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General Discussion  » A Very Simple Solution...

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  Caliburn101

Novice Member

Joined: 3/30/11
Posts: 647

"Imagination is more important than knowledge." Albert Einstein

 
OP  3/14/13 11:08:46 AM#1

There is a lot of hype about how any kind of compromise on explorability and faction lock is impossible at this stage and would require so much change it will never be done.

But the answer to more exploration and no other consequences is not a complicated one.

The war is already completely illogical - faction leaders fighting over who is emperor and then giving it away because of a vote of their minions?

Please...

Invisible walls; 'just add water' instant mountain ranges (that crumble to nothing in later times); Hadrians Wall Mk 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9 ad nauseam... or however the absolute faction lock will 'work'.

The simple fact is - there are so many logical holes in the faction set-up already, why would intruducing another fairly mild one which consequently made TES-style exploration fans happier, be a problem?

Anyway...

... here it is.

1. Allow anyone to travel anywhere without being PvP flagged except in Cyrodil.

2. Add voiceovers which randomise a culturally flavoured insult or snide comment from guards and vendors whilst interracting with an enemy faction player. Make prices higher for enemy faction members etc.

"Come back here once we have beaten your faction in Cyrodil and I will shoot an arrow in YOUR knee - damn troll-brained Nords!"

3. Gate faction-only quests and dungeons (if and where they exist...)

"We need someone who has a chance of succeeding on this quest Bretonian, not some pint-sized southern weakling - now begone!"

Job done.

Easy.

The explanation? (as if the game really needs a logical one after the one used for the way the war works...)

The threat from Molag is too great to risk all-out, all-regional war. All the leaders agree. Thus outside of Cyrodil, enemies are bound not to fight one another. If orders from faction leaders isn't enough, let's say the Mages Guild did a ritual drawing on the power of Oblivion - a unique ability they have JUST FOR NOW as the anchors make the two realms closer than they have ever been. So magically, people can't fight except in Cyrodil, there Molag's proximity obstructs the ritual. Hell, maybe Molag set it up that way, maybe the Psijic Order did it with a Dwemer artefact - WHO CARES!

This is a relative doddle to program, makes about as much sense as any other part of the 'metaplot' already rolled out, and allows nearly full exploration without detracting from factional PvP one bit!

I for one will be at least as motivated to have 'factional pride' if the guards and vendors insults are good - probably more motivated than I would be just because the big bad enemy built some walls I wasn't allowed to go around...

  David_Lopan

Novice Member

Joined: 9/07/10
Posts: 815

"There is no progress. Everything is the same as it was. Form changes. The essence does not." RLS

3/14/13 11:25:05 AM#2
Yeah, that makes sense to me. Lets see what they do as this seems to be a hot topic. I would be suprisied if things go excatly as planned with the huge interest of total world exploration.
  sapphen

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/07
Posts: 920

3/14/13 11:32:23 AM#3
Originally posted by Caliburn101

1. Allow anyone to travel anywhere without being PvP flagged except in Cyrodil.

2. Add voiceovers which randomise a culturally flavoured insult or snide comment from guards and vendors whilst interracting with an enemy faction player. Make prices higher for enemy faction members etc.

3. Gate faction-only quests and dungeons (if and where they exist...)

The threat from Molag is too great to risk all-out, all-regional war. All the leaders agree. Thus outside of Cyrodil, enemies are bound not to fight one another.   This is a relative doddle to program, makes about as much sense as any other part of the 'metaplot' already rolled out, and allows nearly full exploration without detracting from factional PvP one bit!

I for one will be at least as motivated to have 'factional pride' if the guards and vendors insults are good - probably more motivated than I would be just because the big bad enemy built some walls I wasn't allowed to go around...

I like this idea, good post.

  Caliburn101

Novice Member

Joined: 3/30/11
Posts: 647

"Imagination is more important than knowledge." Albert Einstein

 
OP  3/14/13 11:37:50 AM#4
Originally posted by sapphen
Originally posted by Caliburn101

1. Allow anyone to travel anywhere without being PvP flagged except in Cyrodil.

2. Add voiceovers which randomise a culturally flavoured insult or snide comment from guards and vendors whilst interracting with an enemy faction player. Make prices higher for enemy faction members etc.

