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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

Reviews & Impressions  » BadSpock's Hitting Bottom: A Re-Review

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323 posts found
  Grimula

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/26/08
Posts: 202

10/26/12 4:54:03 PM#41

My favourite part of GW 2 was the underwater combat exploration

 

Underwater is just amazing in GW2...they need to add a whole bunch more to underwater hahah

 

it is a great game for people who want to play a few days a month

Bad game for hardcore video gamers i find hahah

  Randayn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/16/12
Posts: 775

10/26/12 4:56:08 PM#42
Originally posted by Istavaan
the people hating guild wars 2 will be leaving to catch the elder scrolls online hate train..these people hate everything and find fun in nothing.

I love alot of MMO's...

Anarchy Online

Age of Conan

TSW

Rift

WoW

Fallen Earth

Ryzom

But that doesnt mean I cant hate some either...blindly hate...then Ive got a problem....but GW2 is very easy to dislike.  It has design flaws out the wazoo that cripple it from being a "fleshed out masterpiece" and, in turn, becoming a "generic johnny come lately"

btw...ANOTHER ONE BITES THE DUST!!

  GeezerGamer

Elite Member

Joined: 4/03/12
Posts: 5214

10/26/12 4:56:49 PM#43


Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Dim_sum You're not burnt out old bean, it's just not a very good game.  Looks pretty, plays well, essentially soulless. I want a carrot too, don't be ashamed. Loot is awesome. Getting cool shit is fun. Cosmetics are not fun.   Dynamic events have been lauded as some kind of great evolution in gameplay. They are not. Because their inevitable cycling is contradictory.   Rejection of trinity heralded as a revolution in player dynamics. It is not, because homogeneity is not preferential to diversification.   It does some stuff well obviously. And they sold it well enough. But it's all a bit tedious.  Also personal stories suck balls.
I agree, he is not burnt out. It is just that GW 2 is not all that good and ThemeParks in general are not made to last. They are like fastfood, good to pick up now and then but not something for the long haul. 1-3 months is probably what you can squeeze out of a ThemePark, then the dev. created content thins out and there is not much else to do beside moving on.
 

I was trying to say something like this. There are 2 factors here. In most cases with life, people cahnge and when people start to reminisce about "Good Ole Days" it's usually through rose glasses. However, I will make an exception for this genre. It's changed. And not for the better.

I will say this over and over. Longevity in MMOs is because they have in depth Meta-Game to hold our interests on multiple levels. GW2 did what it did very well. But it just lacks Meta-Game. No trading, No building offical communities. I'm not talking just plain guilds, I mean in games like SWG. WoW had other things like obtaining rep rewards that were actually meaningfull past the 1st stage of instancing. There are just lots of things to do. I rememebr trying to get all the cooking recipies in the game in WoW back in TBC. I enjoyed fishing and making food in WOW. It paid well too. I loved being an Herbalist/Alchemist in WoW. Playing the auction house. All these side attractions. Are all gone. Even in WoW, now, these things are all gone or much more limited from 4-10 years ago.

It's the sad state of the genre. The next big title has as many threads discussing issues with it's business model than issues with the game itself.

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

10/26/12 4:58:09 PM#44
Originally posted by Randayn
Originally posted by Istavaan
the people hating guild wars 2 will be leaving to catch the elder scrolls online hate train..these people hate everything and find fun in nothing.

I love alot of MMO's...

Anarchy Online

Age of Conan

TSW

Rift

WoW

Fallen Earth

Ryzom

But that doesnt mean I cant hate some either...blindly hate...then Ive got a problem....but GW2 is very easy to dislike.  It has design flaws out the wazoo that cripple it from being a "fleshed out masterpiece" and, in turn, becoming a "generic johnny come lately"

btw...ANOTHER ONE BITES THE DUST!!

hows the quest to 80 btw?

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  jdlamson75

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 12/27/08
Posts: 928

There's some lovely filth down here.

