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ArcheAge

ArcheAge 

General Discussion  » What ruins Archeage...

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87 posts found
  Greymoor

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 12/30/10
Posts: 804

 
OP  2/26/13 4:58:53 AM#1

Really looking forward to this game but I don't know if i'll be able to stand;

1.) Combat being a heavy CC fest, 1st attacker wins

2.) Armour, weapons, boats are never destroyed. The game would've been brilliant if it had a continuous need to craft. Pitty a year down the line everyone and their mother will have every ship in their bank, all the top gear ready to use and crafters will slowly become obsolete expect for consumables.

  Ehllfhire

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 397

Playing the FFXIV 2.0 Demo

2/26/13 12:09:58 PM#2
Originally posted by Greymoor

Really looking forward to this game but I don't know if i'll be able to stand;

1.) Combat being a heavy CC fest, 1st attacker wins

2.) Armour, weapons, boats are never destroyed. The game would've been brilliant if it had a continuous need to craft. Pitty a year down the line everyone and their mother will have every ship in their bank, all the top gear ready to use and crafters will slowly become obsolete expect for consumables.

Actually boats can be destroyed, when they are you have to pay gold to get them back in condition to sail again. And as for crafting, to make top end gear requires a lot of luck and use of your rare labor points.  So its an over exaggeration on your part. Most people won't have top end gear (at least not any where near what you say.) very quickly.

 

All in all you sound like chicken little claiming the sky is falling despite having no eveidence.

Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing.
PS3

  azzamasin

Elite Member

Joined: 6/06/12
Posts: 2390

We live in a fantasy world, a world of illusion. The great task in life is to find reality.

2/26/13 12:17:00 PM#3
Traditional Tab Targetting is the biggest thing followed by a reliance on systems that only a small percentage of people will utilyze.  A personal prference would be the character animations and character models.  Not a fan of the art style nor of the overly cartony/anime'ish art or animations.

If your idea of a Sandbox is open FFA Full Loot PvP, full crafted world with minimal support for anything combat then your sandbox ideas are bad! Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

  asmkm22

Elite Member

Joined: 11/29/06
Posts: 1616

2/26/13 12:20:29 PM#4
Originally posted by azzamasin
Traditional Tab Targetting is the biggest thing followed by a reliance on systems that only a small percentage of people will utilyze.  A personal prference would be the character animations and character models.  Not a fan of the art style nor of the overly cartony/anime'ish art or animations.

What is the problem with tab targetting?  I see this come up once in a while, but I don't understand the complaint. 

You make me like charity

  Darth-Batman

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/05
Posts: 685

Bruce, I am your father.

2/26/13 12:29:02 PM#5
Originally posted by asmkm22
Originally posted by azzamasin
Traditional Tab Targetting is the biggest thing followed by a reliance on systems that only a small percentage of people will utilyze.  A personal prference would be the character animations and character models.  Not a fan of the art style nor of the overly cartony/anime'ish art or animations.

What is the problem with tab targetting?  I see this come up once in a while, but I don't understand the complaint. 

Probably because tab-target systems involve no player skill and for some act as a sleeping aid.

  Ehllfhire

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 397

Playing the FFXIV 2.0 Demo

2/26/13 12:34:30 PM#6
Originally posted by asmkm22
Originally posted by azzamasin
Traditional Tab Targetting is the biggest thing followed by a reliance on systems that only a small percentage of people will utilyze.  A personal prference would be the character animations and character models.  Not a fan of the art style nor of the overly cartony/anime'ish art or animations.

What is the problem with tab targetting?  I see this come up once in a while, but I don't understand the complaint. 

I dont see a problem either. people who want FPS dynamics can play the failed games that have it TERA and TSW etc

Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing.
PS3

  asmkm22

Elite Member

Joined: 11/29/06
Posts: 1616

2/26/13 12:36:22 PM#7
Originally posted by Darth-Batman
Originally posted by asmkm22
Originally posted by azzamasin
Traditional Tab Targetting is the biggest thing followed by a reliance on systems that only a small percentage of people will utilyze.  A personal prference would be the character animations and character models.  Not a fan of the art style nor of the overly cartony/anime'ish art or animations.

What is the problem with tab targetting?  I see this come up once in a while, but I don't understand the complaint. 

Probably because tab-target systems involve no player skill and for some act as a sleeping aid.

I still don't follow.  Not unless you're one of the people who thinks bunny hopping is somehow skillful play.  What is it about tab targeting that equals no player skill, and what is the alternative that you'd prefer?  Why is the alternative better, and don't just give me some crap answer like "it takes more skill."  Be specific.

