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News & Features Discussion  » [Column] General: Dead MMOs and Emotional Connections

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84 posts found
  tenyearsofmmorpgs

Novice Member

Joined: 3/22/13
Posts: 6

5/13/13 11:47:57 PM#81
Why try to be normal ...i like being an odd mmorpg guy...i wouldnt have it any other way.
  Livnthedream

Novice Member

Joined: 3/20/13
Posts: 582

I like this planet, YOU get off!

5/14/13 5:25:55 AM#82
Originally posted by Beatnik59

Sucks, don't it?  Perhaps you ought to shave, get out of the basement, and live a little instead of sitting around trolling what is, in the greater scheme of things, a real stupid thing to get worked up about.

Wait, why are you telling me to do what I have been telling you to do for pages?

This from the guy who wants me to go to "grief counseling" to accept the loss of my MMO?  Grief is for Fido.  Anger is for getting ripped off, and not making the same mistakes.  Besides, I'm sure your house isn't a "loved one" like your mother, but it doesn't mean you have to go "thank you sir, may I have another?" when the DEA busts it all up and says "sorry."

I would love for the DEA to come bust up my house, its in desperate need of renovating. Which is exactly why that was an extremely poor analogy.

I don't think it's all that unreasonable.  After all, they turned the video game from a commodity to a service in the first place.  The game itself can be commoditized.  The add ons can too, as seen in any PS3 store.  They can create a stand alone client, they can license--heck, even a contingency plan to keep the game up would be enough.

Yes, I hear playing boardgames with yourself is great deals of fun.

But the way things stand now, the service model this industry adopted is just too fragile.  I mean, you can reasonably estimate with a high degree of certainty what the above businesses (barber shop, grocery, restaurant) can gross, what their clientele consists of, etc.  They aren't so dependent on fickle things like fashion, public opinion or buzz to keep them afloat.  That's because the demographics and the needs are simple, "from mediocristan," if we were to quote Taleb.

MMORPG services, by contrast, are highly unpredictable by comparison.  They can last 30 years or 30 days, and there's really no way to tell what you've got until after you have it.  There are so many factors that may cause a service like this to be forced to shut down, some related to the revenue the game generates and others not.  In other words, there's no way for them to predict...let alone the end-user to predict...what the longevity of the purchases will be.

They don't need to turn these "services" into "tangible things," but if they want to remain services, they should at least work out a strategy by which they can become more robust.  A customer shouldn't be left guessing whether they'll enjoy their $50 purchase for 30 days or 30 years.

Bullshit. How many stores have Walmart pushed out of the market? How many mom and pop stores has Amazon? Services get replaced by other services, that is how a competitive market works. Its not fragile its a simple case of only the strong (in this case profitable) survive.

The only thing that CoH "clearly" showed is how fragile these games are.  Because the game was actually making more money than it cost to operate.  The problem was that NCSoft wanted to close down Paragon Studios in its restructuring scheme.  The customers were, sadly, collateral damage.

That was actually never shown. That is the conclusion that you die hards who threw a fit about it came to. What was shown was that profits were up from where they had been previously, but clearly not by enough to keep it around. It was also shown that such a trend was not holding. The actual operating cost of the studio was never disclosed, nor was it at how much of a loss it had been running at. Based on the statements given, even by Miller, they had been running at a loss for quite some time.

Of course "I" am not enough to keep one of these games going...and that's the problem.  Because I can only do what I can do.  I can't be held responsible for the publisher's quarterly profit targets, and yet when they aren't met, my purchases are taken from me.  Heck, even when I--and several other subscribers--pay our way, it might not be enough.  They might not like the profit we give them, and they might want to cut their losses.  Or we might be making them a nice sum, but they want to "change direction" and become something else.

In short, there are all of the same risks associated with this form of computer entertainment (hardware malfunction, etc), plus the risks of an entire production and publishing company that the consumer has to bear, including the fickle nature of MMO management.  And that's just a whole lot more fragile than, say, a single player game or a peer-to-peer multiplayer game.

Wait, you mean just like that store, and barbershop and....

What if I am making it personal?  I've been playing these games for about ten years now.  I'm not some person who hasn't looked at their model, didn't give this industry a chance, and wasn't willing to give it the benefit of the doubt.  I'm just sick of getting screwed.

Except you are not getting screwed. At all. You are renting a service, one which tells you a head of time that you are losing said service and even goes about compensating you. Not unlike a going out of business sale. This is the nature of life.

You're just mad that I'm not buying into the hype of these games anymore, and you are mad that I'm taking issue with your business model.  Maybe because you have a stake in this industry somehow, and someone like me is bad for business.

Yes, back to the Alex Jones like conspiracy theories. My only stake is that stupidity should not be allowed to flourish.

But I'm not here for the business.  I'm here for the people who feel regret, anger and sorrow when their games, online friends, characters and purchases get taken from them.

