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MMORPG.com Discussion Forums

Greed Monger 

General Discussion  » This looks like a scam. Read and decide for yourself.

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154 posts found
  Vesavius

Old School

Joined: 3/08/04
Posts: 7119

Players come for the game, but they stay for the people- Most Devs have forgotten this.

1/15/13 10:31:57 AM#121
Originally posted by taus01

 

Originally posted by Vesavius 

Taus... you clearly state that this *is* a scam, in the title no less, and then you seem to think that it might not be... that's the contradiction that Lok is talking about. Making personal attacks on him, and attempting to hide behind semantics doesn't make you look good here. Again, you are not coming off well at all in this thread IMO.

So, answer us one question, so we know where you stand;

Do you think this is a scam or not? If you do not, if you think it just *might* be, change your thread title.

There, i changed it.

 

lol Taus... the title you have now chosen still says that it looks like a scam *to you*... it is no less contradictory, even with the tagged on 'read for yourself'...

'Is This Game a Scam?: Read and decide' would be a better title and make you look more sure of what it is you are actually thinking and trying to communicate.

For someone repeatedly attacking others on their English comprehension you don't seem very eager to broadcast a very clear message.

  taus01

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/12/06
Posts: 1419

 
OP  1/15/13 10:41:57 AM#122
Originally posted by Vesavius
Originally posted by taus01

 

Originally posted by Vesavius 

Taus... you clearly state that this *is* a scam, in the title no less, and then you seem to think that it might not be... that's the contradiction that Lok is talking about. Making personal attacks on him, and attempting to hide behind semantics doesn't make you look good here. Again, you are not coming off well at all in this thread IMO.

So, answer us one question, so we know where you stand;

Do you think this is a scam or not? If you do not, if you think it just *might* be, change your thread title.

There, i changed it.

lol Taus... the title you have now chosen still says that it looks like a scam *to you*... it is no less contradictory, even with the tagged on 'read for yourself'...

'Is This Game a Scam?: Read and decide' would be a better title and make you look more sure of what it is you are actually thinking and trying to communicate.

For someone repeatedly attacking others on their English comprehension you don't seem very eager to broadcast a very clear message.

Look, there is no point in discussing this with you since we have different opinions, which is fine. This has already derailed into you and Mr. Appleton trying to make this about me and my credibility when in fact i do not need any credibility at all, since i have clearly provided enough evidence backed up with links and posts by Mr. Appleton himself right here in this thread.

We can play this game and i start asking who you are to make any judgment about me and this will derail even more into personal insults and attacks and eventually get locked by an admin.

I will not play this game with you, you will have to find someone else as a target.

Cheers

______________________________________________________________________________

An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man"), short for argumentum ad hominem, is an argument made personally against an opponent instead of against their argument.[1] Ad hominem reasoning is normally described as an informal fallacy,[2][3][4] more precisely an irrelevance.[5]

"Give players systems and tools instead of rails and rules"

  Jayaris

Novice Member

Joined: 9/05/08
Posts: 340

Hi

1/15/13 10:45:03 AM#123

Why does it matter who taus is? The questions he asked Appleton are simple and were not answered.

Hi

  taus01

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/12/06
Posts: 1419

 
OP  1/15/13 10:49:25 AM#124
Originally posted by Jayaris

Why does it matter who taus is? The questions he asked Appleton are simple and were not answered.

Standard tactics by forum trolls. They make it about the person because they can not argue against the intial argument or facts. Not worth my time and only derails the thread.

 

An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man"), short for argumentum ad hominem, is an argument made personally against an opponent instead of against their argument.[1] Ad hominem reasoning is normally described as an informal fallacy,[2][3][4] more precisely an irrelevance.[5]

"Give players systems and tools instead of rails and rules"

  Vesavius

Old School

Joined: 3/08/04
Posts: 7119

Players come for the game, but they stay for the people- Most Devs have forgotten this.

1/15/13 10:57:31 AM#125
Originally posted by taus01
Originally posted by Vesavius
Originally posted by taus01

 

Originally posted by Vesavius 

Taus... you clearly state that this *is* a scam, in the title no less, and then you seem to think that it might not be... that's the contradiction that Lok is talking about. Making personal attacks on him, and attempting to hide behind semantics doesn't make you look good here. Again, you are not coming off well at all in this thread IMO.

