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News & Features Discussion  » [Column] Neverwinter: What It Is...and Isn't

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86 posts found
  Margrave

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/10/06
Posts: 531

4/08/13 8:01:14 PM#21

The game is fun! I love the combat system, I love being in Forgotten Realms, and I've never played 4th edition before, so it's kind of new. The last time I played D&D was AD&D 2nd Ed.

 

Love Neverwinter, and cannot wait for the launch!

  rojoArcueid

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/13/09
Posts: 5825

"It is double pleasure to deceive the deceiver". - Niccolo Machiavelli

4/08/13 8:17:04 PM#22

So the foundry will only be used to create dungeon runs with a storyline and a reward?.....

I was expecting the foundry to be a full in depth modding system like the Skyrim workshop.

I guess i expected too much? Now im sad and not caring about the foundry anymore.

  sketocafe

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/19/11
Posts: 682

4/08/13 8:17:42 PM#23

 There are gathering spots, places to cooperatively quest and much more, all while thousands of players are simultaneously connected to the game. If that’s not an MMO, what is?

 

Why do you even need to point out that thousands are "simultaneously connected?" They're not in these gathering spots, are they? I agree with you that neverwinter is an MMO, but I think you're doing yourself a disservice with that bit. 

  Mardukk

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/05/11
Posts: 1462

4/08/13 8:17:54 PM#24

Massive non linear virtual world...errrrrr.

 

I was suprised I didn't immeditely log out.  I was also suprised that it wasn't bad for what it was. Definitely the best game that I've played from Cryptic (not saying much). 

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

4/08/13 8:21:45 PM#25
Originally posted by rojo6934

So the foundry will only be used to create dungeon runs with a storyline and a reward?.....

I was expecting the foundry to be a full in depth modding system like the Skyrim workshop.

I guess i expected too much? Now im sad and not caring about the foundry anymore.

yes foundry is a dungeon creator.. nothing like skyrims worksop where you basically can make anything you want... this type of creator is a perfect fit for a D&D dungeon crawler MMO game though

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  rojoArcueid

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/13/09
Posts: 5825

"It is double pleasure to deceive the deceiver". - Niccolo Machiavelli

4/08/13 8:28:38 PM#26
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by rojo6934

So the foundry will only be used to create dungeon runs with a storyline and a reward?.....

I was expecting the foundry to be a full in depth modding system like the Skyrim workshop.

I guess i expected too much? Now im sad and not caring about the foundry anymore.

yes foundry is a dungeon creator.. nothing like skyrims worksop where you basically can make anything you want... this type of creator is a perfect fit for a D&D dungeon crawler MMO game though

i thought Neverwinter nights had a also a more in depth modding workshop. Maybe im wrong, but thanks anyway. Ive been so spoiled with Skyrim's workshop that for some reason the comments by cryptic (and players) praising the foundry made me think it was something like beyond a dungeon creator.

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

4/08/13 8:30:15 PM#27
Originally posted by rojo6934
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by rojo6934

So the foundry will only be used to create dungeon runs with a storyline and a reward?.....

I was expecting the foundry to be a full in depth modding system like the Skyrim workshop.

I guess i expected too much? Now im sad and not caring about the foundry anymore.

yes foundry is a dungeon creator.. nothing like skyrims worksop where you basically can make anything you want... this type of creator is a perfect fit for a D&D dungeon crawler MMO game though

i thought Neverwinter nights had a also a more in depth modding workshop. Maybe im wrong, but thanks anyway. Ive been so spoiled with Skyrim's workshop that for some reason the comments by cryptic (and players) praising the foundry made me think it was something like beyond a dungeon creator.

nwn did also but again that was mostly for single player or LAN stuff not for a MMO.. not sure how a workshop like skyrims would really work in this type of game

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  Arglebargle

Elite Member

Joined: 6/13/07
Posts: 1187

4/08/13 8:42:50 PM#28
NeverWinter will live or die on the quality of the Foundry missions.

If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.

  drakaena

Novice Member

Joined: 1/11/06
Posts: 508

4/08/13 8:47:55 PM#29

I compare playing Neverwinter to watching The Hobbit. If you come into it expecting it to stay true to the original, then you are going to walk away disappointed. But if you step back and let go of your biased, you can appreciate it for what it is.

It's not D&D. But it is an action CORPG/MMO (I dunno what's what anymore) with a familar setting and cast of characters.

I loved the original NWN. Some of the best times I ever had online gaming, was played in that game, doing nothing more than sitting around a tavern.

