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Age of Wushu

Age of Wushu 

General Discussion  » AoW: A Great Example of Why Sandbox Titles Don't Work in the West

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236 posts found
  bcbully

Elite Member

Joined: 3/03/12
Posts: 6970

6/08/13 10:20:16 AM#181
Originally posted by Dahkoht
BCBully you spent most of last spring and summer evangelizing TSW as if it was the second coming of Christ and the best mmo ever made and some magical skill formula that made it the only mmo ever worth playing again.

Repeatedly.


How'd that work out ?

You are now doing the exact same thing for AoW , and I predict around this time next year it will be another game.

It's fine to like a game and enjoy it , but here again it seems like you can see no wrong in a game and have to spin everything possible positive about it.

AoW had its flaws , its translated like shit , one of the worst UI's I've ever seen , and expiring items bought for real money ( mounts ) might be the most greedy cash grab I've ever seen.
Customer support is shit compared to someone like CCP or Trion so I don't care if its been out in China for 10 years , the US support is shit pure and simple compared to most other mmo's.

It's got it's niche and that's great , but its not this wonderful all being greatest mmo ever you try and push it out as in every post.

Didn't you learn anything from your months of evangelizing TSW?

I played for 4 month. I loved it. So do many others judging by it being the highest rated released game on this site.

 

The pvp was sorely lacking for me though. I'm a pvpr, and TSW just couldn't get it right.

 

I've played AoW for 7 months now. I've played a insane amount of hours, and can see another 6 months of just pure progression infront of me, without expansions. 

 

AoW took the idea a freeform skill system much father than TSW(TSW did better than all the rest except EVE), and put it all into a FFA pvp world with nearly no rules.

 

If I find something better, I will gush over that too. 7 months later though, there is still no competition except for EVE in shear number of systems and things to do.

  Rinna

Novice Member

Joined: 9/25/04
Posts: 386

6/08/13 10:21:13 AM#182

I like the sandbox aspect of AoW but there was a lot still broken or not yet implemented in the game when I played.  I didn't mind paying so that I could have my online shop up for 4 hours but why give me 20 items to farm but only 2 viable items to create that sell with those viable items.

I liked the different professions and the ability to craft in an open world.  I liked the graphics and the huge vast world and travel options.  I didn't like the open world pvp and I didn't like that it was almost mandatory for you to participate in some pvp, whether it be school spy missions or defending your scrolls in order to progress at a normal rate.

I might have given the game a fair shot at release if it wasn't so pvp oriented.  I want less pvp on my sandbox sammich please.  I agree it has nothing to do with sandbox games working in the West.

No bitchers.

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 11834

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, ESO, and Combat Arms

6/08/13 10:25:24 AM#183
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Kleptobrainiac

I would have totally played this game if wasn't a FTP game.

Mounts & storage on an expiration timer? No thanks.

FTP model killed this game if you ask me.

More misinformation. It's not your fualt. 

Your inventory does not expire. Once you upgrade you bank, it stays forever. You bags due ware out after 30 days. It keeps the crafters in business, and it just makes sense.

Horses, sure you can complain about this if you want. Just know it's as easy as going to an Auction House and buying one.

Am I missing something, or did you just explain how he was correct, right after telling him he was wrong?

  bcbully

Elite Member

Joined: 3/03/12
Posts: 6970

6/08/13 10:45:22 AM#184
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Kleptobrainiac

I would have totally played this game if wasn't a FTP game.

Mounts & storage on an expiration timer? No thanks.

FTP model killed this game if you ask me.

More misinformation. It's not your fualt. 

Your inventory does not expire. Once you upgrade you bank, it stays forever. You bags due ware out after 30 days. It keeps the crafters in business, and it just makes sense.

Horses, sure you can complain about this if you want. Just know it's as easy as going to an Auction House and buying one.

Am I missing something, or did you just explain how he was correct, right after telling him he was wrong?

semantics I guess. 

 

Up until AoW when someone said storage, like in swtor, neverwinter, gw2, tsw, these systems make you unlock your inventory with cash. That would be real stupid if it then left in 30days. The poster would be wrong in this sense, like others have been.

 

AoW you unlock you bank space. it stays forever. You bag space is already unlocked in AoW no need to spend cash on it. You buy bags that deteriorate from players to put into you personal inventory slots, all part of the player driven economy. You bank needs no bags.

 

Horses get tired I guess, so every 30 days, I go to the market and buy a new one with in game silver. 

 

I wanted to make sure everyone was on the same page. I assumed the poster wasn't since he listed this as a reason not to play. 

  superguitardude

Novice Member

Joined: 6/03/13
Posts: 30

6/08/13 4:18:32 PM#185
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by superguitardude
I have two characters: A Tangmen and a Scholar. I stopped playing Age of Wushu because I have so many other games to play at the moment.  I'm put off by constantly playing in 220-300ms. I'll just wait for Age of Wulin to come out in Europe. Hopefully they will fix the translation issues, gold bots and add an ingame explanation for meridians and what they actually do. I'm not interested in trying to understand this stuff on some wiki, out there.

http://www.ign.com/wikis/age-of-wushu/Meridian_System

just in case they never make a in game guide. Here is the meridian system explained. 

