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229 posts found
  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3469

3/14/13 2:07:54 PM#61
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by jimdandy26
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Iselin

 

For me, personally, I don't like the concept of resetting the RvR and having a new emperor every 2 weeks. I would prefer more permanence, the faction leader NPC--not some player--being the emperoro and staying that way until forcibly dethroned.

 

SOLD!!!!

 

Except that is completely counter to the very compition that the game is designed around to move forward. Mechanics come before fluff.

It still works.

Players can compete for whoever wins the seat, the Faction Leader NPC is then seated and this means benefits to the winning faction.

It's somewhat similiar to the Lineage 2 Dawn/Dusk competion in that the winning side gets benefits that then carry over to their side.

 

What would be cool is if a larger then life NPC of you was in the middle of the Cyrodiil castle as emperoro. Larger then life in raid boss size and had your skill set and armor and guild talbard. And to claim Cyrodiil the last thing needed doing was to kill the NPC raid boss of you. 

EDIT: Would keep raiding Cyrodiil fresh as you would not need to kill the same generic NPCs

  jimdandy26

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/28/12
Posts: 559

3/14/13 2:08:31 PM#62
Originally posted by sapphen
Originally posted by jimdandy26

Says the guy that has thrown a temper tantrum for two weeks while being fed by a handful of others about "ruining the Tes ip" but just admitted that you have no idea how many of these mechanics are really going to work because you have not played with them at all? Really?

What temper tanturm are you talking about?   I admitted that I didn't know anything about PvE but we're not even talking about that.  Are you being hostile because I called you dandyman?

[mod edit]

You are the worst kind of fanboy. There is nothing in the "lore" that prevents anything they are doing, and even if there were they have every right to retcon it. Virtually any ip works in pretty much any genre, Star Wars shows that if nothing else. Can you please stop hijacking topics now sewing your doom and gloom garbage?

There is plenty in the lore that works against what they are doing.  There are 3 sets of races (who don't entirely get along with themselves) who suddenly align behind a Breton Merchant Lord, Nord High King and a young Altmer Queen.

...funny, it seems like you're the one trying to hijack topics.

Strictly, sure. Its not realistic that ALL of a given race would unite. However, mechanics trumps fluff. There is a reason even now you will find so many absurd fights on the internet, pirates vs ninjas, superman vs goku, horde vs alliance, star wars vs star trek, team jacob vs team edward. Why? Becuase being part of an easily identifiable team brings out the herd mentality in us. It helps us belong. It also helps that easily identifying races by looks will tell you ally vs enemy, often faster than mere colors, or healthbars will. Its programmed into us instinctually. Hurray for evolution.  and yeah, considering that your little handful have hijacked oh 10 or so topics now I am quite fine with those who actually want to discuss things kicking ya'll out of one for once. Taste of your own medicine is good for you. Those who yell loudest and all that.

I did battle with ignorance today, and ignorance won.

To exercise power costs effort and demands courage. That is why so many fail to assert rights to which they are perfectly entitled - because a right is a kind of power but they are too lazy or too cowardly to exercise it. The virtues which cloak these faults are called patience and forbearance.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17242

3/14/13 2:12:31 PM#63
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by jimdandy26
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Iselin

 

For me, personally, I don't like the concept of resetting the RvR and having a new emperor every 2 weeks. I would prefer more permanence, the faction leader NPC--not some player--being the emperoro and staying that way until forcibly dethroned.

 

SOLD!!!!

 

Except that is completely counter to the very compition that the game is designed around to move forward. Mechanics come before fluff.

It still works.

Players can compete for whoever wins the seat, the Faction Leader NPC is then seated and this means benefits to the winning faction.

It's somewhat similiar to the Lineage 2 Dawn/Dusk competion in that the winning side gets benefits that then carry over to their side.

 

What would be cool is if a larger then life NPC of you was in the middle of the Cyrodiil castle as emperoro. Larger then life in raid boss size and had your skill set and armor and guild talbard. And to claim Cyrodiil the last thing needed doing was to kill the NPC raid boss of you. 

Well what about this, as long as we are cloud talking...

the NPC emperor is seated and the guild that contributed the most gets certain perks, one of them being the guild leader gets expanded abilities thus making him/her more of a "raid boss". The guild leader essentially becomes the Emperoro's Protector of the Realm and the guild becomes the emperor's special elite force army.

Archlord gives the "Archlord" expanded abilities and controls and I believe makes them tougher.

In lineage 2, a player can find one of two demon swords which make them pretty close to a raid boss. I've even seen one go up against a raid boss.

I don't see why a simliar mechanic can't be used here.

