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Darkfall: Unholy Wars

Darkfall: Unholy Wars 

General Discussion  » Clause live streaming honest discussion about future of Darkfall.

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88 posts found
  xpiher

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/22/08
Posts: 3304

10/14/13 8:57:34 AM#21
Classes are a logical evolution from the armor updates we were told about.


Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher

  MrBoots

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/07/03
Posts: 283

10/14/13 9:05:54 AM#22
Originally posted by xpiher
The number of hacks are being blown out of proportion in this thread. I played with dolphin rider in dfo as well as most of the coe/rgf crew and most of the other top pvpers. There were only a few people who cheated in this circle and most where ostracized. White chapel for instance. Mr bucket. Johna hacked on alt account to make money to fuel grinding.

The two biggest names that get accused of hacking are aim bot and dolphin aim bot gets accused of hacking because most people do not understand how the game works and he does. What he does is use the strafe mechanic to force the direction of his arrows at distance and ignores wobble when at mid-short range because of the way hit boxes work. The only video THAT May show him hacking in dfo was one in a village where the only way to run was in a single direction.

I can't comment on dolphin rider as I've only ran into him 3x in uw. But in dfo he was accused of it in dfo during water combat. In water combat constantly strafing and going up and down can throw off a lesser skilled persons aim especially at range and in group fights I don't think I've seen a better person on knowing how and when to pull back, using friendlies to meat shield and sustain pressure.

What would you have done if Dolphin Rider had told you about his cheat program? Would you do the right thing? Your posts make it seem like you would. Do you think it's possible that they wouldn't trust you with that knowledge? I learned this lesson the hard way in another game.

I joined a clan that was doing really well on my server. They were popular because they were the top pvpers on the server. I had fun playing with those guys, and enjoyed winning. Whenever someone cried hacks I would get on the forums and call them a liar. I thought they were just jealous of our accomplishments and I blindly supported my clan mates.

One day I logged in to find my character in a virtual jail. There were 4 walls and no exit. After paging a GM he pops in and starts questioning me. He asked me questions about any 3rd party applications, and if I knew of any being used by my clan members. I had no idea what he was talking about. After about 30 minutes of questions he told me that my account was being suspended until it could be reviewed.

Almost two weeks later I got a response from support saying that my account was clean and that I was being unsuspended. It also said that my clan had been disbanded because most of the members including the leader were permanently banned. They refunded my lost time at least. Before the bust my clan had just under 100 members. Only about 12 of us remained. Most of the guys that got unbanned were newer members. I never saw it coming.

  DarthRaiden

Novice Member

Joined: 11/20/05
Posts: 4547

i make art,
till someone dies.

Forum Terrorist

10/14/13 9:45:25 AM#23
Originally posted by xpiher
Classes are a logical evolution from the armor updates we were told about.

But as a smart guy you don't have to believe in the necessaty of armor speciliasitions to classes "evolution".

This "evolution" step comes namely at the cost of player freedom and game complexity.

 

There are working examples of MMORPG's with the armor spec design that prooves these company's statement  wrong also.

 

 

-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!

"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)

  Galadourn

Elite Member

Joined: 2/06/08
Posts: 1058

10/14/13 9:51:32 AM#24

classes are wrong the way they are implemented; too restricting and without really allowing for gameplay customization.

what they should have done is go for the armor system. Make it so that armor negates spellcasting and archery with hefty penalites to those skills depending on the armor's encumbrance, not like DF1.

OR they could choose to go the classes way, but then they should do it like most other games do. This in-between is not working.

http://kck.st/Xo38HT

  slycritter

Novice Member

Joined: 8/16/13
Posts: 7

10/14/13 10:21:06 AM#25
DF:UW is the best game I've ever played, but they don't release content fast enough or interact with the player base enough to warrant paying a $15 monthly fee. Good luck to them though I hope they can turn things around and get more people interested in the game. 
  Deerhunter71

Novice Member

Joined: 10/25/05
Posts: 554

10/14/13 2:43:30 PM#26
Think he meant 2k current subscribers instead of 20k?  I mean if there just for arguement's sake 10k subscribers and each with an alt the whole damn world would be slam full of people everywhere...  I just do not see the 20k being right.
  kdchan

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/17/07
Posts: 236

10/14/13 3:27:52 PM#27

Yes, probably the correct number is less than 2k users. Is impossible that Df has 20 000 subs.

