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Elder Scrolls Online

Elder Scrolls Online 

General Discussion  » True ES First Person

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61 posts found
  WellzyC

Novice Member

Joined: 10/04/11
Posts: 546

Ceaseless

 
OP  2/18/13 2:57:15 PM#1

 

 

Quote from ESO Dev Matt Firor's Interview:


"We are still working on this system, but as it stands right now, we have first and third person support, just like in any other Elder Scrolls game. The only difference is that you don't see your hands and weapons in first-person mode."

 

 

Frustrating, to say the least. I know lots of people have started to post about this and are making a pretty big fuss about it on a lot of fan based forums. This isn't a deal breaker by any means for me, but it definitely is very frustrating and disappointing from an Elder Scrolls fan stand point.

I like to play as an archer, and seeing my bow and my hands as I am loading up and arrow, now only makes it really easier to aim, but adds a lot to the immersion part of the game.

I really hope they listen to the community and add True ESO first person to the game. I know they mention that 3rd person makes it easier  to pay attention to your surrounding ect ect. but thats what the scroll mouse is for, fast swap from 3rd to first is what Skyrim did very well, and i think it would be great for ESO.

The way mmo's were: Community, Exploration, Character Development, Conquest.

The way mmo's are now : Cut-Scenes,Cut-Scenes, Linear Questing, Cut-Scenes...


www.CeaselessGuild.com

  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 3702

2/18/13 3:12:04 PM#2

I'll give you this: it is ironic that the MMO version of the franchise that pioneered (Ultima Underworld did it first but TES: Arena was based on UU anyway) first person RPGs with aiming isn't doing it the Darkfall way. The DF system is pretty well a copy of the TES combat mechanics.

But on the other hand, I never play MMOs that have the option of 1st person/3rd person in anything but 3rd person POV. Why? Two words: situational awareness. Even in PVE group play you need to know what's all around you to play well. In PVP/RvR it's prety much a requirement for me. Not only do I play in 3rd person, for PVP I scroll the POV back as far as the game allows for even more awareness.

I'm fine with it in an MMO version of TES.

  Maephisto

Novice Member

Joined: 2/15/12
Posts: 653

2/18/13 3:16:51 PM#3
Originally posted by Iselin

I'll give you this: it is ironic that the MMO version of the franchise that pioneered (Ultima Underworld did it first but TES: Arena was based on UU anyway) first person RPGs with aiming isn't doing it the Darkfall way. The DF system is pretty well a copy of the TES combat mechanics.

But on the other hand, I never play MMOs that have the option of 1st person/3rd person in anything but 3rd person POV. Why? Two words: situational awareness. Even in PVE group play you need to know what's all around you to play well. In PVP/RvR it's prety much a requirement for me. Not only do I play in 3rd person, for PVP I scroll the POV back as far as the game allows for even more awareness.

I'm fine with it in an MMO version of TES.

I was about to post this same point.  While a first person view might be normal in ES games, there are far too many things to be aware of in an MMO, especially during PvE raids and PvP.

If 1st person still becomes popular regardless, I am fairly confident the devs will make it resemble previous ES games as soon as possible.

  love-da-bush

Novice Member

Joined: 4/01/12
Posts: 14

2/18/13 3:28:40 PM#4

You could play in "first person" in vanilla WoW, you just couldn't see your hands.... is there a difference here?

Feels like they are putting first person there just for RP purpose or to add one more feature to "please" the fans.

In a pvp enviroment, third person is too superior to first person, so it makes no sense to expect players to keep their view hindered just for the sake of realism. I fear this is one of those features you can't really implement in a MMO.

Speaking of which: I'm really looking forward to try the slow-motion from zooming with bow, I'm wandering about how they overcome the fluctuations in the time continuum allowing multiple players to alter the speed of time, at the same time! Maybe even while aiming at each other! *insert smiley here*

  MaxJac

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/12
Posts: 185

2/18/13 3:32:15 PM#5
I wander how many ES players use third versus first in the single player games. I suspect overwhelmingly first. I wouldn't mind an MMO that did just first. It would mean it would have to be the quality that makes it so good in Bethesda titles.
  Karteli

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/09/12
Posts: 2704

2/18/13 3:36:09 PM#6

Situational awaeness doesn't really mean much in single players games or single player MMO's for that matter, like TESO.