 

Remember guys, if you want something new, you may have to take time to learn when you get it.

I added that last line specifically for this occasion. I wanted to express my contempt for reading some online guide instead of learning through trial and error in game. The least they could do is make a description of each school that actually explains what it does. I read a bit of the wiki on this subject, but I'd rather learn from the MMO itself. Why is it so difficult to just explain the basics INGAME, like most of the other MMOs?

  redcapp

Novice Member

Joined: 5/13/11
Posts: 733

6/08/13 4:22:47 PM#186
Disagree.  This game won't be big in the west, but it's not because it is so called sandbox.
  Karahandras

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/11/08
Posts: 1653

All it takes for evil to succeed is for the good to stand by and do nothing

6/08/13 4:25:39 PM#187
Originally posted by Ujirik
Age of Wushu isn't an example of anything except its own shortcomings.  This topic is just silly and would be like creating a thread about Dragon's Prophet being proof that Fantasy games are dead in the west.  I guess you could say that games are kind of like towers.  You can continue building higher and higher, but what do you do if the foundation is flawed?  A big budget won't change bad concepts and mechanics.

  geoxer2222

Novice Member

Joined: 9/06/08
Posts: 38

6/09/13 3:00:36 AM#188
I have max level scholar and a great guild on black tortoise, i am loving the game. So yeah. having a good set of people to play & talk with can make or break the game. so don't be a solo loner.
  Scalpless

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/22/07
Posts: 1259

6/09/13 3:41:15 AM#189

I'll just repeat this:

AoW isn't very popular because it's a PvP MMORPG. Its PvE is awful.

AoW's tutorial turns people away from the game and no, that's not because of instant gratification or casuals or some other mmorpg.com buzzword. It's because the tutorial sucks. EVE is more complex than AoW, but its tutorial is quite fun, draws you in and explains the game well enough. I suppose EVE is a casual game for the instant gratification crowd, then.

Basically, AoW is a great example of how a decent game can have huge flaws that prevent it from being successful.

  emperorwings

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/25/06
Posts: 1307

6/09/13 3:54:54 AM#190
Lets introduce Trammel.

This isn't a signature, you just think it is.

  aesperus

Elite Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 4575

6/09/13 4:05:31 AM#191
Originally posted by Scalpless

I'll just repeat this:

AoW isn't very popular because it's a PvP MMORPG. Its PvE is awful.

AoW's tutorial turns people away from the game and no, that's not because of instant gratification or casuals or some other mmorpg.com buzzword. It's because the tutorial sucks. EVE is more complex than AoW, but its tutorial is quite fun, draws you in and explains the game well enough. I suppose EVE is a casual game for the instant gratification crowd, then.

Basically, AoW is a great example of how a decent game can have huge flaws that prevent it from being successful.

This ^

Game's got some fun components, but it's clunky & has quite a few problems / things that turn players away from it. The learning curve on understanding the basic game mechanics doesn't help either.

It's not just the PvE that has issues either. While the PvP can be enjoying at times, it has some mechanics that kinda cheapen the whole experience / make it less of a sandbox.

  shinkan

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/05/07
Posts: 220

6/09/13 4:07:02 AM#192


Originally posted by dar_es_balat
Age of Wushu is not a sandbox.

Just because some site tells you its a sandbox does not mean that it is.   So what if you can learn skills from different classes?   You have to essentially play *as that class* in order to use those skills, if even for a few moments.    When you use a skill from a different class tree in combat you are locked out of all similar skills from different classes for a length of time so great that should you try any maneuver like that in PvP youd basically be dead before your next attack.

Age of Wushu is a theme park MMORPG with 30 day limits on most items procured through the cash shop in the game.  Even the bag extensions have time limits.

You want to know why it doesnt work in the west?

Because westerners dont want to pay their hard earned money for limited time crap.  They dont want to rent their outfit.  Theyd rather pay more and own it.

As for your initial point, that Sandbox games dont work in the west.... uh....

Ultima Online was created in the west.

Darkfall was too.

EvE, yep, its a western title.

Asheron's Call... made in Boston!

Entropia Universe: Stockholm, baby!