Yes, down with the man! You are owed for all the wrongs committed against you!

 

 

http://chroniclesofthenerds.com/nerdfight/

Y U NO FLIP TABLE?!?!?!

  Beatnik59

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/23/05
Posts: 2266

"Playing things I shouldn''t be playing since 1977."

5/14/13 6:13:59 PM#83
Originally posted by Livnthedream

Wait, why are you telling me to do what I have been telling you to do for pages?

Because you're the one who needs the advice.  Seems you have a lot of experience in that too.

I would love for the DEA to come bust up my house, its in desperate need of renovating. Which is exactly why that was an extremely poor analogy.

 

It explains a lot of why you like MMOs so much.  Me, I take care of my stuff.

 

Yes, I hear playing boardgames with yourself is great deals of fun.

Spoken from experience?  No, I'd rather play them with other people.  Plus they're cheap.  When you upgrade them, they're yours.  And you don't get them yanked out from under you because Milton Bradley ain't making enough of a cut.

Bullshit. How many stores have Walmart pushed out of the market? How many mom and pop stores has Amazon? Services get replaced by other services, that is how a competitive market works. Its not fragile its a simple case of only the strong (in this case profitable) survive.

 Funny, but the cancelations in this business seem to come from the strong and profitable mega-publishers (EA, NCSoft, SOE, Zynga)  just as much--if not moreso--than from small publishers.  Strength and profitability is no guarantee we'll keep our purchases.  In fact, it could have the opposite effect.  If they are big, they can screw over thousands of customers and just shrug it off as a cost of doing business.

That was actually never shown. That is the conclusion that you die hards who threw a fit about it came to. What was shown was that profits were up from where they had been previously, but clearly not by enough to keep it around. It was also shown that such a trend was not holding. The actual operating cost of the studio was never disclosed, nor was it at how much of a loss it had been running at. Based on the statements given, even by Miller, they had been running at a loss for quite some time.

I'm sure they had their reasons.  Nevertheless, if it was important enough to them to let me keep my game, they could have found a way.  We were, after all, netting a profit.  Whether it was "enough" or not is, frankly, out of my control.  I was, in the greater scheme, not so important to them.  Fine.  That's this business model.

It doesn't mean I have to buy into this business model going forward.  What this industry is trying to sell me is, after due consideration, too expensive and too risky for the return I've been getting.

Wait, you mean just like that store, and barbershop and....

If you want to take it there, sure.  On the day I need a haircut, if the barber is there, I go get my haircut.  Once I get my haircut, I don't need him anymore.  Or if I need a hammer, I can go to the hardware store and buy a hammer.  Once I buy the hammer, I don't need him anymore.  Or if I want dinner, I go to the restaurant.  Once I buy the dinner, I pay and leave.

But if I buy a haircut, my hair doesn't get thrown back on my scalp once the barber determines he's "not profitable enough."  And when I bought a hammer at the hardware store, my hammer doesn't disappear when the hardware store goes in a "new direction."  And when I'm seated at a restaurant, my meal doesn't get taken away from me because the manager decides, on a whim, that he wants to cater to a new clientele.

I don't want to be continually dependent on a publishing company and production house to enjoy the things I buy from them.  I don't have that in other games, so why not go to those other games?

Except you are not getting screwed. At all. You are renting a service, one which tells you a head of time that you are losing said service and even goes about compensating you. Not unlike a going out of business sale. This is the nature of life.

 It really doesn't matter whether you think I'm getting screwed, or the publishing houses think I'm getting screwed.  All that matters is if I believe I'm getting screwed.  That's the nature of life, friend.  Welcome to business.  Welcome to consumer preferences.

And I think I deserve better than what this industry passes off as acceptable.  Do they have to respect that?  No, but at the same time, I don't have to accept whatever deal they are pushing either.

But I'm done with this tired model they are offering now, because it isn't working well for me.  It's good for them, but it sucks for me, so I'm holding out for a newer and better way to deliver games like these.

Yes, back to the Alex Jones like conspiracy theories. My only stake is that stupidity should not be allowed to flourish.

And how successful have you been at not allowing this "stupidity" to flourish, other than rehash the same tired spiel we always hear whenever a game closes down?

Because games don't have to "die" like natural things do.  We just haven't figured out how to keep them up yet.

Yes, down with the man! You are owed for all the wrongs committed against you!

Maybe or maybe not.  But the one thing I can say is that nobody is going to look out for me but me, when it comes to this kind of stuff.  So since I don't like to have my stuff disappear on the whim of a publisher, I'm looking out for #1...the publishers certainly do.

__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken

"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.

"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE

  misternil

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/02/07
Posts: 4

5/20/13 5:28:15 PM#84
The death of CoH /CoV was not necessary. The game was still profitable by all reports and had a solid subscriber base even though it was f2p. It had great storylines and each issue / update was well done. Sad to see it go...

'Tis better to be unarmed or disarmed than DE-ARMED

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