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MMORPG.com Discussion Forums

Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

General Discussion  » ANet has no respect for its supporters

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79 posts found
  Popori

Novice Member

Joined: 8/20/03
Posts: 333

11/19/12 12:34:44 AM#41

I heard they're adding quest hubs in the new expansion.

 

True story.

  IPolygon

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/20/11
Posts: 702

11/19/12 4:27:59 AM#42
For one I was never hyped about the game, since there was no hype. I believed in the words coming from designers and developers, not some trailer. Taking interviews was the main source for new pieces of information beneath blog posts. Word-of-mouth is the most important form of advertising for ANet, if you don't believe that, just take a look at their ridiculously bad launch trailer.

I understand an MMORPG has to change in order to keep going, but changing content, skills, professions etc is one thing, changing the foundation it is built on is another. I am not angry, just sad and disappointed in ANet taking this specific route to split the playerbase and providing dungeon crawling as it is known to WoW-players or any other traditional MMORPG players. The only difference here is that The Agony-Systems prevents players from grouping up like they do in previous dungeons. You don't have to have specific gear in order to stand a chance against encounters in the original dungeons.

Obviously you would deal less damage or be able to absorb less hits with inferior gear, but that wouldn't stop people from forming random groups. Now with the Agony-System in place and the increased RNG for special drops the higher the level of Agony is, the lower is the tolerance for players to take pugs below a specific level (since levels are adjusted). This leads to a forced player segragation and breaks another theorem they advertised for the game: skill>gear.

Instead of designing content for high level characters that scales well with zergs and makes all content relevant, they specifically introduce an area where the player is bound to play in order to stay competitive (wvw) or relevant. Of course, this leads (until other ways to acquire ascended gear are introduced) to a forced playstyle. You can no longer craft your way to the top gear.

I could go on, but I think you get the message of why some players don't like the current direction ANet is taking for GW2. Needless to say, I played hundreds of hours and enjoyed myself so much during that time, but for a lot of things I loved GW2 and ANet, I am disappointed and don't see a lot of what was previously said about it in the game.

ANet always said they are iterating things. Iteration is the most crucial aspect of game development, since you don't know if it really works until you tried it and there is no common solution for all problems. However changing the design philosophy is another story.

If you don't believe in what a developer says about a game's features and see it incorporated mostly well in the game in both BWE and then release and then experience a total switch, how would you react? I understand that taking something somebody says with a grain of salt is a good way to filter a lot of potential disappointment, but once you've seen something realised and then turned into something else, it is hard to stomach. At least for me.

Edit: I need a new keyboard.
  IPolygon

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/20/11
Posts: 702

11/19/12 4:38:45 AM#43
Originally posted by KhinRunite
Originally posted by grindwars2

 

Respect for your intelligence: They tell you ascended is there to "fill the 'gap' between exotics and legendary". Uhuh, right, all the sudden there's a gap to be filled, folks! Then you get a response that doesn't say anything.  Don't you find the double talk disrespectful?

The 'gap' was observed post launch. It's not "all of a sudden". 

Respect for your time: You follow the game for years, keep reading all that awesome "no grind" "is it fun?" "game we'd like to play" talk. It launches, it's great, you invest *600+ hours* into it thinking you'll be playing an awesome game for years and BAM they bail on the game's core 'design philosophies'.

Which design philosophy is this? No item progression? No item grind? Both exist in the game before the introduction of Ascended items.

Respect for the player investment: Fully supportive players who have pre-purchased it thinking it would be what they said it was going to be *can't get a refund* now they have decided to change the game.

What I'm seeing is a bunch of disillusioned people who understood the manifesto wrong.

 


 

 

This is what happens when you get all hyped up. You fall a lot harder.

 

Item progression is no gear treadmill if it stops at one point. Nobody is against gear progression if you actually progress. It becomes a treadmill when there is no end and you and the enemy just scale in power. When both scale in power, it is no progression anymore.

Everything they mentioned in the manifesto was true until the last update. Of course you can be cynical all you want. That doesn't change the fact the others like to listen to what someone else is saying.
  Indrome

Novice Member

Joined: 5/03/12
Posts: 294

This is like trying to drive straight through Schroedinger's minefield!

11/19/12 4:41:27 AM#44
Originally posted by grindwars2
I've made this account to post this. It's the only one. They changed the foundations of the game they said they were gonna make. The ones who followed the game the longest and bought it upfront got shafted. Any trolls need more clarification?  They shafted us and they deserve no credibility and I will spread the word anywhere I can.

*waves hand*

Hi, I am Paul. I followed GW2 since it was first announced and I feel like they have delivered exactly what they promised.

