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EVE Online

EVE Online 

Jita (General)  » EVE Online F2P

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165 posts found
  Gdemami

Elite Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7034

12/10/12 6:34:45 AM#41


Originally posted by Loktofeit

Whether game or government, market regulation is a given. :)


Precisely :)

Didn't want to nitpick, rather my intention was to clarify.

  Rydeson

Elite Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 3376

12/10/12 11:29:20 AM#42
Originally posted by haplo602
Originally posted by Rydeson
Originally posted by tom_gore
Originally posted by Rydeson
Originally posted by Boardwalker
I hope EVE never goes F2P. Having a sub is a great way to keep the freeloaders out, while ensuring consistent updates and free expansions from CCP.

      How is F2P freeloading?   I'm curious how and why you see it that way..  Have you heard of the saying "something is better then nothing"?  There is alot of truth in that..  There are many players such as myself that only play casually on weekends.. Paying for a sub is just careless and crazy..  I'm an advid golfer when weather permits.. Sure I would LOVE a subscription based golf course that allows me to golf all I want, whenever I want.. But should everyone, even the guy that golfs once a month pay the same monthly golf sub.?  Oh hell no..

     When a game has ONLY a subscrption option, if forces people to go  "ALL IN" or fold.. Just like poker..  If a B2P cash shop is set up properly, then both subs and pay as you go customers can co-exist..  As I said in my post, I would have no problem buying unlockables as I play..  Getting $50 out of me per year is better then nothing, which is what they are getting now from me with a manditory sub..  

Your post just plainly tells us you don't understand anything about EVE.

in exchange of every paltry 50 USD per year from casuals like you, they would probably lose ten times the amount from customers disgusted by rampant spammers, spy alts, corp thieves et cetera. Really?  It's amazing that so many sub games already suffer from spammes and such, so subbing doesn't guarantee you anything.. And as I said, if the cash shop model is done correctly there would be no need for spamming because they wouldn't be in business..  Spy alts?  Already exist for those that own more then one account.. I believe you are reaching for "possibilities" to excuse your bias stance.. 

F2P just would not work for EVE. It would cause more problems than solve anything, resulting in the paying customers to leave quickly and the death of the game.  I'm all ears.. do inform us all how F2P would not work.. I don't want vague "could of, should and would of".. I want factual details please..

Thank you.

 

 

It is quite simple. The highest order PvP in EVE does work on heavy metagaming (spies, scams etc.). This means financial investment to keep a spy account. Trial accounts do not work for this purpose. If EVE was F2P, there'd be no limit to metagaming and the most exciting parts of the game would die. If you remove the interesting endgame parts from the game, what do you think the result will be ?

 

The reason why trial accounts don't work is because you are locked OUT of doing much after a certain point.. same can be done with F2P.... I don't know why so many assume that F2P means "everything" is free with no restrictions.. As I have said, if F2P was set up correctly, it would not cause any problems against full paying subs..  HELL.. I would even be interested in a limited sub plan.. Such as $5 a month and I get 10 hours of game time per month as an example..

  Rydeson

Elite Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 3376

12/10/12 11:31:54 AM#43
Originally posted by Gdemami

 


Originally posted by Rydeson

 

But should everyone, even the guy that golfs once a month pay the same monthly golf sub.? 


 

The problem with EVE is the core design that is very unfriendly to F2P model - real time skilling, complex industry system.

I have no doubt CCP would make the game F2P if they think it will make them more money, problem is HOW to make EVE F2P without changing fundamental mechanics of the game.


EVE is quite more complex than any F2P game and it ain't as easy as to just "setup a cash shop".

EVE is plenty easy to set up.. They already did it with trial accounts.. Each skill, each ship, each stargate can be controlled with "unlockables"..  Pay as you go..

  Krematory

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/15/08
Posts: 520

MMOHOLIC

12/10/12 11:33:56 AM#44
Originally posted by Rydeson
 
  HELL.. I would even be interested in a limited sub plan.. Such as $5 a month and I get 10 hours of game time per month as an example..

Now that would be a good idea, and not only for EVE.

