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Vanguard: Saga of Heroes

Vanguard: Saga of Heroes 

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36 posts found
  VengeSunsoar

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/10/04
Posts: 4850

Be Brief, Be Bright... Be Gone.

4/13/13 4:52:19 PM#21
Other than open dungeons what freedom does Vanguard have that WoW doesn't?

Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  mrbungle419

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/16/06
Posts: 23

4/14/13 4:49:13 PM#22
Originally posted by Goldknyght
Originally posted by Everket
Maybe I don't know what grind means, but playing the game doing quests and instances is grinding?

You will have to keep doing something to acheive your goal repeatedly over and over again. One example is the quest for Wardship Armor , you will need to farm out runes, armor peices, and candles. Well the items you need wont drop on every mob you kill, they drop on every 10th mob you kill or even 20th. On top of that its random for which peice you will even receive. So you will just be killing the same mob over and over again till you get all the peices you need. On top of that, in order to even get the armor you will need 2000 for the first 3 peices and they start you at -2000 faction and each mob you kill gives you only +6. There is a repeatable quest u can grab that will give you 1000 a turn in but it requires you to kill 50 of the requested mobs each time.

So in other words when you start to do this armor quest line you will have to grind your faction to get the armor.

And if you attempt to do all the wardship quests you will out level the rewards before you get them unless you turn off your XP.  I know that most of the armot pieces were completely useless to me by the time I got them (on my later toons, not when the game first released and XP rates were slower and XP penalties were bigger).

 

The game just isn't tuned very well, but the leveling dungeons are fantastic so long as you find groups that don't want to cheese them (carry your tombstone to nameds, fly to specific points in the dungeon, etc).

  DavisFlight

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2592

4/14/13 4:56:27 PM#23
Originally posted by VengeSunsoar
Other than open dungeons what freedom does Vanguard have that WoW doesn't?

The class system, the quest system, the auxillary class systems, the crafting system, the sailing system, the diplomacy system, they're all a lot more open, and deeper, than WoW.

  ketzerei

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/06/11
Posts: 48

4/14/13 5:00:25 PM#24

Vanguard IS very worthwhile, however, its a bit of a time sink to level up as the low level population is still a bit low. And doing solo content wont give you the top notch group gear from leveling or let you see the content that makes vanguard really shine: namely its non-instanced group content. I do have some lower level toons there, if you want to give it a go I could probably re-install it to help ya level a bit.

EQ2 is horrid to start fresh in these days. There's nobody under 90 that isnt an alt, and you wont be doing much but solo until 90.

EQ1, on fippy darkpaw, is in darkhollow at the moment. PoR vote is open, so it'll be at LEAST 2 weeks before PoR launch. If you want a funtastic game to play raid and group in THIS is the era in which to restart in EQ1. Fippy requires a sub however, whereas on EQ2 and VG I would recommend playing f2p until you near level cap and then subbing.

  koboldfodder

Novice Member

Joined: 9/18/04
Posts: 367

4/14/13 5:19:17 PM#25

Vanguard was supposed to be an upgraded version of EQ, but obviously it tanked from day one because of massive technical problems....most of which are gone and have been gone for a couple of years.  There are some problems that are inherent with the graphical engine.  World objects pop into view from much shorter distances that you would expect, and the chunking issues still remain.  No way to avoid those two things.

 

But the fixed a ton, added a fair amount and it is a better than average game.  It is not a solo game.  If that is what you want, try EQ2.  Vanguard is still very much a game that takes time and is difficult or almost impossible to solo some areas/levels.  Also, not many people play the game.  Obviously, that is a major issue when playing a game that requires grouping for many areas and many levels. 

 

The graphics are totally outdated.  They were excellent at one point, but that day has long since past.  The guy in charge of the game was Brad McQuiad (of EQ fame) and if you read about his time with Vanguard there were some pretty bad stuff going on behind the scenes.  SOE bought it, didn't really know what to do with it, then began looking under the hood of the game and tried to fix things as they went along trying to revive a dead game.  The failed for the most part not because the stuff they put it didn't work, it certainly did, people just stopped playing or went to other games.

