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Neverwinter

Neverwinter 

General Discussion  » Proof the game isn't P2W!

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48 posts found
  DeniZg

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/29/12
Posts: 508

5/09/13 7:03:15 AM#21
Originally posted by Manolios
Originally posted by pacov
How much do they pay you to post these things? But seriously the game is P2W no matter if you can do well or not in pvp. If players have a huge advantage by using money I consider it P2W.

 

agree 100%

Ok, let's compare NWO with some other popular games for example.

GW2. We roll characters at the same time, however, I will use real money converted to in-game gold to do the following: Craft my way to 80 in 24 hours with mats bought from Trade post, put on my exotic crafted armor (or rare Cultural armor) and buy Siege weapons blueprints. Let's meet in WvWvW after these 24 hours. Who will win, I wonder?

WoW. We both have fresh max level characters, However, I have bought in Blizzard store 10 Guardian cubs for 100$ total and traded them for in-game gold. I use this gold to buy epic crafted armor set and meet in you in PVP. Who will win, I wonder?

 

  Karelia

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/21/12
Posts: 688

5/09/13 7:09:31 AM#22
Originally posted by DeniZg
Originally posted by Manolios
Originally posted by pacov
How much do they pay you to post these things? But seriously the game is P2W no matter if you can do well or not in pvp. If players have a huge advantage by using money I consider it P2W.

 

agree 100%

Ok, let's compare NWO with some other popular games for example.

GW2. We roll characters at the same time, however, I will use real money converted to in-game gold to do the following: Craft my way to 80 in 24 hours with mats bought from Trade post, put on my exotic crafted armor (or rare Cultural armor) and buy Siege weapons blueprints. Let's meet in WvWvW after these 24 hours. Who will win, I wonder?

WoW. We both have fresh max level characters, However, I have bought in Blizzard store 10 Guardian cubs for 100$ total and traded them for in-game gold. I use this gold to buy epic crafted armor set and meet in you in PVP. Who will win, I wonder?

 

 

1. who said gw2 is not a p2w too? at least in some cases.

2. in wow you cant craft epic pvp gear. you just can buy it with conquest points, only available through pvp activities and ratings

  Vannor

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/11/03
Posts: 2995

5/09/13 7:16:16 AM#23
Originally posted by Manolios

2. in wow you cant craft epic pvp gear. you just can buy it with conquest points, only available through pvp activities and ratings

Since the latest PvP stat changes in WoW.. PvP armour isn't needed to be powerful in PvP.

  alkarionlog

Elite Member

Joined: 3/19/09
Posts: 1021

5/09/13 7:19:53 AM#24
Originally posted by Manolios
Originally posted by DeniZg
Originally posted by Manolios
Originally posted by pacov
How much do they pay you to post these things? But seriously the game is P2W no matter if you can do well or not in pvp. If players have a huge advantage by using money I consider it P2W.

 

agree 100%

Ok, let's compare NWO with some other popular games for example.

GW2. We roll characters at the same time, however, I will use real money converted to in-game gold to do the following: Craft my way to 80 in 24 hours with mats bought from Trade post, put on my exotic crafted armor (or rare Cultural armor) and buy Siege weapons blueprints. Let's meet in WvWvW after these 24 hours. Who will win, I wonder?

WoW. We both have fresh max level characters, However, I have bought in Blizzard store 10 Guardian cubs for 100$ total and traded them for in-game gold. I use this gold to buy epic crafted armor set and meet in you in PVP. Who will win, I wonder?

 

 

1. who said gw2 is not a p2w too? at least in some cases.

2. in wow you cant craft epic pvp gear. you just can buy it with conquest points, only available through pvp activities and ratings

 

care to explain where GW2 is P2W?

 

and OP if you have to prove if a game is not P2W, and need to search for proves of it, the game is P2W

FOR HONOR, FOR FREEDOM.... and for some money.

  Karelia

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/21/12
Posts: 688

5/09/13 7:20:09 AM#25
Originally posted by Vannor
Originally posted by Manolios

2. in wow you cant craft epic pvp gear. you just can buy it with conquest points, only available through pvp activities and ratings

Since the latest PvP stat changes in WoW.. PvP armour isn't needed to be powerful in PvP.