10/26/12 4:58:18 PM#45
Indeed, Mr. Spock.  Indeed.
  aesperus

Elite Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 4847

10/26/12 4:59:13 PM#46
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by Yamota

I agree, he is not burnt out. It is just that GW 2 is not all that good and ThemeParks in general are not made to last. They are like fastfood, good to pick up now and then but not something for the long haul. 1-3 months is probably what you can squeeze out of a ThemePark, then the dev. created content thins out and there is not much else to do beside moving on.

I have been reading many of your guys posts for a long time now you guys are burnt out on themeparks you can admit it to yourself or not... obviously GW2 longevity will not appeal to everyone just as Rifts or EVE or any other games longevity will not appeal to everyone as everyone has differn't ideals in what they find fun for long periods of time

Going to have to side w/ Aerowyn on this. You guys really just sound like your burnt out on MMOs in general. Especially you Yamota. You've been posting in the GW2 forums for a while, inspite claiming the whole time to not only dislike the game, but also not be playing it.

The most ironic thing, is that GW2 has a good amount of sandbox features in it. It's not a 'true' sandbox, no, but it does have a good amount of replayability. Furthermore, it still has a strong playerbase, and is still highly active.

That said, it also has it's share of problems. Problems I really hope they get around to fixing sooner rather than later. Atm, WvW matchups, and roaming server transfers are a HUGE problem. As are exploiting / hacking perma stealth thieves, which are not only running around attacking people while staying invisible, but also hacking orbs across the map. That stuff needs to get sorted out asap. As does the culling issue.

The game has it's problems, but much of what is claimed to make gw2 a bad game, comes down to personal preference or bias, more than actual game mechanics. That said, you don't have to play it, and many are perfectly fine w/ the idea of playing GW2 for a while, then taking a break & coming back later.

  mmoguy43

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 3/31/09
Posts: 2354

10/26/12 4:59:14 PM#47
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by f0dell54

 

Good reveiw but it sounds oddly familar from your SWTOR let down.

As a half-human, I'm a creature of habit... half the time.

I guess I just keep getting my hopes up and keep getting them dashed. Figure a Vulcan would learn from his mistakes?

I think I am going to re-invest myself into console gaming.

Lots of good stuff coming up, Halo 4, new CoD, I have never played any of the Assassin's Creed games, might pick a couple of those up... never finished Gears 2 or bought Gears 3....

Haven't picked up Skyrim DLC yet, new DLC coming out, I'm too jaded/bitter to pick up any Mass Effect 3 DLC but the multiplayer was a blast.

I'm sure I'll continue to check out new MMOs too - have some interest in Neverwinter (especially the Foundry for content creation!) as well as Elder Scrolls Online, Archeage, maybe even Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn.

And I'm sure I'll be back to GW2 from time to time. I'm sure I'll get another "let's play GW2!!" kick and try and finish up my personal story, check out some more dungeons... and I'm sure the game will improve as time goes on and very thankfully because of the B2P model I can just hop right back in.

/age of 172 hours. Just over 7 days /played.

Join the fun of Planetside 2!

Let's build the ultimate MMO 1 feature at a time
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/398555/page/1

"blocked nariusseldon since forever"

  Omnifish

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/16/11
Posts: 617

I'll kick your a**e so hard, you could build a swimming pool in the footprint!

10/26/12 5:00:42 PM#48
Originally posted by GeezerGamer
Originally posted by BadSpock
Hopefully when I come back to life I get to bang Robin Curtis too.

Whoa what wait? Not to say there is anyting wrong with this particular choice, but if you are going for the whole in caracter role play gig, WTF stop there, if you are gonna dream big go for Jolene Blalock

Now hang on if were dreaming big we really should go with Annika Hansen, Jolenne Blalock, Marina Sirtis, (1994), Gates Macfadden......and a tub of strawberry ice cream!...

 

On the Enterprise D Battlebridge!