This has less RP appeal, but can turn into a really fun Dungeon Crawler. And that's how I will view it;  A Forgotten Realms themed Dungeon Crawler.

  rojoArcueid

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/13/09
Posts: 5825

"It is double pleasure to deceive the deceiver". - Niccolo Machiavelli

4/08/13 8:58:36 PM#30
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by rojo6934
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by rojo6934

nwn did also but again that was mostly for single player or LAN stuff not for a MMO.. not sure how a workshop like skyrims would really work in this type of game

ah ok.

well it could work with client side mods that can only be seen by people who have the same mod installed. Plus the persistent dungeon creator already in existence.

But its fine. Nobody at cryptic said the foundry was going to be that indepth. That was just me.

  godzilr1

Novice Member

Joined: 10/09/06
Posts: 552

4/08/13 9:24:37 PM#31
If it takes place 50 years before... how are people dead and buried?
  godzilr1

Novice Member

Joined: 10/09/06
Posts: 552

4/08/13 9:26:55 PM#32
Dupe post
  gaeanprayer

Novice Member

Joined: 8/06/08
Posts: 2360

4/08/13 9:41:39 PM#33

In this case a 'cursory glance' was clearly not enough. These are not as close to the 4th ed ruleset as is suggested. You START a 4th ed character with similar skill choices and options, it STARTS feeling comparable, but later in the lifespan of a 4th ed character they end up with far more choices and versatility in their builds that allow for much more diversification than is offered in Neverwinter Online. For example, at level 30 (the highest I got in Neverwinter Beta) I SHOULD have had  3 class encounter powers, 1 paragon encounter power, 3 dailies, 1 paragon daily, 5 utility powers, 1 paragon utility, 1 Epic utility, not including your two at-wills of course.

 

That's why, despite roles also existing in 4.0 pnp, there is no differentiating within the classes outside of what the player specifically decides his build will incorporate, ie, there's no caster cleric, ranged cleric, melee cleric, etc., in an official capacity, there is only a Cleric and how people choose to play them. At its core, 4.0 is still DnD. Neverwinter is not.

 

This kind of info is within the first 20 pages of a dnd manual by the way. Or here:

 

http://www.wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4ex/20080416a

 

Edit - Couldn't find a list of available Spells outside of the books, but some googling would easily lead to forum discussion about the assortment of available spells at any particular level tier.

"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."

  Shroom_Mage

Novice Member

Joined: 9/21/05
Posts: 871

It's all or nothin'!

4/08/13 9:41:53 PM#34


Originally posted by Yamota
According to Wikipedia:

Massively multiplayer online role-playing game (MMORPG) (muh'-mor-puh-guh) is...


I'm more concerned about that ridiculous pronunciation.

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." -Dr. Seuss

  Gyrus

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/20/07
Posts: 2324

4/08/13 9:53:07 PM#35

I would like to address this quote from the article

There is no question that Neverwinter fits every part of that definition. Are there instances? Are there a LOT of instances? You better believe it. But in between all of those instances, there are large areas to explore and to interact with other players in. There are gathering spots, places to cooperatively quest and much more, all while thousands of players are simultaneously connected to the game. If that’s not an MMO, what is?

=

 there are large areas to explore and to interact with other players in.

I love that word "LARGE".

For those that don't remember I am that nerd who used to argue the size of MMO game worlds

This is one of the many many threads on the subject http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/2587797#2587797

FWIW one of the worlds I have info on is Cryptic's Champions Online.  So I have seen this game engine.  A lot of people claimed that CO was "huge" too.

But the thing is our perception of distance and size (particularly in virtual words) is often wrong.  This is because one of the things that influences our perception of distance is how hard it is to get somewhere.  IOW a world with lots of wandering mobs can seem far bigger than a world with none.

So, when Champions Online was new I actually 'measured' it in comparison to some other games and this was the result

 

Well, FWIW I had a tour around Canada tonight.

What surprised me most was thet even on foot my character moved very fast and had no difficulty with most slopes (except the very steepest ones)

Results:

Canada E-W (along south edge of map) 7:00 mins to run 80% of the way.  Had to stop because mountains in SW corner are too steep. 
So... 8.75 mins to travel across Canada W-E.

Traveled S-N along west edge of map (east edge might be better?) 4:00 minutes for 50% of the way.
So...8:00 mins to travel across Canada N-S.

So, Canada instance is about 8 min x 8 min on foot.

Additional

Managaged to do a run around MillenuimCity last night with the following results:
Ran 33% of the way from West to East (before dyiing - Level 10 Force Character) took 4 minutes
Estimate of total time W-E 12 minutes

Running North to South 100% of the way in 5 minutes.

So Millenium City 12 minutes x 5 minutes.

So the total size of the game world is:
Tutorial 3min x 1.5 min
Desert and Canada 8 min x 8 min each
Millenium City 12 min x 5 min
Monster Island and others not yet measured.