3. Gate faction-only quests and dungeons (if and where they exist...)

The threat from Molag is too great to risk all-out, all-regional war. All the leaders agree. Thus outside of Cyrodil, enemies are bound not to fight one another.   This is a relative doddle to program, makes about as much sense as any other part of the 'metaplot' already rolled out, and allows nearly full exploration without detracting from factional PvP one bit!

I for one will be at least as motivated to have 'factional pride' if the guards and vendors insults are good - probably more motivated than I would be just because the big bad enemy built some walls I wasn't allowed to go around...

I like this idea, good post.

I had a chat with my wife - who is herself a developer, and besides rolling her eyes and telling me there were still a fair number of variables, she said this would not be a big problem assuming (amongst a few lesser issues) that Zenimax's claim about most PvE content beng doable outside of questlines etc. was in fact accurate...

... and that the voice acting could be done within a month or two in parallel with other changes.

  Speely

Novice Member

Joined: 2/16/13
Posts: 864

3/14/13 11:39:08 AM#5
While I like your idea, the game is too far along for this. Maybe a seperate server sometime after release?

Or, you can assume that each "realm" will be as big as any other ES game (except Daggerfall lol) and that exploration will be there in spades. I've said it before, but you couldn't explore Elsewyr or Morrowind or Hammerfell in ES V: Skyrim. I was ok with that.

Balance. Alliance identity. Give it a chance. We can always bitch later (and probably will.)

http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/PerfArt

  Maelwydd

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/26/09
Posts: 1169

3/14/13 11:39:57 AM#6

It would be a vast improvement from my point of view.

But there is so much that is possible to improve the current design, doub't they are going to look at stuff like that. It falls too far outside their trying to copy DAOC design.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17627

3/14/13 11:43:28 AM#7

That was pretty much my solution as well.

 

  Caliburn101

Novice Member

Joined: 3/30/11
Posts: 647

"Imagination is more important than knowledge." Albert Einstein

 
OP  3/14/13 11:43:38 AM#8
Originally posted by PerfArt
While I like your idea, the game is too far along for this. Maybe a seperate server sometime after release?

Or, you can assume that each "realm" will be as big as any other ES game (except Daggerfall lol) and that exploration will be there in spades. I've said it before, but you couldn't explore Elsewyr or Morrowind or Hammerfell in ES V: Skyrim. I was ok with that.

Balance. Alliance identity. Give it a chance. We can always bitch later (and probably will.)

If Zenimax stated they would put in a server or megaserver shard with this set up within 6 months of launch I'd just about accept that.

I also suspect the migration to it would be HUGE...

  Maelwydd

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/26/09
Posts: 1169

3/14/13 11:44:01 AM#9
Originally posted by PerfArt
While I like your idea, the game is too far along for this. Maybe a seperate server sometime after release?

Or, you can assume that each "realm" will be as big as any other ES game (except Daggerfall lol) and that exploration will be there in spades. I've said it before, but you couldn't explore Elsewyr or Morrowind or Hammerfell in ES V: Skyrim. I was ok with that.

Balance. Alliance identity. Give it a chance. We can always bitch later (and probably will.)

Sorry but I simply get frustrated when people say changes cannot happen because of the time the game has been in development. If the game fails to work or has glaring problems, both gameplay or bugs, then things must be done. ANY project has a timeframe but at the same time you cannot ignore issues. The issues must be looked at and if neccessarry the project changed or even stopped.

The game is NOT too far along. Especially a damn MMO where development doesn't stop, even post release.

 

  Caliburn101

Novice Member

Joined: 3/30/11
Posts: 647

"Imagination is more important than knowledge." Albert Einstein

 
OP  3/14/13 11:48:29 AM#10
Originally posted by Maelwydd
Originally posted by PerfArt
While I like your idea, the game is too far along for this. Maybe a seperate server sometime after release?

Or, you can assume that each "realm" will be as big as any other ES game (except Daggerfall lol) and that exploration will be there in spades. I've said it before, but you couldn't explore Elsewyr or Morrowind or Hammerfell in ES V: Skyrim. I was ok with that.

Balance. Alliance identity. Give it a chance. We can always bitch later (and probably will.)

Sorry but I simply get frustrated when people say changes cannot happen because of the time the game has been in development. If the game fails to work or has glaring problems, both gameplay or bugs, then things must be done. ANY project has a timeframe but at the same time you cannot ignore issues. The issues must be looked at and if neccessarry the project changed or even stopped.

