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Guild Wars 2

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General Discussion  » GW2 Ruined Combat for me

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173 posts found
  botrytis

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 2623

7/11/13 2:35:29 PM#61
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by Thillian
The Secret World has the same active combat with dodge and no rooting during casting whatsoever. Majority of the fights, including boss fights, requires constant movement and dodging. Plus, TSW has one of the best character building ever seen in MMORPGs.

 

So they're the first attempt at a GW2 clone?

Obviously TSW isn't a GW2 clone - it even released first.

On the other hand even though TSW share some combat elements with GW2, you have less skills that can be shot without target, the combat feels less fluid - probably due to the fact one has to constantly be spamming the builders/finishers, while in GW2 you can have the #1 skill be auto cast and, because the animation just isn't as good.

HUH? TSW was panned early on because the animations were so horrible. It really did look like GTA combat in an MMO which is not fluid and looks clunky, GW2 does flow better than TSW, Rift, or TERA (I play them all - really). I still come back to GW2.

"In 50 years, when I talk to my grandchildren about these days, I'll make sure to mention what an accomplished MMO player I was. They are going to be so proud ..."
by Naqaj - 7/17/2013 MMORPG.com forum

  stevebombsquad

Elite Member

Joined: 3/20/13
Posts: 857

7/11/13 2:54:28 PM#62
Originally posted by Amjoco
Originally posted by Foomerang

What I find interesting is you have some of the same people loving GW2 and Tera's more action based, less button approach while simultaneously bashing consoles for the "dumbing down" of mmos.

There is more to dumbing down a UI and action bars. With a PC you have viable updates, expansions, and even player mods that a console system just doesn't have. Usually, once a console game is out, it is what you get. 

What does any of that have to do with "dumbing down" a game? Besides, console games can be updated, have DLC expansions. All recent consoles have internet connections. Sure, there aren't any mods, but many PC games don't allow modding. 

James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?

  monarc333

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/16/07
Posts: 617

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7/11/13 3:15:45 PM#63
Originally posted by Tierless

Every time I try to plan another MMO, if it doesn't have some sort of dodge or movement it just feels slow, old, and boring! Even FPS's feel less exciting. I didn't realize it was because of GW2 right away. Rather I kept thinking, why does this feel to dead, so slow? Then I instinctively tried to dodge once and it hit me, GW2!

GW2 has many things I would like to change, but I have grown very fond of that combat.

Yup totally agree with this. I tried to play WoW for shits and giggles and was like whoa. Slow, boring and just not fun. GW2 has ruined combat in other games for me. For those saying Tera is better, I would say its about the same to me. Tera def has some great combat mechanics. But there's just something about GW2 combat I like better. Upcoming games better take notice. The only game on the horizon that is close to this type of combat could wildstar, but they have some issues. Putting the telegraphing aside, especially on the warriors, there seems to be a small delay after swings which really turns me off. Prob, HOPEFULLY, something that will be fixed before release.

  Amjoco

Elite Member

Joined: 9/15/10
Posts: 4887

7/11/13 4:14:51 PM#64
Originally posted by silvermember
Originally posted by Amjoco
Originally posted by Foomerang

What I find interesting is you have some of the same people loving GW2 and Tera's more action based, less button approach while simultaneously bashing consoles for the "dumbing down" of mmos.

There is more to dumbing down a UI and action bars. With a PC you have viable updates, expansions, and even player mods that a console system just doesn't have. Usually, once a console game is out, it is what you get. 

True, but how many decent PC games actually have modding?

And out of that modding how many of them are really good? Except for skyrim, which half the mods were fixing or doing things the devs were to bad or lazy to fix, most of the mods were not that great.

Also Expansions are not only on PC so I don't see point, actually if you really think about it except for MMO they hasn't really been a proper expansion for years, just simply dlc which happens on both consoles and PC.

tl;dr 

My point being your statement is misinformed.

My point is hardly misinformed. 

At least weekly almost all AAA titles are updated, with patches or content updates. This doesn't happen on a console.

As far as the mods go, there are many besides skyrim, almost all of Bethesdas top games are set up this way. All the neverwinter nights games are also.  There are many games with mods, I googled just this, and that is just one site. 

