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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

General Discussion  » Wow the elitism-anti-criticism on the official forum is worst than GW2Guru was pre-news-of-an-offical-forum-was-coming

19 posts found
  MMOExposed

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/17/10
Posts: 5925

 
OP  1/15/13 7:07:53 PM#1

Wow the elitism-anti-criticism on the official forum is worst than GW2Guru was pre-news-of-an-offical-forum-was-coming event that changed Guru for the better.

 

But the offical forum is harsh now. Anything bad said leads to an infraction no matter how respectful it is.

 

Just be warned.

 

I suggest if you have criticism, I suggest you format your words on a more freely opinion expression forum like this and allow the the fans to clean up the tone of what you trying to say a bit before posting it on the official forums.

You agree

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  rodingo

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/18/07
Posts: 1656

1/15/13 7:54:52 PM#2
Can I get a synonym to "elitisim-anti-criticism" ?

"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor

  wowfan1996

Novice Member

Joined: 9/25/09
Posts: 741

1/15/13 9:40:52 PM#3
Old news. It's been that way from the get-go.

MMORPG genre is dead. Long live MMOCS (Massively Multiplayer Online Cash Shop).

  Freezzo

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/28/12
Posts: 233

1/15/13 10:06:13 PM#4
I fairly disagree. You shouldn't post anything negative on any gaming forum as people either mark you as a troll or fanboislap you. When that's done none of your arguments hold any value as they have been branded anti-gameyouweregivingconstructivefeedbackon or troll. Welcome to the anonymous internet.

"We need men who can dream of things that never were." - John F. Kennedy
And for MMORPGs ever so true...

  eyelolled

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/13/10
Posts: 3083

I am more than some of my parts

1/15/13 10:33:18 PM#5

I think it's great. I think they should be more aggressive about it, so that you get banned if you make a typo or even if you make a joke and the general concensus is that the joke wasn't "THAT" funny.  

Seriously though, people take it way too far with their "I have a right to share my unhappy feelings" and it really needs to be stopped because it takes away any benefit that can be gained from collective input.  I supported their right to NOT have an official forum, and was disappointed that they made one.

Of course there is going to be some person that quotes the above paragraph and says things like "criticism is healthy and important for growth and development. " but the problem is, there are too many people that don't have anything valuable to share, but that doesn't stop them from sharing. 

You could get 100 different opinions about a skin blemish and not once gain any useful information if none of the people your spoke to were doctors.

And face it, it's their house. If you come to my house and kick my dog, you'll be out on your ass in a heartbeat.  Don't fool yourself. People have the right to speak up, but more often than not people should be exercising their right to shut the hell up. A forum ban is just a helpful tool the mods use to make sure people can understand that.

All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.

  bliss14

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/01/11
Posts: 509

Ahh devil ether.

1/15/13 10:36:36 PM#6
Your hyphens exhibit higher function brain....stuff.  
  bliss14

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/01/11
Posts: 509

Ahh devil ether.

1/15/13 10:38:16 PM#7
Originally posted by eyelolled

I think it's great. I think they should be more aggressive about it, so that you get banned if you make a typo or even if you make a joke and the general concensus is that the joke wasn't "THAT" funny.  

Seriously though, people take it way too far with their "I have a right to share my unhappy feelings" and it really needs to be stopped because it takes away any benefit that can be gained from collective input.  I supported their right to NOT have an official forum, and was disappointed that they made one.

Of course there is going to be some person that quotes the above paragraph and says things like "criticism is healthy and important for growth and development. " but the problem is, there are too many people that don't have anything valuable to share, but that doesn't stop them from sharing. 

You could get 100 different opinions about a skin blemish and not once gain any useful information if none of the people your spoke to were doctors.

And face it, it's their house. If you come to my house and kick my dog, you'll be out on your ass in a heartbeat.  Don't fool yourself. People have the right to speak up, but more often than not people should be exercising their right to shut the hell up. A forum ban is just a helpful tool the mods use to make sure people can understand that.