Claus on the other hand, and his vision (since old Razorwax era), is the last hope for this game.
Also i think that Av should sell the game property of the game, they don't know how to make fun games anymore.

Plan to play
The Repopulation | Peria Chronicles | Tree of Saviour

  Lustmord

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/21/05
Posts: 1102

 
OP  10/14/13 3:31:22 PM#28
Originally posted by Deerhunter71
Think he meant 2k current subscribers instead of 20k?  I mean if there just for arguement's sake 10k subscribers and each with an alt the whole damn world would be slam full of people everywhere...  I just do not see the 20k being right.

Yes, I'm thinking it was a slip of tongue, or a loss in translation.

They have 2k subs and need to get to at least 3.5k to be on mark.

 

Really a shame, considering how much the last combat patch improved the game.

A lot of people are coming back just because Claus is working on the game again. I hope they can pull through this slump.

I hope people will come back to the game, if nothing else, to support indie game companies trying to make something that isn't a wow clone.

  Galadourn

Elite Member

Joined: 2/06/08
Posts: 1058

10/14/13 3:36:35 PM#29
20k subs split between two servers and with different time zones is easily doable.  Nothing surprising about that number.

http://kck.st/Xo38HT

  Mad+Dog

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/02/10
Posts: 671

10/14/13 3:42:37 PM#30

The way Av have treated their player base, me included... the deserve to fail.

 

They fooked all DF1 players over with all the wipe crap for over a year and killed the game because of it.

Then they release a half assed new version of the game with half the stuff missing from the orginal.

 

What goes around comes around AV. You've treated your player base like shit for years.

 Hope AV is no more by the end of the year and all the devs don't have a job and never work on games ever again.

 

Yes I am one bitt mother fuk  er that's followed and played the game since 2007.

  Holophonist

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/15/09
Posts: 2035

10/14/13 3:51:54 PM#31

I'm sorry but if you quit this game because of people hacking, you're making excuses. Most of the top players have released pvp videos where you can clearly see that they're better than the vast majority of players. It's possible they also hack when they're not recording, but it seems more likely that people are just complaining, like they always do.

 

It happens in every game. Watch starcraft 2 streams and you'll see how often these prominent, well known players are accusing other people have stream cheating, wall hacking, etc. But then somebody in their chat will point out that the accused is actually streaming himself, and you can very clearly see that he is not cheating.

 

People will ALWAYS make excuses for why they lose.

  niceguy3978

Elite Member

Joined: 6/14/06
Posts: 2011

10/14/13 3:56:38 PM#32
Originally posted by Lustmord
Originally posted by Deerhunter71
Think he meant 2k current subscribers instead of 20k?  I mean if there just for arguement's sake 10k subscribers and each with an alt the whole damn world would be slam full of people everywhere...  I just do not see the 20k being right.

Yes, I'm thinking it was a slip of tongue, or a loss in translation.

They have 2k subs and need to get to at least 3.5k to be on mark.

 

Really a shame, considering how much the last combat patch improved the game.

A lot of people are coming back just because Claus is working on the game again. I hope they can pull through this slump.

I hope people will come back to the game, if nothing else, to support indie game companies trying to make something that isn't a wow clone.

While needing 35k seems a bit high as a break even points 3.5k seems really low, that's only around 50k in revenue per month.  Bandwidth, server overhead, building overhead, would eat a good bit of that even before you get to salaries.  On the other hand 500k in income per month to break even seems high for an indy game.  

  stux

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/23/09
Posts: 469

10/14/13 4:09:27 PM#33
Originally posted by Holophonist

I'm sorry but if you quit this game because of people hacking, you're making excuses. Most of the top players have released pvp videos where you can clearly see that they're better than the vast majority of players. It's possible they also hack when they're not recording, but it seems more likely that people are just complaining, like they always do.

 

It happens in every game. Watch starcraft 2 streams and you'll see how often these prominent, well known players are accusing other people have stream cheating, wall hacking, etc. But then somebody in their chat will point out that the accused is actually streaming himself, and you can very clearly see that he is not cheating.

 

People will ALWAYS make excuses for why they lose.

People cheat.  You can record a video of yourself cheating and post it as its not going to show the program you are using to do while you are playing the game unless you want to show it and very few are that dumb. 

 

Want to see some starcraft 2 cheats:  

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBZT2ukipkc&feature=player_embedded#!

http://gamasutra.com/view/news/167781/Indepth_Extravagant_cheating_via_Direct_X.php#.URpoY6VEHl-

 

It happens in darkfall as well on many different levels.

