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Camelot Unchained

Camelot Unchained 

General Discussion  » Collision Detection in Camelot Unchained: Yes or No?

15 Pages « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 » Last Search
291 posts found
  Kuldebar

Novice Member

Joined: 2/11/13
Posts: 65

 
OP  3/09/13 1:42:18 PM#41
Originally posted by Tumblebutz

I can see the problems on both sides of the issue. 

-No CD means masses of enemies running through any sort of defense that can be set up and really making it a numbers game, which no one wants.  Additionally, it allows for LoS exploits which no one wants, either.

-Bad CD makes it a lag fest and makes large scale battles unbearable for most players, especially those without AoE.

-Even good CD can be really frustrating if a few heavy tanks with a few dedicated healers can completely block a passage from an entire army.  (Imagine what the milegates would have been like with CD!)

The bottom line is this:  If there is going to be CD, the engine MUST be able to handle it without creating too much lag for players.  AND, the Tank/Healer dynamic must allow for a blockade to be penetrable at some point.

Awesome points, but let me refute a minor point you made on the con side of your post:

(Imagine what the milegates would have been like with CD!

If the Mile Gates and walls were destructible, meaning able to be breached with siege or climbing ropes/ssiege ladders, I don't think it would be an issue at all.

The whole point of attacking a defended fortified position is in the breaching of the defense by attacking the weaker points not the strongest most defended points. If the game allows players to do this, many of the concerns of  having 5 players blocking a gateway become non issues.

Those who tread with ill intent
Beneath our sacred firmament,
Whether of Hammer or of Tree,
Albion's might shall strike at thee!

  Odaman

Novice Member

Joined: 2/17/13
Posts: 195

3/09/13 2:06:27 PM#42
You don't need CD to fix the issue of well timed runthroughs disrupting spells. It's easy to code around that as you can see is most of the modern mmos. Melee positionals, well that's a different story..... it's hard to say how things will go from daoc because strafe was so heavily penalized in that game for melee.
  Kuldebar

Novice Member

Joined: 2/11/13
Posts: 65

 
OP  3/09/13 2:38:26 PM#43
Originally posted by Odaman
You don't need CD to fix the issue of well timed runthroughs disrupting spells. It's easy to code around that as you can see is most of the modern mmos. Melee positionals, well that's a different story..... it's hard to say how things will go from daoc because strafe was so heavily penalized in that game for melee.

 

Positionals go hand in hand with collsion detection, not sure why someone would want to have one and not the other.

Those who tread with ill intent
Beneath our sacred firmament,
Whether of Hammer or of Tree,
Albion's might shall strike at thee!

  Seitr

Novice Member

Joined: 2/14/13
Posts: 50

3/09/13 2:48:52 PM#44
Originally posted by Rhoklaw

Collision Detection is not needed since it wasn't needed in the original DAoC. In my opinion, I would prefer the Crowd Control approach instead for a PvP focused game. Collision Detection while more realistic just isn't fleshed out yet in MMO's. Sure EQ had it but EQ was a PvE focused game. Last thing I want to see is an impenetrable wall of tanks with an army of healers behind them guarding fortress gates. PS and PS2 have CD as well and let me tell you, it's more annoying then it is fun. Especially with people grief blocking you inside a building. So to solve that, you'ld need to implement friendly damage, just like PS and PS2 have and now you have a griefers paradise.

No Thanks!

+1 

 

  dynamicipftw

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/26/12
Posts: 216

3/09/13 2:58:48 PM#45
Originally posted by Kuldebar
Originally posted by Odaman
You don't need CD to fix the issue of well timed runthroughs disrupting spells. It's easy to code around that as you can see is most of the modern mmos. Melee positionals, well that's a different story..... it's hard to say how things will go from daoc because strafe was so heavily penalized in that game for melee.

 

Positionals go hand in hand with collsion detection, not sure why someone would want to have one and not the other.

Why? They are completely unrelated. What you're saying makes no sense.

  Kuldebar

Novice Member

Joined: 2/11/13
Posts: 65

 
OP  3/09/13 3:24:35 PM#46
Originally posted by dynamicipftw
Originally posted by Kuldebar
Originally posted by Odaman
You don't need CD to fix the issue of well timed runthroughs disrupting spells. It's easy to code around that as you can see is most of the modern mmos. Melee positionals, well that's a different story..... it's hard to say how things will go from daoc because strafe was so heavily penalized in that game for melee.

 

Positionals go hand in hand with collsion detection, not sure why someone would want to have one and not the other.

Why? They are completely unrelated. What you're saying makes no sense.

 

Positionals are based on your character's position relative to his target, that is precisely what CD is about.

Walking through one's target completely invalidates the basic underpinning of having positionals, cheapens it entirely.

