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News & Features Discussion  » [Interview] Camelot Unchained: The Helbound Class Revealed

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33 posts found
  DavisFlight

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2594

9/19/13 4:54:57 PM#21
Originally posted by JeroKane
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by eric_w66

One wonders how long a PvP realm based game can last these days. Especially one without PvE. Planetside 2 isn't doing that great it seems, and it's a shooter. The rest of the PvP ones.... dead or dying.

This is PS2 style though. Most of the only successful MMOs of the last few years were PvP games. PS2, Darkfall (not a billion dollar success, but it grew, added more servers, and added staff over the years, something almost no other WoW clone managed to do), and DAoC is still going.

AND. This is not a PvP only game. No one said there was no PvE, just no PvE grinding for levels.

 

And no, RvR doesn't rely on victims, FFA PvP does (not that that is actually a problem, as Eve, the second most popular MMO on the market, proves)

Ehh what? Are you for real or live in a different Dimension that us?

Tell me of any pure PVP MMO that has been as succesful as any of the bigname MMOs out there like WoW, EQ2, LOTRO, FFXIV ARR, GW2.

ARR is anything but a success. It just released, most MMOs die right afterwards, just like FF14 did the first time around. LotRO and EQ2 were mild successes at best. GW2 is a PvP MMO, it's the whole point of the game.

Above games (Except FFXIV yet) have both PVE and PVP as secondary.

Darkfall a success? lol! Sorry... it might have had a tiny hardcore fanbase that kept the Company alive, but that's it.

A company of 12 developers made an MMO from scratch with very little funding. They've steadily grown over 4 years, now sitting at 60 developers, released boxed versions of the game, multiple free expansions, moved into bigger offices, twice, opened new servers, released a sequel, and are currently in the process of releasing in a new country.

Not a success? Yeah, no. They're a huge success for what they've done. You compare that with Rift or SWTOR where they lose developers, close servers, and have declining populations over the years, and have to go FTP just to stay alive. Darkfall still has a subscription. So sorry, you're completely wrong.

 

Just to give you an example. FFXIV ARR currently has over 325.000 concurrent Connections during Prime times and it's a pure PVE MMO (Will get some instanced PVP in a future patch, but it's still a PVE MMO at it's core and always will be). It just launched. SWOTR had bigger numbers at launch. So did AoC. Neither are considered successful.

Tell me of any pure PVP MMO that comes even Close to these amount of players.

Eve.

None! Even EVE Online, which is the most succesful MMO to date With FFA PVP, doesn't even come Close to those numbers.

 
It's the most successful MMO to date outside WoW. Full stop.

 

  DavisFlight

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2594

9/19/13 4:55:49 PM#22
Originally posted by nationalcity
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by eric_w66

One wonders how long a PvP realm based game can last these days. Especially one without PvE. Planetside 2 isn't doing that great it seems, and it's a shooter. The rest of the PvP ones.... dead or dying.

This is PS2 style though. Most of the only successful MMOs of the last few years were PvP games. PS2, Darkfall (not a billion dollar success, but it grew, added more servers, and added staff over the years, something almost no other WoW clone managed to do), and DAoC is still going.

AND. This is not a PvP only game. No one said there was no PvE, just no PvE grinding for levels.

 

And no, RvR doesn't rely on victims, FFA PvP does (not that that is actually a problem, as Eve, the second most popular MMO on the market, proves)

I don't know where you come up with most of the only successful mmo's are PVP games.....

 

Someone a little cray-cray........

 

No pve is gonna hurt this game simple as that.......

[mod edit] There is PvE in this game. As I and many others have said many times.

  RebelScum99

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/26/12
Posts: 1127

9/19/13 4:59:39 PM#23
 

I'm still trying to get over the fact that someone is trying to convince us that the only successful games over the past few years have been PvP games.  And when someone brings up GW2, he claims it's a PvP game.  

Mind-boggling.

  DavisFlight

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2594

9/19/13 5:03:38 PM#24
Originally posted by RebelScum99
 

I'm still trying to get over the fact that someone is trying to convince us that the only successful games over the past few years have been PvP games.  And when someone brings up GW2, he claims it's a PvP game.  

Mind-boggling.

Scroll up buddy, nobody claimed that.

