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Camelot Unchained

Camelot Unchained 

General Discussion  » F2P Model heading for disaster an "apocalypse" in 3-5 years

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313 posts found
  gylnne

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/19/07
Posts: 318

 
OP  4/12/13 12:56:08 PM#1

This warning coming from Mark Jacobs in a recent article he did which included his opinion on the unsustainable f2p model so many games are using.

 

"Camelot Unchained creator and long-time MMO veteran Mark Jacobs has warned of an impending free-to-play “apocalypse” in three to five years time, thanks to a rush towards unsustainable free-to-play models. He predicted to VG247 that developers will close and publishers stand to lose a lot of money.

“The whole free-to-play thing isn’t going away tomorrow,” Jacobs stressed, “but let’s just see what happens in three to five years – and I’m betting closer to three – where free-to-play will become just another model. Right now you’ve got everybody chasing it, going ‘Isn’t this great? Free to play, we’re going to make so much money’”.

Jacobs felt that many developers and publishers are chasing the free-to-play market in the hope that a small percentage of players will actually lay down money on micro-payment items. He doesn’t see it as an economically viable strategy."

Continue reading here:  f2p heading for disaster

  User Deleted
4/12/13 1:01:22 PM#2

good times ,educating times,people learned their lesson.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gk_UG7p428c

  Tierless

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/01/08
Posts: 2085

joie de vivre

4/12/13 1:04:14 PM#3

I think MMORPGers, the old school core ones are smart enough to ignore these silly things. Give us cash or you can't have a bank slot! It's getting sickening. So I buy the product, then I pay you again to "unlock" all the stuff inside. WTF.

mmorpg.com/blogs/Xobdnas

  Horusra

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/26/05
Posts: 1842

4/12/13 1:04:14 PM#4

Good.  I like F2P like Lotr and DDO, but the weak, cheap, crappy games that come out with publishers that just want to make a quick buck should die off.  It is evolution the creatures with weak attributes dies off if there is anything good about them then it will carry on in a new form.

 

F2P is not bad per se.  It is the current form many take that is bad.  Development and progress take time and unfortunately a lot of corpses along the way in the form of bankruptcies, failed games, and disgruntled players.  Hopefully some kind of stimulus will not come in to artificially prop up games that should fail.

  Mkilbride

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 9/01/07
Posts: 569

4/12/13 1:07:10 PM#5

Great interview. Really convinced me. Put 110$ “Young Her” most I’ve ever spent on a game.

I’ve played pretty much every MMO to date, excluding ones not in English(and some that aren’t), and nothing beats Pay 2 play quality.

GW2 disappointed me…GW1 was one of my favorite games ever…GW2 I regret buying.

Help get Camelot Unchained made, a old-school MMORPG, with no hand holding!

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained

  User Deleted
4/12/13 1:07:52 PM#6
Originally posted by Horusra

 

 

  Development and progress take time and unfortunately a lot of corpses along the way in the form of bankruptcies, failed games, and disgruntled players.  Hopefully some kind of stimulus will not come in to artificially prop up games that should fail.

Thats where the problem lies,there is companies building free to play game,what kind of goal is that.

  gylnne

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/19/07
Posts: 318

 
OP  4/12/13 1:10:09 PM#7
Originally posted by Horusra

Good.  I like F2P like Lotr and DDO,

 

I did when Lotro first started but now it is all about a money grab, especially since Warner Bros. owns it now.

  User Deleted
4/12/13 1:11:39 PM#8

I genuinely hope F2P goes away soon.  It's not a good fit for community driven games like MMO's.  Sure it brings a few players back to a failing game for a month or two but other than that it's not really helping to advance the genre. 

  Mkilbride

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 9/01/07
Posts: 569

4/12/13 1:12:44 PM#9

LOTRO is a good F2P.

 

Except that, to get all the content you'd normally get with buying the game...it costs more than release...so you have to spend about 200$ to get all the actual content in LOTRO.

 

Skills, are in the cash shop. Yes, skills, such as a weapon skill, abilitiy, or mount.

 

In GW2, you can buy "Gems" and convert them directly to gold, or buy dyes or something else and re-sell them for money. So in essense, you can buy gold straight from the developers. F2P Man...not being handled well.

Help get Camelot Unchained made, a old-school MMORPG, with no hand holding!

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained

  Rthuth434

Novice Member

Joined: 12/26/12
Posts: 367

4/12/13 1:15:14 PM#10
Mark sounds like TRION. look what happened 3-5 years after they said something similar.
  Vorthanion

Elite Member

Joined: 7/02/11
Posts: 1828

4/12/13 1:21:23 PM#11
I sure hope this buisiness model collapses.  I'm tired of the crappy quality games that have resulted from this movement.