 

Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.

  djazzy

Novice Member

Joined: 6/20/05
Posts: 3624

7/11/13 4:16:42 PM#65

Yeah I have a hard time playing standard mmo combat after GW2.

But there are a few other games in which I enjoy the combat system. While TSW's actual combat is a bit lackluster, I love the deck building part of it. And my favorite action combat has to be Vindictus. I really hope there is an open world mmo that has that combat some day.

  Amjoco

Elite Member

Joined: 9/15/10
Posts: 4887

7/11/13 4:28:20 PM#66
Originally posted by stevebombsquad
Originally posted by Amjoco
Originally posted by Foomerang

What I find interesting is you have some of the same people loving GW2 and Tera's more action based, less button approach while simultaneously bashing consoles for the "dumbing down" of mmos.

There is more to dumbing down a UI and action bars. With a PC you have viable updates, expansions, and even player mods that a console system just doesn't have. Usually, once a console game is out, it is what you get. 

What does any of that have to do with "dumbing down" a game? Besides, console games can be updated, have DLC expansions. All recent consoles have internet connections. Sure, there aren't any mods, but many PC games don't allow modding. 

Nothing, I meant there is more than just dumbing down the gameplay when comparing PC to console.

Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.

  stevebombsquad

Elite Member

Joined: 3/20/13
Posts: 857

7/11/13 9:06:09 PM#67
Originally posted by Amjoco
Originally posted by silvermember
Originally posted by Amjoco
Originally posted by Foomerang

What I find interesting is you have some of the same people loving GW2 and Tera's more action based, less button approach while simultaneously bashing consoles for the "dumbing down" of mmos.

There is more to dumbing down a UI and action bars. With a PC you have viable updates, expansions, and even player mods that a console system just doesn't have. Usually, once a console game is out, it is what you get. 

True, but how many decent PC games actually have modding?

And out of that modding how many of them are really good? Except for skyrim, which half the mods were fixing or doing things the devs were to bad or lazy to fix, most of the mods were not that great.

Also Expansions are not only on PC so I don't see point, actually if you really think about it except for MMO they hasn't really been a proper expansion for years, just simply dlc which happens on both consoles and PC.

tl;dr 

My point being your statement is misinformed.

My point is hardly misinformed. 

At least weekly almost all AAA titles are updated, with patches or content updates. This doesn't happen on a console.

As far as the mods go, there are many besides skyrim, almost all of Bethesdas top games are set up this way. All the neverwinter nights games are also.  There are many games with mods, I googled just this, and that is just one site. 

 

Patches have nothing to do with "dumbing" something down. "Dumbing down" would be referring to mechanics. DCUO and Defiance are both on consoles and they receive regular patches. I think you must not be familiar with modern day consoles.  Sure there are some PC games that are able to be modded. It isn't the norm though. I still play both NWN series and the Elder Scrolls games regularly......

James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?

  craftseeker

Elite Member

Joined: 4/11/09
Posts: 822

7/11/13 9:18:49 PM#68

I would reword the title of the thread a little.

For me GW2 ruined combat.

that is better. 

  Epicent

Novice Member

Joined: 9/16/10
Posts: 671

Die clickers Die!!!

7/11/13 9:19:56 PM#69
Originally posted by Tierless

Every time I try to plan another MMO, if it doesn't have some sort of dodge or movement it just feels slow, old, and boring! Even FPS's feel less exciting. I didn't realize it was because of GW2 right away. Rather I kept thinking, why does this feel to dead, so slow? Then I instinctively tried to dodge once and it hit me, GW2!

GW2 has many things I would like to change, but I have grown very fond of that combat.

lol I was playing FF14 today and an AOE spell went off. I tried to dodge by pressing w twice. lmao. :)

  Mikeha

Elite Member

Joined: 9/03/08
Posts: 5019

Playing: Aion

7/11/13 9:26:40 PM#70
Guild Wars 2's combat was too basic and simple. I could kill anything with my thief by just circling a mob while attacking and if I was using dual pistals it was like I had god mode enabled. TERA's combat would have been great if you were not rooted and if it did not have a aim cursor on screen. I like aiming but more like how Wild Star is doing it. The FPS stuff is just not for me. Waiting to try Blade and Souls combat system next because it looks better then anything I have seen. One thing for sure is that I cant do stand still tab target anymore. Final Fantasy XIV Reborn has shown me that.