You make me like charity

  Ehllfhire

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 397

Playing the FFXIV 2.0 Demo

2/26/13 12:38:17 PM#8
Originally posted by asmkm22
Originally posted by Darth-Batman
Originally posted by asmkm22
Originally posted by azzamasin
Traditional Tab Targetting is the biggest thing followed by a reliance on systems that only a small percentage of people will utilyze.  A personal prference would be the character animations and character models.  Not a fan of the art style nor of the overly cartony/anime'ish art or animations.

What is the problem with tab targetting?  I see this come up once in a while, but I don't understand the complaint. 

Probably because tab-target systems involve no player skill and for some act as a sleeping aid.

I still don't follow.  Not unless you're one of the people who thinks bunny hopping is somehow skillful play.  What is it about tab targeting that equals no player skill, and what is the alternative that you'd prefer?  Why is the alternative better, and don't just give me some crap answer like "it takes more skill."  Be specific.

No use trying to get an answer, he is the type that thinks Halo is a great MMO

Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing.
PS3

  Havekk

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/14/08
Posts: 1300

2/26/13 12:45:58 PM#9
Originally posted by asmkm22
Originally posted by Darth-Batman
Originally posted by asmkm22
Originally posted by azzamasin
Traditional Tab Targetting is the biggest thing followed by a reliance on systems that only a small percentage of people will utilyze.  A personal prference would be the character animations and character models.  Not a fan of the art style nor of the overly cartony/anime'ish art or animations.

What is the problem with tab targetting?  I see this come up once in a while, but I don't understand the complaint. 

Probably because tab-target systems involve no player skill and for some act as a sleeping aid.

I still don't follow.  Not unless you're one of the people who thinks bunny hopping is somehow skillful play.  What is it about tab targeting that equals no player skill, and what is the alternative that you'd prefer?  Why is the alternative better, and don't just give me some crap answer like "it takes more skill."  Be specific.

I really don't get that either as tab targeting has never bothered me... At all. I think it's become a standard reply for folks around here.. Honestly, I played games like Tera as well as tab targeting games... it made no difference whatsoever to me. As a matter of fact, I prefer the tab targeting to the non tab. 

 

In most of the non-tab targeting games I have played, it seems they increase the area of the aoe effect of a spell, swing, etc. So what you get, is a bunch of folks jumping around the screen like maniacs.. which to me, takes away from the immersion of the game. Even if you can tab and target someone, you still need line of sight, etc. I really tend to not like games where it just looks like your running around swining a sword aimlessly. 

 

If I had to pick my favorite to date, it would have prolly been Conan. I really enjoyed the combat in Conan. 

 

  Yalexy

Novice Member

Joined: 12/17/10
Posts: 1003

2/26/13 2:19:16 PM#10

Tab-target combat can be very skillful aswell, it only depends on the mechanics behind that. Usually tab-target combat is way more tactical and playing tactical is just as skillful as FPS-combat, allthough I wouldn't call twitch-combat really skillful, especially not, as it's not a level playingground to begin with, as a 20 year old usually has better reflexes than a 50 year old, but the slow 50 year old may wipe the floor with the 20 year old in a more tactical tab-target MMO, as the 20 year old may be without tactical skills.
So yeah, this nonsense about FPS being the only combat-model where skill is required is just that - nonsense.

  Ehllfhire

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 397

Playing the FFXIV 2.0 Demo

2/26/13 2:21:36 PM#11
Originally posted by Yalexy

Tab-target combat can be very skillful aswell, it only depends on the mechanics behind that. Usually tab-target combat is way more tactical and playing tactical is just as skillful as FPS-combat, allthough I wouldn't call twitch-combat really skillful, especially not, as it's not a level playingground to begin with, as a 20 year old usually has better reflexes than a 50 year old, but the slow 50 year old may wipe the floor with the 20 year old in a more tactical tab-target MMO, as the 20 year old may be without tactical skills.
So yeah, this nonsense about FPS being the only combat-model where skill is required is just that - nonsense.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Tab-targetting is needed with a good combat system in a mmorpg. Since most mmo's aren't "twitch" based it allows more of a level playing field.

Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing.
PS3

  coretex666

Elite Member

Joined: 1/03/12
Posts: 1720

"I shall take your position into consideration"

2/26/13 2:52:25 PM#12

Tab targeting cannot be objectively considered as a weakness of the game.

I doubt everyone will have top gear in a year. I remember how hard it was to get top gear in Lineage II. I expect AA to be similar in this regard.

"What ruins Archeage for me", would be more appropriate title of the thread, in my opinion. It would not have any influence on the correctness of your premises though.