"EVE is likely the best MMORPG that you've never really understood or played" - Kyleran

  Gdemami

Elite Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7034

12/10/12 12:28:33 PM#45


Originally posted by Rydeson

EVE is plenty easy to set up.. They already did it with trial accounts.. Each skill, each ship, each stargate can be controlled with "unlockables"..  Pay as you go..

Trials only work because they are time limited.

This is not how EVE works, and a reason why all EVE expansions are free - because being able to access all content of EVE is vital part of the core game design.

  Gdemami

Elite Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7034

12/10/12 12:30:23 PM#46


Originally posted by Rydeson

The reason why trial accounts don't work is because you are locked OUT of doing much after a certain point..

There is no "certain point", no such thing exist in EVE. You do not get EVE at all.

  Kiljaedenas

Novice Member

Joined: 7/29/11
Posts: 467

To err is human, but to really f*ck things up you need a computer.

12/10/12 1:13:14 PM#47
Originally posted by Rydeson
Originally posted by tom_gore
Originally posted by Rydeson
Originally posted by Boardwalker
I hope EVE never goes F2P. Having a sub is a great way to keep the freeloaders out, while ensuring consistent updates and free expansions from CCP.

      How is F2P freeloading?   I'm curious how and why you see it that way..  Have you heard of the saying "something is better then nothing"?  There is alot of truth in that..  There are many players such as myself that only play casually on weekends.. Paying for a sub is just careless and crazy..  I'm an advid golfer when weather permits.. Sure I would LOVE a subscription based golf course that allows me to golf all I want, whenever I want.. But should everyone, even the guy that golfs once a month pay the same monthly golf sub.?  Oh hell no..

     When a game has ONLY a subscrption option, if forces people to go  "ALL IN" or fold.. Just like poker..  If a B2P cash shop is set up properly, then both subs and pay as you go customers can co-exist..  As I said in my post, I would have no problem buying unlockables as I play..  Getting $50 out of me per year is better then nothing, which is what they are getting now from me with a manditory sub..  

Your post just plainly tells us you don't understand anything about EVE.

in exchange of every paltry 50 USD per year from casuals like you, they would probably lose ten times the amount from customers disgusted by rampant spammers, spy alts, corp thieves et cetera. Really?  It's amazing that so many sub games already suffer from spammes and such, so subbing doesn't guarantee you anything.. And as I said, if the cash shop model is done correctly there would be no need for spamming because they wouldn't be in business..  Spy alts?  Already exist for those that own more then one account.. I believe you are reaching for "possibilities" to excuse your bias stance.. 

F2P just would not work for EVE. It would cause more problems than solve anything, resulting in the paying customers to leave quickly and the death of the game.  I'm all ears.. do inform us all how F2P would not work.. I don't want vague "could of, should and would of".. I want factual details please..

Thank you.

 

 

That particular discussion has been had before. Read this: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/5415659#5415659

Particularly my post on it. It explains in explicit detail why Eve going F2P is a catastrophically bad idea.

Where's the any key?

  dave6660

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/26/08
Posts: 2350

"Next time I see you, remind me not to talk to you."

12/10/12 1:22:37 PM#48
Originally posted by Rydeson

EVE is plenty easy to set up.. They already did it with trial accounts.. Each skill, each ship, each stargate can be controlled with "unlockables"..  Pay as you go..

Holy shit.  You want to pay for each new gate you jump through?  If that was the case I would owe CCP a small fortune.

"Why so serious?"
-- The Joker

  Rydeson

Elite Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 3376

12/10/12 1:27:08 PM#49
Originally posted by Gdemami

 


Originally posted by Rydeson

The reason why trial accounts don't work is because you are locked OUT of doing much after a certain point..

 

There is no "certain point", no such thing exist in EVE. You do not get EVE at all.

WRONG.. I'm playing the trial and by the time you finish the first stage of missions, there are skills that are NOT learnable with trial accounts..... THEY are locked.. Same set up can be done wtih F2P cash shop..  I"m thinking you dont' know the true facts about EVE and trial accounts.. 

  Rydeson

Elite Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 3376

12/10/12 1:35:11 PM#50
Originally posted by Kiljaedenas
Originally posted by Rydeson
Originally posted by tom_gore
Originally posted by Rydeson
Originally posted by Boardwalker
I hope EVE never goes F2P. Having a sub is a great way to keep the freeloaders out, while ensuring consistent updates and free expansions from CCP.

