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Elder Scrolls Online

Elder Scrolls Online 

General Discussion  » No World PvP? No Thanks...

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167 posts found
  Ladrann27

Novice Member

Joined: 5/18/13
Posts: 43

5/23/13 5:03:20 PM#121
Originally posted by Kuro1n
Originally posted by Ladrann27

A lot of people seem to think that having large scale fights is a good thing. What happened to only small skirmishes? I had some of my best moments in small scale group fights where actual skill is involved, not in the zerg of 200vs200, that is just a mess and there is almost never any organization in it.

Look at GW2 for example, the battles in there are just large zergs running around the map chasing each other, in all respects that is not something I would call good PvP. These battles should happen I agree, but not continuously . DAoC definetly had fun PvP but it was nothing more then that, you had the other factions and they were built in to be your enemy. By this I mean that it was hard coded that these players where your enemy and your faction allies.

To me it would make for a far more appealing, immersive and fun experience if there was OWPvP, where clans would form their alliances (for example as in Lineage 2) and would even be able to build castles / strongholds. People would take care of the politics in and out of game themselves and incentives to fight would be land and resource control and clan/alliance pride.

You have griefers running around killing your lower level allies or just low level players in general? Why let the game developer hard code something to stop this? In a system I just described you could take matters in your own hands and take them down. Want to take it a step further? Declare war on their alliance and capture or destroy their castle. They will think twice before griefing again.

In a MMORPG like this you will make many friends (much stronger sense of community) and you will also make enemies which you would be proud of if you defeat them. Instead of just farming zergs for that next piece of gear.

A system like this would open any game up for so many possibilities and instantly creates a very immersive endgame experience.

I am baffled that people would prefer a capture the flag type battleground grind for gear or a zerg vs zerg never ending battle over a system I just described. But to each their own I guess.

large fight and skill depends very much on the game. GW2 was completely void of skill while L2 you could massively slaughter the enemy by having better organization and a clan that did what they were supposed to. Moved together and placed itself in strategic areas.

 

I do agree with you that large fights can also be very skill full, but that is mostly when they are organized, something which is lacking entirely in most games these days. I loved Lineage 2 PvP, because it was some form of a system which I described, although not entirely the same.

To the people using DAoC as an example. yes I have played DAoC aswell (old and new frontiers) and there was definetly some fun PvP to be had, still not as meaningful as PvP I described a few posts up. The PvP in DAoC was a lot of getting a high RR and just fighting for the sake of fighting because you had your faction and the two enemy factions.

I also do not agree that the zerg in DAoC really required a lot of skill, you say this zerg is something only in games as GW2 but it surely was not, the same kind of zerging also took place in DAoC. The group fights 8vs8 were pretty awesome with a lot of skill involved and having a few of these groups enter the zerg taking control could make a difference in how the fight ended.

Still frontiers was just a playground and you did not really care what happened to your keeps or relics. Why do we all hold on to a system like this when we could have a system where players would make the rules who they fight and are allied with?

  nethervoid

Novice Member

Joined: 5/01/05
Posts: 531

5/29/13 7:22:07 PM#122
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by ezduzit

I have to agree. PVP zones or arena have no place in a future MMO. It's part of the same old crap that is proven ineffective to the pvp community.

 

The DAoC model used in ESO for PvP is one well loved and reminisced by many hard core PvP fan. Myself included. They could not have picked a better PvP model IMO. Open world PvP everywhere mostly leads to two things. Players picking on low level chars and camping quest hubs. Or PvP groups spread out so thin you dont get much PvP action. All PvP focused on one big map means more large scale battles and removes the griefers. 

DAoC is not hardcore pvp. Darkfall is hardcore pvp. Faction based PvP is pretty boring IMO. If there's no risk what's the point?

WoW has had pvp zones. Was a pretty sucky concept TBH.

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  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

5/29/13 7:45:50 PM#123
Wow had pretend pvp zones that were basicly battlegrounds in disguise.

Wintergrasp isn't rvr. It's on a bloody timer for a start.
  Kuro1n

Novice Member

Joined: 1/03/07
Posts: 778

5/29/13 10:52:29 PM#124
I am very happy to see that some people actually do understand what hardcore PVP is. Faction PVP, made up rules, invisible walls, equal terms... all those things are casual things, real pvp happens when there are no rules and politics has impact, when alliances are forged and broken before during and after combat.
  Torkaz

Novice Member

Joined: 8/09/09
Posts: 91

5/29/13 10:55:17 PM#125
Elder Scrolls was never a pvp game, dont see why it should be now. PVE FTW.
  Avanah

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/18/04
Posts: 901

5/29/13 10:59:20 PM#126
Originally posted by Dauzqul

So ESO stated that their PvP will be [mod edit]., dedicated PvP area.

