Originally posted by Divion

Originally posted by muffins89

Originally posted by Divion

Whats so hard to understand

 

Blizzard : " We have 10 million subscribers"

 

Lol no you don't.

 

You have 2-3 million subscribers, and allot[mod edit] who paid for an hour of play time.

 

If i subscribe to a year of a magazine, and pay 15 dollars a month for a subscription, and get a magazine everything month, that is a subscription.

 

If i go to the magazine store, and buy 1 copy of the same magazine for 20 bucks, and never buy another magazine, that is NOT a subscription.

 

Saying you habe 10 million subs when you don't is lying.

 

How is this rocket science? Detials don't matter, fact is, they lie.

** Also, i just looked South Korea uses a similar time model ~

 

It's deceptive watch :

 

Play a game that has over 10 million subscribers!

Play  a game that has 3 million subscribers, and some penny men!

 

They use the subs as an advertising pillar, and a quip for broadcasting false consumer health.

10 million people play wow,  get over it.

[mod edit]

 

people in china are also spending $77 dollars for MoP.  how does that make you feel?

 "Netease has the license to operate the game in China, and the expansion pack will be available at the official Netease-Blizzard online store at bmall.163.com. As seen in the image above, it’s priced at 486 RMB (US$77). It’s already hitting some other e-commerce sites in the country, such as Amazon China and 360Buy, though shipping won’t really begin until September 28 in China, allowing Blizzard to first deal with the likely huge demand from the Korea and Taiwan launches on September 27th at midnight local time."

Originally posted by goatus

What is so hard to understand?

WoW total (with Asia) = 9.1M. They never released exact EU/NA numbers (i think), but general consensus is, it was somewhere between 3 / 4.5 (Probably closer to 3 before MoP)

With this info 2.7M MoP sales, including 900k returning players seems realistic.

If we take the 2.7M MoP sales at face value, that means that 2.7M subscribers purchased the expansion (as that is the sales number released before MoP released in markets that pay by the hour, not a monthly subscription).

If only 2.7M subscribers purchased MoP, what did the other 300K / 1.8M do, according to general consensus?

If you apply Occam's Razor to the subscriber / MoP sales numbers, you would reach a very simple conclusion, and that is that 2.7M is the total number of traditional subscribers (as in, players that actually pay a monthly subscription, as opposed to those that pay by the hour and are counted as a subscriber) which make up the NA/EU player base.

However you look at it, WoW still has a huge subscriber base, and Blizzard (and WoW fans) still appear to be padding the numbers.

---

Originally posted by Divion

Blizzard : " We have 10 million subscribers"

Lol no you don't. 

You have 2-3 million subscribers, and allot of china men who paid for an hour of play time.

---

And where is the problem? They include "subscriber" definition in every official sub numbers release. It's not like they are hiding it.

There have been plenty of claims that Blizzard are using fuzzy math for sub numbers and it might be true but nothing have been proven one way or another.

With no proof Blizzards word is however good until someone actually can prove otherwise so unless anyone have actual and good proof this discussion is kinda pointless.

I doubt Blizzard would outright lie about numbers, but noone is actually forcing them to count players the same as Guiness books of records did 2010. 

Personally I dont see how it matters if Blizzard have 6 or 10 million subscribers, it is still a load of players and far more than any other P2P game.

---

Originally posted by Byrhofen

If only 2.7M subcribers purchased MoP, what did the other 300K / 1.8M do, according to general consensus?

If you apply Occam's Razor to the subscriber / MoP sales numbers, you would reach a very simple conclusion, and that is that 2.7M is the total number of traditional subscribers (as in, players that actually pay a monthly subscription, as opposed to those that pay by the hour and are counted as a subscriber) which make up the NA/EU player base.

However you look at it, WoW still has a huge subscriber base, and Blizzard (and WoW fans) still appear to be padding the numbers.

