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EVE Online

EVE Online 

Jita (General)  » What would encourage you to start playing EVE?

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302 posts found
  Malcanis

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/17/09
Posts: 3213

"A very special kind of stupidity"

 
OP  3/12/13 7:48:17 AM#21
Originally posted by bobm111
Originally posted by Malcanis

I'm looking for ideas to take to CCP.

 

well and even playing field in Eve would really be nice. Thus removing moon goo from the big alliances who are spoon fed enormous passive income to run there operations. its been talked about and even  promised but ccp always gives in to those long time subcribers and big alliances who stack the so called player run stellar councill.

So if you want people to come back then or play the game then stop the trillions of  iskies from moon goo into the hands of big alliances.

been a lot of talk about pay to win by companies who by taking real life money and give players and in game edge. Well ccp has set up and now keeps a system which is alot like that. And the big alliances use there influence via the player elected representatives to make sure that 1 thing never changes. Moo goo and enormous passive income to certain alliances and players to run there operation.

So no thanks i dont want to play eve on such and unfair playing ground and that ccp will not change it seems. its reminds me of how governments bail out banks by poring my tax money into them to keep there fat butts out of trouble at the expense of all other poor slobs.

 

Just to specifically reply to the part of your post that I highlighted - the CSM has been banging the drum of tech moon rebalancing almost since the day they were introduced. And the goon reps were banging it loudest of all. I realise that it makes for a good populist "The Man is keeping me down" narrative to believe the opposite, but the truth is sometimes inconvenient like that. Oh and CSM 7 has a wormhole player as chairman and another as secretary this year. Hardly dominated by nullsec blocs!

I am running for election myself this year, and I have made a tech moon and sov space industry rebalance a core part of my platform - not because I think that they have an effect on new players, but because 0.0 will be more fun for more people.

However your post does highlight one important recurring issue: new players are given incorrect information which leads to the false perception that they can only ever be oppressed untermensch.  The skillpoint cap issue is another excellent example of this - skills are capped; you can only get them to level 5, and after you've maxed your skills for a ship, all you can do is diversify the range of ships you can fly. 

CCP could do more to make it clearer that character advancement in EVE is fundamentally different from the level-based PvE grinders, and that "80 million skillpoints" doesn't mean "Can take on 10x 8 million skillpoint players and easily win even if drunk and naked" as it does in WoW type games.

Give me liberty or give me lasers

  tordurbar

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/02/10
Posts: 412

3/12/13 7:53:44 AM#22
Originally posted by Dihoru
Originally posted by Elsabolts

PVE server or on / off pvp switch, No sucide ganking in high section or concidered high section areas.

Go play the game then talk ;) until then your suggestions aren't useful (anyone who's played the game knows its single-shard and PVE only has never ever been EVE and I hope to god anyone who even gets a whiff of that idea throws said idea into a flaming pit of demon love juice).

This is typical of the Eve playerbase attitude. It is also why I play the trial every three years and then quit. This way everyone is happy. I get to play a REALLY cool game for 14 days without paying and the Eve hardcore can get their jollies putting down a carebear for 14 days. 

Eve deserves the half million subs it has. It is a great game. However, without having at least one totally safe zone the game will never be as popular as it could be.  That is the decision of the players and that is the decision of CCP.  No carebears wanted. Ok. My loss. See you in three years.

  Malcanis

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/17/09
Posts: 3213

"A very special kind of stupidity"

 
OP  3/12/13 7:57:07 AM#23
Originally posted by elocke
Eve is one of those games I like to read about and am intrigued by the whole setting and depth of it yet when I play I find the sit back tactical aspect of combat instead of twitch on the fly combat and the sit and wait for progression aspect the 2 main points that don't keep me playing.   Don't think those can be fixed without the game becoming something else.  

yep, EVE simply doesn't offer that kind of experience, and it would have to be pretty much re-written from the ground up as a different game in order to do so.

Dust 514 is CCP's first answer to this issue, but of course it's limited to PS3 owners (This isn't as big a limitation as people make out; second hand PS3s don't cost all that much more than a full price game, or even less if you're willing to get one with a broken bluray player).

