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World of Warcraft

World of Warcraft 

General Discussion  » Why WOW has horrible pvp.

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37 posts found
  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 3778

5/07/13 2:07:45 PM#21

PvP has always been a side attraction in WOW. WOW devs care about questing, instances and raids, not so much PvP.

Also... especially in the past couple of years they have pretty well given up on balancing 1-max level content in both PvE and PvP. Some classes are ridiculously overpowered even in PvE. Just level a hunter (or warlock or Paladin) and a mage in the same 1-30 areas to see what I mean.

I don't know why anyone would expect WOW PvP to be high quality.

Having said that... Noxxic is your friend:  http://www.noxxic.com/wow

  jesteralways

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/17/13
Posts: 553

5/07/13 2:17:48 PM#22
problem with WoW pvp is that blizz always balance it considering end game, that is currently level 90. i have problem with the entire leveling system, i think MMORPG should never have levels. why? because then it becomes necessary to balance each level of character. and it is completely impossible to do, specially at open world situation, we can try to balance character in instance with some system but that can never work in world pvp. get rid off the levels, instead make character upgrade experience based, like upgrading each point of endurance will cost 2000 experience or each point of fire resistance require 5000 xp and so on.it will automatically balance out.     

i want a open world, no phasing, no instancing.i want meaningful owpvp.i want player driven economy.i want meaningful crafting.i want awesome exploration, a sense of thrill.i want ow housing with a meaningful effect on my entire gameplay experience, not just some instanced crap.i want all of these free of cost, i don't wanna pay you a cent, game devs can eat grass and continue developing game for me.
Seems like that is the current consensus of western mmo players.

  filmoret

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/29/13
Posts: 117

 
OP  5/07/13 2:28:16 PM#23
Yea I was just expecting a decent pvp game because of how much money they make.  Sadly however there are tons of other pvp games out there who have done a better job with 1/100th the budget.  I have a few days left on my WOW account if anyone thinks I'm wrong then I accept any challenge to kill my level 70 Paladin in a 2v1.  I'm on the American pvp server zuluhead.  The guy who said the defensive warriors are the strongest is wrong because only the twinked warriors are strong and they are not as strong as the twinked  Paladins, Priests, Druids... Not even close.  Balance cannot be considered without equal gear settings.  Anything is overpowered when they are twinked against new players.
  DamonVile

Elite Member

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 4649

5/07/13 2:31:13 PM#24
Your first clue that a game isn't going to have good pvp in it is....it has mmo at the start of it.

People are like cats. When they die, you get a new one.

  Oysterstew

Novice Member

Joined: 3/10/11
Posts: 8

5/07/13 2:31:51 PM#25
Theres always at least one person who chimes in and says "No one cares about lower level PVP", in a thread like this. While that may be the opinion of that poster, it is hardly fact. Many people, including myself, play lower levels and would like to see the pvp balanced better. There used to even be more of us, but many became to frustrated with the game and moved on. I wonder if a true and proper fix to PVP balance might bring back some old subscibers.
  doodphace

Elite Member

Joined: 6/19/12
Posts: 1424

5/07/13 2:45:25 PM#26
Originally posted by Oysterstew
Theres always at least one person who chimes in and says "No one cares about lower level PVP", in a thread like this. While that may be the opinion of that poster, it is hardly fact. Many people, including myself, play lower levels and would like to see the pvp balanced better. There used to even be more of us, but many became to frustrated with the game and moved on. I wonder if a true and proper fix to PVP balance might bring back some old subscibers.

I have no problem if you have gripes about pre cap PVP....just make sure your complaint is for just that, not "PvP in general", then complain about pre 90 BGs.

GW2 gets around this by not having pre cap PVP at all. I personally prefer GW2's PVP, but some don;t like the fact that when you q for structured PVP, you don't play your character, they give you a fully decked out toon of the same class, which breaks the RPG immersion immensely.

  User Deleted
5/07/13 2:58:45 PM#27

Blizzard has stated again and again that they DO NOT BALANCE around 1v1 nor at levels other than MAX LEVEL.  They also do not balance around open world PVP either.  It's basically arenas and battlegrounds, that's it.  They do a terrible job at balance at max level, so unless you are the flavor of the month class, you're gimped.  Don't forget that gear imbalances abound, so not only is your class gimped, but your gear is as well.  The good news is, there are new players starting every day that follow the same trap as you... so when they arrive in the BGs, smile when you basically one-shot them because that was once you.  That is the essence of PVP in WoW.

  Axehilt

Novice Member

Joined: 5/09/09
Posts: 7213

5/07/13 3:04:46 PM#28
Originally posted by filmoret
Yea I was just expecting a decent pvp game because of how much money they make.  Sadly however there are tons of other pvp games out there who have done a better job with 1/100th the budget.  I have a few days left on my WOW account if anyone thinks I'm wrong then I accept any challenge to kill my level 70 Paladin in a 2v1.  I'm on the American pvp server zuluhead.  The guy who said the defensive warriors are the strongest is wrong because only the twinked warriors are strong and they are not as strong as the twinked  Paladins, Priests, Druids... Not even close.  Balance cannot be considered without equal gear settings.  Anything is overpowered when they are twinked against new players.

