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Defiance

Defiance 

General Discussion  » Why the Defiance hate?

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224 posts found
  User Deleted
4/22/13 9:57:31 AM#141

I only have one question...

 

Was it not fun to progress to where you were at before it was reset/lost?  Sounds to me like you're dreading the notion of having to do it again... a tell-tale sign that it's not actually fun but a race to get to max whatever.   Fun doesn't start when you are at max whatever, it should start at character creation... if not, why even bother with the story and just pay for a max whatever toon?  If that's where the fun is supposed to begin...

  User Deleted
4/22/13 10:03:01 AM#142
Originally posted by pmiles

I only have one question...

 

Was it not fun to progress to where you were at before it was reset/lost?  Sounds to me like you're dreading the notion of having to do it again... a tell-tale sign that it's not actually fun but a race to get to max whatever.   Fun doesn't start when you are at max whatever, it should start at character creation... if not, why even bother with the story and just pay for a max whatever toon?  If that's where the fun is supposed to begin...

Depends on the person I guess. Me personaly I am not even sure what people are talkig about here. I lost nothing with my game. The story is the main reason why I play the game. Wish more MMO's had great stroy lines like Defiance.

  Myria

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/07/09
Posts: 535

4/22/13 10:07:18 AM#143
Originally posted by Isturi

You dont need the season pass. I still dont have it. You get the whole game if you choose not to buy the season pass. It is just for additonal race etc. Game price is half price now and you get a great game imo.

Actually no one really knows what the DLC are going to be. Trion's statements on the subject have been deliberately vague, excruciatingly so for a product that went on sale before the game even launched, and people have been filling in the blanks from there -- mostly with whatever happens to be convenient to whatever argument is being made at the time.

  Hugolin

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/06/07
Posts: 78

4/22/13 10:17:35 AM#144
the game is fun, it has a good price, people that say that should be 10 dollars have 15 years old or dont have jobs, its like a tabula rasa without monthly fee, dunno why someone wouldnt play it, its a fun game and not many mmo with this setting and gameplay. so i really dont understand the hate
  fallenlords

Novice Member

Joined: 5/16/10
Posts: 700

4/22/13 10:27:52 AM#145
Originally posted by pmiles

I only have one question...

 

Was it not fun to progress to where you were at before it was reset/lost?  Sounds to me like you're dreading the notion of having to do it again... a tell-tale sign that it's not actually fun but a race to get to max whatever.   Fun doesn't start when you are at max whatever, it should start at character creation... if not, why even bother with the story and just pay for a max whatever toon?  If that's where the fun is supposed to begin...

I have just plodded along and I am enjoying the journey.  One of the reasons I don't understand why people are wigging about stuff, because I can't put it into context at the moment.  Been playing since launch and think I am just at the end of the main quest line now.  But haven't even started properly with contracts, PVP, Shadow Wars or even major Arkfalls yet.  So I still have a lot to enjoy.   So as far as I am concerned, it's been fun and still is fun.  

 

I understood the max EGO level was 5000 or something.  So I can't see somebody has maxed out already, not unless they have been buying some sort of multipliers/boosts from the in-game store. 

  Oceanhawk

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/11/12
Posts: 25

4/22/13 2:58:48 PM#146
Originally posted by fallenlords
Originally posted by Ginaz

I find TSW to be fun just like I find Defiance fun.  There's no need to trash other games when trying to defend a game you like.

Not trying to defend the game, trying to understand why somebody would get their knickers in enough of a twist to complain about it. 

 

But as for TSW.  There really is no defence, it's a dull and boring game and not even fun. It has guns and it has Zombies, yet it is still dull. Even The Walking Dead Survival Instinct managed to make that aspect fun. A below average game if there ever was one, and a game that was rushed out the door.  Fair enough you like it, it must be nice to be part of a niche crowd is all I will say.  Surprisingly most of which seem to turn up on the Defiance forum giving the game crap.  I would think they would have their heads in issue 6  The Indiana Jones Clone and the Pyramids of Despair or whatever is the latest monthly installment is, to be that bothered with Defiance. But I guess TSW can't be still holding their interest.

Really? YOu don't understand why people are upset? [mod edit]

 

The game had a lot of promise and I guess it still does. However currently it is only fun for a short time then it devolves into a boring repetitive grind fes, where you really don't know why you are grinding. Because EGo rating has no impact on the game at all, EQO points int eh matrix have limited impact, Weapons are all the same no matter if it's a legendary or a beginning "white" weapon. Itemization is poorly done anyway not that it matters.

