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EverQuest Next

EverQuest Next 

General Discussion  » SOEs corporate strategy and EQN

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32 posts found
  Allein

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/13
Posts: 924

9/02/13 3:02:23 AM#21
Originally posted by Sengi

It is alarming that Smedley somehow thinks MMOs could appeal to people that exclusively play games like Bejeweled. I see that 2007 where the hey days of Facebook gaming and Zyngas stock value was going through the roof, but if the Farmville crowd doesn’t want to play your game you can’t address this by making it more like Farmville.

Here is another interesting article.

 http://www.forbes.com/sites/johngaudiosi/2011/08/07/females-spending-more-real-cash-on-virtual-goods-in-video-games-than-males/

Basically, women spend more money in cash shops. I only read the first page, but I assume that is the overview.

Women and young gamers are increasing. Video Games in general are not geared towards aging men (sorry guys) as much as they once were.

SOE is a company and money runs the show.

EQ as a whole has always been female friendly (my girlfriend at the time actually got me into EQ in High School), I was still playing MUDs, but she liked the pretty graphics...

WoW was very friendly to a wide audience and did better than any other mmorpg because of it.

My wife is addicted to Candy Crush, like so many other poor souls. She also enjoys puzzle, exploring, crafting type games. She wasn't a fan of the grind in WoW, but has shown interest in trying EQN if it has some mini-game type stuff to waste some time on (crafting, house designing, farming, etc). She'll come along to slay the dragon, but doesn't want to spend 40 hours a week getting read for the fight.

Smedly made the right move. I don't know many older guys that are just now getting into gaming or at least not mmorpgs. Most have an Xbox or PS3 and that is about it. Where a 20 something might find it easier to get a friend addicted to their game of choice. Many women are looking for a hobby to spend a little time and more importantly money on without dedicating their entire life. I'm pretty much in with the ladies at this point.

I've had my years of 8+ hour game sessions multiple times a week. I hoping EQN caters to a slighly more casual crowd and doesn't require it to be a full time job to not be left behind. If that means it has to be a bit more light hearted and more appealing to females and a younger crowd, sign me up. The more girls instead of G.I.R.L.s the better.

  Caldrin

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/04
Posts: 4138

9/02/13 3:08:00 AM#22

Well SOE like most companies are out to make money.. so of course expanding your player base to the female population is a very good thing to do.. more players = more money..

 

 

My 3D models
http://dragon3d.webs.com/

  noncley

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/16/12
Posts: 635

9/02/13 3:53:13 AM#23
Originally posted by Caldrin

Well SOE like most companies are out to make money.. so of course expanding your player base to the female population is a very good thing to do.. more players = more money..

 

 

Yes, but you're missing the point. SOE has always 'reached out' to new customers in the most crass, clumsy and alienating ways that have tended to keep new players away and fuck off existing players.

  GrayKodiak

Novice Member

Joined: 11/15/12
Posts: 576

9/02/13 7:03:06 AM#24
Originally posted by Telondariel

 

No one in this industry is targeting a 38 year old median age level...

*cough* Camelot Unchained *cough*

Yea well, by the time that one rolls out it will be targeting 48 year olds.

  User Deleted
9/02/13 7:13:46 AM#25

I'll admit I first came to this site because of the NGE....

 

Yet I don't really get a lot of the posts I see on this site.   While I did originally come here raging about something as many were, in a forum that no longer exists.. most of us got over it or at least moved on.

 

[mod edit]

The original post of this thread was flawed and that is putting it nicely.   It really has nothing to do with EQN... at best it would be some kind of "general" rant about SOE with no real logical thought process behind it...

 

Which in a way simply highlights the odd moderation methods this website uses.

  Amylion

Novice Member

Joined: 8/03/13
Posts: 37

9/04/13 4:57:09 PM#26

Hi Sengi!

You made a good observation, but I would consider it obvious. It's obvious that the emancipation of women is leading to a transformation of culture. "EverQuest Next" is targeting women more than "EverQuest" did. The reason is as said, obvious. More women are in higher positions, earning (and spending) more money, making more decisions... it all leads to a "womanization" of culture.

This process is no surprise at all. Just look at "Fight Club" (1999)!