1. It's a MMORPG, buddy.  Don't expect real PVP from a MMORPG.  If you want real PVP find it in real PVP genres (MOBA, RTS, FPS, fighting, etc, etc)

2. Your examples seem to be from completely irrelevant situations while leveling.

3. Impressive someone from Zuluhed!  That server has been empty and "recommended" for literally like 5 years or something.  (This isn't really a positive or negative comment on you; I'm just genuinely shocked/surprised to hear of someone else actually playing there.)

4. Would it be ideal if all classes were perfectly balanced while leveling?  Absolutely.  But it's kind of a stretch and leveling PVP is certainly not the focus of the balance efforts.  So if you care about balance in PVP, you would focus on hitting max level and reaching the part of the game where gear actually stabilizes a little more before claiming you know the true balance of the game.  It's still going to be unbalanced (see Point #1, which is based on the fact that you're playing an RPG and people are going to have gear advantages,) but it's going to be a lot less unbalanced than what you're experiencing now.

  Quirhid

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5512

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

5/07/13 5:26:25 PM#29

Even while they have it, I don't think WoW was designed for open world PvP.

And "competitive PvP" refers to instanced, arena-style PvP, NOT open world PvP. You are misusing the term.

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  User Deleted
5/07/13 5:30:56 PM#30
Competitive PvP and open-world PvP are two very different things.
  Chrisbox

Elite Member

Joined: 7/15/10
Posts: 1501

5/07/13 5:42:13 PM#31
I'd give my left nut for good WoW pvp. 

Played-Everything
Playing-FFXIV:ARR

  Vunak23

Novice Member

Joined: 11/27/10
Posts: 659

In your house Eatin' your Cookies!

5/07/13 5:44:09 PM#32

Originally posted by Quirhid

Even while they have it, I don't think WoW was designed for open world PvP.

And "competitive PvP" refers to instanced, arena-style PvP, NOT open world PvP. You are misusing the term.

Originally posted by asmkm22
Competitive PvP and open-world PvP are two very different things.

Competitive PvP =/= Instanced PvP. 

Instanced PvP = Instanced PVP

World PvP = World PVP

 

Competitive PVP = any PVP that you compete against other teams/guilds/players, so really all PVP is competitive.  Sorry but Sieges in some of the older OWPVP games were a hell of a lot more competitive than any instanced garbage we have now. 

"In the immediate future, we have this one, and then we’ve got another one that is actually going to be – so we’re going to have, what we want to do, is in January, what we’re targeting to do, this may or may not happen, so you can’t hold me to it. But what we’re targeting to do, is have a fun anniversary to the Ilum shenanigans that happened. An alien race might invade, and they might crash into Ilum and there might be some new activities that happen on the planet." ~Gabe Amatangelo

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

5/07/13 5:48:46 PM#33
Competative pvp = not a bloody mmo

You can't ram a fps round peg in a mmo square hole.

Mmo pvp will always be unbalanced, better to embrace the mmoishness of it than try and pretend its esports by sticking it in a little box on a timer.
  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

5/07/13 5:51:31 PM#34
The biggest problem with wow pvp, is blizzard are absolutely bloody obsessed with timers. Even when they finally made outdoor pvp content, they stuck it on a bloody timer.

But that's to be expected when half the lead devs are former EQ hardcore raiders.
  Mtibbs1989

Elite Member

Joined: 12/17/10
Posts: 2574

5/07/13 5:56:02 PM#35
Originally posted by StonesDK

Why WOW has horrible pvp for me.

 

/Fixed

 Fixed: Why wow battle grounds killed open world pvp. :)


Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.

  User Deleted
5/07/13 5:56:13 PM#36
Originally posted by Vunak23

Originally posted by Quirhid

Even while they have it, I don't think WoW was designed for open world PvP.

And "competitive PvP" refers to instanced, arena-style PvP, NOT open world PvP. You are misusing the term.

Originally posted by asmkm22
Competitive PvP and open-world PvP are two very different things.

Competitive PvP =/= Instanced PvP. 

Instanced PvP = Instanced PVP

World PvP = World PVP

 

Competitive PVP = any PVP that you compete against other teams/guilds/players, so really all PVP is competitive.  Sorry but Sieges in some of the older OWPVP games were a hell of a lot more competitive than any instanced garbage we have now. 

competitive *anything* (as  it's used in gaming) implies a balanced playing field.  And I don't just mean the landscape that you run around on, but stuff like things being available to both or all teams (gear and classes) in such a way that player or team skill is the deciding factor.

Open-world PvP, while fun, is almost always a gankfest or a zergfest.  There certainly can be competitive fighting going on, when similarly gear and skilled players cross paths, but that's an exception.

  filmoret

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/29/13
Posts: 117

 
OP  5/07/13 9:41:35 PM#37
Truly balanced pvp is nearly impossible.  I never expected any game to have perfect pvp situations.  The problem I'm having is how horrible of a job WOW has done.  It is seriously the worse I have ever seen out of 15 years of pvp gaming and we are speaking about over 100 pvp games here.  I was very impressed with how SWTOR has balanced their battlezones.  For those who don't realize,  WOW open world mechanics are almost identical to their battleground mechanics.  Priests, Druids, Paladins are overpowered in open world just as much as the battleground.  I definitely would subscribe again without hesitation if they would actually do something about it.
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