I'd prefer a game that does not chiefly rely on simplistic LOS methods for success, why not fill out all the dimensions and let the player exist in a world that is strategically meaningful every step of the way?

Those who tread with ill intent
Beneath our sacred firmament,
Whether of Hammer or of Tree,
Albion's might shall strike at thee!

  Tumblebutz

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/13
Posts: 338

3/09/13 3:27:19 PM#47
Originally posted by dynamicipftw
Originally posted by Kuldebar
Originally posted by Odaman
You don't need CD to fix the issue of well timed runthroughs disrupting spells. It's easy to code around that as you can see is most of the modern mmos. Melee positionals, well that's a different story..... it's hard to say how things will go from daoc because strafe was so heavily penalized in that game for melee.

 

Positionals go hand in hand with collsion detection, not sure why someone would want to have one and not the other.

Why? They are completely unrelated. What you're saying makes no sense.

Because if you can stand inside the geometry of another player, every positional attack becomes either impossible or always possible... both of which are stupid.

Emeryc Eightdrakes - Ranger of DragonMyst Keep - Percival

RED IS DEAD!

  dynamicipftw

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/26/12
Posts: 216

3/09/13 3:30:29 PM#48
Originally posted by Kuldebar
Originally posted by dynamicipftw
Originally posted by Kuldebar
Originally posted by Odaman
You don't need CD to fix the issue of well timed runthroughs disrupting spells. It's easy to code around that as you can see is most of the modern mmos. Melee positionals, well that's a different story..... it's hard to say how things will go from daoc because strafe was so heavily penalized in that game for melee.

 

Positionals go hand in hand with collsion detection, not sure why someone would want to have one and not the other.

Why? They are completely unrelated. What you're saying makes no sense.

 

Positionals are based on your character's position relative to his target, that is precisely what CD is about.

Walking through one's target completely invalidates the basic underpinning of having positionals, cheapens it entirely.

I'd prefer a game that does not chiefly rely on simplistic LOS methods for success, why not fill out all the dimensions and let the player exist in a world that is strategically meaningful every step of the way?

That is completely subjective. I feel that CD cheapens the combat since it turns my enemy into a cylinder or a box.

 

DAoC's combat is SO much better than WAR's, and not having CD is one of the reasons.

  dynamicipftw

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/26/12
Posts: 216

3/09/13 3:31:38 PM#49
Originally posted by Tumblebutz
Originally posted by dynamicipftw
Originally posted by Kuldebar
Originally posted by Odaman
You don't need CD to fix the issue of well timed runthroughs disrupting spells. It's easy to code around that as you can see is most of the modern mmos. Melee positionals, well that's a different story..... it's hard to say how things will go from daoc because strafe was so heavily penalized in that game for melee.

 

Positionals go hand in hand with collsion detection, not sure why someone would want to have one and not the other.

Why? They are completely unrelated. What you're saying makes no sense.

Because if you can stand inside the geometry of another player, every positional attack becomes either impossible or always possible... both of which are stupid.

This is where player skill comes into play. 

  Kuldebar

Novice Member

Joined: 2/11/13
Posts: 65

 
OP  3/09/13 3:34:14 PM#50
Originally posted by dynamicipftw
Originally posted by Tumblebutz
Originally posted by dynamicipftw
Originally posted by Kuldebar
Originally posted by Odaman
You don't need CD to fix the issue of well timed runthroughs disrupting spells. It's easy to code around that as you can see is most of the modern mmos. Melee positionals, well that's a different story..... it's hard to say how things will go from daoc because strafe was so heavily penalized in that game for melee.

 

Positionals go hand in hand with collsion detection, not sure why someone would want to have one and not the other.

Why? They are completely unrelated. What you're saying makes no sense.

Because if you can stand inside the geometry of another player, every positional attack becomes either impossible or always possible... both of which are stupid.

This is where player skill comes into play. 

No, it's where 50 players standing in a single square foot of game real estate comes into play.

Those who tread with ill intent
Beneath our sacred firmament,
Whether of Hammer or of Tree,
Albion's might shall strike at thee!

  Tumblebutz

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/13
Posts: 338

3/09/13 3:45:54 PM#51
Originally posted by dynamicipftw

Positionals go hand in hand with collsion detection, not sure why someone would want to have one and not the other.

Why? They are completely unrelated. What you're saying makes no sense.

Because if you can stand inside the geometry of another player, every positional attack becomes either impossible or always possible... both of which are stupid.

This is where player skill comes into play. 

I really wish everyone who plays the "player skill" card would realize how silly they sound.

Emeryc Eightdrakes - Ranger of DragonMyst Keep - Percival

RED IS DEAD!