 

The game crashes a lot, and this past weekend lots of people lost hours of play in an unannounced rollback. The game is billed as a MMO but it is really just a single player game with 2 or 3 multiplayer elements thrown in so it can be labled an MMO.

 

Still holding out hope that the game will improve and live up to the promises the deelopers made but the realist in me feels like the game will be dead before that has a chance to happen.

  fallenlords

Novice Member

Joined: 5/16/10
Posts: 700

4/22/13 6:11:50 PM#147
Originally posted by Oceanhawk

Really? YOu don't understand why people are upset? [mod edit]

 

No not really.  Shooters are shallow by nature, if you can't play one for whatever reason you play another. Server down, big deal - play something else until the servers are back up.   Defiance doesn't strike me as a game where you have to invest your heart and soul.
 

  Burntvet

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/16/07
Posts: 2747

4/23/13 4:31:33 PM#148
Originally posted by Hugolin
the game is fun, it has a good price, people that say that should be 10 dollars have 15 years old or dont have jobs, its like a tabula rasa without monthly fee, dunno why someone wouldnt play it, its a fun game and not many mmo with this setting and gameplay. so i really dont understand the hate

 

And I wouldn't pay $10 for a $1 McD's burger, either. Sometimes, value is part of the equation. I don't think Defiance is a $10-$20 dollar game because I think all games should be, I think it is because Defiance is not deep or polished or good enough to warrant a full $50-$60 price tag. Especially the PC version. And frankly, people that have and continue to blindly buy every new shiny MMO that comes out at full price are the reason that developers keep putting out the same bland, boring, shallow, crap over and over: because some/enough people keep buying them.
  JeroKane

Elite Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 5012

4/23/13 4:53:56 PM#149
  fallenlords

Novice Member

Joined: 5/16/10
Posts: 700

4/23/13 5:45:52 PM#150
Originally posted by JeroKane

http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?48523-Weapon-damage-is-client-side...-So-is-vehicle-speed-etc.-Way-to-go-Trion-way-to-go.

 

Yeah people cheat, they have and they always will.   That to me is moral standpoint you decide to take as an individual.  You find it at epidemic proportions on the PC in everything from Call of Duty to WoW.   One of the reasons I prefer consoles these days, less hacking overall and more facilities for reporting.

  JeroKane

Elite Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 5012

4/24/13 1:59:15 AM#151
Originally posted by fallenlords
Originally posted by JeroKane

http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?48523-Weapon-damage-is-client-side...-So-is-vehicle-speed-etc.-Way-to-go-Trion-way-to-go.

 

Yeah people cheat, they have and they always will.   That to me is moral standpoint you decide to take as an individual.  You find it at epidemic proportions on the PC in everything from Call of Duty to WoW.   One of the reasons I prefer consoles these days, less hacking overall and more facilities for reporting.

 The point here is, that TRION's developers on DEFIANCE are absolutely clueless and incompetent.

Putting almost everything client side, like Damage, Shields, EGO powers, Speed, etc in an Online (FPS) game. Really??

That is just an Open invite to Hackers!

Sure other online games have hackers too, but mostly it's restricted to aim bots and wall / terrain visibility hacks. Also annoying ofcourse, as it's still cheating... but far less worrisome than people being able to manipulate damage, shields, EGO powers and speed and turn themselves into unkillable gods oneshotting everything!

It also clearly shows they haven't put a single Anti Cheat messure in please either!

It's All Points Bulletin all over again. Anyone remember that game? /shrug

  User Deleted
4/24/13 2:11:31 AM#152
Originally posted by JeroKane
Originally posted by fallenlords
Originally posted by JeroKane

http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?48523-Weapon-damage-is-client-side...-So-is-vehicle-speed-etc.-Way-to-go-Trion-way-to-go.

 

Yeah people cheat, they have and they always will.   That to me is moral standpoint you decide to take as an individual.  You find it at epidemic proportions on the PC in everything from Call of Duty to WoW.   One of the reasons I prefer consoles these days, less hacking overall and more facilities for reporting.

 The point here is, that TRION's developers on DEFIANCE are absolutely clueless and incompetent.

Putting almost everything client side, like Damage, Shields, EGO powers, Speed, etc in an Online (FPS) game. Really??

That is just an Open invite to Hackers!