 

you mean when 5.3 arrives. you have a point there

but anyway you cant craft epic pvp gear

  User Deleted
5/09/13 7:32:02 AM#26
Originally posted by Agoden

I'd say the game is "pay to get ahead" rather then "pay to win" It's ridiculous how slow some things are to get unless you pay, and i don't think respecs are available in game without paying at all, which is insane.

It means that before ever even playing the game and making your first character, you're pretty much forced to theory craft the crap out of everything.

 

not to mention the Mounts in PvP, it costs millions of astral diamonds to upgrade your horse in game, where as anyone who pays gets it within seconds which may not be a big deal in the long run, but right now It's creating massive imbalances.

I'm playing the game, and i could use the cash shop, but i simply refuse to because i do not support It's business model.

Though the game is pretty enjoyable, i hope it fails, hard.. 

 

Cosmetic cash shops and maybe XP boosters or GTFO in my book.

Ffs, i just want subscriptions back.. Tired of getting half a game.

 

Its really not that slow to get fully geared. I already have half my level 60 enchantments without spending any money aside from the founders pack ($60). Would easily gear up fully in 1-2 months.

Can you get there quicker if you spend real cash? You sure can. But its F2P, thats how they make their money.

There is nothing you cant earn through actual gameplay. Making AD off the AH is actually very easy once you get to endgame.

The max speed horses? Its not really that big an issue in PvP unless you are just trying to constantly cap new points rather than defend. And if you are that invested in the game that you care about running at max speed, is $40 for unlocking all characters that big a deal? Thats only 2.5 months of another games subscription for a lifetime unlock.

I do agree about the respecs though. You can buy feat respecs with AD by the way, only powers require Zen to respec, but the cost is too high, It should start out low and build up higher the more you do it.

Most items are fairly reasonable in cost. $2.50 is a bargain for a character slot compared to other games. $2 for appearance change. Nothing really bank breaking. I have set myself a limit of $15 a month to spend on it, since that is what I would normally spend on a MMO. If I thought it was impossible to earn the rewards normally, I wouldnt still be playing at level 60 or thinking of spending any money on the game (Runes of Magic put me off for example).

  User Deleted
5/09/13 7:33:51 AM#27
Originally posted by alkarionlog
Originally posted by Manolios
Originally posted by DeniZg
Originally posted by Manolios
Originally posted by pacov
How much do they pay you to post these things? But seriously the game is P2W no matter if you can do well or not in pvp. If players have a huge advantage by using money I consider it P2W.

 

agree 100%

Ok, let's compare NWO with some other popular games for example.

GW2. We roll characters at the same time, however, I will use real money converted to in-game gold to do the following: Craft my way to 80 in 24 hours with mats bought from Trade post, put on my exotic crafted armor (or rare Cultural armor) and buy Siege weapons blueprints. Let's meet in WvWvW after these 24 hours. Who will win, I wonder?

WoW. We both have fresh max level characters, However, I have bought in Blizzard store 10 Guardian cubs for 100$ total and traded them for in-game gold. I use this gold to buy epic crafted armor set and meet in you in PVP. Who will win, I wonder?

 

 

1. who said gw2 is not a p2w too? at least in some cases.

2. in wow you cant craft epic pvp gear. you just can buy it with conquest points, only available through pvp activities and ratings

 

care to explain where GW2 is P2W?

 

and OP if you have to prove if a game is not P2W, and need to search for proves of it, the game is P2W

Its about the same level of P2W as Neverwinter. Convenience items that progress your character faster and appearance items.

  User Deleted
5/09/13 7:38:17 AM#28

People seem to be under the false illusion that other games do not let people with money progress faster, you guys do realise that in pretty much every MMO out there, there are people using real life cash to buy things instead of earning them. The only difference with F2P games is that the developer makes the money instead of farmers and powerlevelers.