  Arcticnoon

Novice Member

Joined: 4/20/13
Posts: 146

7/11/13 9:32:57 PM#71
Originally posted by Randayn

First, rolling and casting while in movement is also possible in TSW.  I also think TSW implements the roll mechanic  alot better than GW2.

also, Im sick and tired of action combat in MMORPG's.  Call the games MMOAG's or something.  I've been playing the FFXIV beta and the game is amazingly good.  The combat has an old school flair to it that I've missed over the years.

I have to agree with you. Personally I feel the main reason a lot of new gamers are trending towards action style combat mmos is because these new games don't know the first thing about strategy. MMOs are suppose to be about numbers and coming up with builds and ideas that can turn the game into something special for you.

FFXI is a great example of this. The game designers intended Ninja to be a DD, but players quickly figured out the job could tank and solo things other jobs never dreamed of. Once players figured how to just spam low cool down hits with axes as Rangers and then destroy mobs with close ranged weapon skills using their bows or guns the game devs had to nerf and change it. Same with Samurai, players implemented Thief as sub job, and with Sneak/Trick attack, and self weapon skills the damage was so insane that no one wanted any other DD other than Sam. Once again devs nerfed.

But my hands down favorite was when players figured out how amazing Dark Knight was with Ninja sub dual wielding a Kraken Club and a high damage one handed sword versus the intended Great Sword or Scythe. It was the highest damage ever.

This is what MMOs should be about. Testing, tweaking and discovering new possibilities.

Not rolling around like a monkey and dodging mob attacks. But these new gamers wouldn't know anything about this because the Devs have taken all the numbers out of mmo gaming for these mindless new gamers.

At least they have carpal tunnel to look forward to.

  donjuanagain

Novice Member

Joined: 3/16/11
Posts: 140

7/11/13 9:33:45 PM#72

The only thing I found about GW2 was it sucked...........

 

my balls.

  Volkon

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3824

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

7/11/13 9:58:26 PM#73
Originally posted by donjuanagain

The only thing I found about GW2 was it sucked...........

 

my balls.

 

Takes a special combat system to target something that small.

Oderint, dum metuant.

  craftseeker

Elite Member

Joined: 4/11/09
Posts: 822

7/11/13 10:01:08 PM#74
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by donjuanagain

The only thing I found about GW2 was it sucked...........

my balls.

Takes a special combat system to target something that small.

... but with a tab-target system you could target the left one or the right one.  Thus demonstrating the superiority of tab-targeting over other systems.

  Wizardry

Elite Member

Joined: 8/27/04
Posts: 8132

Perhaps tomorrow will be better.

7/11/13 10:12:07 PM#75

Auto miss function just because you did a somersault?Auto buff just because you did a somersault?

The guys who created dodging the Unreal team would not be happy seeing how silly GW2 made the ability.

When playing UT dodging is effective as a surprise tactic,not really going to pull off any surprises in a game where everyone is standing in the open on level ground.Also in Unreal it gave you the ability to dodge aimed attacks,to dodge behind cover.There is going to be no actual dodging for cover in GW2.Then we see the mage can spam non stop auto fire attacks from the staff,like they are some sort of minigun flame attack,so dodge one of those and 20 more coming right behind it..A-net just did so many silly things that they put no thought into weather it made sense.

To really make the somersault silly,they thought it would be realistic if they added different buffs to it.I could understand if they were trying to streamline key button management by having duo abilities to one action but i am pretty sure this was not the reason.

Also why would i miss you just because you did a somersault?Playing Unreal you could dodge all you want but i could still hit you if i could predict the 500 unit dodge or as in GW2 300 units.

IMO Unreal designed the dodge move and did it perfectly.Someone tried to incorporate that matrix mod  somersault into Unreal and it was a joke,not many liked it and eventually nobody was using it.

Here is a perfect example,if i was concentrating on doing a somersault to avoid an attack,how does it make sense that i was able to get off some buff that heals all allies ?It makes zero sense,just a silly idea.

