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Star Wars: The Old Republic

Star Wars: The Old Republic 

General Discussion  » Biowares f2p model, bringing segregation back!

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108 posts found
  Badem

Novice Member

Joined: 8/18/06
Posts: 836

Diplomacy - The art of saying ''Nice Doggy'' while you find a big enough stick to hit it

10/14/12 2:04:48 AM#21
Originally posted by Johnie-Marz
Originally posted by william0532

So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.

This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?

if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.

 

Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)

Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?

I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?

Yes you are missing, free is not free.

In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.

To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay. 

A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .

Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.

But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?

Thank Pete, I was beginning to think I was the only person who seemed to notice this as well! I much prefer to stick with my monthly subscriptions to be honest. Access to everything for a fixed price, rather than trying to calculate how much I spent this month, or budgeting for a month nickel and diming...

 

Luckily in STO and CO I get a monthly Stipend for being a sub allowing me to participate in the 'Item Shop' Wonder if SWTOR will do the same....

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/ab/Norsefire-logo.png

  Karteli

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/09/12
Posts: 2704

10/14/12 2:09:12 AM#22
Originally posted by Draron
Originally posted by william0532
Originally posted by Draron
Better than SOE's model they use with EQ1/2/Vanguard IMO. They limit item and skill tiers along with the usual lack of AH (GTN in SWTOR's case) and limits character progression.

Actually it seems that it's pretty much the same. Since the expansion comes with level increases and free players can only progress to level 50 they will not have the skills and health that the other players do.

From what I know of SWTOR's F2P (at least what's been shown so far) it doesn't limit you from purple or orange items or high level skill ranks like EQ2 and such does. We're not sure yet if SWTOR is going to include the expansion storyline content with F2P or not, as an expansion is a good half year or so away at the earliest.

The biggest thing SWTOR limits is no operations, though EQ2 locks players out of the most recent expansion as well meaning the highest tier raids.

 

Jeff Hickman (Executive Producer for Star Wars) says no to free content. He is still deciding whether to charge paying subscribers "EXTRA" or not, and nowhere even near thinking about giving it away to freemium players.

http://www.swtor-life.com/video/the-future-of-swtor-jeff-hickman-interview/7112/

What (if anything) will subscribers have to pay for after F2P launches?
 

[Jeff Hickman]
I wish I had a solid answer for you on that. We’re still in discussion about some of the larger content updates that we’re planning. Great example is the planet Makeb. We’ve talked about Makeb, we have a lot of plans around Makeb. I wish I could give you more details, but I can tell you that I think the playerbase is going to be really, really pleased. More story content. New and interesting things for the players to do. More systems and interesting functions in the game … I can’t go into a lot of detail, but around things like that … This is a pretty big piece (of content). It is probably all that I can say. It is definitely still for discussion whether we sell that to the subscriber or the subscriber gets that for free because it is a big beefy chunk of content.

Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.

  Draron

Novice Member

Joined: 5/07/11
Posts: 1009

10/14/12 9:59:50 AM#23
Originally posted by Karteli
Originally posted by Draron
Originally posted by william0532
Originally posted by Draron
Better than SOE's model they use with EQ1/2/Vanguard IMO. They limit item and skill tiers along with the usual lack of AH (GTN in SWTOR's case) and limits character progression.

Actually it seems that it's pretty much the same. Since the expansion comes with level increases and free players can only progress to level 50 they will not have the skills and health that the other players do.

From what I know of SWTOR's F2P (at least what's been shown so far) it doesn't limit you from purple or orange items or high level skill ranks like EQ2 and such does. We're not sure yet if SWTOR is going to include the expansion storyline content with F2P or not, as an expansion is a good half year or so away at the earliest.

The biggest thing SWTOR limits is no operations, though EQ2 locks players out of the most recent expansion as well meaning the highest tier raids.

 

Jeff Hickman (Executive Producer for Star Wars) says no to free content. He is still deciding whether to charge paying subscribers "EXTRA" or not, and nowhere even near thinking about giving it away to freemium players.

http://www.swtor-life.com/video/the-future-of-swtor-jeff-hickman-interview/7112/

What (if anything) will subscribers have to pay for after F2P launches?
 