When I played WoW for a while, every 5th group would have a new player who had purchased their character or gotten it off a friend. Some wearing full end game raid gear. In EQ2 I had a full hard mode raid geared Fury in my group who didnt know how to cure. Pretending that this game is P2W because you can progress faster is just silly. All MMOs have that.

The only thing that makes a game P2W is if you cant get the same power level through normal play. Which is not the case for Neverwinter.

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

5/09/13 7:41:06 AM#29

If pay 2 win means getting ahead faster than others by spending money than MANY games are pay to win

If pay to win means you can buy items from the CS that make you more powerfull than someone of equal level could obtain by not paying then its pay 2 win..

my view on pay 2 win goes to option #2

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  MadDemon64

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/19/08
Posts: 1071

Why is it that fantasy trolls are vulnerable to fire, but internet trolls thrive on flame wars?

5/09/13 9:07:55 AM#30
Originally posted by alkarionlog
Originally posted by Manolios
Originally posted by DeniZg
Originally posted by Manolios
Originally posted by pacov
How much do they pay you to post these things? But seriously the game is P2W no matter if you can do well or not in pvp. If players have a huge advantage by using money I consider it P2W.

 

agree 100%

Ok, let's compare NWO with some other popular games for example.

GW2. We roll characters at the same time, however, I will use real money converted to in-game gold to do the following: Craft my way to 80 in 24 hours with mats bought from Trade post, put on my exotic crafted armor (or rare Cultural armor) and buy Siege weapons blueprints. Let's meet in WvWvW after these 24 hours. Who will win, I wonder?

WoW. We both have fresh max level characters, However, I have bought in Blizzard store 10 Guardian cubs for 100$ total and traded them for in-game gold. I use this gold to buy epic crafted armor set and meet in you in PVP. Who will win, I wonder?

 

 

1. who said gw2 is not a p2w too? at least in some cases.

2. in wow you cant craft epic pvp gear. you just can buy it with conquest points, only available through pvp activities and ratings

 

care to explain where GW2 is P2W?

 

and OP if you have to prove if a game is not P2W, and need to search for proves of it, the game is P2W

I think the point is that GW2 isn't P2W, but people will always find a way to describe parts of any MMO where you can buy stuff with real money in a way that, to them, is the very definition of a P2W MMO.

Since when is Tuesday a direction?

  Newfr

Novice Member

Joined: 10/11/06
Posts: 126

5/09/13 9:38:20 AM#31
Originally posted by evilastro

People seem to be under the false illusion that other games do not let people with money progress faster, you guys do realise that in pretty much every MMO out there, there are people using real life cash to buy things instead of earning them.

Well, in this case point is that in some games it's legitimate (and sold to you by developers/publishers) and in some games it's a violation of EULA or some other rule. In later case that illegal activity can have some unpleasant consequences. As in RL there are corruption, drugs/weapons/younameit black market, slavery and etc. So you can get thing that you normally can't get or get thing a way faster or without any problems. Demand creates it's own supply.

 

  Wakygreek

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 4/30/08
Posts: 1244

Reason is a necessity

5/09/13 10:13:54 AM#32

I have still yet to see a single thread proving either side of this coin toss. I have an idea, play the game and see if you enjoy it. If you feel its P2W and find it is your job to warn everyone, then create a thread with valid reasons and proof.

So far all I see is blind hate because its either a PWE game or its P2W because its F2P. I don't like P2W games but lets face it, can anyone actually create a thread with valid information instead of basing everything on assumptions?

 

  Gravarg

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 8/24/06
Posts: 3094

5/09/13 10:16:01 AM#33

I've played several "P2W" MMOs, and none of them seemed to be pay to win for me...I don't PvP, so there's no competition to win at...

 

Edit: MMOs aren't about "winning"  That's why they never end...you never win.

