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WildStar

WildStar 

General Discussion  » This how much more fun and rewarding combat experience Wildstar would be without Telegraphs

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45 posts found
  rounner

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/07/06
Posts: 549

9/06/13 8:20:50 AM#21
The fight in that video would be impossible with the lag of an mmo.
  CrazKanuk

Elite Member

Joined: 10/06/09
Posts: 1429

9/06/13 8:27:02 AM#22
Originally posted by WW4BW

  Woah woah woah... Now hang on a minute.. Are red circles required for moves to be concidered telegraphed? Looked to me like the boss in the video was telegraphing plently with weapon windups and lifting his leg before doing that shockwave-leap move. The windups were so damn long that it looked stupid when the boss charged off in the opposite direction, because the player had so long to move around behind.

  In the game from the video you didnt really need a target indicator since you were the target. That is a bit different in MMOs. You can't always tell who the monster is going to hit. That said though I hate the stupid red circles too.

 

+1 agreed. Everyone is bitching about telegraphs, but every single game that we play has some sort of telegraph. Just because Wildstar uses visual cues over voice, text, or attack patterns doesn't mean anything. If anything it means that they have an opportunity to deviate from the lather, rinse, repeat monotony present in nearly every single MMO (or even every game) on the market. Random attacks, random AoE damage areas, more intelligent mobs, what's wrong with that? If they stick to what they've said from the beginning and make Wildstar an extremely difficult MMO, chances are that you will need the telegraphs to be successful because, otherwise, you never know where an attack is going to hit, who it will hit, etc. At least that's what I'm hoping for.

Crazkanuk

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  Tinybina

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/28/04
Posts: 2119

9/06/13 10:45:08 AM#23

I'm going to love the "I keep getting kicked from instance grioups because I keep dying inside telegraphs" threads when this game launches.  Sure turn them off if you want too, but when your fighting a end boss and you keep standing still rather then move (like your playing that new Final fantasy) that is on you.

 

------------------------------
You see, every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with their surrounding environment, but you humans do not. You spread to an area, and you multiply, and you multiply, until every natural resource is consumed. The only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet.-Mr.Smith

  udon

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/23/07
Posts: 1630

9/06/13 10:57:11 AM#24

Have you ever tried to read a mobs animation telegraphs (yea they are still telegraphing) with 24 people stacked on top of it?  I have and what ends up happening is people either ignore it or someone has to call out in voice when it happens or everyone misses it.

Animation telegraphs end up making group content a cluster unless the mobs are SO much larger and the animations are so much more over the top that players can see them.  I like them in single player games but where I have seen them used in MMO's I generally hate them. 

Not that I love red circles on the ground but it is a much more practical system for multiplayer content.  One of my main concerns about Wildstar is circle overload in 40 man groups.  If you are seeing mob red telegraphs plus beneficial  blue player telegraphs from 40 people all fighting the same boss won't that become a bit confusing exactly what is going on?

  ZenMorph

Novice Member

Joined: 9/15/11
Posts: 11

Sir, I suggest you look at the other battlestar.

9/06/13 3:21:39 PM#25
I'm not understanding all the angst over telegraphs. On the list of things that make or break an mmo, this is way, way at the bottom.
  Realbigdeal

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/08
Posts: 1652

9/06/13 11:05:15 PM#26

This video sum it up pretty well i say.

When he jumps, you can see his shadow to see when he is about to fall on you. He is a giant golem so it's logic.

Other than that, you can see all his skims before they hit even if it's your first time.

An harder version of this boss would give you a very shorter time notice and it would either be nearly impossible or you would have to dodge very precisely.

 

In conclusion, we don't need a telegraph system that wildstar use coz most games cameout with better ways to predict each enemies in a unique way for every single enemies type in a game.

Telegraph should only be used for ongoing area of effects like a rain of fire or around a totem of heal.

C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif

  Utinni

Novice Member

Joined: 7/13/13
Posts: 358

9/06/13 11:07:41 PM#27

For the onetrillionth time.

