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Camelot Unchained

Camelot Unchained 

General Discussion  » Mark Jacobs and Company - Please do not REQUIRE monthly fees to play.

14 Pages « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 » Last Search
264 posts found
  Sketchit

Novice Member

Joined: 11/10/12
Posts: 17

 
OP  3/11/13 4:05:49 PM#41
Alright folks, I get it, you hate the idea. Perhaps I was wrong. I'm sorry to upset so many individuals with my  blasphemy.
  BowbowDAoC

Novice Member

Joined: 5/11/10
Posts: 482

3/11/13 4:06:12 PM#42

Sketchit, please read my answer on page 4, it gives pretty good reasons as to why most (if not all) of us dont agree. its worth reading

 

Plus, like someone said earlier, 15-20$ a month for unlimited access to your hobby, hell i used to spend 10  times that to play pool in my younger days.

Bowbow (kob hunter) Infecto (kob cave shammy) and Thurka (troll warrior) on Merlin/Midgard DAoC
Thurka on WAR

  sweetdigs

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/11/03
Posts: 199

3/11/13 4:15:53 PM#43
Originally posted by Sketchit
Originally posted by Fearum
Why do you care if there are so many great (sarcasm) F2P games out there for you already? Do you just want another casual game to hop into every once in awhile with the only reason to play is to buy the fluffy santa hat from the cash shop

I didn't say that there were, did I? I'm asking for a B2P model. No reason to be rude.

Sure there is. 

  alterfenix

Elite Member

Joined: 3/05/10
Posts: 299

3/11/13 4:16:29 PM#44
Originally posted by Sketchit

Mark Jacobs and City State Entertainment:

Please rethink the archaic idea of requiring people to pay a monthly fee to log on and play the game. We are living in a time where money is tight all around, and there are a lot of gamers that are fed up with the idea of paying for the Box Price of a game, and on top of that, paying a monthly fee every single month in order to login and play a game.

I will take World of Warcraft’s model as an example. I had bought most of the game’s expansions, and paid the monthly fee for the game for several years. I had invested heavily into a character, and spent a lot of time revolved around the game. The sad part is that at the end of the month, you had as much right to play as somebody else who is just starting to play the game. It did not matter if you invested hundreds of dollars into the game – as soon as you stopped forking over cash, you lost ALL access to what you so heavily invested in already.

Many MMORPGers use MMORPGs as a hobby. I know video games are indeed a large hobby of mine. A hobby is something you invest in. Could you imagine any other hobby where if you stopping shelling out money, somebody swooped down and took away everything you had put into it already? I cannot. I do recognize that a business needs money in order to continuously provide a service. This is not a charity, and I understand that completely. Hopefully, however, the developers and other players can understand my reasoning as well. Business models that are not flexible are a thing of the past. I’m not crying for CSE to make Camelot Unchained into a F2P game, but there should be some common ground here.

I have a possible solution to this problem.

  1. A box price with no subscription fee.
  2.  In-Game shop that sells cosmetic items only. Look how successful League of Legends is – and they have no box price whatsoever.
  3. If you want to change to a different realm/server more than once, perhaps also charge as well.
  4. Offer a conversion of gold to In-Game shop currency much like GW2 [but do not do the reverse, as this enables a pay-to-win environment] does to continue to combat Gold Sellers. This allows people to buy stuff from the store without sinking in real-life cash
  5. Any new races that becomes available after the game releases into the in-game shop as well.
  6. Optional in game subscriptions for reduced price for in-game shop currency as well as veteran rewards for long-term subscribers – special cosmetic housing items, ect.

I know people may look at this list and go, “Ewww, I HATE in-game shops. PERIOD!” But, please, look at what you’re gaining. You get consistent access to a game you’ve bought and paid for. You’re still on a equal playing field with everyone else. Gone would be the days of losing that character you played for so long, all because you’re done sinking money you’ve paid for a game ten times over. Please take my suggestions into consideration as you continue planning out the foundation of CU.

As much as such freemium would easily work in case of PvE game (in fact it does after all) in PvP title it would cause only more problems than worth of it.

