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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

General Discussion  » The population appears to be growing still.

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424 posts found
  SoMuchMass

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/16/13
Posts: 583

8/14/13 1:01:39 PM#61
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by SoMuchMass

Gaffney is the guy that hired most of the GW2 staff.  And probably knows more about MMOs thatn most people.  

Yeah I also believed it when Daniel Erikson said SWTOR was not losing subs.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/star-wars-the-old-republic-not-losing-subscribers-says-dev-6373226

 

Subs? In this game there are no subs. 

 

And no... Gaffney went to Carbine in 2007, had nothing to do with hiring GW2 staff. He managed the acquisition of ArenaNet and Guild Wars way back when but had nothing to do with hiring. 

You do realize that most of the leads behind GW1 worked in GW2 right?  Did I mention GW2 had subs?  Where did I mentione that? That point was to show that you don't take devs at their word.  They will obviously bend the truth to help their game.  We need to see actual data not PR talk.

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

 
OP  8/14/13 1:11:42 PM#62
Originally posted by SoMuchMass
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by SoMuchMass

Gaffney is the guy that hired most of the GW2 staff.  And probably knows more about MMOs thatn most people.  

Yeah I also believed it when Daniel Erikson said SWTOR was not losing subs.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/star-wars-the-old-republic-not-losing-subscribers-says-dev-6373226

 

Subs? In this game there are no subs. 

 

And no... Gaffney went to Carbine in 2007, had nothing to do with hiring GW2 staff. He managed the acquisition of ArenaNet and Guild Wars way back when but had nothing to do with hiring. 

You do realize that most of the leads behind GW1 worked in GW2 right?  Did I mention GW2 had subs?  Where did I mentione that? That point was to show that you don't take devs at their word.  They will obviously bend the truth to help their game.  We need to see actual data not PR talk.

 

Maybe most of the leads in GW1 worked in GW2, but most of the people working in GW2 did not work on GW1. As a matter of fact, they're still hiring people, a year out. Besides, you missed the point... he had nothing to do with hiring them. He managed the acquisition of the company (and others) for NCSoft.

Oderint, dum metuant.

  rojoArcueid

Elite Member

Joined: 8/13/09
Posts: 5541

"It is double pleasure to deceive the deceiver". - Niccolo Machiavelli

8/14/13 1:17:34 PM#63
good games always have many people. Bad games have empty servers. Theres plenty of evidence out there.

My endgame begins with character creation and ends with a new mmorpg

  Purutzil

Elite Member

Joined: 10/02/11
Posts: 2860

The Critical Hit Pretzel!

8/14/13 1:19:12 PM#64
Originally posted by Volkon

/counter-facepalm

 

We've already acknowledged that the status doesn't tell us the actual number of people (simply because we don't know the number). That's a fact, as you've stated and we all recognize. However, the fact that they're increasing the caps on the servers and the servers keep growing IS an indicator of a growing population of players in GW2. It's established that the status represents the number of players logged on at that point in time, as demonstrated by the value fluctuating and the fact that the communities can manipulate it with blackout events in order to squeeze more guilds onto a full server. Based on this observed phenomena we can state the relevance of the status to population.

 

It doesn't tell us numbers. It does tell us trends.

Trend: A pattern of gradual change in a condition, output, or process, or an average or general tendency of a series of data points to move in a certain direction over time, represented by a line or curve on a graph.

 

There is nothing i've seen indicating increased server caps. Pin point an exact location of such a topic and maybe I can believe it, and I don't mean 'word of mouth' since obviously other games like SWTOR did that with the 'super server' detail to elude to the fact servers were diminishing and they were trying to compress servers and make it appear as if it was. Hell, a large variety of large titles do this to make its popularity look greater then it is. The only way you can legitamently say it, is if you either

 

A.) See actually statistical proof from the company detailing the number of players on THEIR CHARTS, not just public released snip its with generalized numbers that can easily be manipulated by advertisement.

B.) Rather then 'claim' its growning, maybe state an observation, one NOT reliant on the word full and maybe say "I've seen a lot more people playing around in the game around me" or something of that nature, which doesn't prove anything and really doesn't warrant a topic (I really feel NO thread regarding population growing or shrinking is a good topic, its often just blatant advertising/flaming of a game).

 

It... does nothing. Its just blatent advertisement on your part. You say you aren't doing something using a 'figure' that doesn't prove anything... yet then... you immediately use it.... 