---

Why do you believe every single wow subscriber buys new expansion in the first week / month? Considering you can play both new race and new class without it (i think). So if you decide to reroll / or return to play new race for the expansion, you don't need that box until you are 85

Edit: ok, you can't access Monk class if you don't buy expansion. Good to know :P

Omg this article is so dumb :)

It is very simple - not all 9.1M subscribers are long term subscribers.

People come and go and go all the time and if supposed half of total player base did purchase the expansion, it is very impressive number.

What is an average MMO gamer subscriber time span? 2, 4 or 6 months?

Originally posted by Byrhofen

Originally posted by goatus

What is so hard to understand?

WoW total (with Asia) = 9.1M. They never released exact EU/NA numbers (i think), but general consensus is, it was somewhere between 3 / 4.5 (Probably closer to 3 before MoP)

With this info 2.7M MoP sales, including 900k returning players seems realistic.

If we take the 2.7M MoP sales at face value, that means that 2.7M subscribers purchased the expansion (as that is the sales number released before MoP released in markets that pay by the hour, not a monthly subscription).

If only 2.7M subscribers purchased MoP, what did the other 300K / 1.8M do, according to general consensus?

If you apply Occam's Razor to the subscriber / MoP sales numbers, you would reach a very simple conclusion, and that is that 2.7M is the total number of traditional subscribers (as in, players that actually pay a monthly subscription, as opposed to those that pay by the hour and are counted as a subscriber) which make up the NA/EU player base.

However you look at it, WoW still has a huge subscriber base, and Blizzard (and WoW fans) still appear to be padding the numbers.

I have an active wow account. I am in a guild of about 120 people. Of the 120, about 30 ACTIVE players bought MoP at release. I did not buy it at release. I just bought it about a week ago. You see, even if you didn't buy the expansion, you could make a Panarian, and that's what a lot of folks in the guild did, until the could read some reviews on mist. Most of our guild now has the expansion. However, like I said, we didn't but it out the gate. Just because you have to be in line and buy something day one, don't assume that everyone does. 

Originally posted by ace5572
I'll end this thread right now. Blizzard is owned by Activision. Activision does nothing but lie, take shortcuts, and lube the wheels of corporate greed.

Very dramatic. The wheels of corporate greed....lol

Originally posted by Divion

Whats so hard to understand

 

Blizzard : " We have 10 million subscribers"

 

Lol no you don't.

 

You have 2-3 million subscribers, and allot [mod edit]who paid for an hour of play time.

 

If i subscribe to a year of a magazine, and pay 15 dollars a month for a subscription, and get a magazine everything month, that is a subscription.

 

If i go to the magazine store, and buy 1 copy of the same magazine for 20 bucks, and never buy another magazine, that is NOT a subscription.

 

Saying you habe 10 million subs when you don't is lying.

 

How is this rocket science? Detials don't matter, fact is, they lie.

** Also, i just looked South Korea uses a similar time model ~

 

It's deceptive watch :

 

Play a game that has over 10 million subscribers!

Play  a game that has 3 million subscribers, and some penny men!

 

They use the subs as an advertising pillar, and a quip for broadcasting false consumer health.

Other games do the same, have you seen the advert for world of tanks? have you seen the old lineage boxes that state there are 7 million players? that 7 million was total about to have played the game, not subscribers.

Your problem seems to be the way that WoW counts a subscriber, you think that some guy in a cafe playing for 1 hour should not count in there numbers. How many hours should they have to play to qualify?

All they are doing is quantifying the number of monthly players in a easy to understand way, subbed players and ones using internet cafes that cannot subscribe to the game in the western way.

What about the guy in the internet cafe that plays 200 hours in a month? If you say 1 hour doesnt count as 1 sub then 200 hours must count as more than 1?

Also China is NOT Asia, the asian market for WoW includes Korea, Thailand, Vietnam, Japan, China, Taiwan etc

I wouldnt be suprised if the OP wrote the article on that site.

Hey OP newsflash for months and months Blizzard were reproting sub player looses close to 1 million every quarter, how come you dont have shite to say about that?