Simple scenario. Monthly fee is 10$. You have 100 players and in typical p2p model that gives you 1000$ each month. In your model if let say 90% ppl pay subscription it would make no difference but then how can you make sure that it happens? Rather it would be 50 ppl pay and 50 ppl eventually MAY use item shop. That gives 500$ + something. Not everyone likes cosmetic stuff and so on so not everyone would use it. You can't be certain how much that "something" would be therefore total it may be over 1000$ as well as only 500$. It easily can become way too unstable for serious title that is not f2p by it's design.

  Doogiehowser

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/14/12
Posts: 1843

3/11/13 4:17:38 PM#45
Originally posted by morfidon

Also DISAGREE. I want a good community. Not a hoping players who jump from realm to realm.

I don't want also so many kids. 

10-15$ per month is very cheap. And it's good for overall quality of game. Let devs focus on game not on rewards for people who pay. 

BTW LoL is instant action game not a game like CU is gonna be. CU is gonna have legendary moments that might be unpredictable and we need it to be paid not free.

Ehh..as if there are no kids in P2P games right? 

"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.'
-Jesse Schell

"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid."
-Luke McKinney

  sweetdigs

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/11/03
Posts: 199

3/11/13 4:18:11 PM#46
Originally posted by Sketchit
Originally posted by moguy2

All I see in your posts is you disagreeing with people and firing back at them. If you wanted a fight why not just step out in the street and hit some one?  To me, all you look like, is some one NOT wanting peoples input but wanting people to agree with what you said.  

 

Oh and by the way, this game is YEARS AWAY. Lol lets get our panties in an uproar NOW.

I feel the need to respond to people who talk to me. I'm sorry if that concept is foreign. I want to stand by my decision and defend it, and speak my logic behind it. I'm not insulting others, I'm defending my point of view.  I didn't come here to fight, a lot of my replies are me saying that... as my post clearly states, I'm not asking for a f2p game.

I know its odd, everyone is agaisnt me, I should do what many others do and run and hide.

No, you should just not bother repeatedly posting a request that is clearly NOT going to be implemented per Mark Jacobs' own words and that is one of the basis for the kickstarter funding.

  WellzyC

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/04/11
Posts: 538

Ceaseless

3/11/13 4:24:14 PM#47

 

Disagree.

 

Prefer Sub model.

The way mmo's were: Community, Exploration, Character Development, Conquest.

The way mmo's are now : Cut-Scenes,Cut-Scenes, Linear Questing, Cut-Scenes...


www.CeaselessGuild.com

  MindTrigger

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/19/07
Posts: 2628

3/11/13 4:25:40 PM#48

I don't mind paying a sub fee for a great game either, especially if it will keep the game hoppers away.

Besides, they are damned if they do ~ damned if they don't.  3/4 of the people on this forum believe MMO games should be completely free, as in they don't have to pay a dime for any of it whatsoever.  They whine about cash shops, whine about box fees, and whine about subs.

A sure sign that you are in an old, dying paradigm/mindset, is when you are scared of new ideas and new technology. Don't feel bad. The world is moving on without you, and you are welcome to yell "Get Off My Lawn!" all you want while it happens. You cannot, however, stop an idea whose time has come.

  morfidon

Novice Member

Joined: 2/19/13
Posts: 245

3/11/13 4:25:44 PM#49
Originally posted by Doogiehowser
Originally posted by morfidon

Also DISAGREE. I want a good community. Not a hoping players who jump from realm to realm.

I don't want also so many kids. 

10-15$ per month is very cheap. And it's good for overall quality of game. Let devs focus on game not on rewards for people who pay. 

BTW LoL is instant action game not a game like CU is gonna be. CU is gonna have legendary moments that might be unpredictable and we need it to be paid not free.

Ehh..as if there are no kids in P2P games right? 

Ehh as if there are so many like in F2P game right?