Eh I'll leave you be. Have fun on your rampant fanboi rant. When you get more sense feel free to make an actual meaninful thread and actually argue why people should join GW2 instead of throwing together a makeshift topic like this as 'proof' without any proof, then i would be more then happy to argue why the game isn't good. I'm not into having things manipulated to fit your needs to 'prove' something you are so desperate to prove.

 

Again, you are just making it look as if the game is doing poorly by doing stuff like this, even though it might not be doing bad at all.

  SoMuchMass

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/16/13
Posts: 583

8/14/13 1:25:25 PM#65
Originally posted by Purutzil
 

Again, you are just making it look as if the game is doing poorly by doing stuff like this, even though it might not be doing bad at all.

Bingo.  But it is to be expected from fans of a game.  It happens with every game from AoC, WAR to SWTOR and GW2.

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

 
OP  8/14/13 1:31:51 PM#66
Originally posted by SoMuchMass
Originally posted by Purutzil
 

Again, you are just making it look as if the game is doing poorly by doing stuff like this, even though it might not be doing bad at all.

Bingo.  But it is to be expected from fans of a game.  It happens with every game from AoC, WAR to SWTOR and GW2.

 

As it's also expected for those that prefer to troll games they don't even play to deny facts presented to them that somehow reflect positively on the game. Happens with every game as well. 

Oderint, dum metuant.

  Gaia_Hunter

Elite Member

Joined: 5/04/12
Posts: 2607

8/14/13 1:35:41 PM#67
Originally posted by SoMuchMass

"Full" means nothing.  ANET could set 300 concurrent players = Full and call it a day.  I didn't believe it when SWTOR and Rift did it, I don't believe it when WoW does it.

I play on a server that is labeled "Medium" in WoW and I barely see any 90s on either faction.  I played on a "Very High" server in SWTOR and the population was dead.  I have characters on a "High" server in GW2 and rarely see anyone in the main city (HoD).

Look at the sales report, NCSoft released today, based on that GW2 is dropping steadily.  In fact, today's Q2 '13 report showed a 20%+ drop in sales from the previous quarter. And 80% drop in sales from the quarter before that.  

The game is not gaining people as much as it is losing, which means a net loss.  It isn't 5 or 10% its 20%+.  The game is declining not growing like the devs want you to believe.

When fans of the game try to tell people the game is not dying, you know there is a problem.

Most of these new quarter sales are micro transactions vs box sales of the first 2 quarters - hence the 80% drop since that quarter, 4Q12, had something like 2 million boxes sales.

I really like GW2 but I'm not buying a GW2 box every quarter.

There was also a big microtransaction sale in March 2013.

If everyone was dumping €15 a month in the game it would have around 650k+ subscriptions.

I doubt most are doing that.

 

So, yeah, opposed to games where you have a sub, you can't say a loss in sales is equal to a player loss, because there is only so much stuff you can buy from the store (bank slots, character slots, bag slots) and the non permanent stuff (like golem bankers, boosters) or RNG (loot boxes) won't attract certain segments of the population.

GW2 made over $240M in something like 10 months, far outselling GW1. 

Currently playing: GW2
Cooperative (semi cooperative)board games you should check: Pandemic, Sentinels of the Multiverse, Eldritch Horror, Descent 2.0,Level 7 Omega Protocol, Last Night on Earth

  SoMuchMass

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/16/13
Posts: 583

8/14/13 1:39:13 PM#68
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by SoMuchMass
Originally posted by Purutzil
 

Again, you are just making it look as if the game is doing poorly by doing stuff like this, even though it might not be doing bad at all.

Bingo.  But it is to be expected from fans of a game.  It happens with every game from AoC, WAR to SWTOR and GW2.

 

As it's also expected for those that prefer to troll games they don't even play to deny facts presented to them that somehow reflect positively on the game. Happens with every game as well. 

I would love to see actual facts.  But I haven't seen anything.

  tom_gore

Novice Member

Joined: 2/27/09
Posts: 1803

8/14/13 1:39:30 PM#69

The population is very healthy on most servers. End of discussion.

Btw, their supposedly biggest Living Story update coming up next week. Stay tuned :)

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

 
OP  8/14/13 1:40:50 PM#70
Originally posted by SoMuchMass
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by SoMuchMass
Originally posted by Purutzil
 

Again, you are just making it look as if the game is doing poorly by doing stuff like this, even though it might not be doing bad at all.

Bingo.  But it is to be expected from fans of a game.  It happens with every game from AoC, WAR to SWTOR and GW2.

