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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » [Poll] Which pvp ruleset prevents more the ganks?

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56 posts found
  maccarthur2004

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/12
Posts: 483

 
OP  1/01/13 1:43:45 AM#1

In the posts that i read, i see a lot of people saying or pressupossing that a mmo with FFA pvp will necessarily have a lot more ganks than WoW and the like, which is clearly not true in my opinion.

 

 

Which pvp ruleset prevents more the ganks?

A faction system without any punishment for ganks (like WoW)
A FFA pvp system with significant punishment for ganks.
(login to vote)

"What we are aiming in ArcheAge is to let the players feel the true fun of MMORPG by forming a community like real life by interacting with other players, whether it be conflict or cooperation." (Jake Song)

  Ramanadjinn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/08/11
Posts: 1304

1/01/13 1:46:26 AM#2

Always include a third "show me the results" option.

I voted the first one to see the results.

I'm not certain I can say based on my experience either ruleset prevents more the ganks.  My personal favorite system is EVE online and its not really either, depending on perspective.

 

  Lord.Bachus

Elite Member

Joined: 5/14/07
Posts: 8591

I believe in life before death... So dont forget to enjoy it while you still can.

1/01/13 1:50:24 AM#3

As if these are the 2 only systems...

 

How about a RvR system with no open world PvP?   No ganks and as much PvP as you want.

Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

  StonesDK

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/06/11
Posts: 1832

1/01/13 1:58:37 AM#4

If you are doing everything you can to discourage random PvP encounters then why have PvP at all. A game mechanic being so restrictive, is just detrimental to the PvP system. It would only serves to protect those who want to avoid PvP. Then you may as well just have battlegrounds.

 

I never understood why people want to discourage random PvP encounters in any game. If you want an equal punishment to the attacker, after you lost the fight then doesn't that just make you a poor sport?

 

I understand people don't want their games to be all about PvP but if you want PvP when it suits you then we already have perfectly working solutions like battlegrounds, arenas and contested lands.

 

 

What's your definition of a gank by the way?

  zomard100

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/16/11
Posts: 232

1/01/13 2:09:25 AM#5
Where is the problem? If you don't like open world pvp you can play on pve server. I always wonder why are people crying about ganking in wow, choose pve server and problem is solved.
  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 12112

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, Wildstar, and Combat Arms

1/01/13 2:12:33 AM#6
Originally posted by Starpower

What's your definition of a gank by the way?

Ditto.

 

Instead of saying things like 'gank' or 'hardcore' I wish people would just state the actual mechanic, system or playstyle they are referring to.

 

"And wikipedia is as accurate as Britannica. Wikipedia is very reliable. You would be hard pressed to find a more reliable source for these kinds of things." -fovoroth

  Robokapp

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/15/09
Posts: 4588

The only luck I had today was to have you as my opponent.

1/01/13 2:13:47 AM#7

a healthy ffa pvp will need safe zones.

 

the crafters need a space to operate freely in and build the war toys for you to have what to break.

 

and you as a player should not gank the non-combatants. they serve their purpose and its not to inflate your killboard. it's to build your weapons. safe zones for basic crafting and trading are trivial.

 

edit: by gank I refer to "highly trained and equipped pvp'er stalking a non-combatant who cant fight back, and engaging in combat when the other guy no longer has a way out." basically a gank to me is a fight that had only one possible outcome the second it started. like a cruiser vs a mining barge. or a level 10 mage vs a level 90 rogue.

  Rayshe

Novice Member

Joined: 11/30/11
Posts: 1295

1/01/13 2:14:53 AM#8
i think i smell something... yeah i smell a loaded question.

Because i can.
I'm Hopeful For Every Game, Until the Fan Boys Attack My Games. Then the Knives Come Out.
Logic every gamers worst enemy.

  User Deleted
1/01/13 2:17:20 AM#9

No vote.