      How is F2P freeloading?   I'm curious how and why you see it that way..  Have you heard of the saying "something is better then nothing"?  There is alot of truth in that..  There are many players such as myself that only play casually on weekends.. Paying for a sub is just careless and crazy..  I'm an advid golfer when weather permits.. Sure I would LOVE a subscription based golf course that allows me to golf all I want, whenever I want.. But should everyone, even the guy that golfs once a month pay the same monthly golf sub.?  Oh hell no..

     When a game has ONLY a subscrption option, if forces people to go  "ALL IN" or fold.. Just like poker..  If a B2P cash shop is set up properly, then both subs and pay as you go customers can co-exist..  As I said in my post, I would have no problem buying unlockables as I play..  Getting $50 out of me per year is better then nothing, which is what they are getting now from me with a manditory sub..  

Your post just plainly tells us you don't understand anything about EVE.

in exchange of every paltry 50 USD per year from casuals like you, they would probably lose ten times the amount from customers disgusted by rampant spammers, spy alts, corp thieves et cetera. Really?  It's amazing that so many sub games already suffer from spammes and such, so subbing doesn't guarantee you anything.. And as I said, if the cash shop model is done correctly there would be no need for spamming because they wouldn't be in business..  Spy alts?  Already exist for those that own more then one account.. I believe you are reaching for "possibilities" to excuse your bias stance.. 

F2P just would not work for EVE. It would cause more problems than solve anything, resulting in the paying customers to leave quickly and the death of the game.  I'm all ears.. do inform us all how F2P would not work.. I don't want vague "could of, should and would of".. I want factual details please..

Thank you.

 

 

That particular discussion has been had before. Read this: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/5415659#5415659

Particularly my post on it. It explains in explicit detail why Eve going F2P is a catastrophically bad idea.

Those are not facts but opinion why YOU feel F2P would fail.. and you use YOUR rules of F2P to justify..  TRY again..  Thank you

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 12386

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, Project Gorgon, and Combat Arms

12/10/12 1:40:34 PM#51
Originally posted by dave6660
Originally posted by Rydeson

EVE is plenty easy to set up.. They already did it with trial accounts.. Each skill, each ship, each stargate can be controlled with "unlockables"..  Pay as you go..

Holy shit.  You want to pay for each new gate you jump through?  If that was the case I would owe CCP a small fortune.

The fortune it would cost me would be up there, too. :)

One day in Sank and Jita, next day back in Alenia, then a couple days doing missions in Arraron, then back to Jita for selling and mischief... suddenly the $13.00 to take the GWB out of NY seems like pennies. :)

"And wikipedia is as accurate as Britannica. Wikipedia is very reliable. You would be hard pressed to find a more reliable source for these kinds of things." -fivoroth

  Rydeson

Elite Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 3376

12/10/12 1:50:13 PM#52
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by dave6660
Originally posted by Rydeson

EVE is plenty easy to set up.. They already did it with trial accounts.. Each skill, each ship, each stargate can be controlled with "unlockables"..  Pay as you go..

Holy shit.  You want to pay for each new gate you jump through?  If that was the case I would owe CCP a small fortune.

The fortune it would cost me would be up there, too. :)

One day in Sank and Jita, next day back in Alenia, then a couple days doing missions in Arraron, then back to Jita for selling and mischief... suddenly the $13.00 to take the GWB out of NY seems like pennies. :)

Ok guys.. lets not be petty about stargate being singular.. LOL you could easily group sections or multiple stargates to be unlockable..  The more you explore, they more it cost you to unlock the galaxy..  Consider it a toll :)  lol

  Banquetto

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/06/09
Posts: 1028

12/10/12 1:56:14 PM#53


Originally posted by Gdemami

Originally posted by Banquetto

So I'm not sure what our argument is.


The point is, you claimed that Gems are not purchased with real money.


Originally posted by Banquetto

Not from players spending cash.



Gems are not ordinary item with infinite supply you can purchase for gold, something you were implying. It is quite more complex than that and much closer to PLEX system, just in GW2 case ANet stepped in as a regulator in the process.