Playing: Chronicle 1
Waiting for: None of the games already announced

My game concept thread: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/369707 (any feedback appreciated)

  Dihoru

Elite Member

Joined: 1/11/06
Posts: 2287

2/26/13 3:38:16 PM#13
Originally posted by Ehllfhire
Originally posted by Yalexy

Tab-target combat can be very skillful aswell, it only depends on the mechanics behind that. Usually tab-target combat is way more tactical and playing tactical is just as skillful as FPS-combat, allthough I wouldn't call twitch-combat really skillful, especially not, as it's not a level playingground to begin with, as a 20 year old usually has better reflexes than a 50 year old, but the slow 50 year old may wipe the floor with the 20 year old in a more tactical tab-target MMO, as the 20 year old may be without tactical skills.
So yeah, this nonsense about FPS being the only combat-model where skill is required is just that - nonsense.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Tab-targetting is needed with a good combat system in a mmorpg. Since most mmo's aren't "twitch" based it allows more of a level playing field.

Then sit your ass behind out at long range with a caster-type or long range-type and butcher the younglings by playing tactically in a twitched based combat sistem (keep em stunned/slowed, kite, etc).

  BadSpock

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 7649

Logic be damned!

2/26/13 4:04:08 PM#14

Generally speaking, many gamers apply the words "skilled play" to the form of gameplay that they are good at, and consider everything else "easy-mode."

It's called "selective perception."

 

Now Playing: D3:RoS
Looking Towards: Destiny

  InporylemQQ

Tipster

Joined: 6/14/12
Posts: 158

2/26/13 6:44:20 PM#15

My concerns

1. Game is filled with safe zones

2. Guards inside cities / trading ports = PvP is only allowed in the middle of nowhere (where no one is)

3. Forced factions = The most retarded thing ever developed by human kind.

4. Not a single gold sink or material sink in the game. Economy is just horrible. The amount of cash you get from guesting will buy you a materials for 50 houses and boats. The awesome item decay mechanic got removed from the game so what now, rng is the right answer for everything?

5. Crafting, and gathering for the most part is useless since economy is so horrible you can buy everything for cash.

6. PvP is mainly a grief fest since it doesn't have any meaning in it. You kill people only for the joy of killing someone, but you never get anything from it so why would you have energy to do this longer than few weeks?

7. There is no risk loosing anything. Destroying someones boat is just for the annoying factor he doesn't really loose anything of the value. 3g to repair a galleon is just same as there wasn't any cost. Why couldn't it need like materials to rebuilt it? No risk on anything is just not the way to go. Loosing a trading pack is the only thing you can loose in this game that packs gold will still stay in the economy and the guy who lost it has a bit less bananas which he can buy supercheap from the ah..

8. Not really a concern since they are probably going to fix these, but the class balance is quite horrible at the moment and rather than 120 classes we have around 10.

9. Hacks like teleporting.

If nothing ever breaks and you don't have any risk of doing anything everything will just be pointless in few weeks and you are only left with ganking people that are not doing trade runs inside the safe zones.

ArcheAge, Black Desert and Bless videos InporylemQQ Youtube

  lilmark_utsa

Novice Member

Joined: 7/09/05
Posts: 61

2/27/13 5:27:51 PM#16
Originally posted by inporylemii

My concerns

1. Game is filled with safe zones

2. Guards inside cities / trading ports = PvP is only allowed in the middle of nowhere (where no one is)

3. Forced factions = The most retarded thing ever developed by human kind.

4. Not a single gold sink or material sink in the game. Economy is just horrible. The amount of cash you get from guesting will buy you a materials for 50 houses and boats. The awesome item decay mechanic got removed from the game so what now, rng is the right answer for everything?

5. Crafting, and gathering for the most part is useless since economy is so horrible you can buy everything for cash.

6. PvP is mainly a grief fest since it doesn't have any meaning in it. You kill people only for the joy of killing someone, but you never get anything from it so why would you have energy to do this longer than few weeks?

7. There is no risk loosing anything. Destroying someones boat is just for the annoying factor he doesn't really loose anything of the value. 3g to repair a galleon is just same as there wasn't any cost. Why couldn't it need like materials to rebuilt it? No risk on anything is just not the way to go. Loosing a trading pack is the only thing you can loose in this game that packs gold will still stay in the economy and the guy who lost it has a bit less bananas which he can buy supercheap from the ah..

8. Not really a concern since they are probably going to fix these, but the class balance is quite horrible at the moment and rather than 120 classes we have around 10.

9. Hacks like teleporting.

If nothing ever breaks and you don't have any risk of doing anything everything will just be pointless in few weeks and you are only left with ganking people that are not doing trade runs inside the safe zones.

I agree about the economy....at least it's a concern for me.  The one thing most, if not all, MMO's fail to fully think through is the economy.

They always seem to lack way of filtering out gold/items to prevent inflation and it normally ends up occuring rather quickly.  While it is likely inevitable there are many ways to slow it down. 

The problem though....are the players....

"This is too hard to get..." "I shouldn't lose anything when this happens..."  "This costs too much..."