So, answer us one question, so we know where you stand;

Do you think this is a scam or not? If you do not, if you think it just *might* be, change your thread title.

There, i changed it.

lol Taus... the title you have now chosen still says that it looks like a scam *to you*... it is no less contradictory, even with the tagged on 'read for yourself'...

'Is This Game a Scam?: Read and decide' would be a better title and make you look more sure of what it is you are actually thinking and trying to communicate.

For someone repeatedly attacking others on their English comprehension you don't seem very eager to broadcast a very clear message.

Look, there is no point in discussing this with you since we have different opinions, which is fine. This has already derailed into you and Mr. Appleton trying to make this about me and my credibility when in fact i do not need any credibility at all

 

In the post you quote I do not question your credibility, I suggest that you are clearer in your point and broadcast a less contradictory message, starting with your title (which ofc would result in far less 'derailment').

I am actually giving you advice with which to convey your point better and in a way that you might not have to resort to attempting to attack others on their English comprehension.

Do what you will though, matters little to me.

  risenbones

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/08/09
Posts: 195

An opinion once stated is no longer humble.

1/15/13 10:59:34 AM#126

OP if you work in the development field you've missed your calling.  They way you play with words and sumasault around sometimes calling it a scam them backtracking to say well ok maybe it's just someone who doesn't know any better you should of been a polition or a speech writer for one.

 

That being said I do think there are things about the development of this game that made me wary about putting any money near it.  For starters the way the lead guy jumps around careers I have to think will he really be able to stick with this one thing till it's completed.  Just how experianced is the lead in game development are his ideas able to be developed properly by the people he has working for him.  None of that adds up to scam in my book it does add up to a high likelyhood that any money that goes into it isn't coming back though.

The lesser of two evils is still evil.

There is nothing more dangerous than a true believer.

  Vesavius

Old School

Joined: 3/08/04
Posts: 7119

Players come for the game, but they stay for the people- Most Devs have forgotten this.

1/15/13 11:01:43 AM#127
Originally posted by Jayaris

Why does it matter who taus is? The questions he asked Appleton are simple and were not answered.

 

Because I am personally interested in the background of *any* opinion I read... what it's motives are and what it's agenda is, especially when it is as 'dedicated' as this one is. It starts to look like there is a questional background behind the attack, *especially* when the poster attempts to give himself extra credibility by claims of being an investor in the industry etc.

If you are going to use your personal background to give your opinions weight then be prepared to show evidence for that background.

Just like Jason actually did in this thread tbh (I assume that you have read the thread and not just the OP and come here to post?)

  Rednecksith

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/12/09
Posts: 1272

Bite my fiery metal ass!

1/15/13 11:04:48 AM#128
Originally posted by Jayaris

Why does it matter who taus is? The questions he asked Appleton are simple and were not answered.

Exactly. His replies remind me of a conversation which I had with one of my state representatives. The guy just would not answer a straight yes or no question as such, and instead kept dodging the issue and using vague generalizations. Needless to say, he did not get my vote at election time.

In other words, Mr. Appleton gave a politician's answer. For me that doesn't exactly inspire confidence in the guy.

Also, Taus doesn't have to back himself up. He's not the one begging for money over the internet. He's not the one making one of the most complex game types possible with little to no experience. He's not the one threatening to sue people with his Kickstarter money. He's not the one indulging in shady business practices. Mr. Appleton is.

  Mogus

Novice Member

Joined: 5/21/04
Posts: 176

1/15/13 11:26:43 AM#129

[mod edit]

Look, as far as the 2nd Kickstarter, I will answer this one final time, knowing full well it will be asked many more times and rather than people simply link the answer (like they do everything else but anything productive) when it comes up again, I'm sure we will repeat this over and over.

I have had well over $20,000 worth of additional pledges offered to me from people who missed the campaign. I have turned them all down because I want to have a playable Alpha test ready before accepting any further funds from people. If I were scamming people, I'd simply take the money now and not even tell anyone about it. However, I feel it would be best to simply offer a follow up campaign for those who missed out the first round that would work alongside our alpha test phase. This would #1. Bring in additional revenue to help with any finishing touches, additional content not currently planned, etc. #2. Act as a marketing tool to help bring attention to the Alpha test that is not only free, but help brings in revenue AND draws a lot of attention. So, to answer your question, yes, I would like to have a follow up KS campaign later on.