 

Best way to prevent ganks?  Consensual PVP.  If you're looking for a fight, then flag.  If you're really looking for a fight, then flag and start killing quest givers.

 

edit: splling...damn old crap-top with unreliable keys.

  bcbully

Elite Member

Joined: 3/03/12
Posts: 7191

1/01/13 2:18:27 AM#10
From what I've seen, option two. Harsh penaties, and penalties carried out by players, like bounty hunters and authorities. Give the players the tools, and they will police pk'n. No need for safe zones or guards for that matter.

When I eat chocolate chip pie it just doesn't feel like chocolate chip cookies. The texture, the consistency, it's just not the same and this is disappointing.

  Robokapp

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/15/09
Posts: 4588

The only luck I had today was to have you as my opponent.

1/01/13 2:19:36 AM#11
Originally posted by XAPGames

No vote.

 

Best way to preven ganks?  Consensual PVP.  If you're looking for a fight, then flag.  If you're really looking for a fight, then flag and start killing quest givers.

the flaw is obvious...

 

the guy who dosn't have the upper hand won't consent. and there's always one who doesn' have the upper hand.

 

how much pvp do you see in a wow pve realm ,where this consent system is in place ? one fight per month ? two fights per month ?

  Alberel

Novice Member

Joined: 12/02/09
Posts: 1121

1/01/13 2:20:11 AM#12

I think some people are mis-interpreting the OP here.

Some older MMOs had FFA PvP with a bounty system that allowed the community to police itself and punish 'murderers' in its own way (usually by making them a target who can be killed without consequence and encouraging the community to hunt them down by offering a reward). In my opinion those systems are the best for preventing ganks as it reduces the likelihood of players ganking for the sake of it and instead only doing it when they have a reason to. This kind of system works best in sandbox MMOs though to be fair...

It also creates a soft separation between those who want to PvP and those who don't. Everyone is permanently flagged but the gankers are more likely to go after their own kind due to the way the system works.

It all balances out nicely in the end and allows the PvPers a FFA playground and the others the thrill of playing in that environment without the frustration of battles that are decided before their opponent even attacks.

  User Deleted
1/01/13 2:22:50 AM#13
Originally posted by Robokapp

how much pvp do you see in a wow pve realm ,where this consent system is in place ? one fight per month ? two fights per month ?

 

Plenty, but it goes on in battlegrounds and arenas.

 

Sorry, but I can't condone the rampant slaughter of PVE'ers just because it's fun for the people with the upper hand.

 

EDIT: Unless the game is specifically designed that way.

 

  BTrayaL

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/17/08
Posts: 563

1/01/13 2:23:22 AM#14
Option 2, from my Lineage 2 years.

  StonesDK

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/06/11
Posts: 1832

1/01/13 2:24:05 AM#15
Originally posted by Alberel

I think some people are mis-interpreting the OP here.

Some older MMOs had FFA PvP with a bounty system that allowed the community to police itself and punish 'murderers' in its own way (usually by making them a target who can be killed without consequence and encouraging the community to hunt them down by offering a reward). In my opinion those systems are the best for preventing ganks as it reduces the likelihood of players ganking for the sake of it and instead only doing it when they have a reason to. This kind of system works best in sandbox MMOs though to be fair...

It also creates a soft separation between those who want to PvP and those who don't. Everyone is permanently flagged but the gankers are more likely to go after their own kind due to the way the system works.

It all balances out nicely in the end and allows the PvPers a FFA playground and the others the thrill of playing in that environment without the frustration of battles that are decided before their opponent even attacks.

Except it's easily circumvented by having a character that is strictly for PvP you log on to cause havoc with and log out when you are done and other characters you play differently with. Your premise only works if you have 1 character pr account but even then, people are just going to buy a second account

  Robokapp

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/15/09
Posts: 4588

The only luck I had today was to have you as my opponent.

1/01/13 2:27:30 AM#16
Originally posted by XAPGames
Originally posted by Robokapp

how much pvp do you see in a wow pve realm ,where this consent system is in place ? one fight per month ? two fights per month ?