Oh, no, no, no, I think you misunderstood me partially. Of course gems are purchased with real money. I never meant to imply that they weren't. What I am asserting is that there are two ways gems enter the game: either you pay real money for them, or you buy them from ArenaNet, for gold, at an exchange rate set by ArenaNet.


And that once gems enter your possession, you can either spend them at the cash shop, or sell them back to ArenaNet, for gold, at an exchange rate set by ArenaNet.


I think you are incorrect when you say "Gems are not ordinary item with infinite supply you can purchase for gold". All the evidence suggests that they are.



Originally posted by Loktofeit

Originally posted by Banquetto Gdemami, I honestly have no idea what you're trying to say here. Is it your claim that gems for gold in GW2 involves players directly buying and selling from each other? That each and every gem bought for gold is matched up with one gem purchased for cash and sold for gold? Because I'm claiming that that is not the case.
And you'd be wrong. All gems on the market were purchased and placed there by players. "The gems and gold players get from the Currency Exchange are supplied by other players, not ArenaNet." (source)

Is it possible that there may be no available gems one day as a result of that? Possible, but not at all probable. 



Interesting piece. The follow-up explanation actually doesn't make a whole lot of sense, though. It certainly reads like the writer got a little confused by the discussion:



ArenaNet will set the initial exchange rate for gems to gold when the servers first open for headstart, but after that the rate will fluctuate based on supply and demand of the players using the Currency Exchange. The gems and gold players get from the Currency Exchange are supplied by other players, not ArenaNet. As supply of gems goes up, the price will go down and vice versa. While we do not expect prices to fluctuate wildly, smart traders will be able to get good deals by watching the exchange rate closely and waiting for it to favor gems or gold, whichever they are looking to purchase.


You are correct that if it worked like this, there would be no available gems one day as a result. And actually that is extremely probable: soon after launch, for instance, the exchange rate (the initial rate set by ArenaNet, according to this piece) was so low that countless players were buying gems for gold like crazy (I grabbed $30 worth or so, for a handful of gold), and nobody was selling them for gold because it was so insanely expensive (in the order of $6 to buy one gold).


How were there gems available to buy at this time, if the gems are supplied by other players, not ArenaNet?


You can look at Diablo 3 to see what happens when a fixed exchange rate doesn't match supply and demand - initially, they put a floor of $2.50 per million on gold sales at the RMAH. Result - countless players with millions of gold listed for sale, none of it selling. If GW2 worked as claimed, there would be a frequent state of players wanting to buy gems, and none available.


I think it is far more likely, in the absence of a clear and unambiguous statement directly from ArenaNet (and satisfactory answers to the many follow-up questions), that when you trade at the currency exchange, you are trading directly with ArenaNet, and the effect of this supply and demand is not any market interaction, but rather an algorithmic modification to their exchange rate.

  Gdemami

Elite Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7034

12/10/12 4:24:00 PM#54


Originally posted by Banquetto

I think you are incorrect when you say "Gems are not ordinary item with infinite supply you can purchase for gold". All the evidence suggests that they are.


Gem conversion rate is being regulated, any ordinary item has fixed price.

It does not matter how gems are entering the game, what matters is how their price is formed up. In EVE, the price regulator is supply/demand, in GW2 the regulator is ANet.

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 12386

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, Project Gorgon, and Combat Arms

12/10/12 4:34:57 PM#55
Originally posted by Banquetto


Originally posted by Loktofeit

Originally posted by Banquetto Gdemami, I honestly have no idea what you're trying to say here. Is it your claim that gems for gold in GW2 involves players directly buying and selling from each other? That each and every gem bought for gold is matched up with one gem purchased for cash and sold for gold? Because I'm claiming that that is not the case.
And you'd be wrong. All gems on the market were purchased and placed there by players. "The gems and gold players get from the Currency Exchange are supplied by other players, not ArenaNet." (source)

Is it possible that there may be no available gems one day as a result of that? Possible, but not at all probable. 