CCP Unifex has dropped plenty of hints that CCP would like to attach more games to the EVE universe. If Dust is a success, I'd expect them to start on another similar project.  I'd be more than happy to suggest a flight shooter-sim set in the many, many gas-giant environments that the EVE cluster contains. For the PC.

But this does run into the "No ideas that would take 150 dev-years to implement, please" limitation...

 

Give me liberty or give me lasers

  svandy

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/31/11
Posts: 163

3/12/13 7:58:07 AM#24

I think the biggest thing is "fixing" 0.0, though I don't know how they'd do it. What I mean by that is that the huge alliances in null make it very difficult and intimidating for new players to break into it. If you are not a Goon or in TEST, you can't take part in the meta-game really. And it's that meta-game that most players want, I think.  * *THIS IS AN EXAGGERATION TO MAKE A POINT**

Maybe there needs to be some kind of cost-effective means for small alliances to deal with large ones? Or, and while I hate to admit it, maybe they need to make high-sec less appealing so that people start moving in larger numbers to low or null, which by itself should create more conflict in null.

Currently playing: Marvel Heroes, DayZ

Waiting for: Repopulation, H1Z1

  Malcanis

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/17/09
Posts: 3213

"A very special kind of stupidity"

 
OP  3/12/13 8:01:20 AM#25
Originally posted by tordurbar
Originally posted by Dihoru
Originally posted by Elsabolts

PVE server or on / off pvp switch, No sucide ganking in high section or concidered high section areas.

Go play the game then talk ;) until then your suggestions aren't useful (anyone who's played the game knows its single-shard and PVE only has never ever been EVE and I hope to god anyone who even gets a whiff of that idea throws said idea into a flaming pit of demon love juice).

This is typical of the Eve playerbase attitude....

It's pretty similar to the WoW playerbases's attitude towards people who want to turn WoW into a single-server PvP sandbox.

Give me liberty or give me lasers

  Malcanis

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/17/09
Posts: 3213

"A very special kind of stupidity"

 
OP  3/12/13 8:08:34 AM#26
Originally posted by svandy

I think the biggest thing is "fixing" 0.0, though I don't know how they'd do it. What I mean by that is that the huge alliances in null make it very difficult and intimidating for new players to break into it. If you are not a Goon or in TEST, you can't take part in the meta-game really. And it's that meta-game that most players want, I think. * *THIS IS AN EXAGGERATION TO MAKE A POINT**

Maybe there needs to be some kind of cost-effective means for small alliances to deal with large ones? Or, and while I hate to admit it, maybe they need to make high-sec less appealing so that people start moving in larger numbers to low or null, which by itself should create more conflict in null.

Null does need reforming, but there are existing options for smaller alliances. For instance W-space is explicitly designed to stop large groups dominating the whole zone. And then there is NPC space for larger groups who want to be involved in 'The Great Game' without being in a bloc.

One of my long time hobby-horses is that in EVE geography dictates politics - the open, contiguous, low travel cost nature of sov 0.0 means that large groups are inevitable (Just as in the real world, as communcations and transport tech improved, powerblocs got larger and larger). I fully intend to ask CCP to consider adding new types of space to allow new modes of play that aren't really supported.

But on the other hand, lots of people like being part of a mighty space empire. There's no reason CCP shouldn't continue to enable EVE to support that kind of gameplay too.

But does this issue really matter all that much to someone who's never played EVE for more than a few days?

Give me liberty or give me lasers

  Muke

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/04/07
Posts: 1637

3/12/13 8:16:21 AM#27


Originally posted by bobm111

Originally posted by Malcanis I'm looking for ideas to take to CCP.  
well and even playing field in Eve would really be nice. Thus removing moon goo from the big alliances who are spoon fed enormous passive income to run there operations. its been talked about and even  promised but ccp always gives in to those long time subcribers and big alliances who stack the so called player run stellar councill.

So if you want people to come back then or play the game then stop the trillions of  iskies from moon goo into the hands of big alliances.