 

What you find in Vanguard is three distinct things that are not in any fantasy MMO that is still alive.  One, is the crafting.  While it is not the best crafting system, it certainly ranks among the best.  You can just be a crafter and your stuff is wanted at any level....provided that there are people playing at all levels (which there is not..lol).  Two, the classes are all stellar classes.  This game ranks up there with LOTRO in terms of class fun-ness.  The healer classes are the best in any fantasy MMO.  They are all excellent, and the disciple is one of the great MMO classes of all time.  Three is the diplomacy system.  It is not as in depth as the other two systems, but if you like to read and like to play dress up this is the class for you.  Now, the actual lore of the game is a total joke and it takes a big grind to do the class, but I had a lot of fun just doing the Diplomacy web quests.  No other MMO has this.

 

Would I reccomend Vanguard?  Nope.  It's day is done and has been.  Yes, it is free to play but honestly there are a few games on the horizon that might be worth waiting for in terms of early Beta access.  Besides if you liked Vanguard, that means you loved EQ1 and that means you are totally looking forward to EQ Next....and we will get some type of huge update in August.

 

However, if you have a groupf of three or more firends that are looking for a game I would pick this one as your filler game.  But it soulds like you are looking for a solo type of game, this is not the game you are looking for, there are better out there.

  Adamantine

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/07/08
Posts: 3346

War is not the ultima ratio, but the ultima irratio - Willy Brandt

4/15/13 2:23:39 AM#26

> "Vanguard was supposed to be an upgraded version of EQ"

[mod edit] Vanguard is not an "upgraded version of EQ". They are the same kind of game, but so is WoW, and there are just as many differences between Vanguard and EQ as are between Vanguard and WoW and EQ and WoW. WoW isnt an upgraded version of EQ, either.

 

[mod edit]
  User Deleted
4/15/13 3:39:52 AM#27
Originally posted by Adamantine

> "Vanguard was supposed to be an upgraded version of EQ"

[mod edit] Vanguard is not an "upgraded version of EQ". They are the same kind of game, but so is WoW, and there are just as many differences between Vanguard and EQ as are between Vanguard and WoW and EQ and WoW. WoW isnt an upgraded version of EQ, either.

 

[mod edit]

Trollish as this post is he is kind of right... I jumped onto vanguard for a bit last week to check it out, did a few quests and within the starter zone (not that isle thingy) I ran into 4-5 different people in the span of 1 hour doing quests (they were funnily enough my own level) so this game isn't dead, it isn't populated nearly enough I grant you that but it does seem to be gaining steam slowly, maybe given a little luck and time it'll blossom and SOE will notice and start investing into it more heavily again.

  Adamantine

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/07/08
Posts: 3346

War is not the ultima ratio, but the ultima irratio - Willy Brandt

4/15/13 7:10:10 AM#28
Theres nothing trolling about my posting, in fact I completely avoided the whole issue because the person I was answering to has clearly no idea about what they're talking and I'm not wasting my time trying to convince them otherwise.
  VengeSunsoar

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/10/04
Posts: 4850

Be Brief, Be Bright... Be Gone.

4/15/13 4:43:41 PM#29
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by VengeSunsoar
Other than open dungeons what freedom does Vanguard have that WoW doesn't?

The class system, the quest system, the auxillary class systems, the crafting system, the sailing system, the diplomacy system, they're all a lot more open, and deeper, than WoW.

Ok, how are any of those systems more open and deeper, excepting the sailing and diplomacy of course.

Your still locked into classes, quests are the same IMO.  Crafting... hmm it is more involved and yes deeper than wow, but how does that give you more freedom?

edit - likely I didn't get far enough to know anything about this, but what is the auxillary class system?  is that an Alt. Advance like in EQ/2?

on 3rd thought with crafting of ships and houses I'll definately give you that one. 

Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  Adamantine

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/07/08
Posts: 3346

War is not the ultima ratio, but the ultima irratio - Willy Brandt

4/16/13 7:09:59 AM#30

Hrr was my posting really that offensive ? Some mod edited it.

