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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » How long will MMOs hide P2W behind the veil of FTP?

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210 posts found
  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19463

1/29/13 11:52:05 AM#201
Originally posted by Wraithone
 

Correct. In the absence of sufficient demand, the RMT and other such would not exist.

And given how prevalent RMT is, it is very clear that there is a strong demand.

This discussion is moot. RMT & cash shops are not going away because they work.

  Aeonblades

Elite Member

Joined: 10/12/12
Posts: 2123

1/29/13 11:53:29 AM#202
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Wraithone
 

Correct. In the absence of sufficient demand, the RMT and other such would not exist.

And given how prevalent RMT is, it is very clear that there is a strong demand.

This discussion is moot. RMT & cash shops are not going away because they work.

Sadly, this is the truth. The days of quality are over, it's all about quantity now baby.

Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
Have played: You name it
If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 5632

1/29/13 12:16:31 PM#203
Originally posted by Aeonblades
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Wraithone

Correct. In the absence of sufficient demand, the RMT and other such would not exist.

And given how prevalent RMT is, it is very clear that there is a strong demand.

This discussion is moot. RMT & cash shops are not going away because they work.

Sadly, this is the truth. The days of quality are over, it's all about quantity now baby.

What were these "days of quality"?

I think a mind wipe so people could play an mmo like it was their first time again, would be easier to build than a new mmo people here would actually like. - DamonVile

  Aeonblades

Elite Member

Joined: 10/12/12
Posts: 2123

1/29/13 12:20:02 PM#204

From UO till Vanilla WoW. Most games released during this time phase brought something worthwhile to the table. Note I say most, not all :)

Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
Have played: You name it
If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  Quirhid

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5506

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

1/29/13 2:28:42 PM#205
Originally posted by Aeonblades

From UO till Vanilla WoW. Most games released during this time phase brought something worthwhile to the table. Note I say most, not all :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztVMib1T4T4

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  thinktank001

Elite Member

Joined: 12/13/08
Posts: 1833

1/30/13 2:18:15 AM#206
Originally posted by Torvaldr

You're making up anecdotal evidence and applying it broadly to every scenario.  In GW2, TSW, STO, and now Tera, if I spend $100 on the game I'm not twice as powerful as someone who purchased $50 in cash store items.

The P2P scenario isn't ridiculous at all.  I didn't buy Rift's Storm Legion and I'm at a disadvantage compared to other players even though I still have active sub time.  It doesn't matter that it's p2p or f2p.  They are selling advantage and restricting those who don't pay more than their subscription.

It's not ridiculous because p2p zealots are applying the standard to p2p one way and to f2p another.  You could make the same statement about f2p: why would a player choose never to purchase content and continue play a f2p game?  Just because a p2p game can lock you out of their servers when your subscription ends doesn't mean that them selling an xpac is any less p2w than a f2p game selling stuff.

You could even go so far as to apply the 50/100 rule you stated above to p2p.  If I can only afford $50 worth of sub time a year but someone else can afford $100 worth of sub time then they have purchased an advantage over me.  How is that different from f2p other than in f2p I can actually still improve my character where the sub game I'm locked out.

 

 

It doesn't matter what cash shop game is chosen.  Games that don't sell items that directly improve character strength always offer other items that players can be purchased and sold for in-game currency.    Either way a player spending the most cash will always have an advantage that is proportional to the amount they spent.    

 

Your argument is interesting, but I am still hesitant to consider it a paid advantage.  It would be different if the initial purchase of the expansion gave players the increased levels, new gear, etc., but it only allows them to earn that advantage by playing the game.         

 

    

  Scot

Elite Member

Joined: 10/10/03
Posts: 5213

1/30/13 3:30:33 AM#207

The P2W advantage you get is hard to qualify and you certainly are not twice as good in PvP for playing twice as much. But you get an advantage, and often a substantial one.

This is about having a level playing field, which when you want to make as much cash as possible is a real problem. So first you offer some XP boosts, then its PVE buffs, teleporting in PVE and so on. Get the punters used to all that. After which you sell passes for raids so players can get PVE gear quicker. Then its PvP gear. Or you let players buy wepaons, which they can also obtain through building up PvP points.

P2W is here and now and it is only going to get worse, the cash cow (that's us guy's) is mooing a bit but still paying up like a dream.

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19463

1/30/13 10:21:12 AM#208
Originally posted by Scot

P2W is here and now and it is only going to get worse, the cash cow (that's us guy's) is mooing a bit but still paying up like a dream.

Not "us". Only a small percentage of the player population .. hence whales, not cash cows. It is pretty well known fact that only a small percentage pay through the roof. We are most likely the free loaders riding their coat tails.

 

  Madimorga

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 1997

1/30/13 11:11:38 AM#209

It is now socially acceptable among gamers to spend money above and beyond the sub and/or box price in order to get an advantage over other players, be it through currency, time, gear, or all of the above.

 

It's over.  The genre is completely corrupted.  People pour hundreds into these games, sometimes hundreds every month.  Not only do I not want to compete with these players, frankly I don't even want to share the same gameworlds with them.  Their definition of what 'playing a game' means is too radically different from mine.

 

Yet another reason I'm done spending money on MMOs.  

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19463

1/30/13 11:55:10 AM#210
Originally posted by Madimorga

It is now socially acceptable among gamers to spend money above and beyond the sub and/or box price in order to get an advantage over other players, be it through currency, time, gear, or all of the above.

 

It's over.  The genre is completely corrupted.  People pour hundreds into these games, sometimes hundreds every month.  Not only do I not want to compete with these players, frankly I don't even want to share the same gameworlds with them.  Their definition of what 'playing a game' means is too radically different from mine.

 

Yet another reason I'm done spending money on MMOs.  

Just play an instanced game. You can be in control and never be in the same copy of the "gameworld" with anyone you don't like.

 

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