 


Moongoo solutions have been offered on many occasions, like depleting moon materials, spread them around all regions, offer players different ways to get those materials apart from putting up towers in 0.0 which ofc will be blobbed by 100 supercaps the second you ever manage to take one.

The problem is CCP who acknowledge the problems, yet don't WANT to fix them because:

1: they are in the game themselves and heavily involved in those same alliances that benefit + control the moongoo markets.

2: you have ex-players like for example Soundwave+Darius Johnson working for CCP now and diverting the attention to adding less important content instead of fixing these gamebreaking issues.

Recruiting former players who encouraged exploiting and trying to break the game as developers/senior Staff is a baaaaad idea. :P


So don't expect a fix about moongoo untill one of the big blobs like CFC dies and loses their moongoo, untill then it stays the RMT machine it always was.

"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

  Scalpless

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/22/07
Posts: 1355

3/12/13 8:32:17 AM#28
Improved space. EVE's space looks good, but it's just an empty area for players and interactable objects to float in. I'd prefer something with more interesting content. For example, dynamic environmental hazards (toxic gas clouds, dangerous metorites, etc.) could be interesting. Then again, I'm not sure how well content like that would work with EVE's eccentric movement controls.
  pinktailz

Novice Member

Joined: 11/13/12
Posts: 75

3/12/13 8:36:10 AM#29
content, because there is no content at all
  bobm111

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/26/09
Posts: 156

3/12/13 8:39:02 AM#30

However your post does highlight one important recurring issue: new players are given incorrect information which leads to the false perception that they can only ever be oppressed untermensch.  The skillpoint cap issue is another excellent example of this - skills are capped; you can only get them to level 5, and after you've maxed your skills for a ship, all you can do is diversify the range of ships you can fly. 

 

well mate,

Despite the fluff the point is still huge alliances have and enormus passive income to operate with from moon goo and ccp continues to let it happen. It  also could be called a monopoly where the price of moon goo effects many areas of the game like t2 ships . And ccp defending this monopoly time and again by letting it continue patch after patch. For newer players its hardly the skill point barrier you need to worry about. Ten low sp pilots can take down anybody in the game. But you can not get past the fact that certain alliances control the flow of key resources for building things thus controling the market.

Notice that the goo monopoly which the goons as well as others control is a game breaker and makes newer players slaves upon entering the game. notice since the big silent deal not to attack each others goo moons prices on t2 ships have trippled.

So crocodile tears do not inpress me and my warning to newer players is that as soon as you enter the game because of stuff like this you are being handled like cattle by the big alliances who have made deals with each other to not rock the moon goo boat. And ccp knows very well that this is 1 of the fundemental problems of the eve economy. Not to mention getting into 0.0 for small alliances except perhaps in providence where NRDS and no goo is found.

But weighed against losing these long time players ccp elects to turn the other way on such a fundemental issue. And being that like in real life these people have lobbies and elected polticians to smokescreen the whole issue doesnt help.

But it is a great game and i recommend people giving it ago but with open eyes. there are forces in this game which want to enslave you from the start.

  User Deleted
3/12/13 8:41:32 AM#31
Originally posted by Muke

 


Originally posted by bobm111

Originally posted by Malcanis I'm looking for ideas to take to CCP.  
well and even playing field in Eve would really be nice. Thus removing moon goo from the big alliances who are spoon fed enormous passive income to run there operations. its been talked about and even  promised but ccp always gives in to those long time subcribers and big alliances who stack the so called player run stellar councill.

 

So if you want people to come back then or play the game then stop the trillions of  iskies from moon goo into the hands of big alliances.


 


 

Moongoo solutions have been offered on many occasions, like depleting moon materials, spread them around all regions, offer players different ways to get those materials apart from putting up towers in 0.0 which ofc will be blobbed by 100 supercaps the second you ever manage to take one.

 

The problem is CCP who acknowledge the problems, yet don't WANT to fix them because:

1: they are in the game themselves and heavily involved in those same alliances that benefit + control the moongoo markets.