  FlyinDutchman87

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/25/10
Posts: 187

9/19/13 5:05:52 PM#25

Yeah, I'm pretty sure there will be Mobs, some world bosses and maybe even a PVP dungeon or two that the factions will fight for control over. I wouldn't really classify those as (PVE) per say. 

From what I understand there just wont be any PVE questing or raiding or grinding.

  DavisFlight

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2594

9/19/13 5:41:25 PM#26
Originally posted by Dutchman87

Yeah, I'm pretty sure there will be Mobs, some world bosses and maybe even a PVP dungeon or two that the factions will fight for control over. I wouldn't really classify those as (PVE) per say. 

From what I understand there just wont be any PVE questing or raiding or grinding.

All they've ever said is that there won't be PvE based leveling. They never ruled out mobs in general, and they've hinted at big PvE mobs already.

  DavisFlight

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2594

9/19/13 5:42:46 PM#27
Originally posted by Dutchman87

GW2 isn't PVP centric. 

 

and DAOC and GW1, although great games are at LEAST 3-4 MMO generations ago.

 

and although TOR was a pile of trash it wasn't really a failure.

 

 

 

When you have to merge the servers down to 1/5 their number, when the two founders of the company leave, when EA stocks plummet, when the staff that manages the game gets cut in half twice, when the game scrambles to go free to play... yeah that's a failure all right.

  nate1980

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 3/03/09
Posts: 1839

9/20/13 7:47:42 AM#28

Mark Jacobs,

You want feedback, but haven't told us much of anything. A bit of lore and some artwork. Can't tell you if it's a good class or not for the game with limited data. If you're asking if it's a good concept, then let's just say I wouldn't play it. While it does have some coolness to it, I don't like how half of him looks different than the other half.

  loulaki

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/20/11
Posts: 839

9/20/13 7:52:50 AM#29
i dont trust promises following by amateur concept art ...

  Swedish_Chef

Novice Member

Joined: 8/26/13
Posts: 225

Bort bort bort!

9/20/13 7:55:17 AM#30
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by JeroKane
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by eric_w66

One wonders how long a PvP realm based game can last these days. Especially one without PvE. Planetside 2 isn't doing that great it seems, and it's a shooter. The rest of the PvP ones.... dead or dying.

This is PS2 style though. Most of the only successful MMOs of the last few years were PvP games. PS2, Darkfall (not a billion dollar success, but it grew, added more servers, and added staff over the years, something almost no other WoW clone managed to do), and DAoC is still going.

AND. This is not a PvP only game. No one said there was no PvE, just no PvE grinding for levels.

 

And no, RvR doesn't rely on victims, FFA PvP does (not that that is actually a problem, as Eve, the second most popular MMO on the market, proves)

Ehh what? Are you for real or live in a different Dimension that us?

Tell me of any pure PVP MMO that has been as succesful as any of the bigname MMOs out there like WoW, EQ2, LOTRO, FFXIV ARR, GW2.

ARR is anything but a success. It just released, most MMOs die right afterwards, just like FF14 did the first time around. LotRO and EQ2 were mild successes at best. GW2 is a PvP MMO, it's the whole point of the game.

Calling FFAAR anything at this point is premature at best. So far it's looking like a success, but time will tell.

GW2 is NOT a PvP MMO. Period.

LOTRO and EQ2 were both fairly successful games, and in a pre-WoW world would've been considered great successes.

 

Above games (Except FFXIV yet) have both PVE and PVP as secondary.

Darkfall a success? lol! Sorry... it might have had a tiny hardcore fanbase that kept the Company alive, but that's it.

A company of 12 developers made an MMO from scratch with very little funding. They've steadily grown over 4 years, now sitting at 60 developers, released boxed versions of the game, multiple free expansions, moved into bigger offices, twice, opened new servers, released a sequel, and are currently in the process of releasing in a new country.

Not a success? Yeah, no. They're a huge success for what they've done. You compare that with Rift or SWTOR where they lose developers, close servers, and have declining populations over the years, and have to go FTP just to stay alive. Darkfall still has a subscription. So sorry, you're completely wrong.

 Oh, so we're judging each game based on its own scale now? Fine, then FFAAR is a HUUUGE success if we're going to do that.

