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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Is KickStarter just a charitable contribution without a tax deduction?

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71 posts found

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/13/04
Posts: 2435

"Free crack and everybody gets laid."

3/24/13 7:41:21 AM#61
Originally posted by Terranah

Back in the old days, devs released a crappy game and prayed some poor idiots bought it before the word spread it was shite.  Hell, devs still do this today.


But now days we have what's called kick starter where you just promise a game and people will give you money.  Can it be legitimate?  Yes.  But the potential for abuse is great in my opinion.  What are the safe guards so people don't lose their money?


I pay $60 for a game if I like it.  There's a lot of great ideas or games I would like to play but have no funding.  Would I be willing to pledge $1000 or $10,000 to a game's development to see it to fruition with no payout other than to play what in the end is a $60 game for what amounts to a few online trinkets, a title, or some other digital equivalent marking me as a founder.  Hell to the fooking no.


Now...if there was a promise to share in the rewards at release, like purchasing of stock or bonds, I might have a different view.


Back in the old days, gaming was about having a good time.  Now it's all about microtransaction, freetoplay scams and finding ways to part little nerds from their hard earned cash. 


That's my take.  Anyone here made any money from their 'investment' in kickstarter?

This sums it up pretty well for me.  Kudos to you Terranah.

I just want to play a fucking game that is well made and reward the company that made it.


Novice Member

Joined: 8/27/11
Posts: 155

3/24/13 7:58:29 AM#62
Originally posted by Gdemami


Originally posted by Sal1

Is KickStarter just a charitable contribution without a tax deduction? Is that what Kickstarter really is?


Yep, that is exactly what Kickstarter is.

You are donating healthy people in productive age that are absolutely not in any material need.They should have no issue to find a job, yet they are begging for money.

Quite disgusting in my book...

This indeed. Meanwhile, people on the other half of the world starve to death or are exploited to get us the cheapest products. Humanity at it's finest.


Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/24/04
Posts: 5212

3/24/13 8:10:02 AM#63
Originally posted by Gdemami


Originally posted by Sal1

Is KickStarter just a charitable contribution without a tax deduction? Is that what Kickstarter really is?


Yep, that is exactly what Kickstarter is.

You are donating healthy people in productive age that are absolutely not in any material need.They should have no issue to find a job, yet they are begging for money.

Quite disgusting in my book...

 You're ignoring the positive benefits. If you want less of something tax it. If you want more of something throw money at it. It's an inefficient way of distributing money to encourage making a certain product but it does work sometimes. It's a way of voting positively with your wallet for things you want rather than negatively by witholding cash from things you don't want. People just need to understand the nature of the vehicle.

"Strong and bitter words indicate a weak cause" ~Victor Hugo


Novice Member

Joined: 2/28/13
Posts: 75

3/24/13 2:21:48 PM#64

As a donor, you really just need to view Kickstarter is just a pay-up-front sales model that gives creators/businesses a barometer of market demand.  It just helps answer the question, "If I make this, will enough people buy it?"  If the answer for the individual is, "Yes, I'll buy that," then you "donate."  But you're essentially just paying up front for the donation rewards.

It's an incredibly useful tool.  The only way it's not a win/win is if you go around throwing your money at things you don't actually want.  Obviously with a video game that hasn't been made yet, you run the risk of being disappointed.

Personally we'll be depending on Kickstarter for our game.  Could we fund it ourselves?  Maybe.  But that wouldn't give us any idea if people were actually willing to subscribe to play it.  By paying for a subscription up front, we can guage demand proportional to fundraising.  It not only gives us capitol to invest in the project, but provides an indispensable measure for how much we should be investing in the project based on the level of interest and demand.


Novice Member

Joined: 4/04/12
Posts: 55

3/24/13 2:43:55 PM#65
Originally posted by zymurgeist
Originally posted by CalmOceans
Originally posted by zymurgeist

 You cannot make money by giving to a kickstarter. Kickstarter is not a financial investment.


You don't need to make money to be part of capitalism, when you buy a product in a free market economy you are part of capitalism, you are investing money in kickstarter with the goal to own capital, that is pure capitalism. It sure as hell is not the same as charity.

I don't even know why I'm arguing something this straighforward, you can have your opinion and I'll leave it at that since I think you're being stubborn for no apparent reason.

 You have a flawed grasp of the concept of capitalism.  Purchasing goods for consumption and use is not capitalism. Goods can be sold to obtain capital but are not themselves capital. What is most straightforward is you don't understand Kickstarter. Kickstarter contributions are not a financial instrument. They are a gift.


Nothing is more crucial to capitalism than consumers purchasing goods for consumption. In an ideal capitalist society you always buy a video game because you believe the enjoyment/benefit/happiness (it doesn't really matter what you call it) of owning the game exceeds that of owning the money it costs.

As far as Kickstarter goes it ISN'T anything in particular; you can interpret it in any number of ways. You might say that it is a "capitalist idea" because consumers invest money in something they believe will provide a future return (not in money, but in happiness/enjoyment/benefit). You could also say that it is charity, but it's an odd sort of charity that expects the sort of return I mentioned above. Then again some might argue that charity just tends to be about making yourself feel better, which makes that a sort of investment as well.

In any case it doesn't really matter. What does matter is whether or not Kickstarter can be used to transfer money tax-free. xD


Novice Member

Joined: 6/29/06
Posts: 3565

3/24/13 3:14:06 PM#66

I funded FTL on kickstarter and yes, I made my money back in terms of enjoyment x100.

Jeez, is that game awesome!

Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.

  User Deleted
3/24/13 3:16:34 PM#67
Kickstarter is a scam to get investment into a game you cant get private investors to pay for except you get no profit sharing or stock in the game you're investing in.

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/24/04
Posts: 5212

3/24/13 3:19:05 PM#68
Originally posted by jpnz

I funded FTL on kickstarter and yes, I made my money back in terms of enjoyment x100.

Jeez, is that game awesome!

 Yeah, but did you get any more enjoyment out of it than people who didn't contribute a penny? It wouldn't surprise me if you did.

"Strong and bitter words indicate a weak cause" ~Victor Hugo


Elite Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7481

3/24/13 8:39:31 PM#69

Originally posted by zymurgeist

You're ignoring the positive benefits.

There are none...well, apart from KS donees laughing their asses off about human gullibility.


Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/27/10
Posts: 2782

3/24/13 8:41:15 PM#70

Is the developer a recognized non-profit or not-for-profit organization?



I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil


Novice Member

Joined: 10/05/08
Posts: 599

3/24/13 8:59:34 PM#71


I really don't get the hate kickstarter gets.  Does it have risk?  Yep, but what doesn't?  Every time you buy food you run the risk it will give you food posioning.  Everytime you buy an item you run the risk that it's flawed or defective.  Even with games you run the risk that it's going to be crap.   Do you think the majority of SWTOR, aliens colony marines, DA2, etc... don't reget buying it?


What's the difference between never getting a game or getting a crap one on kickstarter or getting a crap game you're never going to touch again?  In both cases you wasted your money, in both cases you want your money back and in both cases someone else got paid.


The benefit of kickstarter is you can support games that no publisher would touch.  EA wasn't going to pay for FTL, activsion didn't want to pay for wasteland 2, ubisoft wasn't interested in Organ Trail: Director's Cut, etc... 


But more than anything kickstarter does one thing that the normal publisher system doesn't, it shows support for a genre/ideas outside of the normal crap publishers make.

I will not play a game with a cash shop ever again. A dev job should be to make the game better not make me pay so it sucks less.

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