[Jeff Hickman]
I wish I had a solid answer for you on that. We’re still in discussion about some of the larger content updates that we’re planning. Great example is the planet Makeb. We’ve talked about Makeb, we have a lot of plans around Makeb. I wish I could give you more details, but I can tell you that I think the playerbase is going to be really, really pleased. More story content. New and interesting things for the players to do. More systems and interesting functions in the game … I can’t go into a lot of detail, but around things like that … This is a pretty big piece (of content). It is probably all that I can say. It is definitely still for discussion whether we sell that to the subscriber or the subscriber gets that for free because it is a big beefy chunk of content.

Ouch. How they can think of charging for an upcoming content patch when they've been painfully slow already goes over my head to be honest.

  StonesDK

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/06/11
Posts: 1832

10/14/12 10:06:01 AM#24
Originally posted by Sora2810
Originally posted by SuperDonk

At least the F2P will allow you to pretend it is Kotor 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, and 8 like they said it was prior to launch. Drop in play the stories and drop back out.

 

That is if they let you complete the story quests on F2P.

Hey wait.. that's actually a great idea! F2P for the people who want a Single-player story game. Monthly sub for people who want multiplayer content... Seriously, that's not a bad model at all.

I'm behind this a 100%

I might just return to finish a few storylines now

 

I never cared two shits about raiding and pvp

  Vunak23

Novice Member

Joined: 11/27/10
Posts: 659

In your house Eatin' your Cookies!

10/14/12 10:08:18 AM#25

I can't believe people are actually upset about this. 

Your getting the main part of the entire game for free...The story. What did you expect to have everything for free? No you have to pay to compete in the gear department. Makes sense to me. You like the game you will pay for it,  you don't then you wont. I would have liked to of seen all the locks only happen at level 50 (warzones, flashpoints, travel etc). But its understandable, they are trying to give you a reason to pay that sub fee.

This is a pretty good F2P model actually. It still emphasizes the subscription, but allows entry players to experience the game and make a decision on if they enjoy it enough to pay the fee or not. 

People that are complaining about this, weren't ever going to pay for anything anyway...So no the developers don't care about you. Why should they? When you aren't going to be a contributing factor to the games longevity. 

 

Recap: This model is doing exactly what its intended to do. Entry level players experiencing a good portion of the game and allowing them to make a decision on if they want to continue to play via sub or not. 

"In the immediate future, we have this one, and then we’ve got another one that is actually going to be – so we’re going to have, what we want to do, is in January, what we’re targeting to do, this may or may not happen, so you can’t hold me to it. But what we’re targeting to do, is have a fun anniversary to the Ilum shenanigans that happened. An alien race might invade, and they might crash into Ilum and there might be some new activities that happen on the planet." ~Gabe Amatangelo

  MMOGamer71

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/12/07
Posts: 1518

10/14/12 10:08:30 AM#26
Nothing surprises me about SWTOR and it's development team.
  DeaconX

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/08/05
Posts: 3073

Stand up for what you believe; Even if you stand alone.
-==X==-
SHH, my COMMON SENSE is tingling!

10/14/12 10:09:56 AM#27
Originally posted by Starpower
Originally posted by Sora2810
Originally posted by SuperDonk

At least the F2P will allow you to pretend it is Kotor 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, and 8 like they said it was prior to launch. Drop in play the stories and drop back out.

 

That is if they let you complete the story quests on F2P.

Hey wait.. that's actually a great idea! F2P for the people who want a Single-player story game. Monthly sub for people who want multiplayer content... Seriously, that's not a bad model at all.

I'm behind this a 100%

I might just return to finish a few storylines now

 

I never cared two shits about raiding and pvp

Ditto.

 

I just tried to play the 'Play for free to level 15' to see what changes have been made to the game... well, it seems because I once paid for the game, I'm not eligible to try the game now.  I don't know what genius thought that was a good idea... oh no, we don't want previous players to come back for free to check out the game and maybe they'll resub or at the very least, boost server populations so the public perception is that the community is healthy...

BioWare/EA have been utter fuck-ups with Star Wars and it's pretty damn sad.


Why do I write, create, fantasize, dream and daydream about other worlds? Because I hate what humanity does with this one.

BOYCOTTING EA / ORIGIN going forward.

  ktanner3

Master

Joined: 3/19/06
Posts: 4146

Trolls will be ignored

10/14/12 10:11:40 AM#28
Yes, the free loaders will be segragated from everyone else who isn't too cheap to pony up 15 dollars a month.  They get a free ride to level 50, which is really the best part of the entire game. They can either stay at 50 and pay extra for the end game content, pony up the monthy fee which is less than the cost of a night at the movies, or hop onto the next game that offers free rides. 