  User Deleted
3/14/13 2:14:58 PM#64
People keep acting like the dev's just blundered into the currect design, but nobody seems to consider that maybe they designed it this way for a reason?
  jimdandy26

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/28/12
Posts: 559

3/14/13 2:16:37 PM#65
Originally posted by Sovrath
Well what about this, as long as we are cloud talking...

the NPC emperor is seated and the guild that contributed the most gets certain perks, one of them being the guild leader gets expanded abilities thus making him/her more of a "raid boss". The guild leader essentially becomes the Emperoro's Protector of the Realm and the guild becomes the emperor's special elite force army.

Archlord gives the "Archlord" expanded abilities and controls and I believe makes them tougher.

In lineage 2, a player can find one of two demon swords which make them pretty close to a raid boss. I've even seen one go up against a raid boss.

I don't see why a simliar mechanic can't be used here.

Because rewarding a single person for a group effort does not go over well when the vast majority of your playerbase are selfish twats. Its the same reason why we are moving away from "kill stealing" in pve etc.

I did battle with ignorance today, and ignorance won.

To exercise power costs effort and demands courage. That is why so many fail to assert rights to which they are perfectly entitled - because a right is a kind of power but they are too lazy or too cowardly to exercise it. The virtues which cloak these faults are called patience and forbearance.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17242

3/14/13 2:16:52 PM#66
Originally posted by asmkm22
People keep acting like the dev's just blundered into the currect design, but nobody seems to consider that maybe they designed it this way for a reason?

I don't think anyone thinks they blundered into this design and I believe that everyone thinks they designed it for a reason.

  jimdandy26

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/28/12
Posts: 559

3/14/13 2:17:10 PM#67
Originally posted by asmkm22
People keep acting like the dev's just blundered into the currect design, but nobody seems to consider that maybe they designed it this way for a reason?

DING DING DING we have a winrar.

I did battle with ignorance today, and ignorance won.

To exercise power costs effort and demands courage. That is why so many fail to assert rights to which they are perfectly entitled - because a right is a kind of power but they are too lazy or too cowardly to exercise it. The virtues which cloak these faults are called patience and forbearance.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17242

3/14/13 2:18:27 PM#68
Originally posted by jimdandy26
Originally posted by Sovrath
Well what about this, as long as we are cloud talking...

the NPC emperor is seated and the guild that contributed the most gets certain perks, one of them being the guild leader gets expanded abilities thus making him/her more of a "raid boss". The guild leader essentially becomes the Emperoro's Protector of the Realm and the guild becomes the emperor's special elite force army.

Archlord gives the "Archlord" expanded abilities and controls and I believe makes them tougher.

In lineage 2, a player can find one of two demon swords which make them pretty close to a raid boss. I've even seen one go up against a raid boss.

I don't see why a simliar mechanic can't be used here.

Because rewarding a single person for a group effort does not go over well when the vast majority of your playerbase are selfish twats. Its the same reason why we are moving away from "kill stealing" in pve etc.

Well of course that is a good point though there are games that do allow for this level of competition. But look, even Tera allows for a guild leader to be elected and that guild leader is granted abilities as well as the tax money taken from players. It's not really beyond the scope of imagination.

And now that I thnk about it, in Aion, your faction takes a fortress but only one guild is the fortress leader.

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3469

3/14/13 2:20:37 PM#69
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by jimdandy26
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Iselin

 

For me, personally, I don't like the concept of resetting the RvR and having a new emperor every 2 weeks. I would prefer more permanence, the faction leader NPC--not some player--being the emperoro and staying that way until forcibly dethroned.

 

SOLD!!!!

 

Except that is completely counter to the very compition that the game is designed around to move forward. Mechanics come before fluff.

It still works.

Players can compete for whoever wins the seat, the Faction Leader NPC is then seated and this means benefits to the winning faction.

It's somewhat similiar to the Lineage 2 Dawn/Dusk competion in that the winning side gets benefits that then carry over to their side.

 

What would be cool is if a larger then life NPC of you was in the middle of the Cyrodiil castle as emperoro. Larger then life in raid boss size and had your skill set and armor and guild talbard. And to claim Cyrodiil the last thing needed doing was to kill the NPC raid boss of you. 

Well what about this, as long as we are cloud talking...

the NPC emperor is seated and the guild that contributed the most gets certain perks, one of them being the guild leader gets expanded abilities thus making him/her more of a "raid boss". The guild leader essentially becomes the Emperoro's Protector of the Realm and the guild becomes the emperor's special elite force army.

Archlord gives the "Archlord" expanded abilities and controls and I believe makes them tougher.