I also feel I don't have to support my statement with any facts since you didn't either. Farewell, go spread your hate if you feel it gives your soul some comfort. (Blowing this way out of proportion much?)

  Whitebeards

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/02/11
Posts: 750

11/19/12 4:47:26 AM#45

"At the core of Guild Wars 2 is this simple concept. Respect for the player's intelligence, respect for the player's time, respect for the player's investment, and respect, even reverence, for the genre."

 

What? lol

  Thane

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/14/03
Posts: 1866

I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar.

11/19/12 4:48:48 AM#46
Originally posted by Popori

I heard they're adding quest hubs in the new expansion.

 

True story.

yea, and i heard you have no idea what you are talking about.

 

truet story.

"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"

  Gaia_Hunter

Elite Member

Joined: 5/04/12
Posts: 2590

11/19/12 5:11:40 AM#47

The change was made based on "feedback by players".

Since Anet didn't ask for any feedback from players since BWE the only conclusion is that the feedback came from forums and social networks.

Since posting in forums and social networks can lead to change of stances by Anet it becomes obvious if you dislike the changes made you should post.

The same people telling people protesting to shut up are the same that told people protesting about no gear progression and nothing to do to shutup before.

"We want gear progression." - player that wants gear progression

"Game is fine. Gear progression is bad.WoW is that way. Shut up" - dude that doesn't care and whatever is always fine + player that doesn't want gear progression and was the original target for the Guild Wars franchise.

Anet adds gear progression based on player feedbac.

"We don't want gear progression" - player that doesn't want gear progression and was the original target for the Guild Wars franchise.

"Game is fine. Gear progression is good. Go play GW1. Shut up" - dude that doesn't care and whatever is always fine.

To be precise, most didn't say gear progression is good. Most tried to say that either there was no gear progression or that it was just this time or simply tried to divert attention with the rest of the content patch as if criticizing ascended items somehow equates to criticize the rest of the update.

Currently playing: GW2
Cooperative (semi cooperative)board games you should check: Pandemic, Sentinels of the Multiverse, Eldritch Horror, Descent 2.0,Level 7 Omega Protocol, Last Night on Earth

  Whitebeards

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/02/11
Posts: 750

11/19/12 5:15:18 AM#48
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

The change was made based on "feedback by players".

Since Anet didn't ask for any feedback from players since BWE the only conclusion is that the feedback came from forums and social networks.

Since posting in forums and social networks can lead to change of stances by Anet it becomes obvious if you dislike the changes made you should post.

The same people telling people protesting to shut up are the same that told people protesting about no gear progression and nothing to do to shutup before.

"We want gear progression." - player that wants gear progression

"Game is fine. Gear progression is bad.WoW is that way. Shut up" - dude that doesn't care and whatever is always fine + players that doesn't want gear progression and was the original target for the Guild Wars franchise.

Aned adds gear progression based on player feedbac.

"We don't want gear progression" - player that doesn't want gear progression and was the original target for the Guild Wars franchise.

"Game is fine. Gear progression is good. Go play GW1. Shut up" - dude that doesn't care and whatever is always fine.

To be precise, most didn't say gear progression is good. Most tried to say that either there was no gear progression or that it was just this time or simply tried to divert attention with the rest of the content patch as if criticizing ascended items somehow equates to criticize the rest of the update.

I keep reading that but i just can't buy that reason.

  Gaia_Hunter

Elite Member

Joined: 5/04/12
Posts: 2590

11/19/12 5:18:36 AM#49
Originally posted by Whitebeards
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

The change was made based on "feedback by players".

Since Anet didn't ask for any feedback from players since BWE the only conclusion is that the feedback came from forums and social networks.

Since posting in forums and social networks can lead to change of stances by Anet it becomes obvious if you dislike the changes made you should post.

The same people telling people protesting to shut up are the same that told people protesting about no gear progression and nothing to do to shutup before.

"We want gear progression." - player that wants gear progression

"Game is fine. Gear progression is bad.WoW is that way. Shut up" - dude that doesn't care and whatever is always fine + players that doesn't want gear progression and was the original target for the Guild Wars franchise.

Aned adds gear progression based on player feedbac.

"We don't want gear progression" - player that doesn't want gear progression and was the original target for the Guild Wars franchise.

"Game is fine. Gear progression is good. Go play GW1. Shut up" - dude that doesn't care and whatever is always fine.

To be precise, most didn't say gear progression is good. Most tried to say that either there was no gear progression or that it was just this time or simply tried to divert attention with the rest of the content patch as if criticizing ascended items somehow equates to criticize the rest of the update.

I keep reading that but i just can't buy that reason.

Buy it or not it was one of the two reasons given.