  User Deleted
4/12/13 1:23:31 PM#12

People/players like to use  this word "fun" alot ,what is funny cash shop,i would like to see a video when someone is having fun at cash shop.

 

  Rthuth434

Novice Member

Joined: 12/26/12
Posts: 367

4/12/13 1:23:31 PM#13
Originally posted by Vorthanion
I sure hope this buisiness model collapses.  I'm tired of the crappy quality games that have resulted from this movement.

are you also tired of all the crappy quality P2P MMO's that continue to release?

  gylnne

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/19/07
Posts: 318

 
OP  4/12/13 1:23:57 PM#14
Originally posted by Mkilbride

LOTRO is a good F2P.

 

I use to think so when they first started it. But soon it wasn't just selling cosmetics, it was skills, and instant travel, etc. The money temptation is to great to not start adding  pay to win items, every cash shop eventually goes this way. So instead of having a major focus on providing content their focus is divided with the idea of always interweaving the new content with store items.

  gylnne

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/19/07
Posts: 318

 
OP  4/12/13 1:25:57 PM#15
Originally posted by Rthuth434
Originally posted by Vorthanion
I sure hope this buisiness model collapses.  I'm tired of the crappy quality games that have resulted from this movement.

are you also tired of all the crappy quality P2P MMO's that continue to release?

Is it possible Rthuth434 that crappy quality is because they make a pve game with pvp tacked on to it?

  rojo6934

Elite Member

Joined: 8/13/09
Posts: 4546

"It is double pleasure to deceive the deceiver". - Niccolo Machiavelli

4/12/13 1:28:23 PM#16
Originally posted by Xobdnas

I think MMORPGers, the old school core ones are smart enough to ignore these silly things. Give us cash or you can't have a bank slot! It's getting sickening. So I buy the product, then I pay you again to "unlock" all the stuff inside. WTF.

thats why the B2P model is the best of both worlds. In a free to play mmo, you play for free but have to pay for things that are needed in the game(which isnt that bad) but then theres a high risk of being p2w or hardcore nickle n dime. In a sub based mmo you purchase the game but you have to keep paying to even log in, which sucks, i already payed for your game

 

B2P is the most balanced and make the most sense. You purchase the game, and have the entire game. Theres absolutely zero chance to even look at p2w because the company sells boxes and expansions, so the cash shop can be very decent and greed-free.

 

This are times where subscription only wont cut it. We are not getting enough content to justify a sub, not even the gameplay quality is there anymore (grind to endgame then do mindless "endgame" grind for 15 a month? no thanks, thats not quality game for my money, and certainly not AAA as they claim).

 

I think GW2 has the best b2p model (and still need more cool stuff in the cash shop). And i think TERA does the best job mixing all three models together succesfully.

"in peace, in sleep under the barren, abandoned soil"

  boxsnd

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/04/12
Posts: 367

4/12/13 1:29:41 PM#17
We will see if his prediction is right. I predict exactly the opposite. F2P/B2P will flourish and P2P will die out with WoW.

DAoC - Excalibur & Camlann

  Horusra

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/26/05
Posts: 1842

4/12/13 1:30:59 PM#18
Originally posted by gylnne
Originally posted by Mkilbride

LOTRO is a good F2P.

 

I use to think so when they first started it. But soon it wasn't just selling cosmetics, it was skills, and instant travel, etc. The money temptation is to great to not start adding  pay to win items, every cash shop eventually goes this way. So instead of having a major focus on providing content their focus is divided with the idea of always interweaving the new content with store items.

But you can get all that stuff by playing the game and getting the points to buy them.  To me that makes the difference.  Those with more time than money can get what those with more money than time can get.  Old games catered more to those that had more time than money...and frankly that is a not a way to make money.

  Horusra

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/26/05
Posts: 1842

4/12/13 1:32:31 PM#19
Originally posted by ForumPvP
Originally posted by Horusra

 

 

  Development and progress take time and unfortunately a lot of corpses along the way in the form of bankruptcies, failed games, and disgruntled players.  Hopefully some kind of stimulus will not come in to artificially prop up games that should fail.

Thats where the problem lies,there is companies building free to play game,what kind of goal is that.

The goal is for those making crappy games to fail horrible and someone behind them to say "Stop...we are going to make a F2P game, but we are going to make one worth playing not just a one year money grab game."

  Horusra

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/26/05
Posts: 1842

4/12/13 1:34:11 PM#20
Originally posted by gylnne
Originally posted by Horusra

Good.  I like F2P like Lotr and DDO,

 

I did when Lotro first started but now it is all about a money grab, especially since Warner Bros. owns it now.

I frankly have fun with the system. *shrug* It is a difference of opinion I guess.  I would play more games like Lotro where you can get points to buy all the benefits in the shop if you play the game.  Expecting to play a game and it cost you $0 for everything the game has to offer is a pipe dream.

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