It's more surprising that some people here not only seem to be unaware of the social changes, but – even more silly – try to dissect your point by dumb rhetorical tricks. One thing is to have no clue about society, the other thing is to sell his ignorance as wisdom.

Yours,

Amylion.

Others just shoot the zombies which are chasing us. Whereas I try to talk to them.

If the brainless realized that it is dead, maybe, just maybe, it would lay itself down to rest...

  Sengi

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/01/09
Posts: 341

 
OP  9/05/13 9:05:21 AM#27
Originally posted by Telondariel

 ...

The key part to the OP that made the entire article, and subsequent commentary, irrelevant was it was from 2007.  Six years can be a lifetime in business (as well as other professions) allowing for a lot of change to occur during that time.  Judging by the history of SOE since then, change did in fact occur.

 

To the OP:  Your other threads here, and here, are along the same line.  That is, you seem to be convinced that EQN is going to be casual and only suitable to a very young crowd.  In those previous threads, you tried to use the graphic style to back up your suspicions, and now you are using this old, dusty article from 6 years ago to attempt to do the same thing. 

 

From all indications in various interviews with Dave and various Dev's, EQN will cater to many different playstyles and not be as simple as you keep trying to suggest.  Even in the most recent interviews at Gamescon and PAX, Dave again reiterated that it would be silly to try to cater to a single type of player and that EQN will have content for the hardcore, casual, crafters, etc. 

 

So, OP, your message that you think EQN is going to be an ultra-casual, cartoony, dumbed down mess for kiddies has been heard, but it's not based on anything substantive.  Multiple interviews and tweets since the reveal at SOE Live easily counter this speculative assertion.

 

Yes, 6 years are quite a long time, especially in the IT-sector. 2007 was the year the first iPhone was released. I admit it is maybe not entirely fair to rub Smedleys nose in his ramblings of 6 years ago. Maybe he has made up his mind to some degree, but as I see it, Smedley is still the same guy he was in 2007 and what he said about SOEs target audience sounded like a long term strategy. He was talking about SOE as a whole and not only about particular games. Do you know a more recent article about this topic? That would be interesting.

 

Yes, you are right, I'm not a fanboy. :D I see this thread as a follow up to the graphics debate. I was asking myself why in the world they would have choosen that art style. If you consider this article it suddenly all makes sense.

I am worried that SOE might turn out to be a casual game. I don't say it will be this way, but I have seen some things lately that lead in this direction. For example there seems to be no falling damage at all. I really hope they will show us something soon that will point in a different direction again. In my opinion it would be a fiasco if they go to much in the casual direction, because it means to water down all the great concepts they have.

This would mean that SOE would go the same way as GW2. If you watch their manifesto video you see how they jumped off as a tiger and landed as a bedside rug.

That they are saying it would be a game fore everyone is not saying much, every AAA mmo ever was marketed this way.

 

Where exactly are those interviews are tweets you mention that point in a less casual direction that where released after SOE Live? I think I have pretty much seen everything there was about EQN, but maybe I missed something.

 

Maybe It has to do with my expectations for "the greatest sandbox of all times". I was hoping for a virtual world type of game. But even if EQN would turn out to be very casual it would still be worth playing. At least it would demonstrate that a sandbox works for the mass market, unless of course they water it down until it's nor really a sandbox anymore.

  Nadia

Elite Member

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 11491

9/05/13 9:14:54 AM#28
Originally posted by Sengi

as I see it, Smedley is still the same guy he was in 2007 and what he said about SOEs target audience sounded like a long term strategy. He was talking about SOE as a whole and not only about particular games. Do you know a more recent article about this topic? That would be interesting.