Currently Playing: Star Wars The Old Republic

  Zhylaw

Novice Member

Joined: 2/02/08
Posts: 115

10/14/12 10:21:02 AM#29
Originally posted by ktanner3
Yes, the free loaders will be segragated from everyone else who isn't too cheap to pony up 15 dollars a month.  They get a free ride to level 50, which is really the best part of the entire game. They can either stay at 50 and pay extra for the end game content, pony up the monthy fee which is less than the cost of a night at the movies, or hop onto the next game that offers free rides. 

 

Are you channeling the spirit of segregation with this post?

 

F2P is sopposed to mean you get to play the entire game...for free. But you will be unable to enjoy certain conviences, new content or vanity type stuff without either paying for it or subscribing depending on whether the game has a secondary sub model or just a cash shop.

 

Even ripoff F2P games that try to squeeeze you into using the shop do so by making it harder and harder to level or stay competitve without the use of the shop, but it is still techinically possible to do so.

 

DDO lets f2p players enjoy the entire game, you buy new modules as desired. But if your really dedicated you can even earn the points to buy them without money.

 

Bioware is literally slicing off hunks of the game and telling F2P people that cant touch it, period; without paying for the right.

 

This is not F2P, this is Freemium, and an excellent example of how how NOT to implement it at that.

  Sevenstar61

Elite Member

Joined: 7/22/12
Posts: 1575

"But it was so artistically done..." - Grand Admiral Thrawn's final words

10/14/12 10:29:30 AM#30
Originally posted by Obidom
Originally posted by Johnie-Marz
Originally posted by william0532

So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.

This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?

if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.

 

Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)

Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?

I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?

Yes you are missing, free is not free.

In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.

To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay. 

A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .

Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.

But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?

Thank Pete, I was beginning to think I was the only person who seemed to notice this as well! I much prefer to stick with my monthly subscriptions to be honest. Access to everything for a fixed price, rather than trying to calculate how much I spent this month, or budgeting for a month nickel and diming...

 

Luckily in STO and CO I get a monthly Stipend for being a sub allowing me to participate in the 'Item Shop' Wonder if SWTOR will do the same....

Rewards for Sub owner in cartel points (click on image to see it)

Subs vs F2P (click on image to see it)

Edit. 50 GTN listings is the current limit, so there is no change here.

 

 


Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E

  vgamer

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/27/11
Posts: 150

10/14/12 10:35:03 AM#31

Yes you are missing, free is not free.

In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.

To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay. 

A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .

Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.

But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?

If you lack any self-control, then it is your fault for being milked. You DO have the option to NOT pay, you know?

  Karteli

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/09/12
Posts: 2704

10/14/12 10:58:03 AM#32
Originally posted by Sevenstar61
Originally posted by Obidom
Originally posted by Johnie-Marz
Originally posted by william0532

So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.

This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?

if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.

 

Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)

Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?

I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?

Yes you are missing, free is not free.

In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.

To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay. 

A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .

Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.

But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?

Thank Pete, I was beginning to think I was the only person who seemed to notice this as well! I much prefer to stick with my monthly subscriptions to be honest. Access to everything for a fixed price, rather than trying to calculate how much I spent this month, or budgeting for a month nickel and diming...

 

Luckily in STO and CO I get a monthly Stipend for being a sub allowing me to participate in the 'Item Shop' Wonder if SWTOR will do the same....

Rewards for Sub owner in cartel points (click on image to see it)

Subs vs F2P (click on image to see it)

Edit. 50 GTN listings is the current limit, so there is no change here.

 

 

 

The GTN will be significantly gimped for freemium users.

 

Hyperspace Beacon: SWTOR's Gabe Amatangelo on 1.4 and free-to-play

 

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/09/18/hyperspace-beacon-swtors-gabe-amatangelo-on-1-4-and-free-to-pl/

Sep 18th 2012

[Massively]: I'm excited for the opportunity to see what a free-to-play model will do for TOR. However, there have been some mixed reactions regarding F2P in general. What is your take on F2P, and what do you believe it will add to the player's experience in the game?

[Gabe]: It will make galactic trade market entrepreneurs happy.
Free-to-play members can buy but can't list, meaning more customers with less competition. Who wouldn't like that? My take is that what happened to the music industry is happening to online games. Free-to-play options are the future of most, if not all, online games. There are all types of players out there, and the ability to subscribe to a game -- or multiple games -- is a dividing characteristic. This will open the game up to more types of players to try or retry the game, which will be good for all players.

Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.

  Sevenstar61

Elite Member

Joined: 7/22/12
Posts: 1575

"But it was so artistically done..." - Grand Admiral Thrawn's final words

10/14/12 11:05:46 AM#33
Originally posted by Karteli
Originally posted by Sevenstar61
Originally posted by Obidom
Originally posted by Johnie-Marz
Originally posted by william0532

So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.

This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?

if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.

 

Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)

Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?

I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?

Yes you are missing, free is not free.

In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.

To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay. 

A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .

Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.

But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?

Thank Pete, I was beginning to think I was the only person who seemed to notice this as well! I much prefer to stick with my monthly subscriptions to be honest. Access to everything for a fixed price, rather than trying to calculate how much I spent this month, or budgeting for a month nickel and diming...

 

Luckily in STO and CO I get a monthly Stipend for being a sub allowing me to participate in the 'Item Shop' Wonder if SWTOR will do the same....

Rewards for Sub owner in cartel points (click on image to see it)

Subs vs F2P (click on image to see it)

Edit. 50 GTN listings is the current limit, so there is no change here.

 

 

 

The GTN will be significantly gimped for freemium users.

 

Hyperspace Beacon: SWTOR's Gabe Amatangelo on 1.4 and free-to-play

 

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/09/18/hyperspace-beacon-swtors-gabe-amatangelo-on-1-4-and-free-to-pl/

Sep 18th 2012

[Massively]: I'm excited for the opportunity to see what a free-to-play model will do for TOR. However, there have been some mixed reactions regarding F2P in general. What is your take on F2P, and what do you believe it will add to the player's experience in the game?

[Gabe]: It will make galactic trade market entrepreneurs happy.
Free-to-play members can buy but can't list, meaning more customers with less competition. Who wouldn't like that? My take is that what happened to the music industry is happening to online games. Free-to-play options are the future of most, if not all, online games. There are all types of players out there, and the ability to subscribe to a game -- or multiple games -- is a dividing characteristic. This will open the game up to more types of players to try or retry the game, which will be good for all players.

Lets wait and see what a final option will be.

 

Edit:  They added cartel coins for deluxe adition, and it was not in their initial design. Things are still changing and are not cast in stone.


Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E

  Karteli

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/09/12
Posts: 2704

10/14/12 11:21:39 AM#34
Originally posted by Sevenstar61
Originally posted by Karteli
Originally posted by Sevenstar61
Originally posted by Obidom
Originally posted by Johnie-Marz
Originally posted by william0532

So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.

This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?

if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.

 

Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)

Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?

I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?

Yes you are missing, free is not free.

In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.

To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay. 

A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .

Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.

But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?

Thank Pete, I was beginning to think I was the only person who seemed to notice this as well! I much prefer to stick with my monthly subscriptions to be honest. Access to everything for a fixed price, rather than trying to calculate how much I spent this month, or budgeting for a month nickel and diming...

 

Luckily in STO and CO I get a monthly Stipend for being a sub allowing me to participate in the 'Item Shop' Wonder if SWTOR will do the same....

Rewards for Sub owner in cartel points (click on image to see it)

Subs vs F2P (click on image to see it)

Edit. 50 GTN listings is the current limit, so there is no change here.

 

 

 

The GTN will be significantly gimped for freemium users.

 

Hyperspace Beacon: SWTOR's Gabe Amatangelo on 1.4 and free-to-play

 

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/09/18/hyperspace-beacon-swtors-gabe-amatangelo-on-1-4-and-free-to-pl/

Sep 18th 2012

[Massively]: I'm excited for the opportunity to see what a free-to-play model will do for TOR. However, there have been some mixed reactions regarding F2P in general. What is your take on F2P, and what do you believe it will add to the player's experience in the game?

[Gabe]: It will make galactic trade market entrepreneurs happy.
Free-to-play members can buy but can't list, meaning more customers with less competition. Who wouldn't like that? My take is that what happened to the music industry is happening to online games. Free-to-play options are the future of most, if not all, online games. There are all types of players out there, and the ability to subscribe to a game -- or multiple games -- is a dividing characteristic. This will open the game up to more types of players to try or retry the game, which will be good for all players.

Lets wait and see what a final option will be.

 

Edit:  They added cartel coins for deluxe adition, and it was not in their initial design. Things are still changing and are not cast in stone.