Interesting piece. The follow-up explanation actually doesn't make a whole lot of sense, though. It certainly reads like the writer got a little confused by the discussion:


ArenaNet will set the initial exchange rate for gems to gold when the servers first open for headstart, but after that the rate will fluctuate based on supply and demand of the players using the Currency Exchange. The gems and gold players get from the Currency Exchange are supplied by other players, not ArenaNet. As supply of gems goes up, the price will go down and vice versa. While we do not expect prices to fluctuate wildly, smart traders will be able to get good deals by watching the exchange rate closely and waiting for it to favor gems or gold, whichever they are looking to purchase.


You are correct that if it worked like this, there would be no available gems one day as a result. And actually that is extremely probable: soon after launch, for instance, the exchange rate (the initial rate set by ArenaNet, according to this piece) was so low that countless players were buying gems for gold like crazy (I grabbed $30 worth or so, for a handful of gold), and nobody was selling them for gold because it was so insanely expensive (in the order of $6 to buy one gold).


How were there gems available to buy at this time, if the gems are supplied by other players, not ArenaNet?

The gems people bought during beta. You'd be surprised at how many people buy game cash during betas, especially when that game cash will be refunded once the game goes live. There were also gem giveaways. I think the events during Beta Weekend 2 gave the player 3k gems.

 

"And wikipedia is as accurate as Britannica. Wikipedia is very reliable. You would be hard pressed to find a more reliable source for these kinds of things." -fivoroth

  itstheclimax

Novice Member

Joined: 4/09/12
Posts: 28

12/10/12 4:41:03 PM#56
Originally posted by Gdemami

 


Originally posted by banzai014

Oh from what I read I thought PLEX was like gems in GW2 - I didn't know somebody actually had to have spent cash to get it to market.

 

Don't GW2 gems come from real currency purchase only?

no. you can buy gems with the in game currency on your character.

  Kiljaedenas

Novice Member

Joined: 7/29/11
Posts: 467

To err is human, but to really f*ck things up you need a computer.

12/10/12 5:56:13 PM#57
Originally posted by Rydeson
Originally posted by Kiljaedenas
Originally posted by Rydeson
Originally posted by tom_gore
Originally posted by Rydeson
Originally posted by Boardwalker
I hope EVE never goes F2P. Having a sub is a great way to keep the freeloaders out, while ensuring consistent updates and free expansions from CCP.

      How is F2P freeloading?   I'm curious how and why you see it that way..  Have you heard of the saying "something is better then nothing"?  There is alot of truth in that..  There are many players such as myself that only play casually on weekends.. Paying for a sub is just careless and crazy..  I'm an advid golfer when weather permits.. Sure I would LOVE a subscription based golf course that allows me to golf all I want, whenever I want.. But should everyone, even the guy that golfs once a month pay the same monthly golf sub.?  Oh hell no..

     When a game has ONLY a subscrption option, if forces people to go  "ALL IN" or fold.. Just like poker..  If a B2P cash shop is set up properly, then both subs and pay as you go customers can co-exist..  As I said in my post, I would have no problem buying unlockables as I play..  Getting $50 out of me per year is better then nothing, which is what they are getting now from me with a manditory sub..  

Your post just plainly tells us you don't understand anything about EVE.

in exchange of every paltry 50 USD per year from casuals like you, they would probably lose ten times the amount from customers disgusted by rampant spammers, spy alts, corp thieves et cetera. Really?  It's amazing that so many sub games already suffer from spammes and such, so subbing doesn't guarantee you anything.. And as I said, if the cash shop model is done correctly there would be no need for spamming because they wouldn't be in business..  Spy alts?  Already exist for those that own more then one account.. I believe you are reaching for "possibilities" to excuse your bias stance.. 

F2P just would not work for EVE. It would cause more problems than solve anything, resulting in the paying customers to leave quickly and the death of the game.  I'm all ears.. do inform us all how F2P would not work.. I don't want vague "could of, should and would of".. I want factual details please..

Thank you.

 

 

That particular discussion has been had before. Read this: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/5415659#5415659

Particularly my post on it. It explains in explicit detail why Eve going F2P is a catastrophically bad idea.