as i mentioned before

Planetside 2 and DCUO do not appeal to a common audience

 

these are games that were released 4 years after the 2007 interview

  Knytta

Elite Member

Joined: 5/03/07
Posts: 327

9/05/13 9:43:24 AM#29
Well some of us actually still play SOE games I play EQ2 since 2006 (and before that EQ 99-03). After Smokejumper took control they have changed EQ2 and introduced challenging content for 2 people, and challenging and doable content for groups. If you like it or not is up to you but for regular players there are much more to do now and much more that actually is somewhat challenging and fun where before it was either to easy or in many cases to hard especially if you were behind in levels or gear.. The TSO days with awfully boring soloquests (and yes they still do boring questlines but the Cobalt Scar one is a improvement) and an awful grind for shards that by its nature exluded a lot of the playerbase (getting a TSO instance if you were behing in gear or levels was more or less impossible) are over. At the moment EQ2 is better than it has been in a long time and the target group is people like me adults with somewhat limited playtime that still wants progression and see improvement and be able to go  everywhere. Now  you can do the dungeon in a duo and learn the layout and where the nameds are, then do the harder group version (and get better gear) and finally maybe the raid version. I am sure EQN will follow the same path, the old EQ days when a majority of the players never saw most likely of the fun content are over.

Their current strategy and target player are IMHO great. Imagine if SOE could attract even more non gamers with a game where you can do all sorts of things not just kill monsters, that would be a huge step towards a virtual world. But no it would not be "leet"

Chi puo dir com'egli arde é in picciol fuoco.

He who can describe the flame does not burn.

Petrarca

  Sengi

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/01/09
Posts: 341

 
OP  9/05/13 10:14:28 AM#30
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Sengi

... I think Smedley makes it very clear that SOE is not interested in the hardcore crowd anymore.

... SOEs strategy sheds light on the question why they chose that specific cartoony art style for EQN. If teenage girls are their target audience now, it only makes sense to make the art style look kind of girly.

Nevertheless, I believe trying to market a game to female players by making it cute and casual is actually an insult to women.

It is alarming that Smedley somehow thinks MMOs could appeal to people that exclusively play games like Bejeweled. ...

What's more alarming is how many leaps in logic you've made to come to any of those conclusions.

Interest in appealing to a wider audience doesn't mean all products/services will be made to cater to all audiences. Disney didn't add blood and nudity to new Disney movies, they created Touchstone Pictures.

Another thing to note is that the internet in general is so different now from what it was in 2007, that it's rather crazy to think any online entertainment business strategy of 2007 would have any relevance, let alone remain in effect, in 2013.

 

But SOE didn't create a separate company. The only way to bring down the average age of SOEs playerbase is to release no more games that might attract more male 32+ players that are ruining SOEs portfolio .

He explicitly said he wanted a piece of the casual games business. And since SOE has not released any puzzle games jet, he probably meant that he wanted to draw some of the players form Bejeweld into SOEs mmos. With Free Realms this has probably worked.

The fact that alarms me is that I see some elements from Free Realm recur in EQN. You can't deny that the art style is similar. And some of the gameplay elements, the class system for example, look to me as if they where simplified to appeal to the casual crowd. That leads me to believe that SOEs strategy maybe has not changed that much.

  solarbear88

Novice Member

Joined: 12/12/10
Posts: 73

9/07/13 7:49:24 PM#31
I am not really sure Smedley or any designer would be able to design a game that would appeal to the Bejewelled and MMO crowd at the same time. They are two different crowds.

Trying would only lead to failure.

There are activities that appeal to women more than men in an MMO
-crafting
-housing
-character customisation
-social interaction

I think they would be working on these things and they would only add to the MMO.
  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16706

9/07/13 8:08:29 PM#32

I do think that MMOs can do well with some more female touch. Clothes is a good example which in some games are very stereotypical and in games like TERA are stuff few real women would wear. Not that I am against sexy clothes but there should be practical options as well (and for some reason can't we guys make any shoe or boot skin that looks good).

But assuming that female gamers wants it easier then male gamers might be a mistake. Several of the best raiders I know are girls.

Hiring i more female devs = good

Making the games easier = bad

As for "cute" I don't mind that the games have some cute parts (some others should be evil and nasty) but I have a feeling that most female gamers over 14 aren't that impressed by "My little pony" content (then again, I might be wrong but I had several gamer girlfriends in the past).

When you only get guys at a party or for that matter on a workplace things tend to get pretty boring, we do need more female gamers and Smed is right there. But they need to be careful so they don't destroy the MMOs for regulat player including the female players that already play MMOs and messing too much with the difficulty can destroy the games(most MMOs are already so easy that a chimp can play them). 

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