Wtf who goes to someone's house and kicks their dog?  Rude to the utmost.

  dotdotdash

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/01/11
Posts: 347

1/15/13 10:43:04 PM#8
Originally posted by MMOExposed

Wow the elitism-anti-criticism on the official forum is worst than GW2Guru was pre-news-of-an-offical-forum-was-coming event that changed Guru for the better.

 

But the offical forum is harsh now. Anything bad said leads to an infraction no matter how respectful it is.

 

Just be warned.

 

I suggest if you have criticism, I suggest you format your words on a more freely opinion expression forum like this and allow the the fans to clean up the tone of what you trying to say a bit before posting it on the official forums.

I myself have engaged in debates on the official forum(s), and whilst some individuals will try to engage you in a reaosnable back-and-forth... most will not. It's not surprising really as most who actively post on such forums are either die-hard fans of whatever game it is, or are people desperately trying to convince themselves that the flaws are not actually there.

GW2Guru is a commercial site run by fans "for fans"; I wouldn't go so far as to say the official boards are worse than GW2Guru... because they aren't. They certainly aren't worse than GWGuru, the precursor site to GW2Guru. The people who run both sites are people born unto communities built on snobbery more than anything else, although GWGuru is a den of thieves where GW2Guru is just for the mentally unsound.

And MMORPG.com is no better than either. Perhaps worse, in fact.

  dotdotdash

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/01/11
Posts: 347

1/15/13 10:50:31 PM#9
Originally posted by eyelolled

I think it's great. I think they should be more aggressive about it, so that you get banned if you make a typo or even if you make a joke and the general concensus is that the joke wasn't "THAT" funny.  

Seriously though, people take it way too far with their "I have a right to share my unhappy feelings" and it really needs to be stopped because it takes away any benefit that can be gained from collective input.  I supported their right to NOT have an official forum, and was disappointed that they made one.

Of course there is going to be some person that quotes the above paragraph and says things like "criticism is healthy and important for growth and development. " but the problem is, there are too many people that don't have anything valuable to share, but that doesn't stop them from sharing. 

You could get 100 different opinions about a skin blemish and not once gain any useful information if none of the people your spoke to were doctors.

And face it, it's their house. If you come to my house and kick my dog, you'll be out on your ass in a heartbeat.  Don't fool yourself. People have the right to speak up, but more often than not people should be exercising their right to shut the hell up. A forum ban is just a helpful tool the mods use to make sure people can understand that.

All I will say is that it's very hard to measure the value of a persons contribution when such discussions round wholly on subjectivity. Just because you do not value one persons contribution does not mean that others do not, so you're left with a situation where - and unless there is clear consensus - you are mostly policing such comments and contributions on arbitrary grounds, rather than any empirical knowledge.

You cannot draw lines in the sand and say "these people can voice their opinion, but these people cannot". That's not how it works. EVERYONE gets to voice their opinion, and then - as a collective - we sift through the rubbish to find the truth, those opinions and observations worth listening to, ignore those that are clearly silly, and censure AFTER THE FACT those that are dangerous or otherwise untoward. If we applied  your philosophy on moderation of the expression of opinions to human progression, Einstein would have no doubt been muted.

And the dog thing is a flawed and twisted analogy that doesn't quite work. At all.

  Tuchaka

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/14/10
Posts: 453

1/15/13 10:54:45 PM#10
The people who complain about forums being too restrictive are confessing to being trolls.
  Ambros123

Novice Member

Joined: 12/04/11
Posts: 891

1/15/13 10:59:27 PM#11

Nature of th beast, here is a prime example.  Forums do more of bashing and hating than anything else, hence the term "Forum PVP" which I never heard till here and I see it on a daily basis.  Official sites should censor within reason as many will post just for the simple joy of hating on the game or that they are so disgruntled that they have to create hate posts under suger coated words.