Will the game get finished without the 2nd campaign?

Well, yes, that is what I'm trying to say. When I think of Alpha, I think of a game near completed with bugs and such that will need to be ironed out. I'd like to have the game as close to ready as possible by Alpha, BEFORE any additional funds are brought in.

You said no more land! Now your "scamming us!"

Initially, our plan early on was to take whatever we had pledged in the first KS campaign and then double it for launch figuring we would only "sell" 1,500 parcels at maximum from KS. Well, we had over 3,000 parcels spoken for. That's 3,000 parcels of land spoken for in a 30 day period for a game that was very early in its development with very little to show. So, I felt it very safe to assume, if we double that number, as originally planned from day one, though a much larger number, they will either be pledged in a follow up KS/marketing campaign to promote the Alpha, or they will be gone on day one of launch. Then, it's safe to say that at that point, the world is done, no further land will be added and we will be letting the parcel values rise as we continue adding other content and such to the game. Thats only a total of 6,000 parcels for what will most likely be at least 20,000 players on the low end.

You are adding a subscription now! You lied! Scammer!!!

We have not confirmed 100% if we are going to add a subscription. We are still working things out with Hero, but we would like to get our game further in development so we have more to show their business development people what exactly we are doing and why it would work without a sub. Right now, to use Hero for less than the $75,000 license fee and 7% of revenue, they instead take 30% of revenue. Well, they want to see a steady stream of revenue to support their end of things due to them supplying the servers, the engine and support as well as many other things they offer. So, it's very fair for them, however, we need to figure out how to show them that our model will be just as lucrative which will be easier to do once we have more completed.

Hopefully, that will make more sense.

 

www.greedmonger.com
Did you like Ultima Online? Then you'll LOVE Greed Monger!

  JamesP

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/04/06
Posts: 307

1/15/13 11:31:41 AM#130
Originally posted by Rednecksith
Originally posted by Jayaris

Why does it matter who taus is? The questions he asked Appleton are simple and were not answered.

Exactly. His replies remind me of a conversation which I had with one of my state representatives. The guy just would not answer a straight yes or no question as such, and instead kept dodging the issue and using vague generalizations. Needless to say, he did not get my vote at election time.

In other words, Mr. Appleton gave a politician's answer. For me that doesn't exactly inspire confidence in the guy.

Also, Taus doesn't have to back himself up. He's not the one begging for money over the internet. He's not the one making one of the most complex game types possible with little to no experience. He's not the one threatening to sue people with his Kickstarter money. He's not the one indulging in shady business practices. Mr. Appleton is.

We are still early in development alot of the questions that have been asked just simply can't be answered at this point. Would you rather we gave an answer now just to make a few people happy and then a few months from now turn around and say those answers were wrong? 

One thing I can answer is that NO we do NOT NEED another KickStarter Campaign to see this game through to Launch. Yes it would always be nice to have some extra funding to polish things a little more but it's not NEEDED. We have had alot of people wanting to get in on being able to buy larger amounts of parcels so if we were to have the 2nd kickstarter campaign it would be to give those folks a chance to get their parcels as well as to use the Campaign for a final media blitz prior to our Beta. We haven't discussed any potential 2nd KickStarter other then in passing and we have no set date for it were we to have one. 

Lead Programmer
Greed Monger
http://www.GreedMonger.com

  taus01

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/12/06
Posts: 1419

 
OP  1/15/13 11:33:32 AM#131

Originally posted by Vesavius

Originally posted by Jayaris

Why does it matter who taus is? The questions he asked Appleton are simple and were not answered.

Because I am personally interested in the background of *any* opinion I read... what it's motives are and what it's agenda is, especially when it is as 'dedicated' as this one is. It starts to look like there is a questional background behind the attack, *especially* when the poster attempts to give himself extra credibility by claims of being an investor in the industry etc.

If you are going to use your personal background to give your opinions weight then be prepared to show evidence for that background.

Mr. Appleton tried to attack me by saying i am one of the people who did not get on his team or has a grudge against him.