Those are not facts but opinion why YOU feel F2P would fail.. and you use YOUR rules of F2P to justify..  TRY again..  Thank you

...Have you even played the game past the trial period? Haven't you ever had a spy alt steal from your corp (I have), or witnessed the Burn Jita event (I did) or have seen the permanent gank-gangs outside the main Jita station (and I do mean PERMANENT)? You keep asking for "facts" on how a F2P system would affect a game that has a level of logistical and tactical metagame complexity completely unheard of anywhere else, and there is nothing to compare to. My "facts" as it were are based off of plain logical thought, and I'm surprised you don't see them. So let's try again:

1a) It is a FACT that suicide ganking happens in Eve

1b) It is a FACT that suicide ganking is at least partially controlled because the players that do it get a significant security status hit each time, enough of them and they won't even be able to enter Hisec without the NPC police blowing them out of the sky on sight.

1c) It is a FACT resulting from simple logic that if Eve went F2P the players that like to suicide gank would waste no time in creating legions of free suicide gank drone accounts to accelerate their work. Why wouldn't they? It would result in a significant increase in their profit rate as well as "moar carebear tears" as some of them like to say. I'd probably do it too. They could just cycle through account names, discarding ones that have too low of a sec status in place of a new one. If properly set up initially you could get a very effective Thrasher ganker up and running inside of two days in terms of skill training (and if you don't understand that as a fact, you REALLY haven't played the game).

Next point:

2a) It is a FACT that Eve's living, epic economy depends on a careful balance of supply vs demand, creation vs destruction

2b) It is a FACT that excessive mining supply (i.e. bots) can negatively affect the market, hence recent anti-bot campaigns.

2c) It is a FACT resulting from simple logic that if Eve went F2P the players who like to mine would waste no time in creating a legion of mining drones that they could run at the same time (hell, I probably would too) and completely glut the market with supply for hisec ores (which are used in pretty much EVERYTHING) and ruin the market.

If you have any abilities in logic at all, you should also see the spying implications I mentioned in my previous post.

The fact (!) of the matter is, if there is an easier way to make a profit in Eve people will do it. There isn't a single thing you can say that can disprove what I stated above, and if you even try that will prove that you really don't understand Eve Online or the people in it at all.

Where's the any key?

  Rydeson

Elite Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 3376

12/11/12 8:28:26 AM#58
Originally posted by Kiljaedenas
Originally posted by Rydeson

Those are not facts but opinion why YOU feel F2P would fail.. and you use YOUR rules of F2P to justify..  TRY again..  Thank you

...Have you even played the game past the trial period? Haven't you ever had a spy alt steal from your corp (I have), or witnessed the Burn Jita event (I did) or have seen the permanent gank-gangs outside the main Jita station (and I do mean PERMANENT)? You keep asking for "facts" on how a F2P system would affect a game that has a level of logistical and tactical metagame complexity completely unheard of anywhere else, and there is nothing to compare to. My "facts" as it were are based off of plain logical thought, and I'm surprised you don't see them. So let's try again:  keyword being "YOUR" facts on how F2P wouuld effect the game.. No one is saying that gankings and spy doesn't happen, they do and happen on PAID accounts.. So to imply that subscriptions immune you from poor judgement and actions doesn't hold up..

1a) It is a FACT that suicide ganking happens in Eve No one said ganking doesn't happen.. You are off topic here arguing about something that wasn't said..   The fact that sky is blue is true, but had nothing to do with this topic..

1b) It is a FACT that suicide ganking is at least partially controlled because the players that do it get a significant security status hit each time, enough of them and they won't even be able to enter Hisec without the NPC police blowing them out of the sky on sight. (read above)

1c) It is a FACT resulting from simple logic that if Eve went F2P the players that like to suicide gank would waste no time in creating legions of free suicide gank drone accounts to accelerate their work. Why wouldn't they? It would result in a significant increase in their profit rate as well as "moar carebear tears" as some of them like to say. I'd probably do it too. They could just cycle through account names, discarding ones that have too low of a sec status in place of a new one. If properly set up initially you could get a very effective Thrasher ganker up and running inside of two days in terms of skill training (and if you don't understand that as a fact, you REALLY haven't played the game). You obviously didn't bother reading the entire post(s).. You are assuming that F2P means anyone can have 100% access to the game.. As I said, that is NOT my stance.. Pay as you go is my stance.. Could someone invest $$ to unlock enough of the game to become a spy and ganker as you worry about.. Sure.. But that is no different then someone investing the same $$ in a temporary sub to do the same thing you are trying to avoid..