 

 It happens in every game.  That is only part of the problem though.

 

Obviously, if the game is running into money troubles and some people help them out more then other favorites will be played.  Who gets banned and who doesn't.  Who do the GM's help and who doesn't.

 

If AV is having money troubles and looks to its community for financial aid those that contribute are very likely to look and maybe get benefit from it imo.

 

Aside, from that other issues have been covered in other threads on this website.

  Holophonist

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/15/09
Posts: 2035

10/14/13 4:15:41 PM#34
Originally posted by stux
Originally posted by Holophonist

I'm sorry but if you quit this game because of people hacking, you're making excuses. Most of the top players have released pvp videos where you can clearly see that they're better than the vast majority of players. It's possible they also hack when they're not recording, but it seems more likely that people are just complaining, like they always do.

 

It happens in every game. Watch starcraft 2 streams and you'll see how often these prominent, well known players are accusing other people have stream cheating, wall hacking, etc. But then somebody in their chat will point out that the accused is actually streaming himself, and you can very clearly see that he is not cheating.

 

People will ALWAYS make excuses for why they lose.

People cheat.  You can record a video of yourself cheating and post it as its not going to show the program you are using to do while you are playing the game unless you want to show it and very few are that dumb. 

 

Want to see some starcraft 2 cheats:  

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBZT2ukipkc&feature=player_embedded#!

http://gamasutra.com/view/news/167781/Indepth_Extravagant_cheating_via_Direct_X.php#.URpoY6VEHl-

 

It happens in darkfall as well on many different levels.

 

 It happens in every game.  That is only part of the problem though.

 

Obviously, if the game is running into money troubles and some people help them out more then other favorites will be played.  Who gets banned and who doesn't.  Who do the GM's help and who doesn't.

 

If AV is having money troubles and looks to its community for financial aid those that contribute are very likely to look and maybe get benefit from it imo.

 

Aside, from that other issues have been covered in other threads on this website.

I'm not dumb enough to claim that cheats don't exist. I'm saying if you're quitting based on the pretense that cheating is affecting your experience in any kind of a significant way, you're lying to yourself. I've played over 5,000 games of sc2 and I can guarantee you that cheating has had less of an impact on my playing experience than snowstorms taking my power out. It's an excuse.

 

EDIT: Also, what I meant by pointing out that "top tier" Darkfall players post videos is that you can clearly see that they're talented players... in so much as that community has to offer. If they were using any kind of a third party program, you'd be able to see the effects of it by watching the video. It's not about whether you can see the window or not.

  stux

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/23/09
Posts: 469

10/14/13 4:16:21 PM#35

OT,

 

I can't decide if this was a good thing for the game or bad.  The guy was clearly unprofessional and talking about things I think are immoral.  If you are looking for that sort of crowd in a game then that is the community the game may be successful with but I am not interested in playing a game with that crowd

 

Here is an example:

 

"Oh come on. It was fkn 2am for him, he was drunk, are you really upset about that? Some of you are just pussies. The guy has been honest as fuck, and seemed to be motivated, which is amazing imo. Yes, he was joking around and stuff, but you know what, this just make him more human and tbh I prefer this honesty over the big pile of lies and the long AFK periods, which is what AV has given us in the past years."

 

-DaveStunTueur

https://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?381496-Claus-had-his-hand-in-the-Jesus-Patch-of-DF1/page4

 

How this whole thing went down is suspect imo as well.

 

I hope AV well.  I hope the make the game more enjoyable and patch more frequently.  But how they go about and who they cater the game towards may not make me want to play it.

However it proceeds, they need to do it in a more professional level.  I do like the candor but not the application of it.

 

 

 

  stux

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/23/09
Posts: 469

10/14/13 4:19:25 PM#36
Originally posted by Holophonist
Originally posted by stux
Originally posted by Holophonist

I'm sorry but if you quit this game because of people hacking, you're making excuses. Most of the top players have released pvp videos where you can clearly see that they're better than the vast majority of players. It's possible they also hack when they're not recording, but it seems more likely that people are just complaining, like they always do.

 

It happens in every game. Watch starcraft 2 streams and you'll see how often these prominent, well known players are accusing other people have stream cheating, wall hacking, etc. But then somebody in their chat will point out that the accused is actually streaming himself, and you can very clearly see that he is not cheating.

 

People will ALWAYS make excuses for why they lose.