In lineage 2, a player can find one of two demon swords which make them pretty close to a raid boss. I've even seen one go up against a raid boss.

I don't see why a simliar mechanic can't be used here.

That would not fit with ESO model. They are shooting for equal footing in PvP battles. No PvP stats no PvP gear. Earn your gear in PvP or PvE and if you have top gear your all equal. I personally like to know when my butt is kicked in PvP it was because of skill.

  jimdandy26

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/28/12
Posts: 559

3/14/13 2:21:58 PM#70
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by jimdandy26
Originally posted by Sovrath
Well what about this, as long as we are cloud talking...

the NPC emperor is seated and the guild that contributed the most gets certain perks, one of them being the guild leader gets expanded abilities thus making him/her more of a "raid boss". The guild leader essentially becomes the Emperoro's Protector of the Realm and the guild becomes the emperor's special elite force army.

Archlord gives the "Archlord" expanded abilities and controls and I believe makes them tougher.

In lineage 2, a player can find one of two demon swords which make them pretty close to a raid boss. I've even seen one go up against a raid boss.

I don't see why a simliar mechanic can't be used here.

Because rewarding a single person for a group effort does not go over well when the vast majority of your playerbase are selfish twats. Its the same reason why we are moving away from "kill stealing" in pve etc.

Well of course that is a good point though there are games that do allow for this level of competition. But look, even Tera allows for a guild leader to be elected and that guild leader is granted abilities as well as the tax money taken from players. It's not really beyond the scope of imagination.

Both games you are pulling from are primairily from the east. Comunism and all that. All told setting it up that way is essentially shooting themselves in the foot considering the sheer number that will not compete at all if they do not believe that they have a shot. Now, that is all predicated on just how scores are tallied, accuracy, balance, etc etc.

I did battle with ignorance today, and ignorance won.

To exercise power costs effort and demands courage. That is why so many fail to assert rights to which they are perfectly entitled - because a right is a kind of power but they are too lazy or too cowardly to exercise it. The virtues which cloak these faults are called patience and forbearance.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17242

3/14/13 2:24:15 PM#71
all good points of course.
  sapphen

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/07
Posts: 918

3/14/13 2:38:22 PM#72
Originally posted by jimdandy26

[mod edit]

[mod edit]

Strictly, sure. Its not realistic that ALL of a given race would unite. However, mechanics trumps fluff. There is a reason even now you will find so many absurd fights on the internet, pirates vs ninjas, superman vs goku, horde vs alliance, star wars vs star trek, team jacob vs team edward. Why? Becuase being part of an easily identifiable team brings out the herd mentality in us. It helps us belong. It also helps that easily identifying races by looks will tell you ally vs enemy, often faster than mere colors, or healthbars will. Its programmed into us instinctually. Hurray for evolution.  and yeah, considering that your little handful have hijacked oh 10 or so topics now I am quite fine with those who actually want to discuss things kicking ya'll out of one for once. Taste of your own medicine is good for you. Those who yell loudest and all that.

Mechanics doesn't trump anything, in a well desigend game the mechanics, setting and fluffy fit naturally together.  If they are having to do a lot of retcon to fit the story into something else, then they should consider what direction they are going.

It's hard to identify someone by their race when they are fully decked out in armor w/helmet (unless you count tails).  TES games normally do not have faction pride, just because it worked in DAoC doesn't mean it's gonna work in ESO.

Kick us out of what?  I can barely figure out what you're trying to write but you don't have the authority to 'kick' us out of anything.  As for a taste of my own medicine... despite all the over-emotional rants that you spew my way, I have been nothing but civil to you.

[mod edit]

  sapphen

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/07
Posts: 918

3/14/13 2:42:45 PM#73
Originally posted by jimdandy26

Because rewarding a single person for a group effort does not go over well when the vast majority of your playerbase are selfish twats.

Isn't that the same thing the Emporer system is doing?  This is a group game, a player isn't going to be the top ranked player by playing by himself.

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3469

3/14/13 2:46:08 PM#74
Originally posted by sapphen
Originally posted by jimdandy26

Because rewarding a single person for a group effort does not go over well when the vast majority of your playerbase are selfish twats.

Isn't that the same thing the Emporer system is doing?  This is a group game, a player isn't going to be the top ranked player by playing by himself.

Different rewarding someone with a temp title over giving them a power boots in PvP. If you missed it on the last page it works like this... When a battle over Cyrodiil is won, they take up a tally of the winning side. DPS, Healing and what ever metrics they use to work that out, who ever gets the highest score is Emperoro. I think its kinda cool. I know I wont play enough to have that happen to me but would be cool IMO. 