However, I could see 3rd person being superior in TESO's instanced PVP battles, but for just wandering around in PVE mode, not so much .. unless you just want this game to feel like every other game.

 

ES did have a fun 1st person mechanic, and I forsee many fans buying the game without reading up on it (just by brand recognition), only to start blogging, "what the hell is this crap?" .. hehe

 

 

Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.

  azarhal

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/06/09
Posts: 532

2/20/13 7:26:26 AM#7

I personally think they should have only 1st person with a vanity 3rd person. You know, just to try to be different from the rest of the MMO mass. Why not go all the way toward more Elder Scroll like. If everybody can only fight in 1st person the excuse that  "situational awareness" give an advantage in 3rd give goes away.

 

They are already pissing off all the "tab targetting" crowd with the combat system anyway . Well, the QQ haven't started yet, but Neverwinter use a similar system: mouse pointer locked to the middle of the screen, targetting is done through mouse pointer focus and you have to use the keyboard to use abilities, no clicking here, also dodging is in. The NWO beta forum was full of QQ about this system after the first beta weekend. Some people just can't play without clicking icons with the mouse and you can tell they are "MMOs players", because they keep saying stuff like "but other MMOs allowed me to do it".

 

NWO combat system is extremely well done, responsive and easy to use (remembering what 6 buttons do is not hard, is it?). If TESO combat works this way, it will be awesome. But I fear that the MMOers will QQ and the dev will change it to please them. Because since the game was announced, ZOS have only shown one thing: they don't really know the Elder Scrolls fans...

  Tokenaru

Novice Member

Joined: 1/26/13
Posts: 61

2/20/13 7:40:25 AM#8
Originally posted by Iselin

I'll give you this: it is ironic that the MMO version of the franchise that pioneered (Ultima Underworld did it first but TES: Arena was based on UU anyway) first person RPGs with aiming isn't doing it the Darkfall way. The DF system is pretty well a copy of the TES combat mechanics.

But on the other hand, I never play MMOs that have the option of 1st person/3rd person in anything but 3rd person POV. Why? Two words: situational awareness. Even in PVE group play you need to know what's all around you to play well. In PVP/RvR it's prety much a requirement for me. Not only do I play in 3rd person, for PVP I scroll the POV back as far as the game allows for even more awareness.

I'm fine with it in an MMO version of TES.

If you pvp in real life you cant scroll out of your body.  Immersion my friend,  I think some people like 3rd person and some like first person.  Ive been dying for a gorgeous mmorpg with real first person for over 12 years now.  I am not against third person view but real first person in the style of TES should be included imho.  Not only would it set TESO apart from its competitors,  it would give the game a greater sense of attachment a player has to his/her character.  I think pvp in first person would be exciting personally.  Dungeon crawling in first person...omnomnom.

 

 

  Nikopol

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/08
Posts: 627

Brought to you by... The Spirit of Nikopol.

2/20/13 9:45:07 AM#9

Having both 1st and 3rd person in an MMO practically means the MMO is 3rd person. Reason above: In tough encounters you just won't cut it without the situational awareness. The only MMOs you can play all the time (or even almost all the time) in 1st person and not feel gimped are the ones designed as 1st person first and foremost (as in, Darkfall).

On the other hand, of course having the 1st person view in as an option is better than not having it at all. Again, as above, many MMOs already have that option. When soloing / exploring I even use that option for lengths of time for immersion purposes. Still, when the going gets tough, you usually have to switch to 3rd.

  Dihoru

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/11/06
Posts: 2619

2/20/13 9:52:34 AM#10

Situational awarness = first person with a good mini-map.

 

Examples:

Sniping Mode World of Tanks.

Cockpit view World of Warplanes.

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

2/20/13 9:57:29 AM#11
I think its too late now. People might turn on first person for when they are wandering about exploring, but you'd be nuts to do pvp in first person when everyone else is using 3rd, likewise assuming they have dome sort of elitist pve like raiding or whatever no doubt there will be lots of "stop standing in fire use 3rd person noob"

Wish they'd made the game fixed 1st person from the off, for the immersion factor. But then if course people would have moaned about not being able to show off their gear.
  Tokenaru

Novice Member

Joined: 1/26/13
Posts: 61

2/20/13 11:08:55 AM#12
Originally posted by Nikopol

Having both 1st and 3rd person in an MMO practically means the MMO is 3rd person. Reason above: In tough encounters you just won't cut it without the situational awareness. The only MMOs you can play all the time (or even almost all the time) in 1st person and not feel gimped are the ones designed as 1st person first and foremost (as in, Darkfall).