Just to give you an example. FFXIV ARR currently has over 325.000 concurrent Connections during Prime times and it's a pure PVE MMO (Will get some instanced PVP in a future patch, but it's still a PVE MMO at it's core and always will be). It just launched. SWOTR had bigger numbers at launch. So did AoC. Neither are considered successful.

SWTOR has found moderate success after the F2P switch, as has AoC. You don't release expansion packs for unsuccessful MMOs.

Tell me of any pure PVP MMO that comes even Close to these amount of players.

Eve.

He said close. EVE is a fine game, but the most concurrent connections it's had is still sitting right around a third of what FFARR has had.

None! Even EVE Online, which is the most succesful MMO to date With FFA PVP, doesn't even come Close to those numbers.

 
It's the most successful MMO to date outside WoW. Full stop.

 Uhh, no, it isn't. It's successful, but GW2, Rift, LOTRO, AoC, DDO, and others beat it handily. The only place where EVE accels is that its managed to slowly grow over the years. And I do stress slowly.

Ugh, sorry about the formatting. I don't know how it got screwed up so badly, and I've no time to fix it.

  Tamanous

Elite Member

Joined: 3/22/09
Posts: 1827

9/20/13 11:52:20 AM#31

I am completely surprised this update was even covered here. These are simply updates on how their VERY early game development is going. They put out little concept updates for the community and then ask or feedback from the founders forum. These are not huge updates and we likely won't get into the mechanics yet for quite some time.

 

That said I continue to be intrigued by the transparency of this company and the chance we get to see a game developed from such an early stand point. I personally love their bullet form company updates that covers not only just CU.

 

Everyone has to keep a perspective here. MJ knows how to make a game. That isn't the issue. The issue if it magic can strike yet again and a great game is made. Until that time we get to enjoy the journey during game development. We are getting updates YEARS before other companies start with promotion and update. The great thing is that this isn't really promotion ... it is a company trying to be different from day 1 by being transparent at all stages.

You stay sassy!

  Baramos79

Novice Member

Joined: 10/12/12
Posts: 69

9/20/13 7:42:34 PM#32
In Mark we trust. I am learning patience waiting for this game knowing how far away it is.
  DavisFlight

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2594

9/24/13 12:23:30 PM#33
Originally posted by Swedish_Chef
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by JeroKane
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by eric_w66

One wonders how long a PvP realm based game can last these days. Especially one without PvE. Planetside 2 isn't doing that great it seems, and it's a shooter. The rest of the PvP ones.... dead or dying.

This is PS2 style though. Most of the only successful MMOs of the last few years were PvP games. PS2, Darkfall (not a billion dollar success, but it grew, added more servers, and added staff over the years, something almost no other WoW clone managed to do), and DAoC is still going.

AND. This is not a PvP only game. No one said there was no PvE, just no PvE grinding for levels.

 

And no, RvR doesn't rely on victims, FFA PvP does (not that that is actually a problem, as Eve, the second most popular MMO on the market, proves)

Ehh what? Are you for real or live in a different Dimension that us?

Tell me of any pure PVP MMO that has been as succesful as any of the bigname MMOs out there like WoW, EQ2, LOTRO, FFXIV ARR, GW2.

ARR is anything but a success. It just released, most MMOs die right afterwards, just like FF14 did the first time around. LotRO and EQ2 were mild successes at best. GW2 is a PvP MMO, it's the whole point of the game.

Calling FFAAR anything at this point is premature at best. So far it's looking like a success, but time will tell.

GW2 is NOT a PvP MMO. Period.

LOTRO and EQ2 were both fairly successful games, and in a pre-WoW world would've been considered great successes.

After the amount of money it lost the first time around, it's going to have to keep these kinds of numbers for a year to be a success.

GW2, and GW1 before it, were both designed with PvP as the core end game. Ever wonder why there's no linear raiding in GW2, or why so much of the focus has been on the numerous ways to PvP? That's the end game design. It shares a PvE world, but so did DAoC. It's more of a PvP game than most other MMOs on the market.