 

As it's also expected for those that prefer to troll games they don't even play to deny facts presented to them that somehow reflect positively on the game. Happens with every game as well. 

I would love to see actual facts.  But I haven't seen anything.

 

Ah, see that? Right on cue, denial. 

Oderint, dum metuant.

  SoMuchMass

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/16/13
Posts: 583

8/14/13 1:43:28 PM#71
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by SoMuchMass
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by SoMuchMass
Originally posted by Purutzil
 

Again, you are just making it look as if the game is doing poorly by doing stuff like this, even though it might not be doing bad at all.

Bingo.  But it is to be expected from fans of a game.  It happens with every game from AoC, WAR to SWTOR and GW2.

 

As it's also expected for those that prefer to troll games they don't even play to deny facts presented to them that somehow reflect positively on the game. Happens with every game as well. 

I would love to see actual facts.  But I haven't seen anything.

 

Ah, see that? Right on cue, denial. 

No I am being serious.  I would like to see some sort of concrete data.

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 5759

8/14/13 1:44:49 PM#72

It doesn't surprise me at all that the game is continually growing.  The payment model supports that sort of growth and the cash shop is very friendly.

I have this weird, non-scientific, anecdotal measure for a game and its overall success and that is mail spam.  I use it as a sort of vague barometer to measure how interested scammers, hackers, and phishers are in a certain IP which I use to gauge overall interest.  Of course BattleNet and WoW mails have always been the top, followed by Runescape, followed by the latest release of the day.  Usually those last for a couple months and then drop off.  TOR was like that.  The very interesting thing I've noticed is that the amount of GW2 account verification emails I received increased over time and have surpassed the WoW spam.  It has plateaued now, but remains firmly in the number spot for most received.

Again, not scientific at all, but that coupled with indicators from other sources, NCSoft financials, press reports, etc. give me every reason to believe this is one of the most successful releases since WoW and that it is growing, even if that growth is modest, it seems consistent.

Curse you AquaScum!

  SoMuchMass

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/16/13
Posts: 583

8/14/13 1:47:02 PM#73
Originally posted by Torvaldr

Again, not scientific at all, but that coupled with indicators from other sources, NCSoft financials, press reports, etc. give me every reason to believe this is one of the most successful releases since WoW and that it is growing, even if that growth is modest, it seems consistent.

But the NCSoft report don't show a sales growth.  One was released just today.  Sales for ANet were down 20% from the previous quarter.  And it would be safe to assume it will drop again during Q3 '13 mainly due to increased competition.

Also, their payment model is not as friendly as F2P.  F2P has less barrier to entry.  When GW1 launched it could stand on its payment model, the market has changed.  Now most games even good ones are all F2P/B2P.

  Gaia_Hunter

Elite Member

Joined: 5/04/12
Posts: 2607

8/14/13 1:49:20 PM#74
Originally posted by SoMuchMass
Originally posted by Torvaldr

Again, not scientific at all, but that coupled with indicators from other sources, NCSoft financials, press reports, etc. give me every reason to believe this is one of the most successful releases since WoW and that it is growing, even if that growth is modest, it seems consistent.

But the NCSoft report don't show a sales growth.  One was released just today.  Sales for ANet were down 20% from the previous quarter.  And it would be safe to assume it will drop again during Q3 '13 mainly due to increased competition.

Also, their payment model is not as friendly as F2P.  F2P has less barrier to entry.  When GW1 launched it could stand on its payment model, the market has changed.  Now most games even good ones are all F2P/B2P.

Not if GW2 release in Asia.

And GW2 made a bunch more money than GW1 and that is 10 months vs 8 years.

Currently playing: GW2
Cooperative (semi cooperative)board games you should check: Pandemic, Sentinels of the Multiverse, Eldritch Horror, Descent 2.0,Level 7 Omega Protocol, Last Night on Earth

  dadante666

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/07/11
Posts: 400

you stop laughing when hear the same joke ,but always cry for the same thing...

8/14/13 1:50:01 PM#75

 The population appears to be growing still.:

not really just people that used to play  3-4 month after release came back same for me i just play the  living world ,see what offer and what i tem im going for it then  log out  after few minutes not even an hour of gameplay ,the game offer nothing new ATM only cosmetic stuff . for that reason im moving  to ff14 till anet trow some expantion so ican play a month and finish all again ;/ then came back to FF  .