  Kuppa

Novice Member

Joined: 9/24/10
Posts: 3442

The problem with censorship is ********

3/11/13 4:31:34 PM#50

I don't like monthly fees and it's many horrible arguments, like:

  1. "anyone has that amount of money": That amount of money is clearly not in everyones hand, if you have it great. Give thanks for the fact that you have a well paying job or have parents who give you money or maybe won the lotto, I don't know or care the point is not everyone is on the same boat so please don't boast how "cheap" it is. It just makes you look ignorant.
  2. "kids will come!": The kids that will come are the spoiled brats that can afford a sub.
  3. "It's cheaper than a movie!": Yes, it's cheaper than a movie, an amusement park, a concert, ect... Where this falls flat on its ass is that compared to other games it's more expensive. It's easy to know there is something wrong when folks try to justify the price of something when they have to start compairing it to other things aside from it's direct competition.
  4. "they need that montly income": In this market with so many games that cost much less they will not get that monthly income if players feel like they could be getting more for their money elsewhere. They have to lower the price of admission in order to even get people in the door and after they are in the door they have to blow them away to justify a sub. So it actually hurts to charge a sub even though it sounds good in theory(in this market).

 


  Kuppa

Novice Member

Joined: 9/24/10
Posts: 3442

The problem with censorship is ********

3/11/13 4:32:35 PM#51
Originally posted by morfidon
Originally posted by Doogiehowser
Originally posted by morfidon

Also DISAGREE. I want a good community. Not a hoping players who jump from realm to realm.

I don't want also so many kids. 

10-15$ per month is very cheap. And it's good for overall quality of game. Let devs focus on game not on rewards for people who pay. 

BTW LoL is instant action game not a game like CU is gonna be. CU is gonna have legendary moments that might be unpredictable and we need it to be paid not free.

Ehh..as if there are no kids in P2P games right? 

Ehh as if there are so many like in F2P game right?

As far as you and me can tell, yes. We don't have the data but with our limited tools it's obvious there are tons of kids playing P2P games, like WoW.


  Kuppa

Novice Member

Joined: 9/24/10
Posts: 3442

The problem with censorship is ********

3/11/13 4:33:58 PM#52
Originally posted by MindTrigger

I don't mind paying a sub fee for a great game either, especially if it will keep the game hoppers away.

Besides, they are damned if they do ~ damned if they don't.  3/4 of the people on this forum believe MMO games should be completely free, as in they don't have to pay a dime for any of it whatsoever.  They whine about cash shops, whine about box fees, and whine about subs.

So true!


  Nihilist

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/08/04
Posts: 543

3/11/13 4:36:05 PM#53

Free2play almost always turns into pay 2 win unless you have loads of free time to grind.


Even in league of legends there are advantages to having every single champion unlocked which takes a long time to do as a free player.

 

 

  sweetdigs

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/11/03
Posts: 199

3/11/13 4:36:20 PM#54
Originally posted by Kuppa

I don't like monthly fees and it's many horrible arguments, like:

  1. "anyone has that amount of money": That amount of money is clearly not in everyones hand, if you have it great. Give thanks for the fact that you have a well paying job or have parents who give you money or maybe won the lotto, I don't know or care the point is not everyone is on the same boat so please don't boast how "cheap" it is. It just makes you look ignorant.
  2. "kids will come!": The kids that will come are the spoiled brats that can afford a sub.
  3. "It's cheaper than a movie!": Yes, it's cheaper than a movie, an amusement park, a concert, ect... Where this falls flat on its ass is that compared to other games it's more expensive. It's easy to know there is something wrong when folks try to justify the price of something when they have to start compairing it to other things aside from it's direct competition.
  4. "they need that montly income": In this market with so many games that cost much less they will not get that monthly income if players feel like they could be getting more for their money elsewhere. They have to lower the price of admission in order to even get people in the door and after they are in the door they have to blow them away to justify a sub. So it actually hurts to charge a sub even though it sounds good in theory(in this market).

 

It costs money to host and manage servers, to design continued improvements to the game, etc.

That money is going to be paid somehow.  Either by those who are rich enough to Pay to Win in a F2P model, or by all of us evenly in a subscription model where everybody will be on equal footing and you don't have to worry about the guy on the other realm having purchased stuff from the store that will put him at an advantage to you.

Personally, I am with Mark on the equal footing, subscription model.  Especially in a PVP-oriented game.