The game is NOT too far along. Especially a damn MMO where development doesn't stop, even post release.

 

There will always be those who claim 'it cannot be done'.

Fortunately, human history is replete with those who didn't agree...

... and thus we aren't living in caves, fire-hardening sharp sticks which we just found over fires started accidentally by lightning - because we thought that sharpening sticks or starting fire ourselves 'couldn't be done'...

  Maelwydd

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/26/09
Posts: 1169

3/14/13 11:53:17 AM#11
Originally posted by Caliburn101
Originally posted by Maelwydd
Originally posted by PerfArt
While I like your idea, the game is too far along for this. Maybe a seperate server sometime after release?

Or, you can assume that each "realm" will be as big as any other ES game (except Daggerfall lol) and that exploration will be there in spades. I've said it before, but you couldn't explore Elsewyr or Morrowind or Hammerfell in ES V: Skyrim. I was ok with that.

Balance. Alliance identity. Give it a chance. We can always bitch later (and probably will.)

Sorry but I simply get frustrated when people say changes cannot happen because of the time the game has been in development. If the game fails to work or has glaring problems, both gameplay or bugs, then things must be done. ANY project has a timeframe but at the same time you cannot ignore issues. The issues must be looked at and if neccessarry the project changed or even stopped.

The game is NOT too far along. Especially a damn MMO where development doesn't stop, even post release.

 

There will always be those who claim 'it cannot be done'.

Fortunately, human history is replete with those who didn't agree...

... and thus we aren't living in caves, fire-hardening sharp sticks which we just found over fires started accidentally by lighting - because we thought that sharpening sticks or starting fire ourselves 'couldn't be done'...

Yeah, working on projects and see them fail by project leads who have the same attitude gives me no tolerance for such narrowminded foolishness. At best their attitude wastes resources, at worse it makes a project fail or miss targets.

  Caliburn101

Novice Member

Joined: 3/30/11
Posts: 647

"Imagination is more important than knowledge." Albert Einstein

 
OP  3/14/13 11:56:10 AM#12
Originally posted by Maelwydd
Originally posted by Caliburn101
Originally posted by Maelwydd
Originally posted by PerfArt
While I like your idea, the game is too far along for this. Maybe a seperate server sometime after release?

Or, you can assume that each "realm" will be as big as any other ES game (except Daggerfall lol) and that exploration will be there in spades. I've said it before, but you couldn't explore Elsewyr or Morrowind or Hammerfell in ES V: Skyrim. I was ok with that.

Balance. Alliance identity. Give it a chance. We can always bitch later (and probably will.)

Sorry but I simply get frustrated when people say changes cannot happen because of the time the game has been in development. If the game fails to work or has glaring problems, both gameplay or bugs, then things must be done. ANY project has a timeframe but at the same time you cannot ignore issues. The issues must be looked at and if neccessarry the project changed or even stopped.

The game is NOT too far along. Especially a damn MMO where development doesn't stop, even post release.

 

There will always be those who claim 'it cannot be done'.

Fortunately, human history is replete with those who didn't agree...

... and thus we aren't living in caves, fire-hardening sharp sticks which we just found over fires started accidentally by lighting - because we thought that sharpening sticks or starting fire ourselves 'couldn't be done'...

Yeah, working on projects and see them fail by project leads who have the same attitude gives me no tolerance for such narrowminded foolishness. At best their attitude wastes resources, at worse it makes a project fail or miss targets.

On such blinkered vision and casual arrogance are collapses of games companies based...

... look at Funcom and their financial death-dive following the consistent lack of regard for the suggestions of AoC fans as a prime example.

  sapphen

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/07
Posts: 920

3/14/13 11:59:15 AM#13
Originally posted by PerfArt
While I like your idea, the game is too far along for this. Maybe a seperate server sometime after release?

Release is far more important than we give it credit for... remember AoC?


Or, you can assume that each "realm" will be as big as any other ES game (except Daggerfall lol) and that exploration will be there in spades. I've said it before, but you couldn't explore Elsewyr or Morrowind or Hammerfell in ES V: Skyrim. I was ok with that.

The thing that sucks is you couldn't explore all of Tamriel in Skyrim and when we finally get a game that makes it possible, they lock off the territories.