This looks like a job for....The Riviera Kid!

  xAPOCx

Novice Member

Joined: 10/25/12
Posts: 894

10/26/12 5:01:18 PM#49
Originally posted by aesperus
Originally posted by xAPOCx

sorry dont agree with you at all.

That's fine. May I ask, what recent game do you consider to be a good example of a game that is Trinity & gear based that hasn't gotten stale as a result?

All recent games are stale including GW2 hense why some of us are stuck in the MMO limbo. Wandering from game to game. Theres nothing wrong with the carrot. The problem comes with the ease at which you obtain said carrot. Everyone screaming for ease and accessability has giving us games like we have seen these past years including GW2.

 

Those that hate the Trinity are those that dont have the time to look for groups or make mass toons that are overflow types. Like your casters and melee dpsers. And if you make these types of toon your know what your getting into so its your own fault.

 

So no sorry i dont agree with you at all about the trinity OR the carrot.

  User Deleted
10/26/12 5:05:42 PM#50
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by Yamota
 

I agree, he is not burnt out. It is just that GW 2 is not all that good and ThemeParks in general are not made to last. They are like fastfood, good to pick up now and then but not something for the long haul. 1-3 months is probably what you can squeeze out of a ThemePark, then the dev. created content thins out and there is not much else to do beside moving on.

I have been reading many of your guys posts for a long time now you guys are burnt out on themeparks you can admit it to yourself or not... obviously GW2 longevity will not appeal to everyone just as Rifts or EVE or any other games longevity will not appeal to everyone as everyone has differn't ideals in what they find fun for long periods of time

True, it does depend on the individual but what systems inherent in GW2 really promote longevity? Not trolling btw.

 

I can dislike a game and yet still appreciate the fact that it offers dynamic systems/longevity. Likewise I can really enjoy a game but find it offers zero longer term hook.

 

Some types of games are simply not built for longevity, which is why we see sequels in the non mmo game genres. The funny thing is the mmo market is trying to promote the kind of gameplay focus we see in the offline gaming space, i.e. short life span, low retention, sequel galore space.

 

Great for accessibilty, polish, user friendliness and the like. Rubbish for longevity unless you whack in a fking great long carrot grind and no one is going to do that carrot grind when WoW owns the market in carrot grinds.

  Yamota

Elite Member

Joined: 10/05/03
Posts: 6696

Gaming should be about fun, not gender equality.

10/26/12 5:08:41 PM#51
Originally posted by aesperus
Originally posted by bunnyhopper

People "look back" to traditional sandbox games/mechanics/features because they promoted natural player community dynamics and offered freedom. Those of use often castigated for just wanting a rehash of UO are actually seeking games which provide the same ethos of community driven dynamics, longevity and player freedom within a persistent and dynamic game world.

If you can do that via other methods and mechanics, go for it.

The thing is though recently the emphasis has been 99.99% on accessibility, parity and carrot grinds, something other gaming genres offer.

Sadly, even with EQ Next, Unholy Wars, WoD et al coming up, I really, really can't see the genre gettting back to that ethos of longevity, community and freedom though (outside of indieville).

To some degree yes.

However, times are VERY different now. The mentallity most players had back then, is much different from the ones we have now. In the 'golden days' of MMOs, people were more interested in exploring this new form of gaming. It was more social, but it wasn't always due to game design. It was because things were still new, and players were much more willing to work together trying to figure out this new type of game. It was still a fronteir to explore. Games were also a lot more simple back then. They didn't have as many features, as big of a world, combat was generally fairly simple as well, inspite having a large skillset.

People now expect WAY more from an MMO than what we had back then. The shining example of sandbox atm, is still Eve. It's the only sandbox MMO still going strong. Yet it still doesn't have the same numbers as most of the themeparks. Just being a sandbox isn't going to be enough. Even if we were to bring back UO with modern graphics, I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't enough for most players.