  BrodieBroos

Novice Member

Joined: 12/01/10
Posts: 33

5/10/13 10:08:22 AM#34
I don't gwt how this game is p2w. Just because it has a cash shop doesn't make it p2w. They do allow uou to level faster with the cash shop but their are only cosmetic items for sale there. Not sure how this is p2w.
  Tyvolus4

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/12
Posts: 163

5/10/13 10:28:20 AM#35
Originally posted by pacov
[mod edit]  But seriously the game is P2W no matter if you can do well or not in pvp. If players have a huge advantage by using money I consider it P2W.

 have you even played the game  ?  if so for how long ?  I think a lot of people weigh in and really have no idea what they are talking about.  I say this because I play the game, and I would not classify it as P2W.   But, by all means, if you played the game and want to give EXAMPLES of how and why it is P2W, have at it.

 

 

  Tyvolus4

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/12
Posts: 163

5/10/13 10:31:33 AM#36
Originally posted by Agoden

I'd say the game is "pay to get ahead" rather then "pay to win" It's ridiculous how slow some things are to get unless you pay, and i don't think respecs are available in game without paying at all, which is insane.

It means that before ever even playing the game and making your first character, you're pretty much forced to theory craft the crap out of everything.

 

not to mention the Mounts in PvP, it costs millions of astral diamonds to upgrade your horse in game, where as anyone who pays gets it within seconds which may not be a big deal in the long run, but right now It's creating massive imbalances.

I'm playing the game, and i could use the cash shop, but i simply refuse to because i do not support It's business model.

Though the game is pretty enjoyable, i hope it fails, hard.. 

 

Cosmetic cash shops and maybe XP boosters or GTFO in my book.

Ffs, i just want subscriptions back.. Tired of getting half a game.

  "pay to get ahead"  -- and really to further qualify that in most cases, just to get ahead quicker.  Again game is not P2W, but they do need to make some cash and I see no issues with how they are doing so.  good game and so far, IMO fair enough F2P model. 

  Tyvolus4

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/12
Posts: 163

5/10/13 10:35:28 AM#37
Some people will complain about anything and thats why they will never be taken seriously.  Its just like if you say something, no matter how incorrect it is, enough times people will believe it.  This games F2P model doesn't make you pay to unlock spell tiers (thanks SOE), or pay to unlock the UI bar (thanks Bioware/EA).  the cash shop is rather fair in its offerings and you can even sell in game AD for Zen. 
  furbans

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/10/13
Posts: 883

5/10/13 10:53:39 AM#38
Originally posted by BrodieBroos
I don't gwt how this game is p2w. Just because it has a cash shop doesn't make it p2w. They do allow uou to level faster with the cash shop but their are only cosmetic items for sale there. Not sure how this is p2w.

Any sort of advatage is P2W no matter how minor.  Health Stones and the sigil whatevers to get the top enchants that have a 1% default success are indicators of P2W not to mention potion buffs that provide significant advantage.

Is this game breaking or mandatory?  No.  Does this provide an advantage, no matter the size?  Yes.

Fanbois will defend their precious MMOs saying this isn't mandatory or can be earned even though earning is extremely grindsome and will suit no one unless you have not life and live in a basement.

GW2 is a cosmetic and time efficency only CS, Neverwinter is anything but that.  Is it one of the worst?  No, but it certainly not one of the better ones.  DDO is another one that is a cosmetic and time efficency CS but is riddled with MTs for content which isn't a bad thing since it provides a revenue and not having to nickle and dime customers at every chance they can get like in Neverwinter.  Sure there are stat tomes and other things but never any gear.  Course with the Astral Shard auction house it is straight up P2W now.

Cryptic or PWE went greedy with the CS, they are squeezing every ounce of profit out of the players without having to charge content (which is underwhealming at best) or classes.  CS in Neverwinter is way too intrusive.

  kriminal66

Novice Member

Joined: 3/15/12
Posts: 76

5/10/13 7:16:05 PM#39
You can pay to be more powerful but if you suck you still suck just are more powerful when you learn more about runes and upgrading you will understand till then good job & good luck. Cant you win without even getting a kill? I dont understand the people that say its not P2W when clearly you can pay real money to be more powerful isnt that what P2W means?
  jpnole

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/13/10
Posts: 1651

 
OP  5/10/13 8:27:03 PM#40
Updated OP to answer questions asked in the thread.
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