 

YOU CAN TURN THE TELEGRAPHS OFF

  Realbigdeal

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/08
Posts: 1652

9/06/13 11:15:57 PM#28
Originally posted by Nadia
Originally posted by Deciman
Didn't I see somewhere that you will be able to turn off the telegraphs?

supposedly was announced at pax that you could turn it off

http://www.wildstarforums.com/forums/wildstar-discussions/general-discussion/41849-telegraph-opacity

That just creates an other problem. Who the hell would want to turn off this system just to put himself at a great disadvantage? Especially when the game is online and when there's open world pvp server?

What i want, is an open world pvp with no telegraph. Those who started in a pve server with telegraph shouldnt be able to transfer their character in a pvp server with no telegraph because of the good start they would get.

These options would make me want to try the game.

C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif

  Utinni

Novice Member

Joined: 7/13/13
Posts: 358

9/07/13 12:38:12 AM#29
Originally posted by Realbigdeal
Originally posted by Nadia
Originally posted by Deciman
Didn't I see somewhere that you will be able to turn off the telegraphs?

supposedly was announced at pax that you could turn it off

http://www.wildstarforums.com/forums/wildstar-discussions/general-discussion/41849-telegraph-opacity

That just creates an other problem. Who the hell would want to turn off this system just to put himself at a great disadvantage? Especially when the game is online and when there's open world pvp server?

What i want, is an open world pvp with no telegraph. Those who started in a pve server with telegraph shouldnt be able to transfer their character in a pvp server with no telegraph because of the good start they would get.

These options would make me want to try the game.

Why are MMO players so concerned with how other people play the game? If you're a good player you won't be at a disadvantage at all. 

Wildstar will never be open world pvp. MMO PvP will always be pointless because of gear/levels. The fact that you can innately have an advantage over another player is what attracts turds to MMO pvp. Go fight someone on fair terms.

  red_cruiser

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/12/07
Posts: 471

9/07/13 12:51:41 AM#30

I've seen plenty of people miss telegraphs.

And honestly, when you've got death and decay style effects already all over the place courtesy of your fellow players, they can be easy to miss.

I remember TSW having telegraphs and still thinking that some of those boss fights were pretty challenging.

  Tinybina

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/28/04
Posts: 2119

9/07/13 5:38:47 AM#31
Originally posted by Utinni
Originally posted by Realbigdeal
Originally posted by Nadia
Originally posted by Deciman
Didn't I see somewhere that you will be able to turn off the telegraphs?

supposedly was announced at pax that you could turn it off

http://www.wildstarforums.com/forums/wildstar-discussions/general-discussion/41849-telegraph-opacity

That just creates an other problem. Who the hell would want to turn off this system just to put himself at a great disadvantage? Especially when the game is online and when there's open world pvp server?

What i want, is an open world pvp with no telegraph. Those who started in a pve server with telegraph shouldnt be able to transfer their character in a pvp server with no telegraph because of the good start they would get.

These options would make me want to try the game.

Why are MMO players so concerned with how other people play the game? If you're a good player you won't be at a disadvantage at all. 

Wildstar will never be open world pvp. MMO PvP will always be pointless because of gear/levels. The fact that you can innately have an advantage over another player is what attracts turds to MMO pvp. Go fight someone on fair terms.

 

Watch this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG_82r0RzfI  this is the one of the LOWEST LEVEL dungeons in Wildstar(fast forward to 2:40).

 

 

 

 

 

I hope you watched that first....

 

Can you imagine how hard the level cap telegraphs fights will be?.... Now I want you to make a squishy DPS guy, turn off your telegraphs (Mr. Good player) and then run these three boses with your telegraphs off.  I wonder how fast your group will boot you or your tank and healer will leave and get back in their 3 mins queues, just because their silly little squishy DPS guy keeps getting DESTROYED because he has no clue where the BOOM spots are and just sits in them like a idiot.

 

I'm guessing after the first wipe tank /tells the healer to boot you and get another DPS or the vice versa.  Or if it's cross server instance group the Tank or healer (I know you seen this one before) just sits in one spot for a min after a wipe and then DC's, logs back in gets in his/her 3 mins queue and runs with a group that has their telegraphs on!  