Dunno about "open". Whats supposed to be "open" there ? Vanguard is a classic MMO. That includes a tradtitional class system. There are some subclasses (for certain adventuring classes), but there is no alternative advancement or how it is called. They once thought about it, but apparently they just lack the developer power to implement it.

Dont know how the game really compares in gameplay to WoW. After all, I avoided WoW for its graphic looks. So all I know is bits and pieces and hearsay.

I met a lot of people ingame that told me Vanguard dungeons and raids are awesome, compared to other games.

I know also a lot of people who stated WoW is too trivial because it can be scripted. I.e. you can just keep mashing one and the same button (or get a keyboard that does said button mashing). I read an amusing story about one gamer who got a full raid force in WoW and successfully raided with that. Another funny YouTube was one gamer linking every button on his keyboard to one and the same macro, and then just rolling his face on the keyboard, winning second place in total dps.

Vanguard only has relatively limited scripting.

I can also say from what is published about WoW that the classes are simpler, i.e. have less abilities total. Personally I was bored out of my mind after three days of playing GW1 because there just wasnt much to think about what buttons to press; it was just 8 total and thats all. In Vanguard, I need months to get used to really playing a class. Theres just so much stuff to think about.

 

 

  Doogiehowser

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/14/12
Posts: 1954

4/16/13 7:13:01 AM#31
You will miss a lot of content in vanguard because of thin and spread out population. I play MMOS for group play, yes i like to solo but in vaguard it was just soloing all the way to level cap by missing loads of group content.

"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.'
-Jesse Schell

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  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 12401

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, ArcheAge, and Combat Arms

4/16/13 7:14:33 AM#32
Originally posted by Goldknyght
Originally posted by Everket
Okay? but that is just one quest, how can you say the whole game is a grind? And I'm pretty sure you don't have to do that quest. But maybe I'm misunderstanding your meaning.

are you bleeping stupid?? that was an example!

I thought it was a reasonable question. It seemed like you were trying to say the whole game is repetitive and grindy, when it's really only some of the higher level stuff and that stuff is optional.

 

"And wikipedia is as accurate as Britannica. Wikipedia is very reliable. You would be hard pressed to find a more reliable source for these kinds of things." -fivoroth

  kevjards

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/27/10
Posts: 1447

4/16/13 7:22:08 AM#33
Originally posted by asyndeton

So I am in a time of life where I have more time than I want to have. This is good and bad, but one good thing is I can try games that I previously didn't.

Now enters the real problem, finding a game.

I've been looking forward to Archage and such, EQNext seems to look interesting.

I started with EQ1, played EQ2 for a long time.

 

I guess the point I am trying to get at, is Vanguard worth looking in to? I dont really know much about what seems to be a muddled history of the game. However, it has some features that I really like, Player Housing, large class options, crafting, etc.

 

Well, I will probably try it out anyway, any suggestions for a beginner? Or anyone want to play with? (PS I am pretty casual when it comes to gameplay)

Vanguard is an exceptionally deep game from the crafting system which is insanely brilliant to diplomacy and then you have your pve side of things..there is enough content in game for you to do 1 char and it would probably take you 18 months to do all the content,depending how much you play..the gfx are good for its age,the combat is well not brilliant but its ok.

there is tons of stuff to do.explore..neverending list of dungeons..their are raids.but my favourite was the crafting..its so deep.now saying that its not everyones cup of tea but it is f2p.so you have nothing to lose by giving it a shot.

also someone mentioned about a server being shut down.well most people never used that server..its litterally been empty for about 1 year.most transfered their toons to telon server.anyways give it a go..get in a good guild because for a lot of the game you will need groups.

  Adamantine

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/07/08
Posts: 3346

War is not the ultima ratio, but the ultima irratio - Willy Brandt

4/18/13 1:44:57 AM#34
Originally posted by kevjards

[...] the combat is well not brilliant but its ok.

What the heck ? Vanguard has amazing combat. Better than any other game I've ever played.

