My topic is about the exploration/game ruining Group finder! Now we all know what WoW has turned into...a lazy mans click fest! Why leave SW/Org when u can just stand outside the AH and click LFG/LFR till you die to get to max lvl? Where did this worlds sense of exploration and achievment go? The mmo game devs are bending over and kissing ppls you know what making there games for LAZY friendly.

Then ppl say well i dont have time to spamm LFG in a city. OR I only have 1hr a day to play!

To them i say this...MMORPG games arnt for you go play FPS, if you are looking for quick fast gameplay.

I can only PRAY/HOPE/DREAM!!!!! That Elders Scrolls, FF14 Reborn and many more new mmo's do not follow this path and ruin there game, rendering the world a compleat usless waist.

They didn't ruin the genre alone. Instances were the first blow, then quest based leveling after that. And then phasing after that.

There is pretty much ZERO difference now between MMOs and Diablo.

It's really, REALLY pathetic.

Thankfully it seems like SOMEONE with a big company behind them has woken up and realized that the direction of the genre the last 8 years is not sensible for anyone.

I really hope Smed and SoE bring back true MMOs.

In the meantime, Darkfall and Vanguard will have to do.

Originally posted by Arcondo87

Now we all know [...]

We do, do we?

Originally posted by Myria

Originally posted by Arcondo87

Now we all know [...]

We do, do we?

Yeah, less turned into, more "always has been". It's been the most casual MMO on the market since the day it launched. Its just been getting more casual to keep up.

It's not so much about the instancing and group finder, it's more about what is instanced and how the group finder is implemented. If we look at how Anarchy Online did it back in the day (before Lost Eden and Legacy of the Xan expansion packs) the game and the community really did benefit from it. Leveling in missions for example was completely instanced, but it wasn't hard to find a group. The people in your group did benefit a lot by getting a lot more xp in a lot less time. Then look at WoW, for example, where levelling in a full group can even slow you down because of a lack of mobs to kill etc. Then you have raids, in WoW and alike instanced, in AO they where more or less faction or even server wide open world activities.

The group finder tool in AO is also great. You get all the necessary information, you can write a short message about what you're up to (or make fun of guild mates ^^ ) and you can still choose who'll be in your group.

I wouldn't say instancing and group finder ruined MMORPGs, I'd rather say the way they're implemented in a special (but very wide spread) type of MMORPG causes problems.

Originally posted by TheSedated

It's not so much about the instancing and group finder, it's more about what is instanced and how the group finder is implemented. If we look at how Anarchy Online did it back in the day (before Lost Eden and Legacy of the Xan expansion packs) the game and the community really did benefit from it. Leveling in missions for example was completely instanced, but it wasn't hard to find a group. The people in your group did benefit a lot by getting a lot more xp in a lot less time. Then look at WoW, for example, where levelling in a full group can even slow you down because of a lack of mobs to kill etc. Then you have raids, in WoW and alike instanced, in AO they where more or less faction or even server wide open world activities.

 

The group finder tool in AO is also great. You get all the necessary information, you can write a short message about what you're up to (or make fun of guild mates ^^ ) and you can still choose who'll be in your group.

 

I wouldn't say instancing and group finder ruined MMORPGs, I'd rather say the way they're implemented in a special (but very wide spread) type of MMORPG causes problems.

Well designed MMORPGs have absolutely zero need for instancing. And we're not talking about a LFG tool, we're talking about the tool that picks you up and plops you in a dungeon with random people you'll never see again.

Originally posted by Quirhid
What's wrong with skipping to the good stuff?

Because it circumvents the entire purpose of massively multiplayer games?

If you want to "skip to the good stuff" then play Diablo.

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Thankfully it seems like SOMEONE with a big company behind them has woken up and realized that the direction of the genre the last 8 years is not sensible for anyone.

I really hope Smed and SoE bring back true MMOs.

 

In the meantime, Darkfall and Vanguard will have to do.

If the future of MMOs is in Smed and $OEs hands, then we should be afraid... very afraid.  We do need something that takes the WoW formula and sends it through a shredder never to be seen again, but I just don't have faith in Smed or $OE to do that.

Originally posted by maplestone
If you are fretting about how other people are playing an MMO, you're going to have a bad time.

Thanks for spouting your reddit memes.