Honestly, if you can't afford $15/month, you are in the minority here.  Skip out on a night of drinking.  Skip out on one dinner out a month.  I don't know a single person that can't afford $15/month for a game.  Not one. And I know people who don't make a lot of money and don't get money from their parents.  You're doing something wrong if you can't afford it (or  your priorities should be somewhere other than gaming at the moment).

  morfidon

Novice Member

Joined: 2/19/13
Posts: 245

3/11/13 4:37:42 PM#55
Originally posted by Kuppa

I don't like monthly fees and it's many horrible arguments, like:

  1. "anyone has that amount of money": That amount of money is clearly not in everyones hand, if you have it great. Give thanks for the fact that you have a well paying job or have parents who give you money or maybe won the lotto, I don't know or care the point is not everyone is on the same boat so please don't boast how "cheap" it is. It just makes you look ignorant.
  2. "kids will come!": The kids that will come are the spoiled brats that can afford a sub.
  3. "It's cheaper than a movie!": Yes, it's cheaper than a movie, an amusement park, a concert, ect... Where this falls flat on its ass is that compared to other games it's more expensive. It's easy to know there is something wrong when folks try to justify the price of something when they have to start compairing it to other things aside from it's direct competition.
  4. "they need that montly income": In this market with so many games that cost much less they will not get that monthly income if players feel like they could be getting more for their money elsewhere. They have to lower the price of admission in order to even get people in the door and after they are in the door they have to blow them away to justify a sub. So it actually hurts to charge a sub even though it sounds good in theory(in this market).

 

1. If someone don't have 15 free dollars per month he shouldn't play games. So not everyone have 1000$ to go for Disney, let everyone go there for free. Wtf ?

2. It's not always like that. I'm almost sure it's different. Most of people i know who played free games like for example tibia had some poblems with law in real life. At least it's from experience.  (it doesn't apply to all of them of course)

3. So go to that other games. We don't want here ppl who want everything for free. Who thinks that everything should be theirs because they exist in world. Because you were born doesn't give you rights to somebody work for free.

4. As I mentioned above. Go somewhere else. They will get more in PvP game from subscription it will be stable and they will focus on game not on thing like items for people who pay.

  kosac

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/21/05
Posts: 114

3/11/13 4:38:31 PM#56
please p2p!! in f2p and b2p are tons of stupid ppl
  Marcus-

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/28/06
Posts: 967

3/11/13 4:39:40 PM#57

Yes, MMOs are a hobby of mine. I am also more than willing to pay the monthly fee to play them.

 

You see i don't look at it the same way you do, if i stop paying, i don't think of it as someone swooping in and taking away everything i had put into it, i think of it more as they aren't putting enough into it for me to be having fun.

 

You give me a good game, that i find fun, entertaining, exciting, (or whatever you want to call it), I'll gladly shell out my monthly fee, probably for years or as long as you can keep it coming, or better yet, until someone does it better. Its my hobby, and I'm more than willing to invest in it, so long as the developers are as well. Its thier game, and its thier job to keep me coming back and paying that fee. As a consumer, I love monthly fees. I feel like it keeps them on their toes as they really want me to keep that sub going every month.

 

My first non-monthly fee game since the month UO came out has been GW2. I don't care for it much (the pay model). Theres always that hint that you can play it normaly, or, you can do it much, much faster in the cash shop by buying gems. I like everyone on equal footing thanks.

 Just my opinion..

  Kuppa

Novice Member

Joined: 9/24/10
Posts: 3442

The problem with censorship is ********

3/11/13 4:43:05 PM#58
Originally posted by sweetdigs
Originally posted by Kuppa

I don't like monthly fees and it's many horrible arguments, like:

  1. "anyone has that amount of money": That amount of money is clearly not in everyones hand, if you have it great. Give thanks for the fact that you have a well paying job or have parents who give you money or maybe won the lotto, I don't know or care the point is not everyone is on the same boat so please don't boast how "cheap" it is. It just makes you look ignorant.
  2. "kids will come!": The kids that will come are the spoiled brats that can afford a sub.
  3. "It's cheaper than a movie!": Yes, it's cheaper than a movie, an amusement park, a concert, ect... Where this falls flat on its ass is that compared to other games it's more expensive. It's easy to know there is something wrong when folks try to justify the price of something when they have to start compairing it to other things aside from it's direct competition.
  4. "they need that montly income": In this market with so many games that cost much less they will not get that monthly income if players feel like they could be getting more for their money elsewhere. They have to lower the price of admission in order to even get people in the door and after they are in the door they have to blow them away to justify a sub. So it actually hurts to charge a sub even though it sounds good in theory(in this market).