Wait what? Eve has more than 350.000 subs and have been over 300.000 for years. There are only two sub-based MMOs which can best that and that is WoW and Aion and the latter one is F2P hybrid. All other ThemeParks have dwindling subs. such as TERA, Secret World, WAR, AoC, DCU and even SW:TOR has drastically lost subs and is headed for F2P.

If anything Eve shows that there is a demand for sandbox games and not like ThemeParks where they only stay for a few months but rather years. Ofcourse that does not mean a UO copy would be automatically a success, games have evolved since then and ofcourse sandbox MMOs need to also evolve. And imo it is the future of MMO', ThemeParks will soon all go the F2P route and it will only be sandbox MMO's which can provide the reason to sub to an MMO because they will have longetivity, ThemeParks do not.

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

10/26/12 5:09:29 PM#52
Originally posted by bunnyhopper
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by Yamota
 

I agree, he is not burnt out. It is just that GW 2 is not all that good and ThemeParks in general are not made to last. They are like fastfood, good to pick up now and then but not something for the long haul. 1-3 months is probably what you can squeeze out of a ThemePark, then the dev. created content thins out and there is not much else to do beside moving on.

I have been reading many of your guys posts for a long time now you guys are burnt out on themeparks you can admit it to yourself or not... obviously GW2 longevity will not appeal to everyone just as Rifts or EVE or any other games longevity will not appeal to everyone as everyone has differn't ideals in what they find fun for long periods of time

True, it does depend on the individual but what systems inherent in GW2 really promote longevity? Not trolling btw.

 

I can dislike a game and yet still appreciate the fact that it offers dynamic systems/longevity. Likewise I can really enjoy a game but find it offers zero longer term hook.

 

Some types of games are simply not built for longevity, which is why we see sequels in the non mmo game genres. The funny thing is the mmo market is trying to promote the kind of gameplay focus we see in the offline gaming space, i.e. short life span, low retention, sequel galore space.

 

Great for accessibilty, polish, user friendliness and the like. Rubbish for longevity unless you whack in a fking great long carrot grind and no one is going to do that carrot grind when WoW owns the market in carrot grinds.

for me PVP, huge world to explore,  multiple branching stories, classes that all have unique playstyles all add to the longevity for me.. i'm playing 3 classes in PVE currently and each has had a very differn't play and experience through my playthrough.. i also use my other slots as PVP exclusive characters for now but want to try to hit 80 with each race...I enjoy WvW and sPVP and while I think they both need ot be more fleshed out they both provide a much better foundation imho than all the other themeparks out right now

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  Randayn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/16/12
Posts: 775

10/26/12 5:10:46 PM#53
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by Randayn
Originally posted by Istavaan
the people hating guild wars 2 will be leaving to catch the elder scrolls online hate train..these people hate everything and find fun in nothing.

I love alot of MMO's...

Anarchy Online

Age of Conan

TSW

Rift

WoW

Fallen Earth

Ryzom

But that doesnt mean I cant hate some either...blindly hate...then Ive got a problem....but GW2 is very easy to dislike.  It has design flaws out the wazoo that cripple it from being a "fleshed out masterpiece" and, in turn, becoming a "generic johnny come lately"

btw...ANOTHER ONE BITES THE DUST!!

hows the quest to 80 btw?

I hit a snag at 16, but will push on....actually, been REALLY busy with RL...wife went away for a few days and I got the kids to myself, so haven't had a chance to get on.

  Kuinn

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/10/11
Posts: 2103

10/26/12 5:20:03 PM#54
Originally posted by BadSpock

I've also grown frustrated for how weak I feel. The pace of combat was so much better at earlier levels. I had this problem MAJOR bad with TOR - fights just take too long for no reason. It doesn't make me feel like a "hero" when I can't cut through swaths of baddies with ease.

Sure, I like having elite/champion/veteran mobs that take a bit of effort to kill. That's fun. But I don't like feeling like I'm hitting with a wet noodle against normal mobs. TOR made this mistake BIG time, and the only MMO where I never felt this way - is WoW.