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

 
OP  8/14/13 2:01:22 PM#76
Originally posted by SoMuchMass
Originally posted by Torvaldr

Again, not scientific at all, but that coupled with indicators from other sources, NCSoft financials, press reports, etc. give me every reason to believe this is one of the most successful releases since WoW and that it is growing, even if that growth is modest, it seems consistent.

But the NCSoft report don't show a sales growth.  One was released just today.  Sales for ANet were down 20% from the previous quarter.  And it would be safe to assume it will drop again during Q3 '13 mainly due to increased competition.

Also, their payment model is not as friendly as F2P.  F2P has less barrier to entry.  When GW1 launched it could stand on its payment model, the market has changed.  Now most games even good ones are all F2P/B2P.

 

You do understand that you can sell less than the prior quarter and still see the population increase, yes?

Oderint, dum metuant.

  MrSalty

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/13/12
Posts: 43

8/14/13 2:05:47 PM#77
people who quit ,who log back in for 10 minutes to see the game is still trash doesnt mean the population is growing.
  Omnifish

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/16/11
Posts: 615

I'll kick your a**e so hard, you could build a swimming pool in the footprint!

8/14/13 2:07:12 PM#78
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by coretex666
Originally posted by Volkon
Now we're up to at least four FULL servers again. A few months back they boosted the server caps when eight or so wound up full, and the eyes of any dedicated WvW players will assure you they've never been reduced. This is definitely a good sign for the game, but sadly it also means if we want to squeeze more guilds in for WvW on JQ we'll have to organize black out events again, or possibly find times it dips to very high as time zones log off...

Maybe it is supposed to appear to be growing.

Have they published any numbers related to population or server caps? What number does "FULL" stand for? What about 3, 6, 9 months ago?

I thought they publish only financial info as they are obliged to by law.

Maybe its population is really growing which would be great for the game and its community, but it is not possible to determine with practically no information besides server status which noone but ANET knows what it stands for.

Scepticism is not necessarily a bad thing you know.

 

Like I'd mentioned before, we don't know what "Full" means as a number. However, there are a few things we do know...

 

1. The population is based on people logged on to the server at that point in time. The fact that server populations can fluctuate over the course of a day shows that, as do the fact that "blackout events" work to manipulate the population shown.  Wrong 

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/gw2/Server-capacity-increased-again As has been discussed before you wouldn't have a clue about how many players are actually playing due to how ANET judge activity levels on their servers

2. They've been increasing the amount of people allowed per server over time, at least three times that I can recall. The most recent took us from something like eight full servers and the rest very high to having a bunch fall to medium and the fullest ones very high.  If they can increase server capacity they can reduce capacity as well, to make the game appear, 'fuller', then it is in comparison to before. It's a marketing tool to save face, which they borrowed for Fun.com when AOC started tanking 

3. They've never decreased the population caps on the servers. Believe me, the WvW crowd, especially the Tier one crowd, would notice this and scream bloody murder. The answer to this is in the above link as well but the simple fact is that noone in WvWvW woiuld notice if there was a decrease due to the above stated reasons.

So based on observation in lieu of actual numbers we still can see that the overall population of the game is indeed growing. I think it was Blackgate to be the first to recently hit Full again, then TC, followed by SoR and JQ... that order may not be 100% accurate, but it gives a visual of the growth. All of this is based on your undying need to validate your chosen love of ANET to internet people on this forum.  You have no clue and nor do I. The only real way to check success if through annual reports, but I'm sure if they come back positive you'll be the first one to tell us all about it.. 

 

This looks like a job for....The Riviera Kid!

  GeezerGamer

Elite Member

Joined: 4/03/12
Posts: 4735

8/14/13 2:22:57 PM#79

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/wuv/wuv/Blackout-events

Nothing conclusive. Just 2 sides to yes it works, no it doesn't and a bunch of reasons but nothing that explains what mechanics are involved. At least, nothnig official. Although, I do believe they happened and that people were able to move at that time. I just think there is more to it.

(I'm assuming that's your thread Volkon?)

It's the sad state of the genre. The next big title has as many threads discussing issues with it's business model than issues with the game itself.

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

 
OP  8/14/13 2:36:48 PM#80
Originally posted by GeezerGamer

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/wuv/wuv/Blackout-events

Nothing conclusive. Just 2 sides to yes it works, no it doesn't and a bunch of reasons but nothing that explains what mechanics are involved. At least, nothnig official. Although, I do believe they happened and that people were able to move at that time. I just think there is more to it.

(I'm assuming that's your thread Volkon?)

 

Oh hey, it is. Cool, thanks Geez.

Oderint, dum metuant.

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