A solo player has as much chance of winning the title as a team player.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17242

3/14/13 2:52:42 PM#75
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by sapphen
Originally posted by jimdandy26

Because rewarding a single person for a group effort does not go over well when the vast majority of your playerbase are selfish twats.

Isn't that the same thing the Emporer system is doing?  This is a group game, a player isn't going to be the top ranked player by playing by himself.

Different rewarding someone with a temp title over giving them a power boots in PvP. If you missed it on the last page it works like this... When a battle over Cyrodiil is won, they take up a tally of the winning side. DPS, Healing and what ever metrics they use to work that out, who ever gets the highest score is Emperoro. I think its kinda cool. I know I wont play enough to have that happen to me but would be cool IMO. 

A solo player has as much chance of winning the title as a team player.

hmmmm that's intriguing though weird.

  DavisFlight

Elite Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2586

3/14/13 2:56:05 PM#76
Originally posted by Maelwydd

Just make an alt. That's a far FAR simpler solution than the ugly bloody bandaid the OP suggested.

Simpler? Yes. Do I want to do that? No. Should I have to do that? No. Is it impossible to allow it? No.

And I don't want the devs to have to reconfigure the game to suit someone who is too lazy to make a second character.

And I don't want to have players from an enemy realm walking through my home, eating my food, adventuring with my friends, when all the lore of the game tells me that we should be enemies and killing one another.

It undermines the entire fucking game.

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3469

3/14/13 3:07:56 PM#77
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by sapphen
Originally posted by jimdandy26

Because rewarding a single person for a group effort does not go over well when the vast majority of your playerbase are selfish twats.

Isn't that the same thing the Emporer system is doing?  This is a group game, a player isn't going to be the top ranked player by playing by himself.

Different rewarding someone with a temp title over giving them a power boots in PvP. If you missed it on the last page it works like this... When a battle over Cyrodiil is won, they take up a tally of the winning side. DPS, Healing and what ever metrics they use to work that out, who ever gets the highest score is Emperoro. I think its kinda cool. I know I wont play enough to have that happen to me but would be cool IMO. 

A solo player has as much chance of winning the title as a team player.

hmmmm that's intriguing though weird.

I would say fair over weird. Why should solo or grouped or guildied members be rewarded better then the other group. Should be skill based IMO.

  eldaris

Novice Member

Joined: 6/21/06
Posts: 326

3/14/13 3:10:31 PM#78

Actually creating a second character just to see more of the game world destroys faction pride much more than the easy solution op proposed. Sadly I don't think any developer will listen, I saw how old daoc developers destroyed warhammer so I don't really expect from Firor to be able to do another hit game , most old school mmo developers seem to be one hit wonders.

  sapphen

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/07
Posts: 918

3/14/13 3:10:51 PM#79
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by sapphen
Originally posted by jimdandy26

Because rewarding a single person for a group effort does not go over well when the vast majority of your playerbase are selfish twats.

Isn't that the same thing the Emporer system is doing?  This is a group game, a player isn't going to be the top ranked player by playing by himself.

Different rewarding someone with a temp title over giving them a power boots in PvP. If you missed it on the last page it works like this... When a battle over Cyrodiil is won, they take up a tally of the winning side. DPS, Healing and what ever metrics they use to work that out, who ever gets the highest score is Emperoro. I think its kinda cool. I know I wont play enough to have that happen to me but would be cool IMO. 

A solo player has as much chance of winning the title as a team player.

hmmmm that's intriguing though weird.

I would say fair over weird. Why should solo or grouped or guildied members be rewarded better then the other group. Should be skill based IMO.

I wonder if it's also time based or only for hardcore players.  It just seems like this system is rewarding only a small percent of the population.

Plus, why doesn't the faction leaders want to be Emperor - I thought that was the whole reason for the war.

  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15626

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

3/14/13 3:11:05 PM#80

This really isn't any different than Sap's idea's, at least in the area of benefit to the games design. An explorer's add on if you will. Yet without the PVP.

While I see nothing wrong with adding that sort of thing, I wonder what tangible benefit it would have on the overall experience, not to mention the complaint about "doing it all on one character like TES does it". This is no fix for that.

Sapps idea at least made a bit more sense, as he had a gameplay element in mind, player formed wars and such.

This idea seems more on the novelty side, and I'm not sure novelty is an area we should be wanting development to be focusing on at the crucial point this game has entered. Beta is right around the corner, which means everything is just about in place.

That aside, I'm all for wishes and dreams, if I had my way everyone would be happy, but that's a dream in itself.

 

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

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