On the other hand, of course having the 1st person view in as an option is better than not having it at all. Again, as above, many MMOs already have that option. When soloing / exploring I even use that option for lengths of time for immersion purposes. Still, when the going gets tough, you usually have to switch to 3rd.

Then theres the anomaly where someone plays first person but out-performs those using 3rd :)  The most "Efficient" path isnt always the most fun. 

  WellzyC

Novice Member

Joined: 10/04/11
Posts: 546

Ceaseless

 
OP  2/20/13 4:01:01 PM#13

 

I just don't see how you can use the Elder Scrolls IP and not have true first person. It's a kick in the nuts to be honest, and I dont know why bethesda isnt insisting on it. Its what makes elder scrolls... well... elder scrolls..

 

And for the "3rd person is better" bs..  You can instantly scroll out and right back into first person just like you did in Skyrim. It was fluid and worked just fine. For situations that called for 3rd person, it was a quck flick of the pointer finger... not a big deal at all.

 

First person is very important, It needs to be in this game. Thats what elder scrolls games are.

The way mmo's were: Community, Exploration, Character Development, Conquest.

The way mmo's are now : Cut-Scenes,Cut-Scenes, Linear Questing, Cut-Scenes...


www.CeaselessGuild.com

  FallguyArmy

Novice Member

Joined: 12/24/11
Posts: 80

2/20/13 4:27:23 PM#14
This game is turning out to become more of a generic MMORPG by the minute. Great way to destroy a franchise, Zenimax. 
  Tokenaru

Novice Member

Joined: 1/26/13
Posts: 61

2/20/13 4:30:48 PM#15
I feel like the mmorpg market these days is a bit like going to McDonalds, you can get anything you want but none of it will be good for you.
  pb1285n

Novice Member

Joined: 1/28/06
Posts: 506

2/20/13 4:38:30 PM#16
What a vague response. He never said that you wouldn't see your hands and weapon when it gets released, he simply said as it stand right now which implies that it could change. He also says they are working on it which makes sense since the game is in development.

I don't think true first person is out of the question, and will probably come down to fan feedback and if they have the time and resources.

  craftseeker

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/11/09
Posts: 625

2/20/13 5:17:45 PM#17

When a game has optional third person/first person switching it inevitably leads to players switching to third person to gain an advantage.  Once this starts to occurr developers start to develop mechanics that challenge players in third person view.  Very soon these mechanics are problematic to do in first person view.  This leads to it becoming mandatory to play in third person view during fights. 

In short having a third person view in a game means predominately third person play.  I find third person play incompatable with what my idea of a "Role Playing Game" is. 

 

Third-person narrative, it is obvious that the narrator is merely an unspecified entity or uninvolved person that conveys the story and is not a character of any kind within the story being told.

The first-person narrator is always a character within his/her own story (whether the protagonist or not). This viewpoint character takes actions, makes judgments and expresses opinions.

  redcapp

Novice Member

Joined: 5/13/11
Posts: 733

2/20/13 6:02:50 PM#18

Honestly I don't see why they don't throw in a good first person system to appease elder scrolls fans.  It's not like this is some small budget indie studio trying to conserve resources here.

And this coming from someone who always has preferred third person pov.

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

2/20/13 6:23:33 PM#19
Originally posted by Tokenaru
I feel like the mmorpg market these days is a bit like going to McDonalds, you can get anything you want but none of it will be good for you.

this is so true, GW2 sums it up, jack of all trades, master of none

  AmazingAvery

Age of Conan Advocate

Joined: 1/16/07
Posts: 7091

The only time you run out of chances is when you stop taking them.

2/23/13 3:16:00 PM#20

Elder Scrolls Online won’t include the series’ traditional first-person perspective

“The main difference here is that in an online RPG, enemies can spawn in a 360 degree radius around you, especially in PvP,” Frior told Digital Spy. “So third-person view mode, if you use it, will give you a far greater ability to see enemies behind you. In many situations, this will be the difference between living and not surviving a combat sequence.”


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