Originally posted by DamonVile
You don't understand....people here think if a game isn't right for them it's a failure and the devs did it all wrong. It doesn't matter that they made millions and it was a massive financial success....the game should have been made for just them.

Also people here seem to think that unless an mmo pulls wow numbers it's a fail LOLS

wow didn't have even 500k members at launch !

gw2 had 2 million right of the bat, but in their eyes it's a failure.

Same goes for content and features, people seem to think an mmo has to launch with all of wow systems and features in place

when in reality it took even mighty wow at least a year per feature to incorporate them. 

game sucess = financial/ large player population  thats it . Gamers like to debate everything and sorry but people trying to show how cool they are by 'hating the right things' is a big issue. I wouldn't expect people to acknowlege a game they hate as succesful.

  Now with that said i played GW2 i thought it was a big step forward for MMO's , but i also burned out in record time

1.   not enough hotkeys 1-10 bored me to death no matter how many different weapons i used.

2.  most dynamic event/  renown heart stuff is very mundane how many times can you carry around chickens and doing stuff that amounts to simple chores online before your character just doesn't feel like a bad ass anymore.

   There were some dynamic content i really enjoyed but it was literally like 5 of them, then it got really old

so ya its a sucess one of the few MMO's that didn't flop last year , but sorry your never gonna get gamers to agree on anything . Besides you know how many times i have argued facts vs. opinions and i get talked to like i am the dumbest guy alive, don't take things people say online too serious its not like they even know you.

Originally posted by Toxia

Originally posted by grndzro

I'd have to say it isn't from a consumer perspective

 

 

The problem is GW2 could have been absolutely amazing......but the devs f'ed it all up.

Lag issues

Disconnect issues

Pet pathing issues

crap drops

no contact combos, only field effects

even way over level for a zone you still feel....meh

Abysmally slow movement speed

Rediculous warp travel costs

Champion and boss difficulty is simply a matter of toughness/health/dodging

dodging/avoiding blows sometimes simply dosen't work

poorly thought class skill/talent combinations

I'd say over 1/2 the weapon skills are practically useless

I's say over 1/2 the weapon types for any given class are underwhelming. 

Gathering mats for each tier is a serious grind reminescent of FFXI but without the benefit of items that last a long while.

 

Given the high quality build of GW1 people expected much more from GW2 than what we got. I would deem it a failure imo.

None of that matters as to whether it is a success or not. the company made a profit. it is a success.

You want to talk about if it was successful in pleasing you? that's another topic. And one that goes to whether they will KEEP making money, not whether or not they have.

They already have.

if you go by the definition, the company made a profit --> its a succes. at least change the title to "can't we agree that GW2 is a "financial" succes, otherwise everyone will have their own definition of succes and lovers/haters or the indifferent can discuss it forever, and never get to an agreement as usual. in the mean time i'll stick with my own definition "is the game alive and kicking after 1 year --> its a succes. so only time will tell.....

Q: 

Despite everything that has been said, cant we agree that GW2 is a success?

A:

Nope. why?

Because success unfortunately is subjective to a individual level, that said - we will never be satisfied until Xfire numbers are low enough to deem it a failure,  or we move the Goal post far enough and long enough until player retention kicks in, leaving only empty servers and established veteran doomsayers in its wake.

Right now it remains to be seen. you see I'm on the fence about this (yeah look at my history it's really me) and It's not because of the typical nonsense people have been saying about the game.

It's not the nonsense of:

1: omgwtfbbq this game doesn't have a trinity

2: DE's what are those?! boooooring

3: there is no open world pvp for me to gank noobs in....

None of those things are relevant arguments for why I'm on the fence and I won't repeat those.

The first month the game was absolutely great. There was a horizontal progression system. No power creep because there was only one set of gear to achieve and a completely optional legendary item with the only difference of being visually stunning.

Now ascended is the new power creep legendaries are being converted and currently the only system to getting what one needs for these items is a single dungeon. Those of us who are watching this closely are afraid some stupid execubot is going to get ahold of this and further widen the gap by either making tokens for these thru the same dungeon, making them a mystic toilet item, and even if they include the crafters we're afraid they will make the items only available thru special 5 man means like the FotM.

I am holding my judgement about whether this game will be successful again in 2013 by watching the jan/feb updates. Hopefully they will do right by their original design. Right now everyone is holding their breath.

TL;DR it was a success for the first month before the loot drop rate nerf and the ascended items announcement.

Originally posted by klerken

Originally posted by Toxia

Originally posted by grndzro

I'd have to say it isn't from a consumer perspective

 The problem is GW2 could have been absolutely amazing......but the devs f'ed it all up.

yada yada

Given the high quality build of GW1 people expected much more from GW2 than what we got. I would deem it a failure imo.

None of that matters as to whether it is a success or not. the company made a profit. it is a success.

You want to talk about if it was successful in pleasing you? that's another topic. And one that goes to whether they will KEEP making money, not whether or not they have.

They already have.

if you go by the definition, the company made a profit --> its a succes. at least change the title to "can't we agree that GW2 is a "financial" succes, otherwise everyone will have their own definition of succes and lovers/haters or the indifferent can discuss it forever, and never get to an agreement as usual. in the mean time i'll stick with my own definition "is the game alive and kicking after 1 year --> its a succes. so only time will tell.....

If it is a financial success has yet to be determined. So far it seems that they have to introduce more and more detrimental systems to the game to force people to buy the crap they sell on their Gem Store.