2: you have ex-players like for example Soundwave+Darius Johnson working for CCP now and diverting the attention to adding less important content instead of fixing these gamebreaking issues.

Recruiting former players who encouraged exploiting and trying to break the game as developers/senior Staff is a baaaaad idea. :P


So don't expect a fix about moongoo untill one of the big blobs like CFC dies and loses their moongoo, untill then it stays the RMT machine it always was.

Someone's been smoking some strong shit to even suggest those two points. I am not involved in 0.0 and haven't been for years but even I see the terribly bad logic you use because at current the "RMT machines" are Incursions and C5 and C6 wormholes, don't believe me? I have friends who make 1-2 bil a week casually doing Incursions and C5-C6 wormholes that are properly farmed will produce shit tons of value sleeper loot ( 20-30 man fleets can pull 100-200 mil per pilot per site, that's 2-3 billion isk per total in assets for 1 maybe 2 hours of work). Compared to these two Moongoo is a joke and if a serious alliance ever managed to lock down 10-20 C6 wormholes and farm them properly Goonswarm might be in allot of shit (sure the serious alliance couldn't field t2s because Goonswarm control that bottleneck but instead they could field retarded amounts of t1 and t3 ships and the only way Goonswarm could hope to hit them heavily enough to knock out their C6 farms would be to embargo ice harvesting in high-sec completely which in turn causes allot of angry high-sec and wormhole corps to join in on wailing on goonswarm, the only reason this has not happened yet is because no one has yet had the vested interest in doing this to my knowledge).

  bobm111

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/26/09
Posts: 156

3/12/13 8:52:27 AM#32

Ok unfortunately the op is trying to put up a smokescreen claiming that moon goo is hardly the issue. RMT and stuff is happening in whs. What a load of crap. Which brings us to how incursions were changed when the big alliances saw people making billions of isk in hi sec and fundementally breaking there power via moon goo. Why ccp nerfed the incursions to stop newer players from being independent of the big alliances. Faction war was first buffed then nerfed for same reason.

Worm holes politics certainly has nt effected the economy of the game and the big alliances control of key resources to control the market and if they ever do the big alliances and there lobbies and politicians inside ccp will put a stop to that.

Stop covering for these monopolists and players ruining the game so they can keep playing in there little sandbox. The last thing they want is Eve to grow beyond there control.

  User Deleted
3/12/13 9:00:16 AM#33
Originally posted by bobm111

Ok unfortunately the op is trying to put up a smokescreen claiming that moon goo is hardly the issue. RMT and stuff is happening in whs. What a load of crap. Which brings us to how incursions were changed when the big alliances saw people making billions of isk in hi sec and fundementally breaking there power via moon goo. Why ccp nerfed the incursions to stop newer players from being independent of the big alliances. Faction war was first buffed then nerfed for same reason.

Worm holes politics certainly has nt effected the economy of the game and the big alliances control of key resources to control the market and if they ever do the big alliances and there lobbies and politicians inside ccp will put a stop to that.

Stop covering for these monopolists and players ruining the game so they can keep playing in there little sandbox. The last thing they want is Eve to grow beyond there control.

Sounds like someone is a little bit sore he can't turn a profit in t2 production, take an example from one of my corp mates: tech 3 production while more skill intensive requires no moon products, it is all readily made with wormhole loot and with the venture frigate introduced you truly do not have an excuse not to (before mining gas could've been an issue, now if you spend a a couple of weeks training in gas harvesting and getting the frigate skill up to level 5 you have a frigate which can only be caught by interdiction bubbles and can mine with 2 turrets the output of 5).

 

As for the incursion "nerf", said nerf to quote one of my friends was "barely noticeable" considering professional incursion runners don't only run one type of incursion (only vanguards got hit with the nerf because they were too profitable considering their positioning in space and the ease with which they were done).