Also it does get tiresome after seeing the 100th "critical review" post.

  Lovely_Laly

Novice Member

Joined: 11/02/10
Posts: 736

game is also real

1/15/13 11:11:55 PM#12

Forum is place where every one can freely tell his / her opinion.

If not, it's not a forum but rose garden for compliments or just GM contact area.

BUT if you use forum to insult, flame or troll you opponents, or even if you use only curse to express yourself, may be you should not post such thread anywhere and don't cry if you got banned (although I more for "warned" instate of "banned" and for going very carefully with repressions).

Keep in mind though to never post on FUN site anything negative, as fun is not objective but subjective player who is in love with this game. Such player can't hear any critics (same as you tell to guy deep in love, that his lady is just ugly).

I keep my position: official forum MUST be more tolerant to criticism and even totally negative opinions as it might help them to know public needs. Sure they can ask to express negative reactions in correct and polite form.

try before buy, even if it's a game to avoid bad surprises.
Worst surprises for me: Aion, GW2

  Corehaven

Novice Member

Joined: 7/27/11
Posts: 1574

I swear by my pretty floral bonnet, I will end you.

1/15/13 11:18:23 PM#13
Originally posted by Dampyre
The people who complain about forums being too restrictive are confessing to being trolls.

 

Uh huh.  Because all internet forums are fairly run, and the mods are saints.  Nope.  Welcome to the internet.  I'm sure you'll figure it out soon enough. 

  eyelolled

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/13/10
Posts: 3083

I am more than some of my parts

1/15/13 11:25:17 PM#14
Originally posted by dotdotdash
Originally posted by eyelolled

I think it's great. I think they should be more aggressive about it, so that you get banned if you make a typo or even if you make a joke and the general concensus is that the joke wasn't "THAT" funny.  

Seriously though, people take it way too far with their "I have a right to share my unhappy feelings" and it really needs to be stopped because it takes away any benefit that can be gained from collective input.  I supported their right to NOT have an official forum, and was disappointed that they made one.

Of course there is going to be some person that quotes the above paragraph and says things like "criticism is healthy and important for growth and development. " but the problem is, there are too many people that don't have anything valuable to share, but that doesn't stop them from sharing. 

You could get 100 different opinions about a skin blemish and not once gain any useful information if none of the people your spoke to were doctors.

And face it, it's their house. If you come to my house and kick my dog, you'll be out on your ass in a heartbeat.  Don't fool yourself. People have the right to speak up, but more often than not people should be exercising their right to shut the hell up. A forum ban is just a helpful tool the mods use to make sure people can understand that.

All I will say is that it's very hard to measure the value of a persons contribution when such discussions round wholly on subjectivity. Just because you do not value one persons contribution does not mean that others do not, so you're left with a situation where - and unless there is clear consensus - you are mostly policing such comments and contributions on arbitrary grounds, rather than any empirical knowledge.

You cannot draw lines in the sand and say "these people can voice their opinion, but these people cannot". That's not how it works. EVERYONE gets to voice their opinion, and then - as a collective - we sift through the rubbish to find the truth, those opinions and observations worth listening to, ignore those that are clearly silly, and censure AFTER THE FACT those that are dangerous or otherwise untoward. If we applied  your philosophy on moderation of the expression of opinions to human progression, Einstein would have no doubt been muted.

And the dog thing is a flawed and twisted analogy that doesn't quite work. At all.

I disagree. 

Lets say that I am the developer of a product. We'll call it the "male anti-inflammatory device", guaranteed to reduce swelling within 5 minutes.  Now,I would like to sell my product to everybody, but of course that isn't feasible, so I have a specific target audience that I am focusing my product towards. For ease, lets say the TA is men, ages 18 to 50.  I create my marketing to appeal to that target audience but any effective marketing can affect people not within the TA. For examples sake, lets say men age 60+ that use drugs causing inflammation. 