The game may have recovered some of the initial development cost maybe even all of it (very unlikely with the massive add campaigns), but it needs to be sustainable to make the company money. This can only happen if people buy stuff at their GEM store or new people buy the the Game (althought that is a one time fee and it gets cheaper every month).

I would say it had a successful launch in terms of Units sold and critics reviews (which do not count for anything since they are bought with adds). It still needs to proove it can survive on a long term.

Cheers | Skyrant

Originally posted by eyelolled

The thing that I am so absolutely certain of, is that it is immensely less likely to learn anything valuable from forums, than it is to learn something valuable from xfire statistics.

haha that's funny :)

Definition of sucess will vary amongst everyone. People that say no, will say that it wasn't a success for them, maybe because they felt like it didn't live up to GW1. More narrow definition of success may get more people to agree haha.

Originally posted by Toxia

Originally posted by grndzro

I'd have to say it isn't from a consumer perspective

 

 

The problem is GW2 could have been absolutely amazing......but the devs f'ed it all up.

Lag issues

Disconnect issues

Pet pathing issues

crap drops

no contact combos, only field effects

even way over level for a zone you still feel....meh

Abysmally slow movement speed

Rediculous warp travel costs

Champion and boss difficulty is simply a matter of toughness/health/dodging

dodging/avoiding blows sometimes simply dosen't work

poorly thought class skill/talent combinations

I'd say over 1/2 the weapon skills are practically useless

I's say over 1/2 the weapon types for any given class are underwhelming. 

Gathering mats for each tier is a serious grind reminescent of FFXI but without the benefit of items that last a long while.

 

Given the high quality build of GW1 people expected much more from GW2 than what we got. I would deem it a failure imo.

None of that matters as to whether it is a success or not. the company made a profit. it is a success.

You want to talk about if it was successful in pleasing you? that's another topic. And one that goes to whether they will KEEP making money, not whether or not they have.

They already have.

what part of "FROM A CONSUMER PERSPECTIVE" are you having trouble with?

Originally posted by Skooma2
the middle zones are wastelands

That's odd, I've been on several servers in both WoW and GW2, and I've seen more people running around in "middle zones" in GW2 than I ever saw in WoW.  I always have people to do events with.

Anyway, yes, the game is a success.  I don't love everything about it, but its a little silly to claim it's a failure.  I don't like Rift, but I consider it a success too.

If we don't call GW2 a success, I think we'll have a hard time calling any MMO a success in the foreseeable future. :)

It cleared 2 million sales in two weeks, it seems to have sold exceptionally well for a long period of time, and it's still one of the bestselling PC games out there. From what I've seen and heard, there's no shortage of players in the game, either. I'll admit I'm not too fond of the game, but that seems like some solid success to me.

Granted, that doesn't mean it'll stay a success - that, we'll have to see. Cash shop purchases will probably be a big factor there. As will the expansion sales.

Originally posted by Beanpuie

Q: 

Despite everything that has been said, cant we agree that GW2 is a success?

 

A:

Nope. why?

Because success unfortunately is subjective to a individual level

 

 

If every game is subjective to a individual level with your logic all games that have been made for the past 30 years have been a fail.

please move along.

Originally posted by Nikopol

If we don't call GW2 a success, I think we'll have a hard time calling any MMO a success in the foreseeable future. :)

I'd say you must be new here, but it's obvious you're not.  lol.  However successful a game is, there will be a ton of "fans" of this genre who will deny its success simply on the fact that it isn't everything they hoped for.  I just play games for fun, not to see if my laundry list was completed.

Originally posted by Eir_S

Originally posted by Skooma2
the middle zones are wastelands

That's odd, I've been on several servers in both WoW and GW2, and I've seen more people running around in "middle zones" in GW2 than I ever saw in WoW.  I always have people to do events with.

Anyway, yes, the game is a success.  I don't love everything about it, but its a little silly to claim it's a failure.  I don't like Rift, but I consider it a success too.

Wastelands is the new thing to claim about this game. Although it is a feature that affects every mmorpg to some degree, I personally haven't encountered problems with it in GW2. I for one, like smaller more skill based groups to get DEs done, instead of massive zerg numbers.

Originally posted by Torgrim

Originally posted by Beanpuie

Q: 

Despite everything that has been said, cant we agree that GW2 is a success?

 

A:

Nope. why?

Because success unfortunately is subjective to a individual level

 

 

If every game is subjective to a individual level with your logic all games are a fail.

 

But he is right though....if 2 companies make 2 games, the one the person enjoys more is the more successful in his eyes. 

If you are talking shear profit, then its not the case, numbers are factual. What you are asking basically is "do you like GW2?"

Originally posted by Leucent
Wastelands or not, this game is as antisocial as it gets, and yes I talked to people, most just couldn t care less if you re even there.

exactly my point...OP does not define "successful" in a quantitative way.

Originally posted by miagisan

Originally posted by Torgrim

Originally posted by Beanpuie

Q: 

Despite everything that has been said, cant we agree that GW2 is a success?

 

A:

Nope. why?

Because success unfortunately is subjective to a individual level

 

 

If every game is subjective to a individual level with your logic all games are a fail.

 

But he is right though....if 2 companies make 2 games, the one the person enjoys more is the more successful in his eyes. 

 

If you are talking shear profit, then its not the case, numbers are factual. What you are asking basically is "do you like GW2?"

I don't think his thought was that deep when he posted.