Originally posted by FARGIN_WAR

Originally posted by Marcus-

Originally posted by grimal

Originally posted by fat_taddler

GW2 is a great entry point for players who are new to MMO's and those that are looking for a very casual friendly online gaming experience.

 

As many have and will state, the game simply doesn't have enough meaningful gameplay / progression options to keep many MMO veterans and hardcore players engaged over the long term. 

 

Sounds like ANet is seeing this as well which is why the 2013 changes seems to be geared towards player retention which is great.

I think you hit the nail on the head here.  Very good introduction game.

As an MMO Vet, if i wanted another game based on progression and tiers et al., theres plenty of them out there to choose from.

 

 As an MMO vet, i don't really recall most of the early MMOs built so heavily on the progression that so many folks like to harken back on (NwN, UO, SWG) there were some sure, but this fallacy that MMOs have always been about progression is getting old.  Is it casual friendly? Sure it is. Aren't most MMOs these days?

What exactly are you looking for thats so hardcore (out of curiosity)? What is this game lacking that makes it introductory? Again, I agree, it is casual friendly, I'm not disagreeing there, I'm just trying to figure out  your definition of it.

Does this game need more work? Sure it does, which MMO doesn't? Particilarly one that was just released 4 (?) months ago. Is this the game i've always imagined in my MMO? Nope, not even close.  But i find it pretty fun, and i have no qualms if you don't, different strokes and all that.

Theres a pretty lengthy blog post up about their plans for '13. I know gamers these days expect enough content in an MMO to keep them occupied 8 hours a day 7 days a week , for the next three or four years the moment after launch, but most MMO vets know better, I bet... 

Agree with all three quoted posts here with the exception of the underlined bit. I feel that bit is unfair, not to mention completely misleading. I feel players do not want "tons of endless content" they want unscripted content that they can manipulate to their own satisfaction.

Game companies need to stop treating their players like mindless sheep that need to be herded and instead give them at least some tools to make their own fun. GW2 at least attempted to break up some of the standard themepark monotony but at the end of the day once I'd seen the same repetitve game content on a couple of characters I lost any further interest. Just like I have with the last several scripted themepark MMOs.

There was more than a lil bit of sarcasm there,  forgive me.

What i am REALLY curious to see, is when we do get this sandbox you are alluding too, is, what happens then?

I really am having a hard time seeing todays MMO gamer enjoying a sandbox, though more and more seem to be calling for it. I really enjoy sandboxs myself, and look forward to them, but todays gamers i am more than willing to bet will be screaming for more content, just as they do in every MMO released.

How many trips through Jabba's Palace are people willing to take? or Destard, or seeing crafters making the best gear. "Why bother doing anything if i can craft the best stuffs!1!11!!".

"Wheres ma epixx???"

I'm looking forward to it as much as anyone, I just don't see this as being the answer everyone seems to think it is as far as content and keeping people content (as it were).

Though i know i will like it...

Originally posted by Warband

Originally posted by Ramonski7

Originally posted by Warband

Originally posted by sadeyx

hmm,  so far its sold exactly half as many copies as diablo3 did on the first day xD,  Which is a pretty good indicator,  leveling alts, item hunting and acheivments in D3 just seems to be far more gratuitous.

Guildwars2 is neither an MMO nor a standalonge RPG resulting in a game that isnt very very good at either.   Great if your a person who is deeply conflicted about these gamyplay styles but not me.   I rather play either a thorough-bred MMO or a thorough-bred RPG.

The only people in my friends list that still play it are just people determined to prove the game is as good as they convinced themselves it would be during the hype.

The reality is, it was fun for a month but now is the time to accept it will never be the wow-killer, will never live up to the hype and look for something else.

 

 

Diablo 3 is bad game that entirely on the strength of it's predessor and blizzard brand name. When was the last time Blizzard posted any stats about the game sales, yeah the intial one.

I would be careful about throwing around accusations like that. You can easily replace D3 with GW2 and Blizzard with ArenaNET and someone could present you with the same argument. No it's best if you just ignore posters that try to drag down a discussion by bringing in things that are not related to the subject at hand. Calling either game bad is a matter of opinion that varies wildly among millions of players.