 

I'm done with the sass. No thanks.

 

This game seems to be more like a medieval SWTOR, anyways.

OMG I was so worried you didn't let us all know! I'll sleep well now with the knowledge I have that you will not play this game.

 

...but seriously...

 

Enjoy whatever you DO decide to play. :-)

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  User Deleted
5/29/13 11:49:45 PM#127

Not sure why you would play this or any themepark for its pvp.

A game like this I will play for the pve experience.  If I want pvp I go to a game where pvp has risk and more skill involved than parsing the highest dps skill rotation then macroing it.

 

not sure why you people still think themepark battlegrounds wWvWVw or whatever and arenas is good pvp.  die, respawn, hop back in, no loss no risk...oh but "yay I got to the top of the end of match stats im so good at pvp"...

 

I dunno, I find softcore pvp boring and more repetitive than farming boars to endgame.  Who ever stated that pvp balance always messes up pve is right too...another hated side effect of catering to the vocal softcore pvpers.

 

I dunno I wish these types of games stuck to what they do best, deliver a linear storyline and pve experience.  Just do it well and make it complex and appear less linear than it really is...and with that I hope ESO delivers in this aspect.

PVP? could care less many games out there do pvp far better than any themepark...and you typically don't have to deal with the mouthbreathers who just started mmorpgs being randomly matched on your team and having to pvp with zero teamwork.

  Tinybina

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/28/04
Posts: 2126

5/30/13 7:15:38 AM#128
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by ezduzit

I have to agree. PVP zones or arena have no place in a future MMO. It's part of the same old crap that is proven ineffective to the pvp community.

 

The DAoC model used in ESO for PvP is one well loved and reminisced by many hard core PvP fan. Myself included. They could not have picked a better PvP model IMO. Open world PvP everywhere mostly leads to two things. Players picking on low level chars and camping quest hubs. Or PvP groups spread out so thin you dont get much PvP action. All PvP focused on one big map means more large scale battles and removes the griefers. 

 

 

Agreed.. Go play DC Universe Online to see what this man is talking about... As a level 6 villian just trying to level up and understand and learn the freaking game you will be ganked nonstop by level 30 heros in the starter zone.  I said Starter ZONE!

 

Now that's some Fun I tell you!

 

I'm sorry I am all for having world PVP, but new players need to be able to learn their characters and the game before they are forced to have to deal with PVP.    Being ganked by someone 20+ levels above you is not good gameplay, it's griefing and a main reason why games that allow that to happen fail to attract new players, have such a low population and eventually die.

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  DanitaKusor

Novice Member

Joined: 6/17/09
Posts: 550

5/30/13 7:21:53 AM#129

Open world pvp really caters to a niche market these days.  Don't get me wrong, I have really enjoyed world PvP over the years but it has reached the point it seems where most people who play MMOs don't care for it or just prefer more controlled, instanced PvP.

The Enlightened take things Lightly

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

5/30/13 7:37:32 AM#130
Brown
You can have good pvp in a themepark.

Planetside 2 is a themepark.

It's one of the best mmos for pvp you can play today, along with eve and dfuw.
  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

5/30/13 7:40:19 AM#131
Economy driven ffa pvp is the best pvp model for a sandbox

Rvr is the best model of pvp for a themepark. Real rvr, not gw2s extremely gamey take on it.

I share your boredom with instanced mini game Esports though. Thankfully TESO doesn't have minigames.
  SavageHorizon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/14/13
Posts: 1580

5/30/13 7:47:42 AM#132
Originally posted by BrownAle

Not sure why you would play this or any themepark for its pvp.

A game like this I will play for the pve experience.  If I want pvp I go to a game where pvp has risk and more skill involved than parsing the highest dps skill rotation then macroing it.

 

not sure why you people still think themepark battlegrounds wWvWVw or whatever and arenas is good pvp.  die, respawn, hop back in, no loss no risk...oh but "yay I got to the top of the end of match stats im so good at pvp"...

 

I dunno, I find softcore pvp boring and more repetitive than farming boars to endgame.  Who ever stated that pvp balance always messes up pve is right too...another hated side effect of catering to the vocal softcore pvpers.

