Elite Member

Joined: 2/12/12
Posts: 1159

10/15/13 8:52:35 AM#33
Originally posted by Doogiehowser

Whole heartedly agree with the topic. This website is the perfect example where posters would 'white knight' for companies and give an impression that game devs can do no wrong.

FFXIV ARR is the latest example.

Ain't that the truth.

"Devs need to stop trying to make MMOs for people who don't like MMOs" - thevampirelematt/Reddit

  Neo_Viper

Novice Member

Joined: 5/10/13
Posts: 624

If I agreed with you we'd both be wrong.

10/15/13 8:58:08 AM#34
Originally posted by Doogiehowser

Whole heartedly agree with the topic. This website is the perfect example where posters would 'white knight' for companies and give an impression that game devs can do no wrong.

This website is the perfect example where posters would bash a game and/or a company and give the impression that game devs never do anything right.

See what I did here?

My computer is better than yours.

  Doogiehowser

Novice Member

Joined: 3/14/12
Posts: 1939

10/15/13 9:00:34 AM#35
Originally posted by Neo_Viper
Originally posted by Doogiehowser

Whole heartedly agree with the topic. This website is the perfect example where posters would 'white knight' for companies and give an impression that game devs can do no wrong.

This website is the perfect example where posters would bash a game and/or a company and give the impression that game devs never do anything right.

See what I did here?

Yes i see what you did here....you didn't bother to read the original topic or you completely missed the point.

There is difference between offering legitimate crticism and screaming 'this game is fail ..lololo'. OP is talking about the former type of criticism and why snubbing it with fanboyism is bad.

"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.'
-Jesse Schell

"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid."
-Luke McKinney

  vandal5627

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/04/12
Posts: 318

10/15/13 9:02:13 AM#36
Originally posted by Doogiehowser
Originally posted by Neo_Viper
Originally posted by Doogiehowser

Whole heartedly agree with the topic. This website is the perfect example where posters would 'white knight' for companies and give an impression that game devs can do no wrong.

This website is the perfect example where posters would bash a game and/or a company and give the impression that game devs never do anything right.

See what I did here?

Yes i see what you did here....you didn't bother to read the original topic or you completely missed the point.

There is difference between offering legitimate crticism and screaming 'this game is fail ..lololo'. OP is talking about the former type of criticism and why snubbing it with fanboyism is bad.

But you're missing his point, this site is fulll of the latter.

  User Deleted
10/15/13 9:06:42 AM#37


Originally posted by Torvaldr

Originally posted by Foomerang Ah the sweet melancholy that is Raph Koster: the Robert Smith of game developers.
Sometimes you come up with some great ones Foo. This is one of them.

The article was a good read. If you didn't notice there will be an AMA and he's giving a seminar at GDC.


Haha well its true. That guy always has a dark cloud looming. I am very looking forward to his new projects though. Wonder if we will get a mobile sandbox mmo. That would be pretty amazing.

  vandal5627

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/04/12
Posts: 318

10/15/13 9:10:42 AM#38
If it wasn't for fanboyism, he wouldnt have a huge following of people playing his games in the first place.
  Doogiehowser

Novice Member

Joined: 3/14/12
Posts: 1939

10/15/13 9:11:36 AM#39
Originally posted by vandal5627
Originally posted by Doogiehowser
Originally posted by Neo_Viper
Originally posted by Doogiehowser

Whole heartedly agree with the topic. This website is the perfect example where posters would 'white knight' for companies and give an impression that game devs can do no wrong.

This website is the perfect example where posters would bash a game and/or a company and give the impression that game devs never do anything right.

See what I did here?

Yes i see what you did here....you didn't bother to read the original topic or you completely missed the point.

There is difference between offering legitimate crticism and screaming 'this game is fail ..lololo'. OP is talking about the former type of criticism and why snubbing it with fanboyism is bad.

But you're missing his point, this site is fulll of the latter.

I see intelligent and valid crticism shot down as much as i see one line troll posts. Even according to this websites TOS... you can not simpley say 'game sucks' but you have to explain why and people for majority always give their experince in detail which is labelled as 'trolling' or 'hating'.

Look at the first two pages for FFXIV section and find me one topic with one line troll 'this game will fail ..lololo'. It would get locked down quickly. And yet when people explain their impressions and write negative things in detail they are still called haters or insecure. Such is the irony.

 

"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.'
-Jesse Schell

"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid."
-Luke McKinney

  vandal5627

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/04/12
Posts: 318

10/15/13 9:14:06 AM#40
Originally posted by Doogiehowser
Originally posted by vandal5627
Originally posted by Doogiehowser
Originally posted by Neo_Viper
Originally posted by Doogiehowser

Whole heartedly agree with the topic. This website is the perfect example where posters would 'white knight' for companies and give an impression that game devs can do no wrong.

This website is the perfect example where posters would bash a game and/or a company and give the impression that game devs never do anything right.

See what I did here?

Yes i see what you did here....you didn't bother to read the original topic or you completely missed the point.

There is difference between offering legitimate crticism and screaming 'this game is fail ..lololo'. OP is talking about the former type of criticism and why snubbing it with fanboyism is bad.

But you're missing his point, this site is fulll of the latter.

I see intelligent and valid crticism shot down as much as i see one line troll posts. Even according to this websites TOS... you can not simpley say 'game sucks' but you have to explain why and people for majority always give their experince in detail which is labelled as 'trolling' or 'hating'.

Look at the first two pages for FFXIV section and find me one topic with one line troll 'this game will fail ..lololo'. It would get locked down quickly. And yet when people explain their impressions and write negative things in detail they are still called haters or insecure. Such is the irony.

 

But he does have a point correct?  You can see that this site is full of the latter as well?  You going to tell me that's not true?  I"m not even arguing against your point that the former doesn't exist.

12 Pages « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 » Last Search