 

Adjusting how the GTN operates is a major undertaking, and not just tweaking how coins are calculated though.

Gabe was very definitive in his response.  I don't see EA spending money and then completely scrapping what they've invested time in, so if there is any change, I'd expect it to be a minor tweak.  Maybe like upping the maximum postings from zero to 1 .. woohoo lol

Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.

  Sevenstar61

Elite Member

Joined: 7/22/12
Posts: 1575

"But it was so artistically done..." - Grand Admiral Thrawn's final words

10/14/12 11:27:00 AM#35
Originally posted by Karteli
Originally posted by Sevenstar61
Originally posted by Karteli
Originally posted by Sevenstar61
Originally posted by Obidom
Originally posted by Johnie-Marz
Originally posted by william0532

So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.

This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?

if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.

 

Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)

Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?

I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?

Yes you are missing, free is not free.

In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.

To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay. 

A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .

Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.

But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?

Thank Pete, I was beginning to think I was the only person who seemed to notice this as well! I much prefer to stick with my monthly subscriptions to be honest. Access to everything for a fixed price, rather than trying to calculate how much I spent this month, or budgeting for a month nickel and diming...

 

Luckily in STO and CO I get a monthly Stipend for being a sub allowing me to participate in the 'Item Shop' Wonder if SWTOR will do the same....

Rewards for Sub owner in cartel points (click on image to see it)

Subs vs F2P (click on image to see it)

Edit. 50 GTN listings is the current limit, so there is no change here.

 

 

 

The GTN will be significantly gimped for freemium users.

 

Hyperspace Beacon: SWTOR's Gabe Amatangelo on 1.4 and free-to-play

 

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/09/18/hyperspace-beacon-swtors-gabe-amatangelo-on-1-4-and-free-to-pl/

Sep 18th 2012

[Massively]: I'm excited for the opportunity to see what a free-to-play model will do for TOR. However, there have been some mixed reactions regarding F2P in general. What is your take on F2P, and what do you believe it will add to the player's experience in the game?

[Gabe]: It will make galactic trade market entrepreneurs happy.
Free-to-play members can buy but can't list, meaning more customers with less competition. Who wouldn't like that? My take is that what happened to the music industry is happening to online games. Free-to-play options are the future of most, if not all, online games. There are all types of players out there, and the ability to subscribe to a game -- or multiple games -- is a dividing characteristic. This will open the game up to more types of players to try or retry the game, which will be good for all players.

Lets wait and see what a final option will be.

 

Edit:  They added cartel coins for deluxe adition, and it was not in their initial design. Things are still changing and are not cast in stone.

 

Adjusting how the GTN operates is a major undertaking, and not just tweaking how coins are calculated though.

Gabe was very definitive in his response.  I don't see EA spending money and then completely scrapping what they've invested time in, so if there is any change, I'd expect it to be a minor tweak.  Maybe like upping the maximum postings from zero to 1 .. woohoo lol

The F2P players will just sell stuff to vendors then. Good thing for subscribers... we will get richer,,,


Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 5671

10/14/12 11:27:25 AM#36
Originally posted by ktanner3
Yes, the free loaders will be segragated from everyone else who isn't too cheap to pony up 15 dollars a month.  They get a free ride to level 50, which is really the best part of the entire game. They can either stay at 50 and pay extra for the end game content, pony up the monthy fee which is less than the cost of a night at the movies, or hop onto the next game that offers free rides. 

The game isn't worth a monthly fee.  They're still thinking it is.  This is why Freemium games never seem to pull off the success of actual F2P games.  Most every western company doesn't get F2P at all, period.  When you go in with the mindset that your potential revenue generators are a bunch of free-loaders and then treat them like shit, then you're bound to fail.  The Bioiware team is an embarassing case study in incompetence and short-sightedness.  Let's see how far this gets them a year or so from now.

I think a mind wipe so people could play an mmo like it was their first time again, would be easier to build than a new mmo people here would actually like. - DamonVile

  ohpower

Novice Member

Joined: 5/13/12
Posts: 72

10/14/12 11:38:20 AM#37

Ah come on, they can't be just giving out stuff for free for real. It's not related to how bad a company they are, for once: they just can't give you everything for free, or else they'd go bankrupt.

What I say is that if they give you the 50 first levels free, and the possibility to try out zones or raids etc... like once before paying, well it's already great, and you just pay if you like it and you want more -maybe you pay more, but at least you know what you're paying for. My problem with spending cash on a game is not the amounts I pay but the fact that I feel it's wasted sometimes. Here if you waste your money, shame on you.