 

I'm sorry if I concentrate on off-topic here, but since you mentioned it I just have to give some credit to TOR. The fights against single weak enemies does not take long. The whole point in TOR to send a pack of weak mobs at you is that you can cut them down quickly, and that's what you indeed can do. They die in just a few blows. Weak mobs in GW2 at least for me die almost as quick too, with the difference that in TOR you can fight a pack, but if you pull a lot of mobs in GW2 you'll die quick.

  User Deleted
10/26/12 5:21:38 PM#55

What took you so long?

 

Originally posted by BadSpock

<> but I have yet to press ANY button in any class at any level in GW2 where I felt like "Wow, I love this ability it is so freaking cool and awesome."

Pretty much sums up how I felt about the game as a whole: Ho-hum. 

 

3. No kill stealing, everyone gets loot, never a bad idea to help another player, cross-profession combos with anyone outside of grouping etc. is awesome and a huge, huge step forward in PvE.

I liked some of the ideas. Some of them seemed overly carebear in their nature. Which caused a reaction inside me, opposite to what the devs were aiming for.

 

I've hit MMORPG rock bottom.

We kind of all have. But I'll keep searching. Like back when I used to play other games, I kind of got bored of them and their genre and never thought I'd ever find something else like them. How was I wrong! Years may have passed, and seemingly out of the blue something smacks me up the head and I fall head over heels once again. 

 

This is BadSpock, signing off...

How about keeping it cool? Next time you want to cheerlead for another title.

  FlawSGI

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/14/10
Posts: 1431

All of history is a lie. The truth depends on who does the listening, and who does the telling...

10/26/12 5:21:55 PM#56
I have to say I agree with just about everything you said Spock. The few points I wasn't with you on, I could easily see your POV. I happen to play a lot less than I anticipated because my time is delegated in other areas but I have started to draw  the same conclusions. The concerns I expressed while the game was in development have become a reality. I still play the game when time permits, but I don't find myself anticipating my next log-in.  Still a great game and I plan on popping in and I still find plenty of enjoyment.

RIP Jimmy "The Rev" Sullivan and Paul Gray.

  Fusion

Old School

Joined: 5/21/03
Posts: 1392

10/26/12 5:23:24 PM#57

I understand you points Spock. thusly. WoW is just a few (ten) expansions away, ye that direction>

You are an offspring of the 21st generation, thusly you've no idea how far we've come, so you could honestly keep your opinions to yourself.

I've already QUIT GW2 for a lack of better words, but i still feel you are wrongly judging the game, compared to shit that's been shoved down peoples throats for the last DECADE, GW2 is a breath of fresh air in this atrocity of "industry"!

Currently playing: -

Waiting for: Class4.

Dead and Buried: ESO, NWO, GW2, SWTOR, Darkfall, AO, AC2, Vanguard, CoH/V, EnB, EVE, Neocron, FE, EQ, EQ2, DAoC, FFXI, FFXIV, SWG, WoW, and billions of eastern junks!

  coretex666

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/03/12
Posts: 1839

"I shall take your position into consideration"

10/26/12 5:28:30 PM#58

I think people just set their expectations too high. I have seen many posts where people stated they think they gonna play the game for years. I believe that in the end, only little minority actually will.

I think that this game does not have potential to be a longterm fun for large group of people. It does not have a subscription for a reason. It is a B2P game which is good for playing for month or two, but that is about it.

When there is a revolutionary game with mechanisms unprecedented in the genre on the horizon, we will be able to tell. GW tried to do some things differently, but I was missing the "WOW" aspect (not as a shortcut for warcraft, just expression of excitement and surprise - just to avoid confusion :D). It did not really introduce anything mindblowing.

Many people, including me, stated their concerns about the longevity of the game, but they were usually stoned to death by fans.