Completely missed the point. I was stating guild wars 2 sold a million starting 2 months after launch meaning the game continue to sell decent past the intial launch buzz. The same can't be said for Diablo 3 otherwise blizzard would have mentioned it. GW2 also reviewed higher based on critics and general user score. Of course bad game is an opinion but gw2 is generally regard as higher by the majority from the information I have.

Oh I understand your point but a chevy volt builds a base after it's initial launch and porsche however...

What I'm getting at is that you're comparing two totally different genres, but if that was your point in the first place carry on...

Originally posted by Ramonski7

Originally posted by Warband

Originally posted by Ramonski7

Originally posted by Warband

Originally posted by sadeyx

hmm,  so far its sold exactly half as many copies as diablo3 did on the first day xD,  Which is a pretty good indicator,  leveling alts, item hunting and acheivments in D3 just seems to be far more gratuitous.

Guildwars2 is neither an MMO nor a standalonge RPG resulting in a game that isnt very very good at either.   Great if your a person who is deeply conflicted about these gamyplay styles but not me.   I rather play either a thorough-bred MMO or a thorough-bred RPG.

The only people in my friends list that still play it are just people determined to prove the game is as good as they convinced themselves it would be during the hype.

The reality is, it was fun for a month but now is the time to accept it will never be the wow-killer, will never live up to the hype and look for something else.

 

 

Diablo 3 is bad game that entirely on the strength of it's predessor and blizzard brand name. When was the last time Blizzard posted any stats about the game sales, yeah the intial one.

I would be careful about throwing around accusations like that. You can easily replace D3 with GW2 and Blizzard with ArenaNET and someone could present you with the same argument. No it's best if you just ignore posters that try to drag down a discussion by bringing in things that are not related to the subject at hand. Calling either game bad is a matter of opinion that varies wildly among millions of players.

Completely missed the point. I was stating guild wars 2 sold a million starting 2 months after launch meaning the game continue to sell decent past the intial launch buzz. The same can't be said for Diablo 3 otherwise blizzard would have mentioned it. GW2 also reviewed higher based on critics and general user score. Of course bad game is an opinion but gw2 is generally regard as higher by the majority from the information I have.

Oh I understand your point but a chevy volt builds a base after it's initial launch and porsche however...

What I'm getting at is that you're comparing two totally different genres, but if that was your point in the first place carry on...

I ain't comparing shit, I wasn't even the person who brought up the comparison in the fiirst place as you'll notice by the quotations. i was just stating that the while the intial quote is true I don't like D3 after having a playing some of it, and that while D3 sold more at launch it it's post launch have seemingly dropped off a cliff (as if it had sold a million or two in that time Blizzard would have surely mentioned it). So it seems not many people bought the game after the intial launch week or month, which isn't the same for gw2. Personal interpretation is that typically that occurs when the reception to said game wasn't great.

I'll be surprised if the expansion hits 3 million after two years.

Whenever they decide to release one that is. GW2 will be deemed a success or failure based on how many people they've retained willing to buy whatever expansion they are cooking up right now.

There's obviously a difference between financial success and game success.

If they sold 3 million copies, then they made money, and it is indeed a financial success.

But that doesn't say jack about how good or how fun the game is, the majority of those sales were done off of hype, promises, and peoples own imagination of what the game would be like.

So is the game itself (gameplay) a success, that's subjective, and my answer is, no.

Originally posted by Volkon
Still playing it, still loving it. Still hit queues in WvW, still overflows in L.A. Still find that events draw a crowd in PvE pretty much anywhere. Still a great game.

This pretty much sums it up for me too.

I wish that people could finally understand how MMOs work. I wish they finally realize you will never get everything in the first months. In those months, what matters, is what the developer say they plan to do and how their plans are actually working out in game. 

I took a break from GW2 because the game needs work, a lot of work, but so does every MMO in it's first year really. I did not because of lack of content (there still thing I haven't done in game) but because of some flaws in mechanics/gameplay system itself that, in at leastpartial way, are apparently going ot be adressed in upcomming updates. Will see after that. That's the beauty of B2P model coupled with rather vertical progression. I can go play other games for month or two and come back without really feeling behind. 

It's funny how people these days seem to expect that a MMO out of the box will have content volume similar to games like WoW that's been out for 8 years with 4th expansion out... It's simply impossible. Compared to some recent game releases, however I actually see the GW2 devs working on adding new stuff constantly and actually trying to improve the game. When you compare titles like TSW, Rift or GW2, all of which recieved regular updates since launch to a game like TOR, which went without significant updates since it's launch till just now you can see the difference in approach. 