 

Now if you wanna continue spouting rhetoric which has about as much to do with EVE-Online as Zeus's ass be my guest but anyone with the capability of rational thought will see what your demagoguery is (hint: it has something to do with laziness and butthurt).

  elocke

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/15/04
Posts: 4114

3/12/13 9:20:06 AM#34
Originally posted by Malcanis
Originally posted by elocke
Eve is one of those games I like to read about and am intrigued by the whole setting and depth of it yet when I play I find the sit back tactical aspect of combat instead of twitch on the fly combat and the sit and wait for progression aspect the 2 main points that don't keep me playing.   Don't think those can be fixed without the game becoming something else.  

yep, EVE simply doesn't offer that kind of experience, and it would have to be pretty much re-written from the ground up as a different game in order to do so.

Dust 514 is CCP's first answer to this issue, but of course it's limited to PS3 owners (This isn't as big a limitation as people make out; second hand PS3s don't cost all that much more than a full price game, or even less if you're willing to get one with a broken bluray player).

CCP Unifex has dropped plenty of hints that CCP would like to attach more games to the EVE universe. If Dust is a success, I'd expect them to start on another similar project.  I'd be more than happy to suggest a flight shooter-sim set in the many, many gas-giant environments that the EVE cluster contains. For the PC.

But this does run into the "No ideas that would take 150 dev-years to implement, please" limitation...

 

Yeah, sorry bout that.  But that's why I'm really looking forward to World of Darkness to see how they handle a living world feel and see if it has the same depth and style(in it's own genre of course) that Eve brings to the table. 

On a side note, they should make an Eve movie or tv show but have it be mature similar to the Walking Dead, Sons of Anarchy, Spartacus or Game of Thrones.  I'd be hooked.

http://www.twitch.tv/elockethemmoaddict

https://twitter.com/MMOAddicted

  bobm111

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/26/09
Posts: 156

3/12/13 9:38:30 AM#35
Originally posted by Dihoru
 

Sounds like someone is a little bit sore he can't turn a profit in t2 production, take an example from one of my corp mates: tech 3 production while more skill intensive requires no moon products, it is all readily made with wormhole loot and with the venture frigate introduced you truly do not have an excuse not to (before mining gas could've been an issue, now if you spend a a couple of weeks training in gas harvesting and getting the frigate skill up to level 5 you have a frigate which can only be caught by interdiction bubbles and can mine with 2 turrets the output of 5).

 

As for the incursion "nerf", said nerf to quote one of my friends was "barely noticeable" considering professional incursion runners don't only run one type of incursion (only vanguards got hit with the nerf because they were too profitable considering their positioning in space and the ease with which they were done).

 

Now if you wanna continue spouting rhetoric which has about as much to do with EVE-Online as Zeus's ass be my guest but anyone with the capability of rational thought will see what your demagoguery is (hint: it has something to do with laziness and butthurt).

Actually mate was making dreads which do not require moo goo.But you miss the point is there a monopoly on moo goo in eve? Does it effect t2 productions? Is there a hidden agreement not to touch the moo goo holy cow. Is there a lobby and politicians who time and again have sabotaged doing anythin about it and has ccp done anything about it.

This is hardly retoric but facts widely known.

and your arguement about t3s and whs basically proves my point it does not effect the monopoly now present in central parts of eve via moo goo.

But once again eve is a great game unfortunately some of these so called alliances are destroying eve thru there power and monopolist tendencies. and people who decide to take up eve should do so with there eyes open.

And i have" friends" to doing incursions who tell quite a different story.

  User Deleted
3/12/13 9:40:09 AM#36
Originally posted by elocke
Originally posted by Malcanis
Originally posted by elocke
Eve is one of those games I like to read about and am intrigued by the whole setting and depth of it yet when I play I find the sit back tactical aspect of combat instead of twitch on the fly combat and the sit and wait for progression aspect the 2 main points that don't keep me playing.   Don't think those can be fixed without the game becoming something else.  

yep, EVE simply doesn't offer that kind of experience, and it would have to be pretty much re-written from the ground up as a different game in order to do so.

Dust 514 is CCP's first answer to this issue, but of course it's limited to PS3 owners (This isn't as big a limitation as people make out; second hand PS3s don't cost all that much more than a full price game, or even less if you're willing to get one with a broken bluray player).