 

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  rojoArcueid

Elite Member

Joined: 8/13/09
Posts: 6563

"It is double pleasure to deceive the deceiver". - Niccolo Machiavelli

7/11/13 10:20:05 PM#76
Originally posted by QSatu
Originally posted by grenseal
Try Tera Online - it will ruin gw2 combat for u :)

it depends. After gW2 I hated the constant rooting of my character to use a skill.

yeah and the dodging in Tera is limited to archers and slayers and its only one skill with cooldown. Only warriors have a decent dodge based on stamina but i play magicians so its still a no no. EDIT: mage has the same stepback as archers but tahts not even a dodging.

  ropenice

Novice Member

Joined: 10/02/04
Posts: 594

7/11/13 10:32:47 PM#77
Originally posted by marcuslm

While I think GW2 is a great game, it certainly does have its weaknesses. I think combat could definitely use some improvement. One thing that bothers me is how floaty and light  it feels. Maybe floaty is the wrong word to use but it seems like nothing is really solid or has weight. When I swing and hit, I wish it was more visceral, like I actually connected with something solid. I personally think Neverwinter gets that right. When you have your shield up and a monster throws a couple of quick strong swings, it looks and sounds like they are banging on a solid piece of metal. Maybe my issue has more to do with animation and sound, than the actual mechanics. I don't know.

I certainly do prefer more class-appropriate damage avoiding mechanics. I mean rolls and stuff make sense for a thief, blocks and parrys make more sense for a fighter type classs, for mages I kind of like a teleport type mechanic.

I'm no game designer. It's hard to explain exactly what I like. I just know it when I experience it. Like how does the combat FEEL.

I'm rambling.

Ramble on, brother. You're making some good points. I think sound and animations in combat get over looked on how they make combat feel.

  RizelStar

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Joined: 8/12/11
Posts: 2837

We all breathe and we all die.

7/11/13 10:36:05 PM#78
Originally posted by craftseeker
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by donjuanagain

The only thing I found about GW2 was it sucked...........

my balls.

Takes a special combat system to target something that small.

... but with a tab-target system you could target the left one or the right one.  Thus demonstrating the superiority of tab-targeting over other systems.

lol you just helped Volkon's point even more, or was that what you where trying to do?

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  loulaki

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Joined: 12/20/11
Posts: 916

7/12/13 1:47:12 AM#79
Originally posted by QSatu
Originally posted by grenseal
Try Tera Online - it will ruin gw2 combat for u :)

it depends. After gW2 I hated the constant rooting of my character to use a skill.

yeah here the story ends, for me too, TERA looks much more slower than Gw2 for me ... i tried it many times (i have a friend playing it, but i cant ... )

  loulaki

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Joined: 12/20/11
Posts: 916

7/12/13 1:50:46 AM#80
Originally posted by Wizardry

Auto miss function just because you did a somersault?Auto buff just because you did a somersault?

The guys who created dodging the Unreal team would not be happy seeing how silly GW2 made the ability.

When playing UT dodging is effective as a surprise tactic,not really going to pull off any surprises in a game where everyone is standing in the open on level ground.Also in Unreal it gave you the ability to dodge aimed attacks,to dodge behind cover.There is going to be no actual dodging for cover in GW2.Then we see the mage can spam non stop auto fire attacks from the staff,like they are some sort of minigun flame attack,so dodge one of those and 20 more coming right behind it..A-net just did so many silly things that they put no thought into weather it made sense.

To really make the somersault silly,they thought it would be realistic if they added different buffs to it.I could understand if they were trying to streamline key button management by having duo abilities to one action but i am pretty sure this was not the reason.

Also why would i miss you just because you did a somersault?Playing Unreal you could dodge all you want but i could still hit you if i could predict the 500 unit dodge or as in GW2 300 units.

IMO Unreal designed the dodge move and did it perfectly.Someone tried to incorporate that matrix mod  somersault into Unreal and it was a joke,not many liked it and eventually nobody was using it.

Here is a perfect example,if i was concentrating on doing a somersault to avoid an attack,how does it make sense that i was able to get off some buff that heals all allies ?It makes zero sense,just a silly idea.

 

well, i agree in Unreal T the developers done great work, but from your post it seems you doint know to dodge in GW2 :p

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