I dont have anything against the game, dont mean to insult its fans, it is great when people have something they like and they can enjoy. I just never believed that this game will be THE ONE that will dictate trends in the industry. I do believe there will be a game as influential as WoW released in next 5-10 years. Devs just need to understand or learn to deliver (if it is even possible) something truly revolutionary. Not that WoW was btw, but its influence is undisputable.

Currently playing: L2 Chronicle 4

  someforumguy

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/07
Posts: 3517

10/26/12 5:30:13 PM#59

I agree with the OP about Orr. It is either in a karma farm group running from event to event or on your own which feels like a chore. Risen are so annoying to fight imo. And what doesn't help are their silly comedy capers animations. The areas look awesome though, it really shows that it was all those years underneath the sea. But I just hate Risen.

Halloween event so far has been disappointing too. Seems just a bunch of achievements you can complete. I don't care about those orange bars. I hoped for a fun instanced questchain like personal story. The goosechase they send you on, is just some maptravel. The costumebrawl is fun for a minute or so and maybe a little longer with some of the better costumes which are clearly overpowered.

So I'm mainly busy grouping with guildies in areas that don't contain too many Risen and basically ignoring the halloween stuff. This is still a lot of fun though. But I also wonder how long this lasts. We really can use some new high lvl areas that don't have Risen :p

  Bad.dog

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/20/10
Posts: 1155

10/26/12 5:33:07 PM#60
Originally posted by Yamota
Originally posted by aesperus
Originally posted by bunnyhopper

People "look back" to traditional sandbox games/mechanics/features because they promoted natural player community dynamics and offered freedom. Those of use often castigated for just wanting a rehash of UO are actually seeking games which provide the same ethos of community driven dynamics, longevity and player freedom within a persistent and dynamic game world.

If you can do that via other methods and mechanics, go for it.

The thing is though recently the emphasis has been 99.99% on accessibility, parity and carrot grinds, something other gaming genres offer.

Sadly, even with EQ Next, Unholy Wars, WoD et al coming up, I really, really can't see the genre gettting back to that ethos of longevity, community and freedom though (outside of indieville).

To some degree yes.

However, times are VERY different now. The mentallity most players had back then, is much different from the ones we have now. In the 'golden days' of MMOs, people were more interested in exploring this new form of gaming. It was more social, but it wasn't always due to game design. It was because things were still new, and players were much more willing to work together trying to figure out this new type of game. It was still a fronteir to explore. Games were also a lot more simple back then. They didn't have as many features, as big of a world, combat was generally fairly simple as well, inspite having a large skillset.

People now expect WAY more from an MMO than what we had back then. The shining example of sandbox atm, is still Eve. It's the only sandbox MMO still going strong. Yet it still doesn't have the same numbers as most of the themeparks. Just being a sandbox isn't going to be enough. Even if we were to bring back UO with modern graphics, I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't enough for most players.

Wait what? Eve has more than 350.000 subs and have been over 300.000 for years. There are only two sub-based MMOs which can best that and that is WoW and Aion and the latter one is F2P hybrid. All other ThemeParks have dwindling subs. such as TERA, Secret World, WAR, AoC, DCU and even SW:TOR has drastically lost subs and is headed for F2P.

If anything Eve shows that there is a demand for sandbox games and not like ThemeParks where they only stay for a few months but rather years. Ofcourse that does not mean a UO copy would be automatically a success, games have evolved since then and ofcourse sandbox MMOs need to also evolve. And imo it is the future of MMO', ThemeParks will soon all go the F2P route and it will only be sandbox MMO's which can provide the reason to sub to an MMO because they will have longetivity, ThemeParks do not.

So out of a ball park figure of say 20 million folks having played some sort of mmo since 2004 ...you are promoting a game style that has been able to sustain a population of 350 k ? I'm sorry your theory of a sandbox MMO providing anything close to a reason for paying a sub or longevity is just "pipe dream" at best ...sorry bud forums wars for the next 5 years isn't the path most folks want to take .

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