My guess is 4,194 days, 5 hours, 29 minutes and 3 seconds.

What is the prize for the winner?

Originally posted by Cecropia

Originally posted by nariusseldon
The sub model already is death for me.

"Death" for you? Geez that sounds pretty dramatic, buddy. Personally, I cannot seem to get that worked up over video games let alone payment plans.

Anywho, even with all of the craziness in the industry right now, I don't see the sub model going anywhere anytime soon. WOW and EVE are living proof of that. There is no shortage of gamers that are willing to pay a sub for a good MMO, however there is a serious shortage of good MMOs that are worth paying for.

Exactly. Look at the huge number of people who were more than willing to sub up to TOR. Then look at how many wanted to renew that subscription. There's still a big subscription market out there waiting for a developer who can find the courage to produce a game that's not a "slash-and-burn", level-cap-in-2-weeks gutless wow-clone.

I hope that the subscription model will ultimately draw a line in the sand between gamers and true MMO players.   The flood of non-MMO players that bum rushed the genre shortly after WoW launched ruined the community feel that most MMO's had back in the day.

If we can keep the instant gratification crowd and the kiddies in the B2P / F2P games, that will hopefully improve the quality of the communities in sub based games down the road. 

Originally posted by Quirhid

Originally posted by Tjed

Originally posted by Quirhid
As long as the suckers are willing to pay...

If I got to the point that $15 a month is no longer disposable income, I must have really been a sucker in the business aspect of my life. 

I'll be a $15 a month sucker for a quality product any day.  That's less than 2 beers at the pub with tip.

Yeah. You're the kind of sucker who thinks he gets quality by paying a subscription fee. Look around and try the games that don't require subscription fee. They are just as good only cheaper. And the devs don't have an excuse to stretch their content.

Did I say I was currently paying a sub fee? 

I would love to pay one for a quality game, but right now I'm not.  I'm playing GW2 and laughing at their attempts to push me into the cash shop.  I'm sure there are people that use the cash shop and end up paying more than $15 a month without even knowing it.  You want to call someone a sucker?  There ya go. 

Oh, but those are the whales who support my lazy ass so that I can play everything for free right?  That's really the goal here now isn't it?  It's sad. 

Since you missed the entire point of what I said before, I'll spell it out for you real simple like,

Fifteen dollars a month is nothing.  I don't feel it, I don't notice it's gone from my checking account, it's completely out of my budget, it's pocket change. 

I don't mind paying it because it is not a large sum of money.  Understand?

"Sucker"

Get over yourself.

sub will remain until people stop paying for them. or there is another type of sub model created. 

as for mmos that come out sub and go free. its got nothing to do with the game being a sub but the fact the price did not equal what you got from the game.  or it just out right sucked completely

like paying 50bucks a week to play vanilla WoW where you are level capped at 10 and can only play for 5minutes per day.  sub is not worth it

Originally posted by VassagoMael
Forever.

Forever. 

All good MMOs have at least a membership OPTION with premium benefits.

Huh, and guess what - I´m paying it because I´m neither broke nor unemployed

The sub model will last. As long as quality games are released.

The recent dropping of subs, has not been because of subs, but becasue the games sucked, or at best were WoW-clones. SImply, why sub to a new WoW when I am invested in WoW.

Personally I think the sub model, with TOTAL access is the best.

As a Capitalist Libertarian, I want full access to all of the games I play, not it bits or pieces either, or with a limited time(s). As long as a developer provides me with a product I enjoy I will gladdly pay and play.

Take GW2 for example, I wasted my money there, in my heart of hearts I told myself "its B2P, so get it and you play whenever.". But, I don't, I think it sucks, and since they already got my cash what do they care? If there was a sub system, they would have a reason to keep up a quality product.

Sorry if I rambled , I currently have a fevor.

Originally posted by grimgryphon
If I enjoy a game, I'll participate in whatever payment model they choose; p2p, f2p, b2p, cash shop or no. Like many other types of entertainment, you want to play, you got to pay.

I think some people feel the payment method can get in the way of fun. Such as always having to make a microtransaction to do something silly. While I agree with what you said, I would add that I would only play it if those methods were used within reason.

MMO's cost money to run. GW2 has lowered the cost of running a MMO by lowering the service. Note that it has no RP servers and little to no GM presence in the game. That has a simple reason, GM's expect to be payed and there is only so much money to be made from a single game sale. 

Meanwhile people focus on WoW as "the" subscription game sticking to the old model but COUNTLESS smaller titles still work with a subscription model JUST as they did ten years ago. Eve is the biggest amongst them but there are far more, just check the game listing right on this site.

GW2 is B2P with cash shop AND gold selling. And it is no secret that the cash shop is a major source of their revenue. Gamers who only bought the game are filler, the company is loosing money on them every second they play without buying something.

That isn't sustainable, it would be like running an "all you can eat" restaurant that really had no limits. Of course you COULD do that... IF you could run organize it that a bathroom visit costs enough to cover the costs of all the food consumed. That is what GW2 hopes is the case, play for free but you will be so tempted to buy gold that you end up paying for the game after all...

ONLY this time with no monhtly limit. In a pure subscription game, I know in advance what each month is going to cost me. In GW2? Not so much. Oh, YOU can say "zero" but in the case you are not the type of customer Areanet/NCsoft wants. 

To me subscription should mean I simply get the full game with no further attempt to milk me for more coin. In SWTOR you know get hussled for every cash every step you take and gosh, it is NOT fun. 

The only people I see in favor of cash shop games are those who have no trouble spending more money on the game then a subscription would cost or those who fundementally think all games should be free to them and someone else should pick up the tab. Few regular subscription players evenbother responding anymore because they know they will be torn to shreds by the PayToWin crowd and the "everything must be free" mob.

Personally I am just waiting until a company does something really simple. Release a basic working game where combat is FUN and there is other stuff to do and where PvP and balance are ignored for the sake of having a fun moderately challenging game with a heavy focus on social and soloist are just told to fuck off.

Oh wait, they already exist. Back to the niche and ignored game corner for me.

Originally posted by fat_taddler

I hope that the subscription model will ultimately draw a line in the sand between gamers and true MMO players.   The flood of non-MMO players that bum rushed the genre shortly after WoW launched ruined the community feel that most MMO's had back in the day.

 

If we can keep the instant gratification crowd and the kiddies in the B2P / F2P games, that will hopefully improve the quality of the communities in sub based games down the road. 

This is what I'm counting on.

Further, the FSA soldiers expect everything in life for free (aka someone else pays for it). They think businesses are for charity and that they are entitled to everything.

Can't wait for the producers to all move away and it all goes BOOM.

When I looked at the list of games listed here maybe a week ago I saw about a 1/4 for sub games so already I know that there are more cash shop games out there.

I think it will get a little worse but I have hope that some games will come out that will be so awesome people want to pay for them. Of course, I think the game I'm making will included in that list :) I'll shut mine down before I do cash shop.

I don't think subscription games are history, they are just niche. Like country clubs vs YMCA.