Between player feedback and a gap between exotic and legendary items, at least there was people shoutting for progression while the only gap between exotics and legendaries was a grind gap.

On the other hand dispite exotics being seen as easy to acquire, they had  made them easier to acquire (apparently player feedback was saying it was too hard to grind exotics and that it was too easy to grind exotics?) and there was an increase in resource generation with this patch, making again exotics easier to obtain.

Exotic items were “easy to obtain” if, and only if, you:

1) Refuse to play more than one character.
2) Refuse to play more than one build on each character.
3) Refuse to use anything other than the cheapest (profession-crafted) Exotics in the game.

It seems to me a big cluster fuck, with Anet trying to appease to two completely different group of players.

Currently playing: GW2
Cooperative (semi cooperative)board games you should check: Pandemic, Sentinels of the Multiverse, Eldritch Horror, Descent 2.0,Level 7 Omega Protocol, Last Night on Earth

  someforumguy

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/07
Posts: 3481

11/19/12 5:27:30 AM#50

While I was pissed about this totally messed up one time event too and I don't like the some of the changes that this Lost Shores update will bring, it makes no sense to assume that this is some kind of form of negligence from Arenanet.

The blog that introduced the ascended gear was already PR disaster and the bugged event totally messed up their free trials this weekend. I don't think that it was Arenanet's intention to show a buggy and laggy GW2 to potential new buyers lol and at the same time piss off the existing customers.

But yeah, the new gear changes they introduce makes me wonder whats left of the people at Arenanet who were so enthousiastic about the manifesto.

  Mothanos

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/20/10
Posts: 1834

11/19/12 5:43:54 AM#51

ive spend 600 hours in WvW and was pro Anet the moment i heared about GW2.
What happend to GW2 ? its just another carrot on a stick in no less then 3 months.

They promised not to do this, but what happend is my time spend in WvW is less returning less gear then some1 spending time in dungeons.
And here we go again dungeon crawlers on top of pvp players, where have i seen this before :) ?


I have nothing against gear progresion !!! but i want to be on equal foot in a WvW setting versus people that join WvW.
Now to be on par i am forced to do PvE...or accept iam on the weaker end of the stick if i dont want to pve.

My karma is worthless, my badges are worthless, but farming the new dungeons gives me better gear even in a WvW setting.

Planetside 2 on the horizon (24 hours)
Eve always smile's back at me ;)
And next year we can have a shot at mmo number 49582985792 who promise RvR / WvW namely Elders Scroll Online.

Rage is filling the forums and WvW players are mostly frustrated by their new vieuw on gear progresion.
They will update WvW rewards, but it might take a month or 2 -_-

Time to pack me bags and leave GW2 for the time untill they sort this mess out.

http://speedtest.net/result/2112016336.png

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 18999

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

11/19/12 5:47:52 AM#52

"Read my lips, no new taxes" GWB Sr.

Some promises, much like ANET's are ill thought out and sometimes reality requires they be broken for the greater good of the situation.

No reason to get totally strung out over it, this is after all, a 60.00 video game and in the greater scheme of the universe, largely inconsequential.

I'm guessing if the game was enjoyable to you before, it will largely still be after these changes.

But of course, if you can't live with this, then stop playing is the right way to go, though I can't agree with the idea of asking for a refund if you've spent any amount of time on this game.

 

 

"In these forums 'honest' seems to be a symonym for 'hates the game just like I do'" - ohioastro
Kyleran - Bitter Vet ™ since 2006
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 18999

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

11/19/12 5:51:08 AM#53
Originally posted by Mothanos

ive spend 600 hours in WvW and was pro Anet the moment i heared about GW2.
What happend to GW2 ? its just another carrot on a stick in no less then 3 months.

They promised not to do this, but what happend is my time spend in WvW is less returning less gear then some1 spending time in dungeons.
And here we go again dungeon crawlers on top of pvp players, where have i seen this before :) ?


I have nothing against gear progresion !!! but i want to be on equal foot in a WvW setting versus people that join WvW.
Now to be on par i am forced to do PvE...or accept iam on the weaker end of the stick if i dont want to pve.

My karma is worthless, my badges are worthless, but farming the new dungeons gives me better gear even in a WvW setting.

Planetside 2 on the horizon (24 hours)
Eve always smile's back at me ;)
And next year we can have a shot at mmo number 49582985792 who promise RvR / WvW namely Elders Scroll Online.

Rage is filling the forums and WvW players are mostly frustrated by their new vieuw on gear progresion.
They will update WvW rewards, but it might take a month or 2 -_-

Time to pack me bags and leave GW2 for the time untill they sort this mess out.