CCP Unifex has dropped plenty of hints that CCP would like to attach more games to the EVE universe. If Dust is a success, I'd expect them to start on another similar project.  I'd be more than happy to suggest a flight shooter-sim set in the many, many gas-giant environments that the EVE cluster contains. For the PC.

But this does run into the "No ideas that would take 150 dev-years to implement, please" limitation...

 

Yeah, sorry bout that.  But that's why I'm really looking forward to World of Darkness to see how they handle a living world feel and see if it has the same depth and style(in it's own genre of course) that Eve brings to the table. 

On a side note, they should make an Eve movie or tv show but have it be mature similar to the Walking Dead, Sons of Anarchy, Spartacus or Game of Thrones.  I'd be hooked.

While not CCP made, and I doubt you donno it but still:

Clear Skies 1

Clear Skies 2

and

Clear Skies 3

(3 gets a bit more dramatic).

  User Deleted
3/12/13 9:41:58 AM#37

Say one thing about the Eve fans, they're dedicated to their game

 

Unfortunately its niche, and my free trial tryout bored me almost to death, so there's pretty much nothing that could make me want to subject myself to this game again

  Malcanis

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/17/09
Posts: 3213

"A very special kind of stupidity"

 
OP  3/12/13 9:57:38 AM#38
Originally posted by pinktailz
content, because there is no content at all

EVE's content is the interaction with other players.

Give me liberty or give me lasers

  Slampig

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/29/03
Posts: 2404

Whatever you do, do NOT speak ill of Asheron's Call 2...

3/12/13 9:59:32 AM#39
I would start playing if they took the game and instead of spaceships they had dragons. And instead of space stations they had majestic cities. Basically if EvE was high fantasy instead of stuck in space I would play the HELL out of it.

That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!

  Malcanis

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/17/09
Posts: 3213

"A very special kind of stupidity"

 
OP  3/12/13 10:03:37 AM#40
Originally posted by bobm111

However your post does highlight one important recurring issue: new players are given incorrect information which leads to the false perception that they can only ever be oppressed untermensch.  The skillpoint cap issue is another excellent example of this - skills are capped; you can only get them to level 5, and after you've maxed your skills for a ship, all you can do is diversify the range of ships you can fly. 

 

well mate,

Despite the fluff the point is still huge alliances have and enormus passive income to operate with from moon goo and ccp continues to let it happen. It  also could be called a monopoly where the price of moon goo effects many areas of the game like t2 ships . And ccp defending this monopoly time and again by letting it continue patch after patch. For newer players its hardly the skill point barrier you need to worry about. Ten low sp pilots can take down anybody in the game. But you can not get past the fact that certain alliances control the flow of key resources for building things thus controling the market.

Notice that the goo monopoly which the goons as well as others control is a game breaker and makes newer players slaves upon entering the game. notice since the big silent deal not to attack each others goo moons prices on t2 ships have trippled.

So crocodile tears do not inpress me and my warning to newer players is that as soon as you enter the game because of stuff like this you are being handled like cattle by the big alliances who have made deals with each other to not rock the moon goo boat. And ccp knows very well that this is 1 of the fundemental problems of the eve economy. Not to mention getting into 0.0 for small alliances except perhaps in providence where NRDS and no goo is found.

But weighed against losing these long time players ccp elects to turn the other way on such a fundemental issue. And being that like in real life these people have lobbies and elected polticians to smokescreen the whole issue doesnt help.

But it is a great game and i recommend people giving it ago but with open eyes. there are forces in this game which want to enslave you from the start.

You are apparently not aware that no one alliance or even bloc has a monopoly on any kind of moon goo, particularly since CCP reintroduced Alchemy, and now Technetium can be synthesised from (IIRC) Cobalt and Platinum, two pretty common and widely distributed moons. Since when Technetium has fallen to ~1/3 of its peak price (ie: to just below the level of the cost of synthesising it).

You seem to be an excellent example of someone who has been enraged by misleading propaganda into thinking that you're much worse off that you really are. Might I suggest that you get your information from a wider range of sources?

Give me liberty or give me lasers

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