 

Plenty, but it goes on in battlegrounds and arenas.

 

Sorry, but I can't condone the rampant slaughter of PVE'ers just because it's fun for the people with the upper hand.

 

the counter argument looks like this:

 

I can't condone the protection of PvE'rs by invisible artificial mechanics.

 

while i'm not a ganker, nor a pvp'er, BG's and arenas are by themselves insufficient unless a game can incorporate them into its world in a relevant way. Back to Wintergrasp and Told Barad, that's good. It's consensual, it's very much like a BG, and its relevant to the world. If every BG had such functions - aka not just another BG where all that's at stake is 250 honor points - then I'd agree with you fully.

 

bg's and arenas are miningames. they are holding little to no relevance to the game world.

  Phry

Elite Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 5209

1/01/13 3:37:45 AM#17
Eve pretty much addressed a lot of these concerns i think, you can have FFA PvP, but you have to have areas, like towns etc, which, while not exactly 'safe zones' are so heavily policed, that anyone who breaks the law is killed, with repeat offenders unable to even enter the cities until they have improved their standing with 'law enforcement' in Eve this was by killing npc pirates, or at least that was one way. Without zones like that, any FFA PvP game will mostly fail, which is pretty much one of the reasons, although not the main one, why Darkfall online was a bit of a fail game - the other fail factor was the afk grinding mechanism, which you had to do in order to even stand a chance at pvp in the first place. Anyway, as long as PVP is in a game then there will be 'ganks' which i interpret as victory through numerical advantage, but i suspect is really just a case of being tactically outmanoeuvered.
  Robokapp

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/15/09
Posts: 4588

The only luck I had today was to have you as my opponent.

1/01/13 3:40:35 AM#18

victory thru numbers is a 'zerg' not a gank. ganking can be 1 v 1.

 

back to the stealth rogue popping out and one-shotting you...

  Rydeson

Elite Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 3271

1/01/13 4:30:29 AM#19
I voted for neither.. it's an incomplete list..  Can I choose "none of the above"?
  Ramanadjinn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/08/11
Posts: 1304

1/01/13 4:59:21 AM#20
Originally posted by Phry
Eve pretty much addressed a lot of these concerns i think, you can have FFA PvP, but you have to have areas, like towns etc, which, while not exactly 'safe zones' are so heavily policed, that anyone who breaks the law is killed, with repeat offenders unable to even enter the cities until they have improved their standing with 'law enforcement' in Eve this was by killing npc pirates, or at least that was one way. Without zones like that, any FFA PvP game will mostly fail, which is pretty much one of the reasons, although not the main one, why Darkfall online was a bit of a fail game - the other fail factor was the afk grinding mechanism, which you had to do in order to even stand a chance at pvp in the first place. Anyway, as long as PVP is in a game then there will be 'ganks' which i interpret as victory through numerical advantage, but i suspect is really just a case of being tactically outmanoeuvered.

that pretty much hit the nail on the head.

EVE is so great because there is .5 to 1.0 space for people who want to carebear around and lower security to no security for all kinds of ganking and faction warfare.

and ya you could get ganked in 1.0 space but it added a little more of a thrill to the game because it wasn't as if everyone at all times was trying to gank you.  it was more of a don't flash your cash in front of everyone and play smart sort of thing.

If Darkfall or any MMORPG with swords and sorcerers had implemented a system like that with a solid PVE game to go along with it i wouldn't play any other game.  

In my opinion you gotta have both and just throwing PVP players and PVE players in a game and slapping an optional TEF on them doens't make PVP players happy.

throwing PVE players in the ring with PvP players and saying "oh but you can put a bounty on their head that their friend can collect and give to them" doesn't thrill PVE people.  They really don't care what negatives the PVP person gets, all they know is somebody ganked em and that makes them rage.  what happens next is mostly irrelevant.

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