This is a company the clearly definwhat they use to describe as a sub.   What other company choeses to disclose player loasses of 600k a quarter?  They have shown gains and loses. Do you have a problem with that?

NOP. Not every single player that ahs subbed to wow wants to or has even the money to pay for mop.  Jesus christ I have players in my guild that are still at 80 because they dont have mop. In wotlk I had players in my guild stuck at 70 because they didnt have the money at the time or want to evenbuy WOTLK. And they just carried on playing wow. Maybe they eventually might buy the expac. But if in your twisted mind you think somehow the whole subscriber base is magically going to buy the expansion when its out you just dont know anything.  

OP get the hell over it.  Mop has stabalised Blizzards playerbase once again after BLIXXARD reported IN THEIR QUARTELY REPORTS , which they have to do by law to their shareholders.    Blizzard has once again I repeat reported huge losses that no other fuuckign company has done, now they have seen aan upsurge in players withmops release, and you have a problem?

Yes 10 million subs they have, so GET THE FUCK OVER IT.  I bet you were one of the guys that prayed for blizzards and wows demise with GW2 or any other game for that fact.  KEEP hating Blizzard and wow keep going strong while all other so called next gen super uber wow killing wtf bbqsauce hyypee of the month games keep falling flat.

they see em rooooollling, they hating!

nuff said, next topic.

I'm going to start by saying what WoW is up to has never effected me directly in my gaming experience (Runescaper here, and no I will never step down from that soap box)....

That said WoW and many other MMO's are selling a service to the sum of tens of millions, up to hundreds of millions of dollars per enterprise. They should be kept transparent and honest...The question is by who. I think as far as the United States is concerned, there should be some interest from the FTC in lobbying for congress to allocate funds and mandate to the FTC for a division devoted to keeping such enitities transparent and honest where their business is conducted with U.S. Consumers and Capital Investors (they have done this before for other sectors).

It wasn't but a few years ago that the video game industry as a whole over took (in the United States) the pornography and feature cinema industry combined in annual revenues (to the tune of over $8 billion USD).

There are just under 50,000,000 MMO players worldwide (based on what is measurable as not all of them have released data to draw on). About 46% of these are paying into MMO's at an average of $8.30 USD per person...per month. That's roughly $390,100,000 USD (almost 400 million) spent monthly on MMO's worldwide. Again, this comes from the graphs we can create based on the data we can see alone (and the relliability of the data can be called into question). That's around 4.6 billion a year and we can only roughly account for about half of the world wide industry here in the states.

We're talking about massive sums of money that are the biggest chunk of the biggest from of world wide entertainment. And we're lucky if they vuluntarily opt into ESRB Ratings and Privacy policy adherence yet alone transperent spending practices. And, the only people watching them are the people who are interested in what they are making because they report to the people who are making money off of them.

Read the EULA's and ToS for many of these carefully and you'll see that as a consumer you have next to no legal recourse and no consumer protection by the meer act of dowloading and installing their products (even runtime environment plugins for browser based MMO's).

It's seriously ridiculous how much the parent companies of MMO's could get away with if they find them selves in trouble and need to jump ship. Some one should at least be holding their passports.

Originally posted by Divion

 

If i subscribe to a year of a magazine, and pay 15 dollars a month for a subscription, and get a magazine everything month, that is a subscription.

 

If i go to the magazine store, and buy 1 copy of the same magazine for 20 bucks, and never buy another magazine, that is NOT a subscription.

 

You're lacking some key information (and thus, wasting our time).

Blizzard counts anyone who's payed for access "in the last 30 days" from the announcement. That means that everytime they announce their player numbers,  that many payed for access in the last month.

Get it? I mean, do you, really?

They didn't pay *ONCE* and got counted unto eternity. They payed in the 30 days leading up to the announcement - everytime.

Why is that so hard to understand? After all these years?

So, you're saying subscription-based arguments are (and always have been) inherently guesswork?

We knew that.