F2P in this way is just a bigger free trial. But I mean if I can play the solo campaigns for free, well it's worth it IMHO

  xmenty

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/22/10
Posts: 691

10/14/12 11:43:56 AM#38
Originally posted by Torvaldr
Originally posted by ktanner3
Yes, the free loaders will be segragated from everyone else who isn't too cheap to pony up 15 dollars a month.  They get a free ride to level 50, which is really the best part of the entire game. They can either stay at 50 and pay extra for the end game content, pony up the monthy fee which is less than the cost of a night at the movies, or hop onto the next game that offers free rides. 

The game isn't worth a monthly fee.  They're still thinking it is.  This is why Freemium games never seem to pull off the success of actual F2P games.  Most every western company doesn't get F2P at all, period.  When you go in with the mindset that your potential revenue generators are a bunch of free-loaders and then treat them like shit, then you're bound to fail.  The Bioiware team is an embarassing case study in incompetence and short-sightedness.  Let's see how far this gets them a year or so from now.

You give EAWARE too much credit.

Lets wait 6 month instead of 1 year lol.

 

 

 

Pardon my English as it is not my 1st language :)

  hikaru77

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/28/07
Posts: 964

10/14/12 11:53:05 AM#39
F2P never was free, the only difference is that u can customize ur gameplay experience without paying a sub if you dont want to , Like Lotro or AoC as an example, or even STO.   
  tiefighter25

Novice Member

Joined: 7/30/12
Posts: 949

10/14/12 11:53:33 AM#40

Although to a certain extent, discussion of SWTOR's FReemium system is a bit premature because they have still not released the finer details of it, their monetization system does seem a bit bizzare.

I think this is mostly because that the game wasn't meant to be a FTP type game in the first place. (Maybe a tacked on cash shop for vanity items or a reduction of Legacy costs,not a complete overhaul.) I think the main reason why the FTP set up is bizzare, and in my mind unsustainable, is because the primary motivator for the FTP overhaul isn't to make long term money, but to deflect EA"s investors from continued concern over SWTOR's subscription numbers which was dragging down the EA stock price. Once the game goes ftp, EA no longer has to talk about subscribers, the game's performance will be measured in terms of revenue, and EA has already demonstrated it can be awfully clever when releasing financial figures.

As to the secondary motivation to switching to FTP, I fear that SWTOR is just a reworking and expansion of the Warhammer On Line cash shop. The FTP accounts are not expected to buy vanity items or access  warzones and OPs from the cash shop. The cash shop's primary market audience will be the subscribers themselves. At first the items will be mostly vanity in nature, but likely will slowly drift towards the pay to win end of the spectrum. As the game ages, (and subscribers continue to dwindle) the subscribers will find more and more required barriers to overcome in the cash shop. Case in point will be the Makeb level cap expansion, which will be a required optional purchase in the cash shop if you want to continue progressing in the game.

Again, EA claims that they are basing their model on Turbine's LOTRO, but I suggest it will be more like WAR's. WAR has an endless trial with severe restrictions. (TOR equivalent FTP account). WAR sells mounts, vanity pets, and P2W perks in the store.

http://store.origin.com/store/ea/ContentTheme/pbPage.warhammer-online-bundles

More importantly, the game which never had an expansion in content, requires who to buy a Reknown Cap Augment in order to be competative in the game.

Of course, maybe I'm wrong, but it doesn't seem like a LOTRO system where most of the csh shop items can be obtained by grinding in game. Then again, LOTRO is slowly drifting from FTP to P2W, and the game design itself pushes players towards either subbing or the cash shop a little bit more as time goes on. Freemium which is supposed to be a hybrd of the best of P2P and FTP can also be a hybrid of the worst of P2P and FTP is not implemented correctly.

Then again, maybe SWTOR will find a happy medium, but locking out FTP players from so much of endgame, and conversely giving away what many see as the best part of the game is logic confounding.

As a side note, in regard to segregation. I find it cnfusing that SWTOR's subscribers can simulataneously herald the FTP system as what will save TOR and make it a huge success; and with their next breath call FTP players free-loading scrubs who shouldn't have access to chat, forums, etc. It would seem to me that you have to decide if you want to have your cake or it. Also, the first person to make a Portal joke either wins a prize or a smack. (Like anyone got this far in a wall of text.)

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