Sure other online games have hackers too, but mostly it's restricted to aim bots and wall / terrain visibility hacks. Also annoying ofcourse, as it's still cheating... but far less worrysome than people being able to manipulate damage, shields, EGO powers and speed and turn themselves into unkillable gods oneshotting everything!

It also clearly shows they haven't put a single Anti Cheat messure in please either!

I rest my case.

LMAO all that thread is that is linked  is just a disgruntle person who just seems to want to get attention with a negative thread. It dose not prove anything. Bottom line is Defiance is not going anywere gamers are enjoying the game very much so and no matter what kind of nagativity people may contenue to try to post or youtube or whatever true fans of the game will contenue to enjoy and play and watch the show.

I rest my case.

  JeroKane

Elite Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 5012

4/24/13 2:27:17 AM#153
Originally posted by Isturi
Originally posted by JeroKane
Originally posted by fallenlords
Originally posted by JeroKane

http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?48523-Weapon-damage-is-client-side...-So-is-vehicle-speed-etc.-Way-to-go-Trion-way-to-go.

 

Yeah people cheat, they have and they always will.   That to me is moral standpoint you decide to take as an individual.  You find it at epidemic proportions on the PC in everything from Call of Duty to WoW.   One of the reasons I prefer consoles these days, less hacking overall and more facilities for reporting.

 The point here is, that TRION's developers on DEFIANCE are absolutely clueless and incompetent.

Putting almost everything client side, like Damage, Shields, EGO powers, Speed, etc in an Online (FPS) game. Really??

That is just an Open invite to Hackers!

Sure other online games have hackers too, but mostly it's restricted to aim bots and wall / terrain visibility hacks. Also annoying ofcourse, as it's still cheating... but far less worrysome than people being able to manipulate damage, shields, EGO powers and speed and turn themselves into unkillable gods oneshotting everything!

It also clearly shows they haven't put a single Anti Cheat messure in please either!

I rest my case.

LMAO all that thread is that is linked  is just a disgruntle person who just seems to want to get attention with a negative thread. It dose not prove anything. Bottom line is Defiance is not going anywere gamers are enjoying the game very much so and no matter what kind of nagativity people may contenue to try to post or youtube or whatever true fans of the game will contenue to enjoy and play and watch the show.

I rest my case.

 Are you just daft and blind or what?

People have been posting thread after thread for weeks now, with proof to various youtube videos and sites showing how easy it is to hack this game and people hacking live on video streams.

If this was all fake and the work of some disgruntled player.... those videostreams wouldn't have been taken offline and stream accounts closed!

All these threads have been deleted at an alarming rate, as TRION wants to obviously wipe it under the rug and keep it quiet.

There are already entire cheat engines available dedicated for DEFIANCE since day one, as they had plenty of time to create it during the beta weekends.

But sure... go ahead and stick your head in the sand and pretend everything is fine and hacking doesn't exist.

Just like All Points Bulletin did not had any hackers either. It was all just imagination. lol.

  DAS1337

Novice Member

Joined: 11/28/07
Posts: 2379

4/24/13 2:28:00 AM#154

Just entered San Fran.  Taking my time.  Really enjoying the story.  No crashes at all.  Very few bugs, and the ones I have found are misson related, which have been fixed very quickly.  I haven't even tried PvP.  I haven't done the Co-op missions either.  Haven't done the shadow wars.  Havent started any pursuits.  I paid $60 for a game that I'm still playing and having fun with since launch.  I won't have to pay a subscription fee.  All updates are free, in exception for some DLC.  Okay, that's fine, most expansions cost money anyways.  I'm enjoying the TV show as well.  Oh, the game's storyline evolves with the show starting next season?  Haven't seen that before.  I can leave for six months and come back without losing much of anything because there is no 'I WIN' gear?  Nice.

 

Totally worth it.  I also paid full price for BF3 and beat the campaign in hours.  All of the Gears games were beat in hours.  To be honest, I kind of feel ripped off when it comes to those.  Considering what Defiance has given me, and promises in the future.  

 

And just to address the cheating comments.  I don't cheat, nor have I seen a cheater in the game.  Perhaps they are there, I won't argue that.  Though, I doubt they will be there for long.  Those people will get reported very quickly and banned.  