I'll stop now.


second that

  Dihoru

Elite Member

Joined: 1/11/06
Posts: 2619

6/09/13 4:07:41 AM#193
AoW: A Great example of why people don't even know what a sandbox game is. This game is open world, it'll be a sandbox when they rip out the pay to win aspects of the game and give players territories to conquer as part of their own independent groups of dubious alignment, build those territories up, allow for wars to be fought on massive scales across many different player owned, controlled and built regions and allow for a much greater degree of player character customization than currently possible (strip out the idea of schools or allow people to abandon them and train themselves in whatever mish-match of skills they desire, possibly have a skill limit to reign this in somehow). After this is done look at crafting and make it so that crafters can create their own unique items (allow them to swap out model bits and pieces for a unique visual look to their products in addition to everything else that would make a crafter wet themselves just thinking of it). Then after both those systems are done and you throw some bones to the PVE crowd (possibly via exploring public instances and stuff like that) you can call this game a sandbox MMO title.

  Vindicar

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/13
Posts: 137

Dun Mock meh engliesh !

6/09/13 4:50:24 AM#194

Big fan of AoW here.

Definitly not a sandbox but ofc pretty close to being one.

 

Politics betwin schools and guilds is there and is pretty awesome, but that's the only sandbox element (+ the open world ofc and player-made economy ofc) I can think of...

Guild's castles are cool but pre-built and all looking the same. What should have been a great sandbox element is just fluff.

 

Old school french hardcore whiner. Online since T4C.

I was "Namless" and "Daroot" in AO (Rk2)
Recently known as "Vindicar" (Aion (EU), SWTOR (EU), WoW (EU).
Actually Known as "Wundicar" in Age of Wushu (US)

  terroni

Novice Member

Joined: 4/03/10
Posts: 941

6/09/13 7:38:56 AM#195

I think the game has a lot of issues, and whether it is a sandbox or not, I don't think it's a deciding factor. Are people so desperate for a sandbox they will play bad ones?

I think the success of multiplayer games like Minecraft prove people like sandboxes. I think the lack of success of this game proves people don't like poorly made games.

 

Drop the next-gen marketing and people will argue if the game itself has merit.

  Slampig

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/29/03
Posts: 2378

Whatever you do, do NOT speak ill of Asheron's Call 2...

6/09/13 7:41:10 AM#196
Originally posted by fat_taddler

I just started playing AoW and absolutely love the game so far.   For the first time since the launch of SWG back in 2003,  I have "that feeling" of immersion and wonder that I've been missing for all of these years.  

 

What I also realized during my initial few hours in the game and from reading many forum posts, is that most of the current crop of MMO players have not and probably will not make it through the tutorial aspects of this game.   

 

This is a real shame because there is a ton of potential in this game but it seems that most will never get to see it because the tutorial is "boring." 

 

We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title.   Why not?   If you are so desperately seeking a sandbox experience, here's a great title to try.   The best part is that it's free, you just need to invest some time and patience to learn the game. 

 

Unfortunately,  I think a lot of players enjoy the idea of a sandbox style game but so far it seems that most can't or won't even play one. 

 

 

So, if sandbox games dropped tutorials then they would become huge hits in the west? What!?

That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!

  strangiato2112

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 9/21/12
Posts: 1566

6/09/13 8:34:07 AM#197
Originally posted by Scalpless

I'll just repeat this:

AoW isn't very popular because it's a PvP MMORPG. Its PvE is awful.

 

and because its an eastern game.

 

The thread title should read AoW: A Great example of why eastern titles dont work in the west.

 

  stragen001

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/09/09
Posts: 1736

Mr Flibble is VERY cross

6/09/13 8:45:14 AM#198
Originally posted by TalulaRose

Let you in on a secret......its up to the players to make the game engaging in a sandbox.

True to some extent, but it is far more important for the developers to give the players the tools that they need to make the game engaging. AOW doesnt. 

Also, AOW is not a sandbox, it is a themepark without direction. Just because there arent quests telling you exactly where to go all the time, doesnt make a game a sandbox. 

Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom

  Muke

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/04/07
Posts: 1529

6/09/13 8:49:39 AM#199
Originally posted by fat_taddler

I just started playing AoW and absolutely love the game so far.   For the first time since the launch of SWG back in 2003,  I have "that feeling" of immersion and wonder that I've been missing for all of these years.  

 

What I also realized during my initial few hours in the game and from reading many forum posts, is that most of the current crop of MMO players have not and probably will not make it through the tutorial aspects of this game.   

 

This is a real shame because there is a ton of potential in this game but it seems that most will never get to see it because the tutorial is "boring." 

 

We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title.   Why not?   If you are so desperately seeking a sandbox experience, here's a great title to try.   The best part is that it's free, you just need to invest some time and patience to learn the game. 

 

Unfortunately,  I think a lot of players enjoy the idea of a sandbox style game but so far it seems that most can't or won't even play one. 

 

 

Don't project the -possible- failure of 1 sandbox (is this one?) over all others please, there are sandboxes out there that do work and are growing.

"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

  thetimes

Novice Member

Joined: 10/27/12
Posts: 49

6/09/13 9:49:57 AM#200
The only game that was not made like WoW. You want would pvp ok. You want guild wars ok. You what a game that takes a long time. You guys don't want that. You say you do. You want themepark.
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