People cheat.  You can record a video of yourself cheating and post it as its not going to show the program you are using to do while you are playing the game unless you want to show it and very few are that dumb. 

 

Want to see some starcraft 2 cheats:  

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBZT2ukipkc&feature=player_embedded#!

http://gamasutra.com/view/news/167781/Indepth_Extravagant_cheating_via_Direct_X.php#.URpoY6VEHl-

 

It happens in darkfall as well on many different levels.

 

 It happens in every game.  That is only part of the problem though.

 

Obviously, if the game is running into money troubles and some people help them out more then other favorites will be played.  Who gets banned and who doesn't.  Who do the GM's help and who doesn't.

 

If AV is having money troubles and looks to its community for financial aid those that contribute are very likely to look and maybe get benefit from it imo.

 

Aside, from that other issues have been covered in other threads on this website.

I'm not dumb enough to claim that cheats don't exist. I'm saying if you're quitting based on the pretense that cheating is affecting your experience in any kind of a significant way, you're lying to yourself. I've played over 5,000 games of sc2 and I can guarantee you that cheating has had less of an impact on my playing experience than snowstorms taking my power out. It's an excuse.

I am not talking about SC2.  I was just pointed out its not that hard to if you want.

 

I am talking about in DFUW and yes there are people cheating in the game.  They just don't run around showing you how to do it via recording videos of it and posting them on youtube.

The best programmers can easily record playing the game and post what they want you to see and it would be very hard to tell the difference.

I have seen it in the game.  Is it completely out of control?  NO.  But its there and some people will leave as a result depending on how it effects them.

  Mardukk

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/05/11
Posts: 1459

10/14/13 4:27:48 PM#37

It is a shame.  This is without a doubt the beginnings of what most of the people on this forum ask for in their MMO's.  I suspect the full loot part is too daunting for most to even give it a try.  I also think this game has attracted the wrong crowd for games actual strengths.  I see a lot of calls for almost no character development, they just want a big pvp arena I think.

 

The community is a bit odd as I've played mostly PvE focused games.  People seem to thrive on instability.  I'm crushed when our alliance losses a town...as I just lost easy access to hunting areas.  They shrug and say nothing.  Major clans go away overnight and no one thinks twice about it...it's not a bad community just very different from what I'm used to.  Dueling is somehow fun to them, I would rather go PvE or craft.

 

It is a truly remarkable game world that has the beginnings of an amazing game.  I think the old school MMO crowd (if they are open minded about PvP in the open world) as well as any explorers would do well to give this game a shot.  I have seen more awe inspiring vistas and visuals in this game than any other (Vanguard was impressive as well).

 

Hopefully with next patch they give some thought to PvE loot tables (not for PvP reasons but for the rewards as they are terrible now).  And more thought to the character development systems in general.  

 

 

 

  DarthRaiden

Novice Member

Joined: 11/20/05
Posts: 4547

i make art,
till someone dies.

Forum Terrorist

10/14/13 4:49:21 PM#38
Originally posted by Mardukk

It is a shame.  This is without a doubt the beginnings of what most of the people on this forum ask for in their MMO's.  I suspect the full loot part is too daunting for most to even give it a try.  I also think this game has attracted the wrong crowd for games actual strengths.  I see a lot of calls for almost no character development, they just want a big pvp arena I think.

 

The community is a bit odd as I've played mostly PvE focused games.  People seem to thrive on instability.  I'm crushed when our alliance losses a town...as I just lost easy access to hunting areas.  They shrug and say nothing.  Major clans go away overnight and no one thinks twice about it...it's not a bad community just very different from what I'm used to.  Dueling is somehow fun to them, I would rather go PvE or craft.

 

It is a truly remarkable game world that has the beginnings of an amazing game.  I think the old school MMO crowd (if they are open minded about PvP in the open world) as well as any explorers would do well to give this game a shot.  I have seen more awe inspiring vistas and visuals in this game than any other (Vanguard was impressive as well).

 

Hopefully with next patch they give some thought to PvE loot tables (not for PvP reasons but for the rewards as they are terrible now).  And more thought to the character development systems in general.  

 

The community is a bit odd as I've played mostly PvE focused games.  People seem to thrive on instability.  I'm crushed when our alliance losses a town...as I just lost easy access to hunting areas.  They shrug and say nothing.  Major clans go away overnight and no one thinks twice about it...it's not a bad community just very different from what I'm used to.  Dueling is somehow fun to them, I would really go PvE or craft.

 

 

 

Last paragraph  is a bit redundantly.