 

I dunno I wish these types of games stuck to what they do best, deliver a linear storyline and pve experience.  Just do it well and make it complex and appear less linear than it really is...and with that I hope ESO delivers in this aspect.

PVP? could care less many games out there do pvp far better than any themepark...and you typically don't have to deal with the mouthbreathers who just started mmorpgs being randomly matched on your team and having to pvp with zero teamwork.

I agree, bragging rights, faction buffs and become emperor as long as you sahre your account is nothing to shout home about to be honest. You lose nothing and respawn and jump back in a never ending cycle of no risk fluffy pvp, oh wait Cyrodiil does also have PVE.

An battle ground with fluffy PVP, really and people in this thread are making out it's some sort of skill full hardcore PVP.

 

Not that it won't be fun for a while but let's not make out it's the best form of PVP.

 

I'll play the game for PVE not PVP.

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  User Deleted
5/30/13 7:48:30 AM#133
I'm playing Darkfall now and I'm getting plenty of open world pvp. I am really looking forward to trying out TESO for my other game. I'm looking forward to this game more than any other since Warhammer online back in 2008. I hope this doesn't turn out like that. I don't think it will. And I sincerely hope it's nothing like SWTOR. I really don't need the dead world and the loading screens, truth be told.
  Ice-Queen

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/02/08
Posts: 2444

"Always borrow money from a pessimist. They won't expect it back."

5/30/13 7:50:49 AM#134
Pvp like DAOC where the frontiers were huge was great.  GW2 "pvp area" is a terrible instanced zergfest. The phasing and instancing already has me worried enough to be cautious with the game and I will not buy it at release.

What happens when you log off your characters????.....
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  SavageHorizon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/14/13
Posts: 1580

5/30/13 7:52:58 AM#135
Originally posted by The1ceQueen
Pvp like DAOC where the frontiers were huge was great.  GW2 "pvp area" is a terrible instanced zergfest. The phasing and instancing already has me worried enough to be cautious with the game and I will not buy it at release.

And ESO has plenty of phasing and instancing.

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  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

5/30/13 7:53:15 AM#136
^ this, most of these people thinking ava is "less pvp" than say wow pvp servers are basing their experience on gw2, not the games that did it right - daoc & planetside.
  SavageHorizon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/14/13
Posts: 1580

5/30/13 7:57:49 AM#137
Originally posted by ShakyMo
^ this, most of these people thinking ava is "less pvp" than say wow pvp servers are basing their experience on gw2, not the games that did it right - daoc & planetside.

I've played DAOC, Planetside 1-2, hell i've been PVPing since UO so don't assume that everyone is basing their experience off GW2.

Fact is no matter if Matt is involved ESO is not DAOC, anyone thinking that it's going to be a carbon copy of DAOC is delusional.

And DAOC wasn't perfect either.

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  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

5/30/13 3:37:38 PM#138
Originally posted by SavageHorizon
Originally posted by ShakyMo
^ this, most of these people thinking ava is "less pvp" than say wow pvp servers are basing their experience on gw2, not the games that did it right - daoc & planetside.

I've played DAOC, Planetside 1-2, hell i've been PVPing since UO so don't assume that everyone is basing their experience off GW2.

Fact is no matter if Matt is involved ESO is not DAOC, anyone thinking that it's going to be a carbon copy of DAOC is delusional.

And DAOC wasn't perfect either.

I dont think it will be as good too

but i dont think it will be as gamey as GW2 either, but somewhere inbetween

I definitely think it will be vastly superior pvp wise to wow "pvp" servers

  asrlohz

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/29/11
Posts: 666

Alea iacta est, beloved Doomsayers.

5/30/13 3:43:20 PM#139
Originally posted by ShakyMo
Economy driven ffa pvp is the best pvp model for a sandbox

Rvr is the best model of pvp for a themepark. Real rvr, not gw2s extremely gamey take on it.

I share your boredom with instanced mini game Esports though. Thankfully TESO doesn't have minigames.

Depends on how you design the PvP. And RvR where you could set up your own strongholds in strategical placements to guard certain resources it could be considered sandbox.

 

It is hard to just claim that "this thing is the best for this scenario" when you are infact only taking a certain game's take on it into consideration.

  Dren_Utogi

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/21/10
Posts: 1477

5/30/13 3:45:19 PM#140

I agree. specifically if it isn't full loot.

when I log in atlvl one, I want to slay the other level one beside me. :)

reviews are !@#$ing stupid. Play what you love.

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