 

It costs money to host and manage servers, to design continued improvements to the game, etc.

That money is going to be paid somehow.  Either by those who are rich enough to Pay to Win in a F2P model, or by all of us evenly in a subscription model where everybody will be on equal footing and you don't have to worry about the guy on the other realm having purchased stuff from the store that will put him at an advantage to you.

Personally, I am with Mark on the equal footing, subscription model.  Especially in a PVP-oriented game.

Honestly, if you can't afford $15/month, you are in the minority here.  Skip out on a night of drinking.  Skip out on one dinner out a month.  I don't know a single person that can't afford $15/month for a game.  Not one. And I know people who don't make a lot of money and don't get money from their parents.  You're doing something wrong if you can't afford it (or  your priorities should be somewhere other than gaming at the moment).

So you went with both argument 4 and 1?

All those costs can be paid by both models you are correct, I already told you why P2P is at a disadvantage.

 

Please don't sound ignorant. How do you know that is a minority? do you have some data to back it up and even if you do what makes it right to alianate the minority? Of course you don't know anyone who can't pay that sub, because in societies people tend to be around their same age group, wealth group, ect...Again guys, NOT EVERYONE has it as good as you do. Please stop coming here and saying that is money everyone should have, it really makes you sound arrogant and ignorant.

 


  Roguewiz

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/01/02
Posts: 454

When a Kender says "oops!"; its already too late.

3/11/13 4:46:40 PM#59

Subscription is fine as long as they can release content quicker than once every blue moon (or every 2-3 years)

whichever is shorter  :)

 

I'm not asking for everquest content releases (6 months for an expansion), however something quicker than WoW

I be Raq, destroyer of game balance!
Raquelis in various games
Played: Everything
Playing: League of Legends, Dark Souls 2, Elder Scrolls Online
Wants: The World
Anticipating: Everquest Next (And Landmark)
Trying to beat Dark Souls without using magic is like having a naked hot blond give you a root canal every day; painful and enjoyable at the same time.

  Kuppa

Novice Member

Joined: 9/24/10
Posts: 3442

The problem with censorship is ********

3/11/13 4:47:07 PM#60
Originally posted by morfidon
Originally posted by Kuppa

I don't like monthly fees and it's many horrible arguments, like:

  1. "anyone has that amount of money": That amount of money is clearly not in everyones hand, if you have it great. Give thanks for the fact that you have a well paying job or have parents who give you money or maybe won the lotto, I don't know or care the point is not everyone is on the same boat so please don't boast how "cheap" it is. It just makes you look ignorant.
  2. "kids will come!": The kids that will come are the spoiled brats that can afford a sub.
  3. "It's cheaper than a movie!": Yes, it's cheaper than a movie, an amusement park, a concert, ect... Where this falls flat on its ass is that compared to other games it's more expensive. It's easy to know there is something wrong when folks try to justify the price of something when they have to start compairing it to other things aside from it's direct competition.
  4. "they need that montly income": In this market with so many games that cost much less they will not get that monthly income if players feel like they could be getting more for their money elsewhere. They have to lower the price of admission in order to even get people in the door and after they are in the door they have to blow them away to justify a sub. So it actually hurts to charge a sub even though it sounds good in theory(in this market).

 

1. If someone don't have 15 free dollars per month he shouldn't play games. So not everyone have 1000$ to go for Disney, let everyone go there for free. Wtf ?

2. It's not always like that. I'm almost sure it's different. Most of people i know who played free games like for example tibia had some poblems with law in real life. At least it's from experience.  (it doesn't apply to all of them of course)

3. So go to that other games. We don't want here ppl who want everything for free. Who thinks that everything should be theirs because they exist in world. Because you were born doesn't give you rights to somebody work for free.

4. As I mentioned above. Go somewhere else. They will get more in PvP game from subscription it will be stable and they will focus on game not on thing like items for people who pay.

1. Missed the point completely. Im not saying that if you don't have the money then let them play it anyways. It's the idea that if I have that money everyone else SHOULD also have it. Don't think 15/mo is within reach of everyone.

 

2. ???

 

3 & 4. I'm not complaining about the game, Im debating the business model itself. Don't take it personal with the game, although if you believe a list of ideas on a piece of paper stands to deserve anything then so be it but that's a different problem.

 


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