 

Not sure if you have been here for PRE DF:UW incarnation of DF.   The pure and unpolluted DF was more of a game for oldskool players and it had more potential before it got ruined by themepark ideas and focus on themepark arena pvp.

So i have been there and done that but then company took my submoney and created a themepark while pretending to work on extending the sandbox.

 

 

 

-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!

"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)

  IstrebiteI

Novice Member

Joined: 10/28/11
Posts: 272

10/14/13 5:07:03 PM#39
Originally posted by Holophonist
I'm not dumb enough to claim that cheats don't exist. I'm saying if you're quitting based on the pretense that cheating is affecting your experience in any kind of a significant way, you're lying to yourself. I've played over 5,000 games of sc2 and I can guarantee you that cheating has had less of an impact on my playing experience than snowstorms taking my power out. It's an excuse.

Just wanted to comment on this. Sorry, but your opinion is ridiculous. Cheaters break games. I've met cheaters in WoW and in Counter-Strike, and they just ruin the experience. Granted, WoW cheaters are not as rampant (met one on BG that capped nodes for our team before gates opened, and several that mined nodes from underground) but they still hurt you. However, when cheats are really frequent, you just lose any will to play, regardless of your skill! And this is no excuse!

I had once played pirated CS:S (yeah I know, my bad for playing a non-legit game) and so, I had to use servers that had no official valve cheat protection. Well, this was unplayable. Every game, I mean literally every 4 out of 5 games, there was a cheater either on our team or their team. He would move at insane speeds, autoheadshotting everybody, and we could do nothing about him. This just ruined the experience!

Of course, you can ignore cheaters and move on. Of course, you should not make cheaters take you off balance, make you rage. Of course you must tell yourself "he didn't win, because he cheated, so his win does not count" and so on. But there is just no fun playing with cheaters. You just think "okay there is a better way to spend my time" and do so.

So yeah, people do quit games because of cheaters, and that's a valid reason to quit games. No lying to yourself - you just go and spend your time better, in a game where people don't cheat (and such games do exist, go try make a maphack in Dota2 or Lol or Hon... OOPS you cannot because the programmers are smart and don't even send you the info about stuff you aren't supposed to see!)

  Holophonist

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/15/09
Posts: 2035

10/14/13 5:18:19 PM#40
Originally posted by IstrebiteI
Originally posted by Holophonist
I'm not dumb enough to claim that cheats don't exist. I'm saying if you're quitting based on the pretense that cheating is affecting your experience in any kind of a significant way, you're lying to yourself. I've played over 5,000 games of sc2 and I can guarantee you that cheating has had less of an impact on my playing experience than snowstorms taking my power out. It's an excuse.

Just wanted to comment on this. Sorry, but your opinion is ridiculous. Cheaters break games. I've met cheaters in WoW and in Counter-Strike, and they just ruin the experience. Granted, WoW cheaters are not as rampant (met one on BG that capped nodes for our team before gates opened, and several that mined nodes from underground) but they still hurt you. However, when cheats are really frequent, you just lose any will to play, regardless of your skill! And this is no excuse!

I had once played pirated CS:S (yeah I know, my bad for playing a non-legit game) and so, I had to use servers that had no official valve cheat protection. Well, this was unplayable. Every game, I mean literally every 4 out of 5 games, there was a cheater either on our team or their team. He would move at insane speeds, autoheadshotting everybody, and we could do nothing about him. This just ruined the experience!

Of course, you can ignore cheaters and move on. Of course, you should not make cheaters take you off balance, make you rage. Of course you must tell yourself "he didn't win, because he cheated, so his win does not count" and so on. But there is just no fun playing with cheaters. You just think "okay there is a better way to spend my time" and do so.

So yeah, people do quit games because of cheaters, and that's a valid reason to quit games.

If you were to play WoW and participate in BG's, how many of your matches do you think would be ruined by cheaters?

If you were to play CS on an official server, how many of those matches do you think would be ruined by cheaters?

 

Again, if you're quitting a game because of cheaters, it's an excuse. I'm not saying NOBODY cheats. What I am saying is that the vast majority of it is in your head. When I was playing DFUW there were people in my clan's mumble just CONSTANTLY complaining about dying to hackers. What was their reasoning? "Nobody can hit that often!".. or something similar. Not exactly "beyond a reasonable doubt."

 

So many other things are probably factoring into your losses than cheating or hacking. Lack of skill, poor in-game performance, latency, etc. 

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