Neither Baldurs Gate 1+2, Wizardry 8, Planescape: Torment Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic, Vampire: The Masquerade: Bloodlines (the combat system is trivialistic but felt a lot more interesting in actual gameplay), Neverwinter Nights, Neverwinter Nights 2 (two very different games from different companies, thus I wont just write 1+2), TES4 Morrowind, TES5 Oblivion, The Witcher (that one has a throughoutly disappointing combat system), Lineage 2, Diablo 2, certainly not Guild Wars (omg the combat there was so super boring), certainly not Dragon Age (hard to believe it was Bioware who came up with this awful rulesystem) nor any other game I've ever come across or read about offered such interactive combat with so many layers and so many things to consider.

In no other game I can play a class for months and suddenly find out another detail about it of how I can play it even more efficiently.

If you think its "just ok" then please point out what the frak would still be missing. And dont come up with "but it doesnt play like one of these wonderful twitch based shooter games" because yes, *this* is a *real* MMORPG.

 

  Adamantine

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/07/08
Posts: 3346

War is not the ultima ratio, but the ultima irratio - Willy Brandt

4/18/13 2:08:24 AM#35
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Goldknyght
Originally posted by Everket
Okay? but that is just one quest, how can you say the whole game is a grind? And I'm pretty sure you don't have to do that quest. But maybe I'm misunderstanding your meaning.

are you bleeping stupid?? that was an example!

I thought it was a reasonable question. It seemed like you were trying to say the whole game is repetitive and grindy, when it's really only some of the higher level stuff and that stuff is optional.

If you want best equipment on all levels, yes there are definitely some grinds. Not "omg I want to get on a rampage this is so boring I'm doing this since weeks" grinds, but definitely "grr I will have to spend some hours on this" grinds and "well, I should do this repeateable quest again so I get the final reward at some point in the future" grinds.

For example, to get the Wardship armor, which is about level 35, you need to do the Vol Tuniel and Thelassen dungeons. In fact, you have to do them once, then get another quest and return for a second run. But doing dungeons, especially of a complex handmade design, doesnt really qualify as "grind" to me.

The grindiest I can think of right now is Xenn items. They give stuff like invisibility and levitation and waterbreathing, though, so, depending upon your class, they are just wonderful to have and huge rewards at the end of the grind.

Calling the whole game grindy though sounds really riddiculous to me.

First of all, even if you do all "grinds" in this game, it still feels perfectly grind free for somebody coming from Lineage 2. Now THAT was a game that was really grindy. There you could spend weeks on getting a single drop from one single mob, with just a bit of bad luck even months.

Second, there are tons of different stuff to do in Vanguard. In the adventuring sphere alone I think there has been thousands of quests in the game at release and they're still all there. Also, if you are bored with adventuring, you can do harvest or crafting or diplomacy or fishing. So, if you dont like grinds, well then dont do them. There is just TONS of other content available.

 

  zhandao

Novice Member

Joined: 11/07/06
Posts: 47

4/19/13 5:34:45 PM#36
Originally posted by Adamantine
Originally posted by kevjards

[...] the combat is well not brilliant but its ok.

What the heck ? Vanguard has amazing combat. Better than any other game I've ever played.

Neither Baldurs Gate 1+2, Wizardry 8, Planescape: Torment Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic, Vampire: The Masquerade: Bloodlines (the combat system is trivialistic but felt a lot more interesting in actual gameplay), Neverwinter Nights, Neverwinter Nights 2 (two very different games from different companies, thus I wont just write 1+2), TES4 Morrowind, TES5 Oblivion, The Witcher (that one has a throughoutly disappointing combat system), Lineage 2, Diablo 2, certainly not Guild Wars (omg the combat there was so super boring), certainly not Dragon Age (hard to believe it was Bioware who came up with this awful rulesystem) nor any other game I've ever come across or read about offered such interactive combat with so many layers and so many things to consider.

In no other game I can play a class for months and suddenly find out another detail about it of how I can play it even more efficiently.

If you think its "just ok" then please point out what the frak would still be missing. And dont come up with "but it doesnt play like one of these wonderful twitch based shooter games" because yes, *this* is a *real* MMORPG.

 

Looks like someone needs to play Temple of Elemental Evil

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