"But if you are pissed about something, be it, you weren't hired onto the team, you were banned from the forums by a mod, or whatever, then it's easier to simply link to old threads created based on unsupported assumptions and accusations as if to add some kind of crediability to your bogus and unsupported claims." - Mr. Appleton

I made clear that i have nothing to do with his project and development. I never tried to make any deals with him or tried to be on his team. I can see how this might have confused some people. The intend was to make clear that i am not invested or at all interested in investing in this game or have any ties to it. All i do is invest in various projects incl. some games, indie developers and hardware, one which i have linked and i think deserves some attention. 

Just like Jason actually did in this thread tbh (I assume that you have read the thread and not just the OP and come here to post?)

Originally posted by Rednecksith

Originally posted by Jayaris

Why does it matter who taus is? The questions he asked Appleton are simple and were not answered.

Exactly. His replies remind me of a conversation which I had with one of my state representatives. The guy just would not answer a straight yes or no question as such, and instead kept dodging the issue and using vague generalizations. Needless to say, he did not get my vote at election time.

In other words, Mr. Appleton gave a politician's answer. For me that doesn't exactly inspire confidence in the guy.

Also, Taus doesn't have to back himself up. He's not the one begging for money over the internet. He's not the one making one of the most complex game types possible with little to no experience. He's not the one threatening to sue people with his Kickstarter money. He's not the one indulging in shady business practices. Mr. Appleton is.

Thank you.

 

Originally posted by risenbones

OP if you work in the development field you've missed your calling.  They way you play with words and sumasault around sometimes calling it a scam them backtracking to say well ok maybe it's just someone who doesn't know any better you should of been a polition or a speech writer for one.

I never said i work in development. I said i worked in Management.

I am just a human beeing and i have the right to change my mind as much as anyone. I did think this was a scam but since then learned much more details and insight due to the contribution by Mr. Appleton himself that makes me think that this indeed could be a person that is simply in over his head with no malicious intend.

On the other hand Mr. Apleton does not make it easier by not answering 2 simple questions.

"Give players systems and tools instead of rails and rules"

  Alorse89

Novice Member

Joined: 1/14/13
Posts: 8

1/15/13 11:44:48 AM#132
If the game does turn to a sub since it's still on board, will people such as me be able to get a chance to sell the land without purchasing a sub?
  adam_nox

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/31/06
Posts: 2047

1/15/13 12:13:52 PM#133
Originally posted by Mogus

Not all of my efforts have been successful, but I have found success in most, but lets put a lot of this to rest in one post, shall we?

Well, my magazine was founded in 2001 and after 2 issues, we had the Cincinnati Riots. A lot of businesses folded and nobody could afford advertising. It was an 8.5 x5 in entertainment rag back when there was only city beat. I decided to pull out and not continue at that time.

The record label was Opulent Records. I started in band booking for many bands, then moved into management and ended up forming Opulent Records. My first signing was Extra Blue Kind. We released their debut album The Tide And The Undertow with some decent success. I got them on MTV2, Much Music and 35 other Video Networks. We did two music videos, one for my favorite song on the album, Pinch Blink, Stay Alive and another for Make Yourself Useless.  We charted them on the Top 20 Add Charts on College Radio, Top 200 Rotation and some Commercial Air (if any of you have any experience in the music industry you'll know getting commercial spins is very expensive). EBK opened for bands like Creed, Stone Temple Pilots and others. We then began working on their follow up album where we recorded 3 songs with two of the countries top producer Ray Martin and Junior Sanchez.  We never Officially released these 3 songs because the band struggled with keep a guitar player while on the road full time touring to build up their fan base as I was working with several major labels to pick up from where we were. Due to the conflicts within the band, after all that we had accomplished, the band decided to go different ways and I didn't hold them to their contract. So I released the 3 songs we did in New York along with some live tracks online only under my other company which can be found here.

After all of this, I decided to get out of the music business because it was just too risky as anything could happen and the longer you work with a band, the higher the liklihood of something going wrong and sending everything into the crapper.

At that time I was 305lbs at 7ft tall and borderline Diabetic and needed to lose weight. So I joined an MMA fight team. I trained in BJJ, Boxing, Muay Thai and Wrestling for about 6 months and dropped to 270lbs. Well, in the course of training the team went to a couple of MMA events in other cities and I realized there was nothing like it in Cincinnati. So I began the MMA Big Show. The first Pro/Am promotion in the region. Promoters were only promoting amateur fights at the time as Pro fights were too expensive. My first event was MMA Big Show: RESPECT November of 2006.