 

Better yet I'm pretty sure that after having failed a few runs due to people having telegraphs off and causing their groups to  wipe,  the tank and the healer will demand that everyone has their telegraphs on in every group they get into.  And if they see that you don't (ala your not avoiding the telegraphs you CANNOT SEE) you get the boot or they leave.

 

I'm sure this will not only apply to DPS types, if a healer has a tank doesn't try to avoid anything he will probably do pretty much what has been said above..  So you can pretty much insert any class in the mix.

 

 

 

 

------------------------------
You see, every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with their surrounding environment, but you humans do not. You spread to an area, and you multiply, and you multiply, until every natural resource is consumed. The only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet.-Mr.Smith

  Realbigdeal

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/08
Posts: 1652

9/07/13 12:07:05 PM#32
Originally posted by Tinybina
Originally posted by Utinni
Originally posted by Realbigdeal
Originally posted by Nadia
Originally posted by Deciman
Didn't I see somewhere that you will be able to turn off the telegraphs?

supposedly was announced at pax that you could turn it off

http://www.wildstarforums.com/forums/wildstar-discussions/general-discussion/41849-telegraph-opacity

That just creates an other problem. Who the hell would want to turn off this system just to put himself at a great disadvantage? Especially when the game is online and when there's open world pvp server?

What i want, is an open world pvp with no telegraph. Those who started in a pve server with telegraph shouldnt be able to transfer their character in a pvp server with no telegraph because of the good start they would get.

These options would make me want to try the game.

Why are MMO players so concerned with how other people play the game? If you're a good player you won't be at a disadvantage at all. 

Wildstar will never be open world pvp. MMO PvP will always be pointless because of gear/levels. The fact that you can innately have an advantage over another player is what attracts turds to MMO pvp. Go fight someone on fair terms.

 

Watch this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG_82r0RzfI  this is the one of the LOWEST LEVEL dungeons in Wildstar(fast forward to 2:40).

 

 

 

 

 

I hope you watched that first....

 

Can you imagine how hard the level cap telegraphs fights will be?.... Now I want you to make a squishy DPS guy, turn off your telegraphs (Mr. Good player) and then run these three boses with your telegraphs off.  I wonder how fast your group will boot you or your tank and healer will leave and get back in their 3 mins queues, just because their silly little squishy DPS guy keeps getting DESTROYED because he has no clue where the BOOM spots are and just sits in them like a idiot.

 

I'm guessing after the first wipe tank /tells the healer to boot you and get another DPS or the vice versa.  Or if it's cross server instance group the Tank or healer (I know you seen this one before) just sits in one spot for a min after a wipe and then DC's, logs back in gets in his/her 3 mins queue and runs with a group that has their telegraphs on!  

 

Better yet I'm pretty sure that after having failed a few runs due to people having telegraphs off and causing their groups to  wipe,  the tank and the healer will demand that everyone has their telegraphs on in every group they get into.  And if they see that you don't (ala your not avoiding the telegraphs you CANNOT SEE) you get the boot or they leave.

 

I'm sure this will not only apply to DPS types, if a healer has a tank doesn't try to avoid anything he will probably do pretty much what has been said above..  So you can pretty much insert any class in the mix.

 

 

 

 

You talk about booting me off, but i already said that i'm not gonna play wild star  if there will be no server with telegraph off and pvp on.

 

Now, you just sound like someone who wants to beat every dungeon, bosses, raids, what ever in one shot. You don't want a second try. 

I'm not a wow player, but i heard about how many time they had to fail to complete one raid. You can even lose in a dungeon, not only in a pvp arena.  Now that the addon for telegraph exist, i bet you get booted for not downloading it and this is why i will never play wow again. Addons and autohotkeys should not even exist

My question to you, why do you hate losing that much? Losing is a part of life and it allows you to learn from your mistakes before you can advance. This whole telegraph system simply removes the whole aspect of losing and learning.

As for the immersion, it completely breaks it. Red giant dots all across the room will get old very quick. EQN use a telegraph too, but not for every abilities. Spell effects over interface system that's showing you what's going on, but it shouldnt be too obvious at the same time.

