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News & Features Discussion  » [Dev Journal] Camelot Unchained: A New Beginning

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74 posts found

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/30/06
Posts: 331


2/05/13 5:11:44 PM#41
Originally posted by SBE1
So, the moral of the story is that the quant aspects of balancing classes is important, you can't recreate the combinations that players can create to find the imbalances.  Furthermore, you can't rely on PvE focused players to figure it out either.  Finally, get the PvP folks in earlier in the game so that when you need to rebalance the classes, you can do it sooner rather than later in the process so PvE can be adjusted if needed.  It always seems to me that the game does the PvE first, then PvP last, and trying to rebalance the PvP screws up the PvE, then all chaos breaks out and people get really upset about having to redo so much stuff.


I understand making MMO games, er, successful MMO games, is really hard work. I certainly wish you the best in your upcoming venture and hope for a 3-way balanced PvP game that allows me to continue to grow my characters via PvP points that also never releases an expasion that requires massive PvE investment to be competitive in PvP (cough ToA cough).


Good luck.  Seriously.  

It's hard to tell what he is saying, but I think Mark stated there will be no pve, but from this quote, its not black and white.

"Mark Jacobs: CU first differentiator is that the entire game revolves around RvR not RvR+PvE or PvE+RvR or anything like that. Also, systems such as crafting and housing are also tied directly into RvR."



Joined: 7/01/08
Posts: 2163

Nothing is til it is and even then you never know until its been.

2/05/13 5:45:03 PM#42
Classy post, hope it works out for us.


Novice Member

Joined: 8/13/05
Posts: 162

2/05/13 6:56:55 PM#43
Perhaps he's talking about instanced large scale RvR type battles that you queue for via lobby.  More than likely there would persistant growth of stats and such since the roots are in MMORPGs and the gameplay will likely follow.  It would be fun, maybe not taking the place of your favorite MMORPG but could definitely replace the PVP in your chosen game.  As long as there were tons of customization, gear to be won/earned, and a sense of persistance I could see myself losing tons of hours in it without the PVE, think Chivalry: Medieval Warfare only with a heap more MMO roots.  It wouldn't detract me from wanting to play other MMOs but would be successful in taking a chunk of my free time and money.  Ol' Jacobs is responsible for a lot of good that is often taken for granted, non of us are perfect but he's equipped with a good idea machine.  God speed man I hope your game turns out great, I'll be following it.

Novice Member

Joined: 6/27/05
Posts: 636

2/05/13 7:55:11 PM#44
Originally posted by 4bsolute

Oh my... I cant read it anymore: Redesign, rebirth, revamp, relaunch...

What Virus infected the human brain not being able to create Novelty anymore??

Is it SO hard to come up with genuine ideas these days??

Or is the game industry really so hardwired and tripping constantly over their contracts with bigoted publishers that do NOT UNDERSTAND A SINGLE BIT of art and design??

I could vomit left and right... such a bad bad time being a video gamer.


And whose fault is it? 80% of you people reading this, because you can NOT stop buying those god damn warmed up franchise-cr@p being released!!!

God damn hold back your wallet now and FORCE QUALITY to happen again OVER QUANTITY.

Motherhoppin brainless consumers.

Agreed completely.

Also, I get the feeling most people here are mad at Jacobs for some updates done to WAR that "ruined" the game? When I actually played the game, it looked to me that no amount of updates could get me to play it beyond beta.

It was, and still is, sub-par game in most aspects to many F2P mmorpgs (which aren't that great either).


Novice Member

Joined: 3/23/05
Posts: 220

2/05/13 8:00:29 PM#45
Can't wait for this!


Spotlight Poster

Joined: 3/28/11
Posts: 672

2/05/13 8:50:37 PM#46

I believe Jacobs wants to do something here. He's got the motivation, and it's personal, after WAR. 


I believe something good will come out of this.


Advanced Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 263

2/05/13 9:40:05 PM#47

Well I for one am thrilled to see developers embracing the three-sided PvP concept again. It’s really odd with the success of DAoC that future fantasy MMO’s didn’t embrace similar mechanics in their PvP design. Instead we ended up with two-sided conflicts, and when one side dominates the other side loses interest. Three-sided conflicts create quite a different dynamic and make it harder for one side to dominate. 

God speed to you Mark, we need a true spiritual successor. You helped create the original game, so let’s see what you can do. My only suggestion would be to remember what made DAoC successful and make it easier to access for all players.

Novice Member

Joined: 10/12/12
Posts: 69

2/05/13 9:57:15 PM#48
Originally posted by winter
 More Trials of Atlantis? No thanks, I'll pass this time.

Someone obviously didn't read ANYTHING about the game.^


Novice Member

Joined: 8/24/07
Posts: 34

2/05/13 10:13:19 PM#49

DAoC was and still is my favorite MMO ive ever played, if this is even close (minus the Atlantis part) you may have a customer for years to come. Three way pvp is THE best way to do it,even if its not balanced it makes it very interesting.

disclaimer: Shadowbane was really my favorite game ive played but was run/maintained by idiots.....