  CthulhuPuffs

Novice Member

Joined: 3/03/13
Posts: 379

Will consume your soul, yet stay crunchy in milk

3/14/13 12:12:22 PM#14
Originally posted by Maelwydd
Originally posted by Caliburn101
Originally posted by Maelwydd
Originally posted by PerfArt
While I like your idea, the game is too far along for this. Maybe a seperate server sometime after release?

Or, you can assume that each "realm" will be as big as any other ES game (except Daggerfall lol) and that exploration will be there in spades. I've said it before, but you couldn't explore Elsewyr or Morrowind or Hammerfell in ES V: Skyrim. I was ok with that.

Balance. Alliance identity. Give it a chance. We can always bitch later (and probably will.)

Sorry but I simply get frustrated when people say changes cannot happen because of the time the game has been in development. If the game fails to work or has glaring problems, both gameplay or bugs, then things must be done. ANY project has a timeframe but at the same time you cannot ignore issues. The issues must be looked at and if neccessarry the project changed or even stopped.

The game is NOT too far along. Especially a damn MMO where development doesn't stop, even post release.

 

There will always be those who claim 'it cannot be done'.

Fortunately, human history is replete with those who didn't agree...

... and thus we aren't living in caves, fire-hardening sharp sticks which we just found over fires started accidentally by lighting - because we thought that sharpening sticks or starting fire ourselves 'couldn't be done'...

Yeah, working on projects and see them fail by project leads who have the same attitude gives me no tolerance for such narrowminded foolishness. At best their attitude wastes resources, at worse it makes a project fail or miss targets.

Even if Firor would make changes, which I doubt he would even consider. I honestly dont think he could.

Hes a 1 trick pony and DAOC is his rabbit in the hat.

10 years ago he helped make DAOC. Since he left Mythic, what other games has he developed? none. 10 years later, when he finally has a chance to Dev another game what does he do? Uses his old DAOC model.

Not only that, but he re-worked the already established IP he aquired to fit his DAOC model

To me that shows absolutely no creativity or artistic insight what-so-ever.

 

Hes like someone who plays the same patterns in chess because ONCE he won a game using that method

Bringer of Eternal Darkness and Despair, but also a Nutritious way to start your Morning.

Games Played: Too Many

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3712

3/14/13 12:29:43 PM#15
So what do you do once you can wander anywhere? By your suggestion there would be no PvP, if I read right you cant enter the other factions dungeons. Quests and story are writen for the faction that map is made for? So were there just to look around?
  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 4169

3/14/13 12:30:34 PM#16
I have to hand it to you guys. You certainly are creative when it comes to proposing basic design choices other than those the developers chose. Me? I want the spellmaker to make a strong comeback in TESO.
  bill4747

Novice Member

Joined: 10/07/06
Posts: 203

3/14/13 12:32:24 PM#17

I love Skyrim, and it does not bother me one little bit to me that there are three realms in ESO.

It's a plus.

I will have great fun playing three characters, one from each.

  sapphen

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/07
Posts: 920

3/14/13 12:32:38 PM#18
Originally posted by Iselin
I have to hand it to you guys. You certainly are creative when it comes to proposing basic design choices other than those the developers chose. Me? I want the spellmaker to make a strong comeback in TESO.

...from what I hear, it will be making a comeback in TES 6.  I rather enjoyed that system as well but I don't think we'll see it in ESO.

  Maelwydd

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/26/09
Posts: 1169

3/14/13 12:34:23 PM#19
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
So what do you do once you can wander anywhere? By your suggestion there would be no PvP, if I read right you cant enter the other factions dungeons. Quests and story are writen for the faction that map is made for? So were there just to look around?

Being able to explore...yeah that includes and can actually only mean just being able to look around. Why is that a problem?

  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 4169

3/14/13 12:37:36 PM#20
Originally posted by sapphen
Originally posted by Iselin
I have to hand it to you guys. You certainly are creative when it comes to proposing basic design choices other than those the developers chose. Me? I want the spellmaker to make a strong comeback in TESO.

...from what I hear, it will be making a comeback in TES 6.  I rather enjoyed that system as well but I don't think we'll see it in ESO.

 I hope you're right. I loved that too.

 

Note: for those of you who may have forgotten... http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Magic_(Arena)

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