C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif

  Tinybina

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/28/04
Posts: 2119

9/07/13 9:01:26 PM#33
Originally posted by Realbigdeal
Originally posted by Tinybina
Originally posted by Utinni
Originally posted by Realbigdeal
Originally posted by Nadia
Originally posted by Deciman
Didn't I see somewhere that you will be able to turn off the telegraphs?

supposedly was announced at pax that you could turn it off

http://www.wildstarforums.com/forums/wildstar-discussions/general-discussion/41849-telegraph-opacity

That just creates an other problem. Who the hell would want to turn off this system just to put himself at a great disadvantage? Especially when the game is online and when there's open world pvp server?

What i want, is an open world pvp with no telegraph. Those who started in a pve server with telegraph shouldnt be able to transfer their character in a pvp server with no telegraph because of the good start they would get.

These options would make me want to try the game.

Why are MMO players so concerned with how other people play the game? If you're a good player you won't be at a disadvantage at all. 

Wildstar will never be open world pvp. MMO PvP will always be pointless because of gear/levels. The fact that you can innately have an advantage over another player is what attracts turds to MMO pvp. Go fight someone on fair terms.

 

Watch this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG_82r0RzfI  this is the one of the LOWEST LEVEL dungeons in Wildstar(fast forward to 2:40).

 

 

 

 

 

I hope you watched that first....

 

Can you imagine how hard the level cap telegraphs fights will be?.... Now I want you to make a squishy DPS guy, turn off your telegraphs (Mr. Good player) and then run these three boses with your telegraphs off.  I wonder how fast your group will boot you or your tank and healer will leave and get back in their 3 mins queues, just because their silly little squishy DPS guy keeps getting DESTROYED because he has no clue where the BOOM spots are and just sits in them like a idiot.

 

I'm guessing after the first wipe tank /tells the healer to boot you and get another DPS or the vice versa.  Or if it's cross server instance group the Tank or healer (I know you seen this one before) just sits in one spot for a min after a wipe and then DC's, logs back in gets in his/her 3 mins queue and runs with a group that has their telegraphs on!  

 

Better yet I'm pretty sure that after having failed a few runs due to people having telegraphs off and causing their groups to  wipe,  the tank and the healer will demand that everyone has their telegraphs on in every group they get into.  And if they see that you don't (ala your not avoiding the telegraphs you CANNOT SEE) you get the boot or they leave.

 

I'm sure this will not only apply to DPS types, if a healer has a tank doesn't try to avoid anything he will probably do pretty much what has been said above..  So you can pretty much insert any class in the mix.

 

 

 

 

You talk about booting me off, but i already said that i'm not gonna play wild star  if there will be no server with telegraph off and pvp on.

 

Now, you just sound like someone who wants to beat every dungeon, bosses, raids, what ever in one shot. You don't want a second try. 

I'm not a wow player, but i heard about how many time they had to fail to complete one raid. You can even lose in a dungeon, not only in a pvp arena.  Now that the addon for telegraph exist, i bet you get booted for not downloading it and this is why i will never play wow again. Addons and autohotkeys should not even exist

My question to you, why do you hate losing that much? Losing is a part of life and it allows you to learn from your mistakes before you can advance. This whole telegraph system simply removes the whole aspect of losing and learning.

As for the immersion, it completely breaks it. Red giant dots all across the room will get old very quick. EQN use a telegraph too, but not for every abilities. Spell effects over interface system that's showing you what's going on, but it shouldnt be too obvious at the same time.

 

I'm going to try to break this down for you real simple like.

 

EVEN WITH THE TELEGRAPHS THE GAME WAS STILL PRETTY HARD!

 

So um no, I don't want to beat the dungeons, quest and/or adventures (what ever the hell they are) on the first try nor do I think I could.  

 

You haven't even played this game yet you seem to think that as long as you step out of ever telegraph all is good in the world.  Yeah it helps, a lot, but Mobs still do white damage and the encounters are usual with MULTIPLE MOBS.  Atleast when I got to play it earlier in the year at a show that was the case. Me and people around me where wiping on quest at level freaking 4 and 5!  I don't think I ever got killed on a quest at that level in any MMO.  Yet when I was trying to do the soldier missions and people would join me we had a really hard time of it.