We're talking about the future of the genre, with affects ALL of us. There's a couple million of us who have spent the last 8 years watching our favorite genre get destroyed.

Originally posted by Latronus

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Thankfully it seems like SOMEONE with a big company behind them has woken up and realized that the direction of the genre the last 8 years is not sensible for anyone.

I really hope Smed and SoE bring back true MMOs.

 

In the meantime, Darkfall and Vanguard will have to do.

If the future of MMOs is in Smed and $OEs hands, then we should be afraid... very afraid.  We do need something that takes the WoW formula and sends it through a shredder never to be seen again, but I just don't have faith in Smed or $OE to do that.

 

After Planetside 2, I've have renewed faith.

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Originally posted by Quirhid
What's wrong with skipping to the good stuff?

Because it circumvents the entire purpose of massively multiplayer games?

If you want to "skip to the good stuff" then play Diablo.

Group finder does not make an MMORPG like Diablo. Obviously you don't care enough to make the distinction so I don't have to go any further than that.

I love skipping right to the good stuff.   That is why I usually rush to max level so I can be the first to start queuing up for the real game.    It's like they put these whole worlds of pointless shiet in my lobby based games and I don't know why....

Originally posted by Quirhid

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Originally posted by Quirhid
What's wrong with skipping to the good stuff?

Because it circumvents the entire purpose of massively multiplayer games?

If you want to "skip to the good stuff" then play Diablo.

Group finder does not make an MMORPG like Diablo. Obviously you don't care enough to make the distinction so I don't have to go any further than that.

Er, yes it does. Diablo is all about hopping into random servers and doing dungeon crawls with a couple of people. Or doing it with a few real life friends. You have no lasting relationship with the people beyond that.

In WoW, you hop in a random dungeon, run through it on autopilot, never talking to anyone, then get ported out.

It destroys the feel of the game world, removes socializing, and essentially, the entire point of the game. 6 man dungeons aren't massively multiplayer.

To be painfully honest I am not totally against instancing. I am against amount of instancing in modern mmorpg's. It is like 5-10 x too much. It should be exception when there is not mean to do desired thing without instancing not it's goal.  

To LFG / LFR tools. I won't speak about general population. I will speak only about myself.

I don't want those in mmorpg I want to play. I also don't desire my mmorpg to be only or mainly about running instances which many mmorpg's currently are about.  Mmorpg design I like is when there is only few instances which are not core gameplay but rather an part of gameplay that cannot be achieved without instancing. Still not being main type of gameplay.

If game is designed that way. That instances are present in gameplay but not being their most important part LFG / LFR tools and auto-teleprting can be non-present. Actually then it's presence can be not-desiered.

Originally posted by Quirhid

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Originally posted by Quirhid
What's wrong with skipping to the good stuff?

Because it circumvents the entire purpose of massively multiplayer games?

If you want to "skip to the good stuff" then play Diablo.

Group finder does not make an MMORPG like Diablo. Obviously you don't care enough to make the distinction so I don't have to go any further than that.

Well actually if you think about if a bit longer. It does.  Diablo non-pvp(I talk about whole franchise not D3) part is about doing certain bosses / places yourself or  with small group of other people.  You group either with soomeone you know or with some random people, appear in instanced location, kill mobs + boss, get loot, repeat or log out.

Dunegons cross-server LFG in mmorpg's is not fundamentally diffrent from Diablo and arenas matchmaking is not fundamentally dffrent from arena pvp gameplay in fps, rts, dotas or other similar games.

Sure if you cut this out or make it not only part of mmorpg that matters - then you automatically get rid of huge part of playerbase.Sure, Thing is that gameplay was added after mmorpg creation to expand on mmorpg playerbase and that's why big part of current mmorpg playerbase does migrate to game focused on instanced gameplay (various dotas & mobas & corps) and why mmorpg direction to change to follow almost purely matchmaking gameplay is failing to hold players for longer than few weeks to few months.

Online matchmaking games (LoL, Wot, Vindisctus, Dungeon Fighter Online in Asia and similar games) are more and more important and mmorpg's even if they get more similar to them also by incorporating lfg auto-tools won't be able to compete with them in longer-term. Unless they became them and stop being mmorpg's.

Mmorpg's is on road to became more niche again and that's not a bad thing.