Originally posted by PieRad

There's obviously a difference between financial success and game success.

If they sold 3 million copies, then they made money, and it is indeed a financial success.

 

But that doesn't say jack about how good or how fun the game is, the majority of those sales were done off of hype, promises, and peoples own imagination of what the game would be like.

 

So is the game itself (gameplay) a success, that's subjective, and my answer is, no.

 

 

 

That is YOUR answer - MY ANSWER IS YES to gameplay success. We cancel each other out :-)

Originally posted by fat_taddler

GW2 is a great entry point for players who are new to MMO's and those that are looking for a very casual friendly online gaming experience.

 

As many have and will state, the game simply doesn't have enough meaningful gameplay / progression options to keep many MMO veterans and hardcore players engaged over the long term. 

 

Sounds like ANet is seeing this as well which is why the 2013 changes seems to be geared towards player retention which is great.

Aye, the game is perfect for casual players. Too much hand holding for me to have stuck with the game. I knew it was a typical themepark though when I bought it. I treated it like a PS3 game, I bought it, completed it, gave it away.

Still love the game.  I log in for at least 8 hours every week as I have since release.  I still have a ton of stuff to do for my main character (don't even have full exotics yet) and there is still a bunch of stuff I haven't done much of.

For the most part, the events they've had have been a blast as well and I look forward to 2013 being even better!

GW2 sold over 2 million in the first 2 weeks.

In September they sold around 500,000 between the US and Europe. Which would put the total at around 2.5 million.

Which means they have sold around 500,000 in the months since.

Not bad but also not good for a Buy to play MMO.

Originally posted by Xiaoki

GW2 sold over 2 million in the first 2 weeks.

In September they sold around 500,000 between the US and Europe. Which would put the total at around 2.5 million.

Which means they have sold around 500,000 in the months since.

Not bad but also not good for a Buy to play MMO.

You speak as if there were a more successful B2P mmo...

Originally posted by Xiaoki

GW2 sold over 2 million in the first 2 weeks.

In September they sold around 500,000 between the US and Europe. Which would put the total at around 2.5 million.

Which means they have sold around 500,000 in the months since.

Not bad but also not good for a Buy to play MMO.

Umm we don't know the break down for september and the number is flawed considering 13 days of september near half the month was included in those 2 weeks. so it's either 500k an extra 17 days, or more spread over the 3-4 months. Consider many sites didn't even have stock for the game for a few weeks right up until christmas I was still hearing about it, it was a weird periodThe stopped selling the game for a period time even..

Originally posted by botrytis

Originally posted by PieRad

There's obviously a difference between financial success and game success.

If they sold 3 million copies, then they made money, and it is indeed a financial success.

 

But that doesn't say jack about how good or how fun the game is, the majority of those sales were done off of hype, promises, and peoples own imagination of what the game would be like.

 

So is the game itself (gameplay) a success, that's subjective, and my answer is, no.

 

 

 

That is YOUR answer - MY ANSWER IS YES to gameplay success. We cancel each other out :-)

What was the point of that? lol

Yes it's MY answer, or I wouldn't have said it.

Originally posted by Tayah

Originally posted by fat_taddler

GW2 is a great entry point for players who are new to MMO's and those that are looking for a very casual friendly online gaming experience.

 

As many have and will state, the game simply doesn't have enough meaningful gameplay / progression options to keep many MMO veterans and hardcore players engaged over the long term. 

 

Sounds like ANet is seeing this as well which is why the 2013 changes seems to be geared towards player retention which is great.

Aye, the game is perfect for casual players. Too much hand holding for me to have stuck with the game. I knew it was a typical themepark though when I bought it. I treated it like a PS3 game, I bought it, completed it, gave it away.

I think the problem with GW2 is that it a skill based game and folks like the above posters have a real problem getting around the concept ...gone is the gear grind crutch that soothes folks ego's .Meaningful gameplay was grinding gear drops ,the reason someone kills you in pvp was they had better gear but no in GW2 they take away the ego buffer ,now the reason you lose is your opponent is better .MMO veterans and hard-core players have always known that gear grinds and farming drops were just added to keep the cannon fodder happy and thinking they were competitive ...GW2 cuts the cord, it's builds and skills the reign over grinding and loot drops .