 

Like they have preached over and over. This game will be hard, I just hope they keep it that way.

------------------------------
You see, every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with their surrounding environment, but you humans do not. You spread to an area, and you multiply, and you multiply, until every natural resource is consumed. The only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet.-Mr.Smith

  jesusjuice69

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/07/13
Posts: 293

9/10/13 6:29:39 AM#34
Originally posted by Realbigdeal

You talk about booting me off, but i already said that i'm not gonna play wild star  if there will be no server with telegraph off and pvp on.

 

You would die constantly without telegraphs.  Even simple mobs would like rape the shit out of you.  You can easily see what happens, even at low levels, if you stand in a telegraph.  You get rocked!!!

 

If you refuse to play a challenging game with telegraphs, then I wish you luck playing the flavor the month casualized piles of shit that the other companies keep pumping out.

  Voqar

Novice Member

Joined: 1/28/04
Posts: 484

9/13/13 6:10:28 AM#35
Originally posted by thecapitaine
The last time I played Dragon's Prophet, their boss battles were like this, with no red circles or any such telegraphs.  People didn't seem to have too much of a problem with them, except for some glitches and one-shotting abilities.  I actually think there's not a whole lot of difference in challenge between avoiding big red circles and long, slow windups once you've had a little experience fighting the mob.  It might be nice to have a toggle option for people who want to look at enemy animations instead of waiting for nasty stuff to appear on the ground.

Right.  There needs to be SOME kind of prompt to let players know it's time to react.  Does it really matter if it's a marker on the ground or a blatantly obvious animation?  Should players need to learn every little different animation for every mob and memorize all that just to do fights?  Can you expect healers to be watching healbars AND be able to keep track of stuff like that?

 

I don't see the telegraph stuff as a big deal.  Players still have to react.  Players still fail to move.  Players still try to finish that one cast or whatever before moving.  Etc.  If the game moved your character to safety automatically, that'd be one thing.  But if there's player awareness, decision making, movement, etc, does this really matter?

 

Premium MMORPGs do not feature built-in cheating via cash for gold pay 2 win. PLAY to win or don't play.

  Swids2010

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/22/13
Posts: 221

Pay to Win. If it can be earned in game its not pay to win FACT

9/13/13 6:23:14 AM#36
Originally posted by ElRenmazuo
And also proves that you dont need big red dots to anticipate boss attacks and be completely easy to have a successful game.

This is like 4/5th thread I seen about this if you don't like telegraphs there is two options available

1 Disable them

2 Don't play the game

  Cetra

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/05/04
Posts: 371

9/13/13 6:52:25 AM#37

There are game mechanics that are best left to single player games and mechanics that mmo needs.

Some noobs dont understand at all.

You are not fighting only 1 mob. Outside of instances, you will also be dealing with several adds frequently in wildstar. No telegraphs will make combat a frustrating experience.

Devs can also give the mobs stronger and more interesting abilities that make the fights more intense. If not, we can go 10years back where mobs only use auto attacks.

Telegraphs enhance the combat. period.

I laugh at ppl who will not use telegraphs in mmos. I bet after 1-2 days of frustrating gaming, they will turn back on telegraphs.

  Thupli

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/25/11
Posts: 431

9/22/13 12:11:14 AM#38

IMO, it starts coming down to spell effects versus telegraphs.

 

In wow, it was hard to see what the boss was going to do unless you turned off all of the spell effects.

 

Would you rather play a game w/o spell effects and w/o telegraphs, or with both spell effects and telegraphs?

 

I hope you can scale the opaqueness of the telegraphs to make them more "hidden".

  nilden

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/26/05
Posts: 964

9/22/13 2:22:48 AM#39
After watching the video the telegraphing in this game seems excessive. Pretending like turning off the telegraphing is a real option is the same thing as saying playing this with your monitor off is a viable option. This amount of telegraphing is just red shape assault on your eyes. Actually I think you will be able to customize the color of the telegraphed shape barrage. Color me uninterested.

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  lp7p

Novice Member

Joined: 9/22/13
Posts: 6

9/22/13 8:54:31 AM#40
I am really looking forward to this game!
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