  User Deleted
4/24/13 2:53:34 AM#155
Originally posted by DAS1337

Just entered San Fran.  Taking my time.  Really enjoying the story.  No crashes at all.  Very few bugs, and the ones I have found are misson related, which have been fixed very quickly.  I haven't even tried PvP.  I haven't done the Co-op missions either.  Haven't done the shadow wars.  Havent started any pursuits.  I paid $60 for a game that I'm still playing and having fun with since launch.  I won't have to pay a subscription fee.  All updates are free, in exception for some DLC.  Okay, that's fine, most expansions cost money anyways.  I'm enjoying the TV show as well.  Oh, the game's storyline evolves with the show starting next season?  Haven't seen that before.  I can leave for six months and come back without losing much of anything because there is no 'I WIN' gear?  Nice.

 

Totally worth it.  I also paid full price for BF3 and beat the campaign in hours.  All of the Gears games were beat in hours.  To be honest, I kind of feel ripped off when it comes to those.  Considering what Defiance has given me, and promises in the future.  

 

And just to address the cheating comments.  I don't cheat, nor have I seen a cheater in the game.  Perhaps they are there, I won't argue that.  Though, I doubt they will be there for long.  Those people will get reported very quickly and banned.  

See it is because of players like us will be the main reason why Defiance will stay around for a long time to come.

Good Hunting.

  thark

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/01/03
Posts: 1107

4/24/13 3:08:09 AM#156

Defiance is a great game :) Not really sure how anyone can think othervise , sure It's not the best TPS and not the best feature vise MMO..But it's fun as hell.

Most professional reviews will tell you that if you bother to actuallly read them since they all basically has given Defiance a 5-7 in scores based on diffrent things, but It's fun, the bugs and the problems some are having will go away..eventually.

  fallenlords

Novice Member

Joined: 5/16/10
Posts: 700

4/24/13 4:38:06 AM#157
Originally posted by JeroKane

 The point here is, that TRION's developers on DEFIANCE are absolutely clueless and incompetent.

Putting almost everything client side, like Damage, Shields, EGO powers, Speed, etc in an Online (FPS) game. Really??

That is just an Open invite to Hackers!

Sure other online games have hackers too, but mostly it's restricted to aim bots and wall / terrain visibility hacks. Also annoying ofcourse, as it's still cheating... but far less worrisome than people being able to manipulate damage, shields, EGO powers and speed and turn themselves into unkillable gods oneshotting everything!

It also clearly shows they haven't put a single Anti Cheat messure in please either!

It's All Points Bulletin all over again. Anyone remember that game? /shrug

You can hardly blame the game company for people hacking.  Perhaps the config files have to be client based due to the consoles, I don't know.    General rule in an MMO if you find somebody cheating, however that might be, you report them.    As for anti-cheat measures, you can't spend your time developing with the idea everybody is going to cheat in the back of your mind, because that is like saying you don't trust your userbase.   You have to assume cheats will be isolated instances and that you plug the holes with patches as and when. 

  JeroKane

Elite Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 5012

4/24/13 5:02:25 AM#158
Originally posted by fallenlords
Originally posted by JeroKane

 The point here is, that TRION's developers on DEFIANCE are absolutely clueless and incompetent.

Putting almost everything client side, like Damage, Shields, EGO powers, Speed, etc in an Online (FPS) game. Really??

That is just an Open invite to Hackers!

Sure other online games have hackers too, but mostly it's restricted to aim bots and wall / terrain visibility hacks. Also annoying ofcourse, as it's still cheating... but far less worrisome than people being able to manipulate damage, shields, EGO powers and speed and turn themselves into unkillable gods oneshotting everything!

It also clearly shows they haven't put a single Anti Cheat messure in please either!

It's All Points Bulletin all over again. Anyone remember that game? /shrug

You can hardly blame the game company for people hacking.  Perhaps the config files have to be client based due to the consoles, I don't know.    General rule in an MMO if you find somebody cheating, however that might be, you report them.    As for anti-cheat measures, you can't spend your time developing with the idea everybody is going to cheat in the back of your mind, because that is like saying you don't trust your userbase.   You have to assume cheats will be isolated instances and that you plug the holes with patches as and when. 

 Ah come on! You really cannot be that naive now do you?

As that is EXACTLY what developers need to have in mind from day one! That people will try to hack your game!

According to your philosophy... why would we even need a password on our account? Why not just login without a password?

Why  have any security messures at all right? If developers are not responsible and should ignore hackers.

Just remove firewalls too.... it will sertainly improve latency and performance.

/facepalm

  thark

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/01/03
Posts: 1107

4/24/13 5:18:31 AM#159
Originally posted by JeroKane
Originally posted by fallenlords
Originally posted by JeroKane

 The point here is, that TRION's developers on DEFIANCE are absolutely clueless and incompetent.