But based on what is measured to put it in context:
CO is about 1/5th the size of PotBS
or about 1/25th the size of WoW (actually smaller since there have been some new continents added recently)
or about 1/150th the size of Darkfall
or about 1/5000ththe size of the playable area of  WWIIoL

Please remember though – this is an out and out size comparison – it does NOT refer to content or game 'fun'.

Please remember this is old data now as WoW has had at least two(?) expansions since then but the point still stands. The Cryptic engine produces worlds that only seem big. In reality they are actually some of the smallest MMO worlds out there.  You only think they are big because you spend a lot of time doing "fed ex" and "kill mob X" quests - which keeps you busy.

=

There are gathering spots, places to cooperatively quest and much more, all while thousands of players are simultaneously connected to the game. If that’s not an MMO, what is?

Do you want me to dig up my link to "FARMTOWN vs MMORPG.com"?

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/247530/page/1

The Cryptic Engine is "Instance director software" for a graphical lobby game.

It's a step backward in what is defined as an MMO game.

Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.

  Arshoon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/29/05
Posts: 66

4/08/13 9:54:17 PM#36

I have personally boycotted this game. It was intended to be NWN3, and the NWN community is still big, was like 5 million people at one point if I remember right. NWN was a fantastic way for DMs and players to share their vision of their worlds. People could make adventures in the toolset and share them as well as content hak packs. There still is an NWN section hosted on ign.

Obsidian tried with NWN2 to follow the legacy and failed, mostly with poor planning and implementation (the worst idea was to use Granny to export 3D animations, a VERY expensive program).

When I heard NC Soft was purchased by Perfect World Entertainment and they turned the beloved NWN into a F2P POS MMO, the community was in outrage. But I guess that all got lost on the MMO crowd.

You can have this piece of crap. Its not what it should have been, and PW can suck a fat one for thinking everyhting needs to be an MMO.

If you aren't actively part of the solution, you have no right to complain about anything.

  GreenHell

Novice Member

Joined: 11/27/05
Posts: 1342

4/08/13 9:58:32 PM#37
Originally posted by Jerek_

The same comments about being an MMO or not were made about swtor.  I didn't understand before I played that game how someone could claim it wasn't an MMO- clearly by the definition both tor and neverwinter are MMO's.  But the technical definition is lacking because TOR proved its possible to satisfy those requirements without delivering anything that feels massively multiplayer.

The "neverwinter isn't D&D" complaint is probably a similar issue for many D&D fans.  Clearly Neverwinter is a D&D product, but that doesn't mean playing it will feel the least bit D&D to them.  Just because somthing meets a technical definition doesn't mean it captures the essence of a thing.

This. Well said.

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 6122

4/08/13 10:06:34 PM#38
Originally posted by Arshoon

I have personally boycotted this game. It was intended to be NWN3, and the NWN community is still big, was like 5 million people at one point if I remember right. NWN was a fantastic way for DMs and players to share their vision of their worlds. People could make adventures in the toolset and share them as well as content hak packs. There still is an NWN section hosted on ign.

Obsidian tried with NWN2 to follow the legacy and failed, mostly with poor planning and implementation (the worst idea was to use Granny to export 3D animations, a VERY expensive program).

When I heard NC Soft was purchased by Perfect World Entertainment and they turned the beloved NWN into a F2P POS MMO, the community was in outrage. But I guess that all got lost on the MMO crowd.

You can have this piece of crap. Its not what it should have been, and PW can suck a fat one for thinking everyhting needs to be an MMO.

Just in case your TARDIS fell through an inter-dimensional rift... PWE didn't purchase NCSoft.  Nexon bought a major stake in them.  I remember the game being multi-player, but never an officially announced NWN sequel.  This isn't NWN3.  It's just 4ed D&D:Neverwinter.

Curse you AquaScum!

  Nemesis7884

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/21/10
Posts: 572

4/09/13 12:12:22 AM#39
Its fun, its frer, its awesome....if it doesnt feel like dnd to you doesnt mean its not, it cab simply mean you still stuck in dnd 3.5 which it isnt - thanks god - neverwinter is great game for what it is, fun with friends - lot more than tor - fun combat, great environments and - im sure - great user content to come. If xou want a sandbox play one...but thats what most people dont want either cause they feel lost, complicated, unfinished with very few good ones..and please stopp with that crap of "its not the longterm game im looking for". Thats what people tell themself with eeeevery mmo like tor, like gw2; and then stop playing after 6 months...it just doesnt happen so accept games as wbat they are - a temporary entertainment - and youre going to have a lot of fun without making it a philosophy
  Nemesis7884

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/21/10
Posts: 572

4/09/13 12:13:21 AM#40
Its fun its free...dont make games to more and gaming more complicated than what it is
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