LotRO, the biggest Ip in the entire world, and had a prerelease following numbering in the millions, released to a dull roar. For what it should have been, it wasn't a big success and its numbers never reached the numbers of pre WoW MMOs like DAoC or EQ. It limped along content to cater to its more sophisticated WoW clone niche. It was like the Wendy's to Mcdonalds. (LotRO to WoW)

EQ2 never escaped from its failed launch, but it stuck in there sure. But the point of this discussion is, and the point the OQ tried to make was that no PvP MMO got anywhere near EQ2 or LotRO, and I say that's false because both games were fairly small. Especially compared to the MMOs that came before them.

 

Above games (Except FFXIV yet) have both PVE and PVP as secondary.

Darkfall a success? lol! Sorry... it might have had a tiny hardcore fanbase that kept the Company alive, but that's it.

A company of 12 developers made an MMO from scratch with very little funding. They've steadily grown over 4 years, now sitting at 60 developers, released boxed versions of the game, multiple free expansions, moved into bigger offices, twice, opened new servers, released a sequel, and are currently in the process of releasing in a new country.

Not a success? Yeah, no. They're a huge success for what they've done. You compare that with Rift or SWTOR where they lose developers, close servers, and have declining populations over the years, and have to go FTP just to stay alive. Darkfall still has a subscription. So sorry, you're completely wrong.

 Oh, so we're judging each game based on its own scale now? Fine, then FFAAR is a HUUUGE success if we're going to do that.

Uh, actually if we're judging games based on their own scale (which is how all comparisons are made) then FFAAR was a massive MASSIVE failure, followed by a short term successful rerelease. The amount of money lost 2 years ago on FF, followed by two extra years of development, this game has not turned a profit yet.

Just to give you an example. FFXIV ARR currently has over 325.000 concurrent Connections during Prime times and it's a pure PVE MMO (Will get some instanced PVP in a future patch, but it's still a PVE MMO at it's core and always will be). It just launched. SWOTR had bigger numbers at launch. So did AoC. Neither are considered successful.

SWTOR has found moderate success after the F2P switch, as has AoC. You don't release expansion packs for unsuccessful MMOs.

SWTOR has found moderate success after they put a skeleton team working on it to keep it limping along making a meager amount of money. You do expansion packs for MMOs when you want to keep that drip feed going to get your initial investment back. If I spend 300 million on an MMO and it dies right away like SWTOR did, but is making the tinest bit of profit, I'm going to scale everything back (which they did) and keep that tiny bit of profit going as long as I can in the hopes I at least make my money back.

To call SWTOR and AoC  a success is undermining the entire meaning of the word. AoC dropped off the face of the earth after its launch failure and only grabbed a few curious folks with FTP (just like every other failed MMO under the sun) and then faded back into obscurity. If it was a moderate success (or any success) Funcom wouldn't have announced its never doing another MMO. Notice how when a game goes FTP its all roses and "we doubled our (0$) of revenue!" and then you never hear anything again? It's because, like the first time around, the launch is the only period where they make any money.

Tell me of any pure PVP MMO that comes even Close to these amount of players.

Eve.

He said close. EVE is a fine game, but the most concurrent connections it's had is still sitting right around a third of what FFARR has had.

Wrong, Eve holds the record for most concurrent users in the MMO field. (I think in all mutiplayer gaming history actually.

None! Even EVE Online, which is the most succesful MMO to date With FFA PVP, doesn't even come Close to those numbers.

 
It's the most successful MMO to date outside WoW. Full stop.

 Uhh, no, it isn't. It's successful, but GW2, Rift, LOTRO, AoC, DDO, and others beat it handily. The only place where EVE accels is that its managed to slowly grow over the years. And I do stress slowly.

 

Ok at first I thought you were just slightly skewed in your perspective but that last sentence is flat out wrong. LotRO never had 500k subs. Never. Rift has been losing subs since it launched. Age of Conan was such a catastrophic failure it ruined Funcon and bankrupted two of their partners. DDO was laughed at for 5 years until it went FTP, where it enjoyed a very VERY brief revival, until a bunch of better games went FTP.
GW2 has been successful, yes, but its impossible to judge very well because there are no sales numbers or sub figures.

Meanwhile, Eve has NEVER STOPPED GROWING and currently has more subscribers than any MMO in the field except WoW. In every measurable sense that is success. Much bigger success than selling a couple million box copies in the first month and then collapsing as everyone leaves for the next shiny WoW clone.

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