If you don't want to do PVE to progress then don't play MMORPG's, stick to MMOFPS'ers like Planetside, but I'll bet even there some progression will creep in, players demand it these days.

 

"In these forums 'honest' seems to be a symonym for 'hates the game just like I do'" - ohioastro
Kyleran - Bitter Vet ™ since 2006
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  Torgrim

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 12/15/05
Posts: 2139

11/19/12 6:10:01 AM#54

So we got a new random hater who created a new account with the proper hater name.

Nothing to see here move along.

If it's not broken, you are not innovating.

  Z3R01

Novice Member

Joined: 9/09/08
Posts: 2457

MMO gamer since 1997

11/19/12 6:10:30 AM#55

 

I dont understand this complaint. 

In WoW back in vanilla PVP was small scale (mostly)  and PVE gear had bloated stats so high end pve players had a massive advantage.

In Gw2 PVP is mostly Large scale and the difference between the best gear and this new gear are only a few stat points.

Are you telling me those few stat points really matter that much when a hundred people are killing each other in WvW? 

I think the OP is overreacting. 

Playing: None

Waiting on: None

  BTrayaL

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/17/08
Posts: 563

11/19/12 6:18:10 AM#56

I have bought the game, after a friend of mine let me use his account, and play a warrior until level 36.

I started all over again, reached 62 now, and I don't regret for a second buying it.

To people in doubt, try it, then decide; don't be a drone and blindly trust people on the forums.

  Torgrim

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 12/15/05
Posts: 2139

11/19/12 6:18:44 AM#57
Originally posted by Thane
Originally posted by Popori

I heard they're adding quest hubs in the new expansion.

 

True story.

yea, and i heard you have no idea what you are talking about.

 

truet story.

 

He used something called sarcasm.

If it's not broken, you are not innovating.

  GwapoJosh

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/10/12
Posts: 1009

11/19/12 6:37:57 AM#58
I say let people make more threads like this.. Let people's voices be heard.. Anet is treating their community like shit.  The devs are being a bunch of ****s.

"You are all going to poop yourselves." BillMurphy

  someforumguy

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/07
Posts: 3481

11/19/12 6:38:33 AM#59
Originally posted by Kyleran
Originally posted by Mothanos

ive spend 600 hours in WvW and was pro Anet the moment i heared about GW2.
What happend to GW2 ? its just another carrot on a stick in no less then 3 months.

They promised not to do this, but what happend is my time spend in WvW is less returning less gear then some1 spending time in dungeons.
And here we go again dungeon crawlers on top of pvp players, where have i seen this before :) ?


I have nothing against gear progresion !!! but i want to be on equal foot in a WvW setting versus people that join WvW.
Now to be on par i am forced to do PvE...or accept iam on the weaker end of the stick if i dont want to pve.

My karma is worthless, my badges are worthless, but farming the new dungeons gives me better gear even in a WvW setting.

Planetside 2 on the horizon (24 hours)
Eve always smile's back at me ;)
And next year we can have a shot at mmo number 49582985792 who promise RvR / WvW namely Elders Scroll Online.

Rage is filling the forums and WvW players are mostly frustrated by their new vieuw on gear progresion.
They will update WvW rewards, but it might take a month or 2 -_-

Time to pack me bags and leave GW2 for the time untill they sort this mess out.

If you don't want to do PVE to progress then don't play MMORPG's, stick to MMOFPS'ers like Planetside, but I'll bet even there some progression will creep in, players demand it these days.

 

I'm pretty sure that Arenanet's vision is still that you don't have to grind for gear in PVE to be competitive in PVP. Something that seems to be changed with the introduction of Ascended gear. Which is the point that Mothanos is trying to make. In GW1 it worked like a charm.

With the add of a tier above exotics in stats, I can understand that many players are afraid that Arenanet is moving away from that idea. A very important idea for many Arenanet fans. Especially those that followed GW2 through development.

This has nothing to do with having to lvl up to max lvl in PVE to be competitive.. But with dreading a potential gear treadmill after you hit lvl80 and having no assurance at this point that they won't keep adding more after this update.

If they want to have an additional tier that has infusion slots , fine. But that should be reason enough. Not adding another bump in base stats. Because it is kind of obvious that players who want to be prepared as best as possible for something like WvWvW, will see this gear as mandatoy.

There is no reason for the additional bump in stats on the new gear except for satisfying the gear treadmill crowd. To me this seems like a crappy compromise.

And I agree with him about the badges and karma.

  User Deleted
11/19/12 6:42:32 AM#60
Oh yes, they have absolutely no respect. Two months after release, already two FREE content additions in what is a B2P game. Absolutely no respect. Everyone should just cancel their subscriptions.
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