So now, I make a forum, where users could talk about my product. I find that there are alot of retired gentlemen who are finding my product does not work for them, as they are on medications that cause inflammation. They seem exceedingly vocal about it, because they've paid money for my product. I offer an option for unconditional money back, at an expense to my company, so that these people can at least say I'm running a good company. Instead, they turn around and continue to go on about how my product didn't work for them, and nobody should trust the product.

I also find that there are a bunch of women who are up in arms about my product, because it wasn't designed for them. They want me to change the product entirely, so it could be more suitable for their personal use. The people that are happy with my product (my target audience) get into arguments with the women because they don't want the product changed.

Should I listen to the women or the elderly gentleman and keep their unhappiness threads up, even though the product is not designed for them? No. I delete the threads and ban the worse offenders. Why? Because I care about my target audience. That is who my product is for. That is where my patronage lies.

Do the other people have rights that have been trampled on?  Don't care.

 

 

And the dog analogy works just fine, even if you have difficulty accepting it.

All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.

  Volgore

Tipster

Joined: 6/15/08
Posts: 1900

Posts deleted: 12589457

1/16/13 11:43:00 AM#15
Originally posted by Dampyre
The people who complain about forums being too restrictive are confessing to being trolls.

Yes, just like everyone who is being banned and warned on this forum is 100% a troll...

  Pivotelite

Novice Member

Joined: 1/19/12
Posts: 2189

1/16/13 1:52:16 PM#16
Originally posted by Dampyre
The people who complain about forums being too restrictive are confessing to being trolls.

 i'm not a troll, I gave honest feedback then they labelled my post as "trolling" and banned me.

 

That along with other things essentially lost them a player, who took some friends with him. Some friends that certainly spent a lot in the cash shop. Excessively strict moderation on forums isn't always a good thing, actually it almost never is.

 

I'm sure most people here are well aware how "strict" MMORPG can be at times, well GW2 forums are far worse. I think thats enough evidence its overboard.

  Gaia_Hunter

Elite Member

Joined: 5/04/12
Posts: 2566

1/16/13 2:29:41 PM#17
Originally posted by Pivotelite
Originally posted by Dampyre
The people who complain about forums being too restrictive are confessing to being trolls.

 i'm not a troll, I gave honest feedback then they labelled my post as "trolling" and banned me.

 

That along with other things essentially lost them a player, who took some friends with him. Some friends that certainly spent a lot in the cash shop. Excessively strict moderation on forums isn't always a good thing, actually it almost never is.

 

I'm sure most people here are well aware how "strict" MMORPG can be at times, well GW2 forums are far worse. I think thats enough evidence its overboard.

I just think it is more likely that people are used to behave in the internet in a way that would lead to broken noses out there.

And since they are used to, they don't recognize that their behaviour as aggressive or offensive anymore.

The simple fact of going on the forum and posting "I'm leaving because of this this and that" is flame baiting.

Simply saying "I'm not enjoying this feature and that because of this" or "I rather this feature was more like this" would avoid any problems.

Currently playing: GW2
Cooperative (semi cooperative)board games you should check: Pandemic, Sentinels of the Multiverse, Eldritch Horror, Descent 2.0,Level 7 Omega Protocol, Last Night on Earth

  Icewhite

Made History

Joined: 7/11/11
Posts: 6495

Pink, it's like red but not quite.

1/16/13 2:31:50 PM#18
Originally posted by rodingo
Can I get a synonym to "elitisim-anti-criticism" ?

I've read that sentence three times. Not sure it's in English.

Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  Amana

MMORPG.COM Staff

Joined: 1/03/11
Posts: 2341

1/16/13 2:35:53 PM#19

There are already threads discussing GW2 official forum moderation. Making a new one every time there's moderation over there you don't agree with only floods it over here.

So, instead of a new thread, please seek the open thread or two that are talking about gW2 moderation. Like this: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/373655/Official-forums-are-an-utter-nonsense.html

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