A lot of players (mostly US I'm sad to say) just want it risk-free like their console games.

Things I'd like to see...

You ship is permanently lost if destroyed 3 times.

The first 2 times your ship is destroyed it costs 20% >> 40% of the "materials" to repair.

If I attack someone to steal the materials they're carrying on their back and successfully defeat them....a random % of those materials should be lost/destoryed during the scuffle.

If a ship carrying materials is destroyed some of those materials should be lost when they drop to the ocean.

Things of those nature help keep an economy stable and slow down inflation.

While I enjoyed "full looting" when someone died in Ultima Online I can understand why people loathe that idea.  However, they should at least damage all of your gear when you die whether it be PvE or PvP.  While you wouldn't lose your items, you'd at least have to pay gold to have it repaired.

Oh well, we'll see how the game goes.  As of now I like it more than all of the other MMO's out there.

 

  waynejr2

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/12/11
Posts: 3662

RIP City of Heroes!

2/27/13 5:36:48 PM#17
Originally posted by Darth-Batman
Originally posted by asmkm22
Originally posted by azzamasin
Traditional Tab Targetting is the biggest thing followed by a reliance on systems that only a small percentage of people will utilyze.  A personal prference would be the character animations and character models.  Not a fan of the art style nor of the overly cartony/anime'ish art or animations.

What is the problem with tab targetting?  I see this come up once in a while, but I don't understand the complaint. 

Probably because tab-target systems involve no player skill and for some act as a sleeping aid.

Well, this is a Role Playing Game.  You know, where you are playing a character.  I'd bet none of us can cast fireball spells in real life.

I find that real life offers far greater tests of my skills than a mere video game can provide.  Wouldn't be better to get that feeling for yourself outside a videogame?

  DrunkWolf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/07/09
Posts: 978

2/27/13 5:42:11 PM#18
Originally posted by Greymoor

Really looking forward to this game but I don't know if i'll be able to stand;

1.) Combat being a heavy CC fest, 1st attacker wins

2.) Armour, weapons, boats are never destroyed. The game would've been brilliant if it had a continuous need to craft. Pitty a year down the line everyone and their mother will have every ship in their bank, all the top gear ready to use and crafters will slowly become obsolete expect for consumables.

 Heavy CC is enough to keep myself and my guild away. we are sick and tired of this crutch used in pvp.

oh well.

  dadante666

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/07/11
Posts: 397

you stop laughing when hear the same joke ,but always cry for the same thing...

2/27/13 5:48:52 PM#19
Originally posted by Ehllfhire
Originally posted by Greymoor

Really looking forward to this game but I don't know if i'll be able to stand;

1.) Combat being a heavy CC fest, 1st attacker wins

2.) Armour, weapons, boats are never destroyed. The game would've been brilliant if it had a continuous need to craft. Pitty a year down the line everyone and their mother will have every ship in their bank, all the top gear ready to use and crafters will slowly become obsolete expect for consumables.

Actually boats can be destroyed, when they are you have to pay gold to get them back in condition to sail again. And as for crafting, to make top end gear requires a lot of luck and use of your rare labor points.  So its an over exaggeration on your part. Most people won't have top end gear (at least not any where near what you say.) very quickly.

 

All in all you sound like chicken little claiming the sky is falling despite having no eveidence.

lol funny thing he talking whitought playing the game ..dont waste ur time in  an uless and personal feeling  info other than the truth

  Karteli

Elite Member

Joined: 7/09/12
Posts: 2688

2/27/13 5:49:05 PM#20

Tab targeting can be very skillful, in the right scenario.

 

Playing a warlock in various WoW Cataclysm raids for instance was skill intensive.  Targets needed to be toggled back and forth while evading a grisly death.  Very few warlocks raided as a result, compared to other classes.  To add to the mix, short-term buffs on player targets had to be coordinated.  You had to visualize where everyone was and monitor their movements, and not forget.

 

The overall fight was very chaotic, and highly skill oriented.  Of course none of those extras I spoke of needed to be done, but performance would suffer on the damage meters, which was pretty crucial if (as a lock) you were trying to keep your raid spot in a top guild.

 

Tab targeting is as difficult as you allow it to be.  FPS are more of a joke in comparison, since you just stand there and spam < swing > < swing > < swing > turn < swing > < swing > endlessly .. or put < shoot > in the mix

 

Blizzard kind of screwed things up by making some classes more difficult to play (while others were simple).  How people gravitated to EZ-mode classes that didn't require much effort might indicate that some players actually like easy tab targetting classes.  I like the hard ones however, and find it enjoyable when tab-targeting gets hectic.

 

People gravitated towards the easy classes though and then complained that tab targeting was too simple.  Mmm'kay.

Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.

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