Putting almost everything client side, like Damage, Shields, EGO powers, Speed, etc in an Online (FPS) game. Really??

That is just an Open invite to Hackers!

Sure other online games have hackers too, but mostly it's restricted to aim bots and wall / terrain visibility hacks. Also annoying ofcourse, as it's still cheating... but far less worrisome than people being able to manipulate damage, shields, EGO powers and speed and turn themselves into unkillable gods oneshotting everything!

It also clearly shows they haven't put a single Anti Cheat messure in please either!

It's All Points Bulletin all over again. Anyone remember that game? /shrug

You can hardly blame the game company for people hacking.  Perhaps the config files have to be client based due to the consoles, I don't know.    General rule in an MMO if you find somebody cheating, however that might be, you report them.    As for anti-cheat measures, you can't spend your time developing with the idea everybody is going to cheat in the back of your mind, because that is like saying you don't trust your userbase.   You have to assume cheats will be isolated instances and that you plug the holes with patches as and when. 

 Ah come on! You really cannot be that naive now do you?

As that is EXACTLY what developers need to have in mind from day one! That people will try to hack your game!

According to your philosophy... why would we even need a password on our account? Why not just login without a password?

Why  have any security messures at all right? If developers are not responsible and should ignore hackers.

Just remove firewalls too.... it will sertainly improve latency and performance.

/facepalm

 Well, I sort of agree with you here..But only to some degree, since whatever they do there will always be ways to cheat anyway

The hackers will NOT go away easily..and NOT easily stopped ..

Someome will ALWAYS try to cheat, either with hacks or exploits or even built in cheat codes (not in MMO's hopefully) they will also use guides, hints and other spoiler sites to get an ADVANTAGE.

The problem here is naturally the "gamers" that feels the need to prove themselvs wthout actually proving anything,,

The need to win is strong, without it we would not even TRY to cheat during the olympics and  risk  jail and complete bans from the sport you love..

 

 

  JeroKane

Elite Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 5012

4/24/13 5:34:47 AM#160
Originally posted by thark
 

 Well, I sort of agree with you here..But only to some degree, since whatever they do there will always be ways to cheat anyway

The hackers will NOT go away easily..and NOT easily stopped ..

Someome will ALWAYS try to cheat, either with hacks or exploits or even built in cheat codes (not in MMO's hopefully) they will also use guides, hints and other spoiler sites to get an ADVANTAGE.

The problem here is naturally the "gamers" that feels the need to prove themselvs wthout actually proving anything,,

The need to win is strong, without it we would not even TRY to cheat during the olympics and  risk  jail and complete bans from the sport you love..

 

 

 Ofcourse people will always try to find ways to hack.

But in case of DEFIANCE, TRION has made it EXTREMELY easy for them! It's just basically an open invite for hacking!

They don't even need to hack the client files, because everything is just loaded in plain memory. So they can just adjust the values realtime in memory! Even, if there were client file integrity checks in place, they can bypass those completely.

Critical stuff like damage, speed, shield, powers, etc should be handled server side with checks in place. At least hackers won't be able to get around that anymore. Which is the critical part of the game.

Hacks like aimbots, wall/terrain visibility hacks are harder to detect, but can still be countered by client integrity checks.

It just shows TRION's engine they used for DEFIANCE is just utter crap and them being forced to put everything client side to make the game even work. And yet they still have trouble keeping the servers performing and stable. /shrug

I have said it before. With the budget they had, they should just have licensed a decent engine, like Unreal Engine or Crytek.

Fully optimised for Online FPS games, with build-in support for ALL platforms! Basic anti-cheat messures in place, so less worry about hacks, etc.

Sure it would have cut in their initial profits, but at least they would have a decent, stable and good performing game with less bugs and issues, working chat system.

Longterm it would have paid off for them.  Now it's slowly turning into a complete dissaster for them (at least for PC platform) and I just can't see how they can get out of it.

The game is now live! First impressions are key! It will be too expensive and too much work to overhaul the entire game and move all this stuff from client to server.

They would have to redesign the entire server infrastructure to cope with the extra processing load.

It's just a shame! Moreso a HUGE dissapointment, as I had expected better from TRION.

I mean.... after the whole hacking debacle with All Points Bulletin (twice even with the relaunch!). You would have thought it had raised RED flags to other developers to NOT make these same mistakes again!

/shrug

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