Next point:

2a) It is a FACT that Eve's living, epic economy depends on a careful balance of supply vs demand, creation vs destruction HUH?  lol  Who is arguing that EVE doesn't have an ecomomy? As I said, fact is sky is blue, but it has nothing to do with this topic or what I'm saying..

2b) It is a FACT that excessive mining supply (i.e. bots) can negatively affect the market, hence recent anti-bot campaigns. (read above)

2c) It is a FACT resulting from simple logic that if Eve went F2P the players who like to mine would waste no time in creating a legion of mining drones that they could run at the same time (hell, I probably would too) and completely glut the market with supply for hisec ores (which are used in pretty much EVERYTHING) and ruin the market. Again you are using YOUR set of rules of F2P to base your argument from.. There are safety protocols to keep multiple accounts being generated by a single sourse.. MMORPG.com uses some to only allow ONE account per ISP...  and even if there are those diehards that can find backdoors into multple accounts, what good would it do for them if they are LOCKED out from all mining outside the starting locations..

If you have any abilities in logic at all, you should also see the spying implications I mentioned in my previous post.

The fact (!) of the matter is, if there is an easier way to make a profit in Eve people will do it. There isn't a single thing you can say that can disprove what I stated above, and if you even try that will prove that you really don't understand Eve Online or the people in it at all.

total strawman argument you posted.. you are arguing your stance using your set of rules.. Sorry.. but try again..  Happy Holidays..

  dave6660

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/26/08
Posts: 2350

"Next time I see you, remind me not to talk to you."

12/11/12 9:17:54 AM#59
Originally posted by Rydeson
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by dave6660
Originally posted by Rydeson

EVE is plenty easy to set up.. They already did it with trial accounts.. Each skill, each ship, each stargate can be controlled with "unlockables"..  Pay as you go..

Holy shit.  You want to pay for each new gate you jump through?  If that was the case I would owe CCP a small fortune.

The fortune it would cost me would be up there, too. :)

One day in Sank and Jita, next day back in Alenia, then a couple days doing missions in Arraron, then back to Jita for selling and mischief... suddenly the $13.00 to take the GWB out of NY seems like pennies. :)

Ok guys.. lets not be petty about stargate being singular.. LOL you could easily group sections or multiple stargates to be unlockable..  The more you explore, they more it cost you to unlock the galaxy..  Consider it a toll :)  lol

During the course of my three years in Eve my character lived in at least a half dozen different regions from Placid to Black Rise to Lonetrek to the Great Wildlands to Syndicate to Essence.  I still would've owed a fortune.  So I'll gladly pay $15 a month and not have to bother about paying to unlock different regional gates.

"Why so serious?"
-- The Joker

  Rydeson

Elite Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 3376

12/11/12 10:50:37 AM#60
Originally posted by dave6660
Originally posted by Rydeson
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by dave6660
Originally posted by Rydeson

EVE is plenty easy to set up.. They already did it with trial accounts.. Each skill, each ship, each stargate can be controlled with "unlockables"..  Pay as you go..

Holy shit.  You want to pay for each new gate you jump through?  If that was the case I would owe CCP a small fortune.

The fortune it would cost me would be up there, too. :)

One day in Sank and Jita, next day back in Alenia, then a couple days doing missions in Arraron, then back to Jita for selling and mischief... suddenly the $13.00 to take the GWB out of NY seems like pennies. :)

Ok guys.. lets not be petty about stargate being singular.. LOL you could easily group sections or multiple stargates to be unlockable..  The more you explore, they more it cost you to unlock the galaxy..  Consider it a toll :)  lol

During the course of my three years in Eve my character lived in at least a half dozen different regions from Placid to Black Rise to Lonetrek to the Great Wildlands to Syndicate to Essence.  I still would've owed a fortune.  So I'll gladly pay $15 a month and not have to bother about paying to unlock different regional gates.

       THEN pay your 15 a month sub..  NO ONE has said that a monthly sub would be canceled..   Grrr why do so many assume that F2P means that monthly subs are canceled..  Choose your payment method based on what fits you best..  Right?  You like buffet playing, I like to ala carte my menu.. TY..    Happy Holidays :)

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