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As demonstrated by Planetarion (wikipedia link), Dominion and various other similar games where your planet, kingdom etc. is represented by a webpage(s) of numbers and stats. These games have everything they need to be called an MMO and the ones which have player characters in them (instead of planets or dominions) are fully fledged MMORPGs. A lack of a world does not unmake an MMORPG and a "true MMORPG" (if you insist such a thing exists) does not need a world nor does it need to be a world simulation. Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. -Author unknown, attributed to Mark Twain |
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12/09/12 5:00:38 PM#2
Originally posted by Quirhid Sure you're just not poking the hornet's nest, hoping for the angry buzz? |
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12/09/12 5:02:23 PM#3
Originally posted by Quirhid
Wheels are not required for a bicycle. "The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently." - Friedrich Nietzsche |
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12/09/12 5:06:13 PM#4
Originally posted by Hrimnir wheels are for casuals http://cdn.pocket-lint.com/images/HbtC/star-wars-hover-bike-becomes-reality-0.jpg?20120822-165633 Pi*1337/100 = 42 |
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12/09/12 5:07:59 PM#5
I actually agree with the premise of the OP. Sometimes unwritten 'rules' need to be broken. I'd love to see more MMORPG break the traditional molds that are stagnating the genre.
If in 1982 we played with the current mentality, we would have burned down all the pac man games since the red ghost was clearly OP. Instead we just got better at the game. |
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12/09/12 5:13:26 PM#6
world not needed, yes your right, you could be like all the rest, but what were looking for is an MMO with a world, why make another one with out a world, so many to choose from right now i dont believe we need another.
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Originally posted by Icewhite Merely, trying to burst a few bubbles. If someone gets upset it is because their ingrained views are being questioned. And people don't like that. Still, if you can point out where they are wrong, shouldn't you do that? Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. -Author unknown, attributed to Mark Twain |
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12/09/12 5:24:20 PM#8
More single player console mentatlity whorshipping the linear dog leash games that have plaqued the industry far too long. Thank god a few dozen sandboxes are coming along to debunk this. Dont know about you, i prefer more from my mmo and the things i can do in them.
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12/09/12 5:26:19 PM#9
Originally posted by Quirhid i dont agree. so by your standerd any game with an online function can be considered an MMO? because alot of people can play it online? if you dont have a persistant world then my friend what you have is a online game not an MMO, You could refer to browser games like PA and tribal wars as MMO´s but lets keep them at browser games shall we? |
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Loktofeit
 Elite Member
Joined: 1/13/10
EVE in 2013 - DUST 514, CSM8, Fanfest, 10th Anniversary, Uprising, Odyssey. Gonna be a good year :) |
12/09/12 5:34:04 PM#10
Originally posted by Quirhid My suggestion is that you decouple MMO from MMORPG. MMORPG has too much baggage and too many preconceptions around here to make for a constructive discussion. Also, I'm assuming you mean 3D world wehn you say "world" correct? An MMO exists in a virtual worldspace. That virtual worldspace or virtual community can exist in text, 2D or 3D form. Omega Day, Travian and Die2Nite are just as much an MMO, if not more of one, than most of the mainstream 3D MMOs are. filmoret: One thing I have never figured out is why the game devs hardly ever fix simple problems that arise. It is like they don't care about the pvp community. Nitth: What makes you so sure its a simple fix? filmoret: Because most of them are. Sometimes its just changing a number in a code string other times its creating a few variables. However none of them should take over a few hours of coding. |
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12/09/12 5:54:36 PM#11
MMO in that sense is nothing more than descriptor of how many people play certain game. Which I guess is right now.
I've been playing this kind of browser games like around 10 years ago. If we start calling that kind of games MMO's (or MMORPG's when there is personal character you play) then we need more subgenres created, because "world simulation" mmorpg's and those games have very little in common.
Anyway - I am all for it. Just need subgenres. MMO and MMORPG desciptor grown way too big anyway and lose their 'genre' desciptive function. MMO nowadays is like saying game is Single Player or Multiplayer. Does not bring any knowegedle to player aside of how much players can play with themself at once at same time.
Same with MMORPG where 'RPG' part is used just in most basic sense that game have some kind of statistics attached to personified being and more than half of games nowadays have something like this. Afterall EvE Online and GW2 have practically nothing in common, not more than in example Prototype and Morrowind and yet they are placed in same genre and Prototype and Morrowind are not.
Detach 'virtual world rpg games' into separate genre from mmorpg's and then it will be easy to call non 'world'' games an mmorpg without much resistance. |
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12/09/12 5:59:57 PM#12
Your right people can make really really bad games and call them MMO's because they went down the check list. Your point? At the end of the day they are no less a train wreak.
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12/09/12 6:09:27 PM#13
Originally posted by Icewhite Who'd a thunk it. |
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12/09/12 6:29:28 PM#14
I agree. I've seen more role playing in games like Imperial Conflict, and Astro Empires than I've seen in world of everclone games. Speaking of which I've been seeing more MMO there to. Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent. If monsters ate people, it'd be in the news. |
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Originally posted by Loktofeit World as in it exists and functions without player input or presence. MMOs do not need that. In Planetarion's case the game is the environment, but there is actually no world in the game. As much as chess has a world - sort of. And I agree, people attach way too much baggage on the term - each one something different. Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. -Author unknown, attributed to Mark Twain |
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Originally posted by fenistil And yet, people like to make a distiction when one small detail changes here and there. For example, in another thread, if it is something is scripted or determined by game engine - even if the end result is exactly the same. Or this one small detail of being instanced, when otherwise the two games play exactly the same. Rather, don't sweat about genres and definitions. Let them be broad strokes, because they're only useful that way. Sort less, play more. Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. -Author unknown, attributed to Mark Twain |
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12/09/12 6:52:20 PM#17
Yes, exactly! Thank you OP as this is a good example of the worlds argument. These browser based text games do not have the artificial walls that the "not world" games have and therefore offer a better MMO IMO. Great point :)
Dear developers, In my humble and inexperienced opinion if I can get through all the content you spent the last 5+ years working on within 6 months you have not done your work justice. Please give me, and everyone else, some tools to create our own content from what you have made so I can stay in your world and appreciate it longer than three weeks before I say "meh". It's a shame and I'd rather not do that to something you put so much of yourself in to. |
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Loktofeit
Elite Member
Joined: 1/13/10
EVE in 2013 - DUST 514, CSM8, Fanfest, 10th Anniversary, Uprising, Odyssey. Gonna be a good year :) |
12/09/12 6:53:10 PM#18
Originally posted by Quirhid But there is a world in Planetarion. The planets, factories and asteroids all exist in a persistent state world even though that world environment is not readily visible. filmoret: One thing I have never figured out is why the game devs hardly ever fix simple problems that arise. It is like they don't care about the pvp community. Nitth: What makes you so sure its a simple fix? filmoret: Because most of them are. Sometimes its just changing a number in a code string other times its creating a few variables. However none of them should take over a few hours of coding. |
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12/09/12 6:53:18 PM#19
Originally posted by Quirhi good philosophy  |
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12/09/12 7:01:19 PM#20
Doesn't Planetarion have a world though? It's the space out of which you're stealing asteroids and such. You can't see it, but it's there. When you get down to it, the "world" is really just a space shared by players, that they all interact in. It doesn't matter how you represent that space, so long as it exists. Obviously, it works perfectly fine being represented as statistics on a webpage. ** edit ** Loktofeit got there first. Join the League For Gamers. |
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