  Seitr

Novice Member

Joined: 2/14/13
Posts: 50

3/09/13 3:49:42 PM#52
Originally posted by Tumblebutz
Originally posted by dynamicipftw
Originally posted by Kuldebar
Originally posted by Odaman
You don't need CD to fix the issue of well timed runthroughs disrupting spells. It's easy to code around that as you can see is most of the modern mmos. Melee positionals, well that's a different story..... it's hard to say how things will go from daoc because strafe was so heavily penalized in that game for melee.

 

Positionals go hand in hand with collsion detection, not sure why someone would want to have one and not the other.

Why? They are completely unrelated. What you're saying makes no sense.

Because if you can stand inside the geometry of another player, every positional attack becomes either impossible or always possible... both of which are stupid.

/face or /stick......that's a big reason no CD wasnt a big deal in DAoC

  dynamicipftw

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/26/12
Posts: 216

3/09/13 3:50:07 PM#53
Originally posted by Kuldebar

No, it's where 50 players standing in a single square foot of game real estate comes into play.

Infinitely better than trying to find your way out of a friendly zerg.

  Kuldebar

Novice Member

Joined: 2/11/13
Posts: 65

 
OP  3/09/13 3:51:58 PM#54
Originally posted by Tumblebutz
Originally posted by dynamicipftw

Positionals go hand in hand with collsion detection, not sure why someone would want to have one and not the other.

Why? They are completely unrelated. What you're saying makes no sense.

Because if you can stand inside the geometry of another player, every positional attack becomes either impossible or always possible... both of which are stupid.

This is where player skill comes into play. 

I really wish everyone who plays the "player skill" card would realize how silly they sound.

LOL

 

Poster A: But having no fall damage is where player skill comes into play!

 

Poster B: Wat! The players are jumping over the cliff and escaping, let's add fall damage!

 

Poster A: No, that's player skilllz!

 

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Those who tread with ill intent
Beneath our sacred firmament,
Whether of Hammer or of Tree,
Albion's might shall strike at thee!

  Kuldebar

Novice Member

Joined: 2/11/13
Posts: 65

 
OP  3/09/13 3:53:12 PM#55
Originally posted by dynamicipftw
Originally posted by Kuldebar

No, it's where 50 players standing in a single square foot of game real estate comes into play.

Infinitely better than trying to find your way out of a friendly zerg.

And that is the true heart of this debate.

Those who tread with ill intent
Beneath our sacred firmament,
Whether of Hammer or of Tree,
Albion's might shall strike at thee!

  Raunu

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/18/04
Posts: 486

3/09/13 4:00:23 PM#56

Being trapped in a building with no way out because someone thought it would be funny to afk in a doorway isn't fun.

Collision detection should be turned off when out of combat, and turn on when you're in combat.

- - "What if the hokey pokey really is what it's all about?" - -

  waynejr2

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/12/11
Posts: 3714

RIP City of Heroes!

3/09/13 4:04:15 PM#57
Originally posted by Raunu

Being trapped in a building with no way out because someone thought it would be funny to afk in a doorway isn't fun.

Collision detection should be turned off when out of combat, and turn on when you're in combat.

 Or within N yards of a fight as an additional rule.

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

3/09/13 4:06:16 PM#58
Originally posted by dynamicipftw
Originally posted by Niix_Ozek
No, if CD is in this game I won't be playing
I'm not playing a 200v200 battle where every time you move you hit a wall
Not to mention all the bugs and problems with this system being implemented with the low budget they have

This isn't the "solution" to tanks
Go play daoc people ugh

Seriously... if someone played both WAR and DAoC and thinks CD is a good idea he must be clinically insane. 

i played both

while clearly daoc is the better game, its not the lack of CD that makes it better, its amillion other things.

combat with CD is just better  as done by war, aoc, both planetsides etc..

without out you just get people doing their "skillz" by jumping around in a figure of 8 or stepping insde people to spam AOE.  Also CD makes the use of terrain more important.

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

3/09/13 4:07:05 PM#59
Originally posted by Raunu

Being trapped in a building with no way out because someone thought it would be funny to afk in a doorway isn't fun.

Collision detection should be turned off when out of combat, and turn on when you're in combat.

that is true

IN PVE

CU doesnt have PVE.

you can make CD vs hostiles only anyway.

  Raunu

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/18/04
Posts: 486

3/09/13 4:10:51 PM#60
Originally posted by waynejr2
Originally posted by Raunu

Being trapped in a building with no way out because someone thought it would be funny to afk in a doorway isn't fun.

Collision detection should be turned off when out of combat, and turn on when you're in combat.

 Or within N yards of a fight as an additional rule.

Well, we could have it as within N distance of an enemy player. However, if this were the case, people would use collision detection as a way of detecting stealthers.  I guess you could set that so collision detection ignores stealthed targets. But then people would complain about how stealthers can walk right through them...  I personally think this complaint is invalid because no stealther wants to walk through an enemy because they will be detected that way.

- - "What if the hokey pokey really is what it's all about?" - -

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