Since then, I promoted the top Pro/Am events in the region and am to this day the only Pro/Am Fight Promoter to broadcast a live 2 hour special on national television. MMA Big Show: ALL OR NOTHING

I have developed the careers of many fighters from amateur up to UFC such as Roger Bowling, Mojo Horne etc.

I took a break from MMA altogether after so many promoters began to flood the market and spread the fan base thin which caused me to have to cut down in production. I felt, if you can't do it right, don't do it. But, we are looking at potentially getting another 4 shows a year scheduled this year for old times sake now that things have died down a bit. I did finally fight myself before going on break and won my fight in 35 seconds by TKO.

 

 

 

I'm not sure I would consider any of your ventures a success.  Maybe other people have vastly different standards for such a word.  I'm a big mma fan (even watch crappy promos on AXS TV) and even I have never heard of Roger Bowling, lucky him belonging to an organization bought by zuffa and getting a chance at the big show though.

 

In my opinion you've put capital into a lot of failures, and can drop a lot of names no one has ever heard of, and this is why I and others were curious.  I think it would have been smarter to not try to prop yourself up as a jack of all trades.  I mean look at what a distraction, and now somewhat awkwardness, it has become. 

  Mogus

Novice Member

Joined: 5/21/04
Posts: 176

1/15/13 12:24:27 PM#134

Adam, if you are a big MMA fan, I'm truly surprised you aren't familiar with Roger.

Maybe you just aren't a Strikeforce fan?

 

www.greedmonger.com
Did you like Ultima Online? Then you'll LOVE Greed Monger!

  Dreamo84

Defender of Worlds

Joined: 5/20/04
Posts: 2727

I actually still like MMORPGs

1/15/13 12:50:07 PM#135

How is this anything like Ultima Online if all the land is pre-purchased with real world money. Sounds awful to me. If I play the game after it launches, will I just be joining a world full of land owners then?

Also, Tauso's "I am not allowed to divulge my name" thing is kind of rediculous. What are you James Bond? Secret missions?! Its your name for goodness sake, not your SS#.

  sevae

Novice Member

Joined: 11/26/11
Posts: 3

1/15/13 1:05:03 PM#136

I'm not trying to tear apart this guy, but it's safe to say that nobody in their right mind would hire him to make a game, or manage a team of game developers.


"There's an important phrase that we use here, and think it's time that you all learned it. Act as if..."

Not really a scam, more like a snow-job. Whatever... good for him. People over at Kickstarter love throwing money at anyone with an idea that they like. These backers deserve what they get for doing just that, good or bad.

Will this be a great game? Who cares. I sure as hell didn't put my money into it. 

 

 

  User Deleted
1/15/13 1:15:42 PM#137

Why is this thread allowed to continue?

 

Example:

"GW2 is bad!" - lock

 

"Greed Monger is a scam!" - 7 pages of arguing and conjecture and no mod in sight...

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 11834

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, ESO, and Combat Arms

1/15/13 1:17:52 PM#138
Originally posted by taus01
Originally posted by Mogus
[mod edit]
[mod edit]

He's referring to that other line that you keep quoting as a personal attack.

It's not all about you, bro.

  Stabba

Novice Member

Joined: 4/18/12
Posts: 4

1/15/13 1:29:12 PM#139
Originally posted by Mogus

 Since then, we got a general approval from the backers that a $10 sub would be ok, which re-opened the doors to Hero

 

 

So this is the final word.. All this talk of no decision has been made on a sub is over..  70 Votes of a Greed Monger Forum Post over about 2 days, then the post was locked,  made that decision I guess.

  taus01

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/12/06
Posts: 1419

 
OP  1/15/13 1:30:15 PM#140

Originally posted by Psychow

Why is this thread allowed to continue?

 Example: "GW2 is bad!" - lock

 "Greed Monger is a scam!" - 7 pages of arguing and conjecture and no mod in sight...

Maybe because this thread has real information and the owner cared enough to participate and post valuable information too.

You know, instead of just the usual: "This game sucks and it will FAIL" troll post.

"Give players systems and tools instead of rails and rules"

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