Advanced Member

Joined: 7/02/04
Posts: 981

"Shutting down threads sense 2004"

2/06/13 12:26:37 AM#50

This is a wait and see...


While I can see MJ making an open "I was an ass" appology. The point is, I and others have heard this before. GS, DAOC and WAR, each time an appology then a rant against the community a month later. It will take allot for me and others that know you this way to just "let it go". The old saying comes to mind " You made your bed, sleep in it". Time will tell and it will take years to do it for this isn't your first public appology .


"The monster created isn't by the company that makes the game, it's by the fans that make it something it never was"


Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/10/03
Posts: 5697

2/06/13 3:21:11 AM#51
Always happy to see those who gave us great games before give it another go. But as always no matter what your credentials don't expect a pre-order.

Novice Member

Joined: 9/20/12
Posts: 364

Wish I had something positive to say =(

2/06/13 5:31:21 AM#52
This is merely a " hey look at this, go give them money " article.  I would have rather read about a homeless man creating a game than this drivel.
  User Deleted
2/06/13 5:32:20 AM#53

It would be awesome if it gets off the ground depends on how much Mark Jacobs is asking for $$$$$ I know Chris Taylor Wildman is a Kickstarter project that doesn't look like it's going to get off the ground cause he's asking for a million dollars!

  User Deleted
2/06/13 5:34:34 AM#54

The gameplay monsters character and sounds is what made DAOC special to me...

Plus the addiction =)


Novice Member

Joined: 12/03/12
Posts: 67

2/06/13 6:07:41 AM#55

This "Guy" learnd something?



Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/12/04
Posts: 125

2/06/13 6:28:40 AM#56
Please shut up and take my money

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/01/05
Posts: 287

Today is a good day to Pwn someone

2/06/13 9:02:59 AM#57

Very excited to spend some money supporting this :)

i hope all the lessons of what was both good and bad in both DAoC and WAR is attended to. Despite all the froth at WAR's failures, there were a lot of improvements on DAoC.

however to capture the "magic" of CAMELOT, well good luck and don't balls it up mate!


Novice Member

Joined: 12/24/06
Posts: 4

2/06/13 11:18:35 AM#58
Couple of things WAR did right that I have wished DAoC would have adopted:  Public Quest was a great idea.  RIFT has used it effectively and should be considered for CU.  All classes were able to engage in ground combat, as a long time DAoC Midgard Healer, I can only hope that CU allows all classes to mix it up in hand to hand combat.  DAoC Midgard healers had no offensive damage spells, they should have been able to swing a mean hammer/staff to keep the wounded enemy on it's toes if not running away.   Instead, they are an easy kill once their instant heals runs out. 

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/07/10
Posts: 4

2/06/13 11:59:52 AM#59

I just hope that your new company will be more open to your beta testers then they have been in the past, Mark. I was a beta tester and a TL in Dark Age and a beta tester and Core Tester in Warhammer and most of our feedback (especially on ToA and the release condition of WAR) was largely ignored. I can't even count the number of arguements I got into with Mackey over ToA ... everything was a fundamental design and not open to discussion.


I wish I had been the TL program when LotM came out ... that was actually one of my favorite expansions of any MMO ... even better than SI. I was pretty sure at that point that you had learned your lessons ... but then WAR testing began.


Actually, it would be more fair to say WAR testing winded down ... because in the beginning it was the norm for a beta test. However, once the deadline was set it was total chaos ... much more so than WOW, RIFT, GW2 closed beta/alpha were. All input was competely shot down ... it was "test this and shut up" all the time. It became worse when the list of items being cut from the game to make the deadline was announced. Every tester was in a state of shock at that point as we realized that the game we thought we were testing was never actually going to make it live.


The feedback ... or attempted feedback at that point should have been a clear indicator of what was going to happen if you released the game.



Novice Member

Joined: 4/22/06
Posts: 2395

2/06/13 7:48:14 PM#60

While i had high hopes i feel much of them are dashed with this release. Something i warned my friends about.

The simple truth is this seems to appear to be a shadowbane meets daoc idea w/ limited pve or easy leveling pve (if any at all). In this case ill probably pass. DAoc's pve worked, its what i have been laregly missing in recent mmos.... and i hardly have any hope that MJ would get rvr right.

Rvr keeps in daoc: ladders or ramps? Everyone should ask this question to see if mark jacobs even understands WHY daoc keep warfare worked (NF). A minor aspect but exhibits alot.

A modern daoc with its orginal pve (maybe less exp required, or better equipment [it was hard to get off the bat] to more easily exp.) would be wonderful. There are pleanty of games out there with rvr , albeit weaker rvr than daocs but not by a ton, what they often lack is a good pve side, a good socail side (built by the REQUIRED cooprative nature of pve), and more things to do than pvp (Other than an one party instanced dungeons). DAocs pve had this and provided all of this, now i see mark jacobs stating he going to make a game with daoc's rvr without the things that made daocs rvr valuable... My response /cheer - inc. faliure.

Sure this is a cynical view, but with good reason. There was a game named war and not all of its bad decisions were made by EA. EArth to mark jacobs.

"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine

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